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Jesus. You can see him getting into trouble even before he crosses the divider, did he not think to slow down?
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Jan 14, 2013 06:46
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He gave up the thinking thing well before that turn.
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Jan 14, 2013 06:51
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nsaP posted:He gave up the thinking thing well before that turn. By buying a gixxer. 
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Jan 14, 2013 06:57
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Funny how all those crashes start out the same way: maximum throttle pull on a straightaway up to some ridiculously high speed, then a goddamn shameful understeer off the edge of a perfectly navigable corner because buddy doesn't know how to do anything but go fast in a straight line. Was that his entire riding club he passed at the beginning? Also, confiscate all GoPros from people who point them down at the road. VVVV well, yeah. I don't mean understeer in the mechanical sense, but rather "he did not steer the bike or enter the turn properly, and as a result he exited the road to the outside." VVVV thanks for taking the blame Slavvy 
Sagebrush fucked around with this message at 07:09 on Jan 14, 2013 |
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Jan 14, 2013 06:58
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It's not so much understeer as it is poor line choice making him run wide. Turns in really early and just totally fucks himself by doing that.
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Jan 14, 2013 07:02
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Z3n posted:It's not so much understeer as it is poor line choice making him run wide. Turns in really early and just totally fucks himself by doing that. This is what I meant sorry. To me, understeer on a bike = improper line/too much speed/not enough lean. I've never actually seen a bike understeer in the automotive sense, with the front wheel sledging outward (lowsides don't count), although I've owned a few which had a front end soft enough that adding throttle mid-corner made them 'push' toward the outside (sv650 for one).
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Jan 14, 2013 07:07
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Liveleak commenters are cold bastards as well.Safety Dance posted:Long Way to 7-11, with nsaP To the Shell station. Strangely a lot of meet up/set off points happened to be Shell's.
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Jan 14, 2013 07:09
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IIRC, dude was going >80mph on a stretch of road with a 20 mph speed limit.
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Jan 14, 2013 07:22
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Silver posted:Sorry it's the very first go pro they made, so it sucks. Hoping to upgrade soon to a Hero3 either Black or Silver. Especially because using double A batteries on this one gives me about 30 min record time. Goddamn, old GoPros sucked... my $50 Midland camera takes better video than that. I envy a new GoPro, but $250 buys a lot of gas.
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Jan 14, 2013 08:12
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Sagebrush posted:VVVV well, yeah. I don't mean understeer in the mechanical sense, but rather "he did not steer the bike or enter the turn properly, and as a result he exited the road to the outside." I've found myself doing nearly that on quiet roads, just about poo poo myself the one time I crossed the centreline! I just take hard turns slowly to be safe, but how does one learn to properly lean over? Is it just time and experience, or something you pick up in further lessons? Wootcannon fucked around with this message at 09:35 on Jan 14, 2013 |
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Jan 14, 2013 09:32
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Wootcannon posted:I just take the turns slowly to be safe, but how does one learn to properly lean over? Is it just time and experience, or something you pick up in further lessons? Bit from a, bit from b. It depends on the rider, and their perception of comfort. I have no idea where you are geographically, but there are many good schools world over that'll teach advanced and safe riding skills to everyone (including experienced riders).
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Jan 14, 2013 09:35
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Slavvy posted:I've never actually seen a bike understeer in the automotive sense, with the front wheel sledging outward (lowsides don't count),
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Jan 14, 2013 14:51
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Pham Nuwen posted:Goddamn, old GoPros sucked... my $50 Midland camera takes better video than that. Yeah, pretty horrid. The two I have are both first gen. The go pro wide wasn't much better. Then HD and so on. Also 300 for the Silver Hero3 and 400 for the black Hero3. Yeah that does buy a lot of gas. I tend to use mine a whole lot though so upgrading would probably be a benefit. Would be nice to be able to turn it on and go and not ask at every stop if it's still on. Also the Hero3 built in wifi where you can get the app for your phone and actually see what it's shooting. Hopefully make for less shoot at the ground shots as you can line it up and adjust off the phone app. Content: Leadbelt, who wants some chocolate milk?
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Jan 14, 2013 15:36
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Wootcannon posted:I've found myself doing nearly that on quiet roads, just about poo poo myself the one time I crossed the centreline! I just take hard turns slowly to be safe, but how does one learn to properly lean over? Is it just time and experience, or something you pick up in further lessons? Read twist of the wrist 2, specifically the bits about late apexes. Sport riding techniques has some good info as well. But basically the entirety of it is learning to turn in later than your brain says is ok. The natural thing to do is try and cheat the corner and turn in early and while that makes you feel better on corner entrance it pushes you wide on exit, and there is really no way to "fix" an early apex pushing you wide.
