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Rabbit Hill posted:Hi, thread. I just learned that 1) Desmond from Lost is on this show, and 2) he is looking Handsome As gently caress on it, and welp. The first few episodes can be very YA and generally bad, but