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Jan 14, 2013 16:40
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Sagebrush posted:Funny how all those crashes start out the same way: maximum throttle pull on a straightaway up to some ridiculously high speed, then a goddamn shameful understeer LOL wut. I don't think you know what understeer is, if that dude was pushing the front end you might have a point.
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Jan 14, 2013 20:45
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I'm aware of the mechanical and technical concept of understeer, but I've also heard the term used (incorrectly, I guess) in reference to people sliding off the outside of a turn, regardless of what caused the error. What proper term would you use to describe that kind of error?
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Jan 14, 2013 21:19
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'Squidheadedness'
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Jan 14, 2013 21:22
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Sagebrush posted:I'm aware of the mechanical and technical concept of understeer, but I've also heard the term used (incorrectly, I guess) in reference to people sliding off the outside of a turn, regardless of what caused the error. What proper term would you use to describe that kind of error? Underutilizedsteer
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Jan 14, 2013 22:00
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Continuing in this vein, often I find that I psychologically cannot force myself to lean the bike over any further. Intellectually I know for a fact that it will lean over and the tyres will grip and things will be fine, but something in my lizard brain starts to scream that THE TYRES WONT GRIP AND YOU'LL LOWSIDE YOU FOOL and the sensation is so paralyzing that I can feel it holding me back from cornering better. But I can't overcome it? How do you fix this. Currently the sort of bike I'm riding determines the psychological threshold; sport bikes feel much more confidence-inspiring and so on, yet I know I could never make myself scrape the pegs on a harley or similar, despite intellectually knowing that I'd barely need to lean over at all to make it happen. E/N CA edition.
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Jan 14, 2013 22:39
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Slavvy posted:Continuing in this vein, often I find that I psychologically cannot force myself to lean the bike over any further. Intellectually I know for a fact that it will lean over and the tyres will grip and things will be fine, but something in my lizard brain starts to scream that THE TYRES WONT GRIP AND YOU'LL LOWSIDE YOU FOOL and the sensation is so paralyzing that I can feel it holding me back from cornering better. But I can't overcome it? How do you fix this. Currently the sort of bike I'm riding determines the psychological threshold; sport bikes feel much more confidence-inspiring and so on, yet I know I could never make myself scrape the pegs on a harley or similar, despite intellectually knowing that I'd barely need to lean over at all to make it happen.
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Jan 14, 2013 22:46
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Slavvy posted:Continuing in this vein, often I find that I psychologically cannot force myself to lean the bike over any further. Intellectually I know for a fact that it will lean over and the tyres will grip and things will be fine, but something in my lizard brain starts to scream that THE TYRES WONT GRIP AND YOU'LL LOWSIDE YOU FOOL and the sensation is so paralyzing that I can feel it holding me back from cornering better. But I can't overcome it? How do you fix this. Currently the sort of bike I'm riding determines the psychological threshold; sport bikes feel much more confidence-inspiring and so on, yet I know I could never make myself scrape the pegs on a harley or similar, despite intellectually knowing that I'd barely need to lean over at all to make it happen. I had this problem in my MSF course. Their way of solving it was yelling at me and then having me sit pillion while the instructor scraped pegs all over the parking lot.
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Jan 14, 2013 22:55
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Slavvy posted:Continuing in this vein, often I find that I psychologically cannot force myself to lean the bike over any further. Intellectually I know for a fact that it will lean over and the tyres will grip and things will be fine, but something in my lizard brain starts to scream that THE TYRES WONT GRIP AND YOU'LL LOWSIDE YOU FOOL and the sensation is so paralyzing that I can feel it holding me back from cornering better. But I can't overcome it? A few of my advanced track (because you can't really practice this safely on the road) riding classes started out with no brakes. Ride the entire circuit in an appropriate gear, and never use the brakes unless you're going end up in trouble. I've yet to hear of it not working as a strategy for teaching riders how to corner faster. Even if I manage to get the tyres to slide, everything else I've been forced to do up to that has resulted in an even slide that's fully controlled and adjustable. Cornering isn't about lean or hanging off, it's about setting your body weight on the bike correctly to maximise traction while setting the geometry to corner. I've lost count of the number of times I've passed on the inside some knee-down fool on the racetrack while my knee is still foot off the surface. I can't be alone in suggesting hunting down some advanced rider training courses. Reading it on a forum is one thing, having an instructor video tape you, and then pass you to demonstrate is much more productive.
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Jan 14, 2013 23:12
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http://i.imgur.com/9uDdX.jpg
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Jan 15, 2013 01:57
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Slavvy posted:Continuing in this vein, often I find that I psychologically cannot force myself to lean the bike over any further. Intellectually I know for a fact that it will lean over and the tyres will grip and things will be fine, but something in my lizard brain starts to scream that THE TYRES WONT GRIP AND YOU'LL LOWSIDE YOU FOOL and the sensation is so paralyzing that I can feel it holding me back from cornering better. But I can't overcome it? How do you fix this. Currently the sort of bike I'm riding determines the psychological threshold; sport bikes feel much more confidence-inspiring and so on, yet I know I could never make myself scrape the pegs on a harley or similar, despite intellectually knowing that I'd barely need to lean over at all to make it happen. You can be like me and probably at least 90% of riders and just never lean over very far and have huge chicken strips. I hate pushing it in the corners on the street because there's a million loving things that can go wrong. A puddle with a little moss growing in it, a pebble, a piece of garbage, etc. It takes nothing at all to have an unlucky spill. You're also a fair bit more vulnerable to other traffic because you can't correct or change your course very easily when at an extreme lean angle. Just not worth it. People will call me a wuss about it on the internet, but whatever. I ride how I feel safe riding and I enjoy it. 
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Jan 15, 2013 03:36
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Slavvy posted:Continuing in this vein, often I find that I psychologically cannot force myself to lean the bike over any further. Intellectually I know for a fact that it will lean over and the tyres will grip and things will be fine, but something in my lizard brain starts to scream that THE TYRES WONT GRIP AND YOU'LL LOWSIDE YOU FOOL and the sensation is so paralyzing that I can feel it holding me back from cornering better. But I can't overcome it? How do you fix this. Currently the sort of bike I'm riding determines the psychological threshold; sport bikes feel much more confidence-inspiring and so on, yet I know I could never make myself scrape the pegs on a harley or similar, despite intellectually knowing that I'd barely need to lean over at all to make it happen. You do understand the concept of countersteering, right? Push harder, do squats. Grow a set, wear some gear, you'll be fine.
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Jan 15, 2013 03:41
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You can get to the edge of the tire on the street without going too crazy, but I don't do it that often. I probably have a little strip of barely touched rubber right now. I still go pretty quick on the backroads. I'd worry more about later apexes and trying to take a fast line thru the turn, and if you have to lean it over to do that, it'll come. A lot of times on the street tho you don't need to kick it over that far. I've watched a few videos of dude's claiming to be dragging knee on a 10 mile strip of good road around here and when I timed the videos I was within 5 seconds of them and not pushing that hard, line selection makes a big difference. When I ride those roads I try to keep the highest average speed over the road while keeping my top speed low, under 65 usually, so they aren't that quick.
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Jan 15, 2013 03:50
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My chicken strips are about half an inch wide, I've been riding for about 4 years so I'm fully aware of the concepts of counter-steering etc. My problem, as someone else said earlier, is worrying aboutlack of mechanical grip because of road imperfections, being unable to trust the tyres and so on. I know intellectually what I have to do, I just can't stop thinking about the possibility of crashing. I've never had a corner-related crash so I'm not sure why I think this way. Good advice about line selection though.
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Jan 15, 2013 04:03
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Slavvy posted:My chicken strips are about half an inch wide, I've been riding for about 4 years so I'm fully aware of the concepts of counter-steering etc. My problem, as someone else said earlier, is worrying aboutlack of mechanical grip because of road imperfections, being unable to trust the tyres and so on. I know intellectually what I have to do, I just can't stop thinking about the possibility of crashing. I've never had a corner-related crash so I'm not sure why I think this way. Good advice about line selection though. What do you ride? Modern bike and modern sports tires, you've got way more grip than you think. Don't go stupid on wet or cold roads, but otherwise, just trust the bike. Grab some leathers and knee pucks and just push on that handlebar. You paid for the full tire, use it.
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Jan 15, 2013 04:12
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ThatCguy posted:What do you ride? Yeah, I've been really conservative this past month or two because well, winter. Sucks.
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Jan 15, 2013 04:27
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Buy a supermoto, corner hard as a motherfucker everywhere, maybe dump the bike, maybe not, its all in a days work. Problem solved
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Jan 15, 2013 04:44
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Slavvy posted:My chicken strips are about half an inch wide, I've been riding for about 4 years so I'm fully aware of the concepts of counter-steering etc. My problem, as someone else said earlier, is worrying aboutlack of mechanical grip because of road imperfections, being unable to trust the tyres and so on. I know intellectually what I have to do, I just can't stop thinking about the possibility of crashing. I've never had a corner-related crash so I'm not sure why I think this way. Good advice about line selection though. On your "lizard brain" concept, it's a good feeling to overcome that when going into a corner to hot. Your whole brain and body is SCREAMING at you to stand it up and hit the brakes but yet you dive into the corner and stay on the throttle. I totally get that. On the leaning more, confidence I guess. As others have said, advanced riding course or a track day to help with that maybe? Being aware of crashing is a good thing. For road imperfections and whatnot, normally I'm super slow around blind corners. Ride as fast as you can see basically. If I can see all the way through the corner then game on, if not, take it slow. 
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Jan 15, 2013 04:54
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ThatCguy posted:What do you ride? SV650 K4. Not the best bike I've owned by far, but it's what circumstance has left me with and I'll take an average bike over no bike any day. I'll just have to force myself to push harder I guess; maybe I'm just not used to the front end being so crap. It just feels like the front end will sledge outward and crash me if I push it any harder; I know that's probably in my head. Trackdays are difficult to attend around here because the track requires you to have one piece leathers, which are expensive and I don't have. Do shinko and pirelli angel constitute modern sport tyres? Genuinely curious because I've read that on the road, most of the time it's impossible to take advantage of a proper sport tyre and that sticky sport tourers are enough.
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Jan 15, 2013 04:59
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Slavvy posted:SV650 K4. Not the best bike I've owned by far, but it's what circumstance has left me with and I'll take an average bike over no bike any day. I'll just have to force myself to push harder I guess; maybe I'm just not used to the front end being so crap. It just feels like the front end will sledge outward and crash me if I push it any harder; I know that's probably in my head. I had a SV650S of the same year. The front suspension isn't bad, it's not just good either, so I completely understand your trepidation. It had a tendancy to get hydraulic lock and if you were unlucky, throw a bit of a tank slapper your way (but that usually involved a lovely road surface, doing something stupid and the planets in alignment.) If you've got a few spare dollars and some time on your hands, putting a set of emulators and having the suspension properly setup can really make a huge difference to that bike. Slavvy posted:Do shinko and pirelli angel constitute modern sport tyres? Genuinely curious because I've read that on the road, most of the time it's impossible to take advantage of a proper sport tyre and that sticky sport tourers are enough. The speed I need to go on the track to melt a pair of street sport tyres would have left me as a smear over some guard rail a very long time ago on the road. Of course, I could be ham fisted, abusing the throttle and burn them up quicker, but nobody going truly fast ever looks like they're going fast. Content, me on a corner on Lakeside in Australia: 
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Jan 15, 2013 05:28
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Slavvy posted:Trackdays are difficult to attend around here because the track requires you to have one piece leathers, which are expensive and I don't have. Be like me and buy a lovely $100 1-piece suit off of CL. Horrible 90's colors/designs, a huge Ducati badge on the back, and the suit had aleady been down a couple of times. It looked like rear end but it got the job done. The pics are me at my first trackday at PIR. I rode the bike to the track, got a friend to bring me a gas can for a fill-up around lunch, rode home after.  
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Jan 15, 2013 08:01
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Check the BP on the dude in the back, maybe it's camera angle trickery but it looks like he's trying too hard (based on your BP)
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Jan 15, 2013 08:09
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SaNChEzZ posted:Check the BP on the dude in the back, maybe it's camera angle trickery but it looks like he's trying too hard (based on your BP) No, he was just a lot faster than us. I remember that guy and his GSXR1000, he was fast as poo poo. That corner we are in opens out onto the front straight, it's common to carry a lot of speed out of the corner and pass n00bs like myself on the outside coming out onto the straight.
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Jan 15, 2013 11:21
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Slavvy posted:
Wow, that's odd. Most of the bodies I've seen here in the US let you run with a set of two piece zip togethers.
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Jan 15, 2013 15:47
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If you're worried about stuff in the road, ride it slow once to size it up and then have another go.
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Jan 15, 2013 17:09
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Intentionally getting lost on the backroads of Sonoma County when I had time to kill was some of the most fun riding I ever had. Time to kill, middle of summer, weekday, GPS to guide me to my uncle's house when I was done. The roads were poo poo, but it didn't really bother me as much as I thought.quote:For road imperfections and whatnot, normally I'm super slow around blind corners. Ride as fast as you can see basically. If I can see all the way through the corner then game on, if not, take it slow. Picture unrelated
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Jan 15, 2013 19:01
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Ducati unveiled the new 2013 Desmosedici GP13, and it is orange. So very orange. Since we don't have a '13 racing thread yet and I'm not qualified to write one I'll post this here. Factory team, with Dovizioso and Hayden, respectively  Junior factory team, with Iannone and Spies, respectively I just realized that they have 1 Italian and 1 American on each team. via motomatters.com
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Jan 16, 2013 02:04
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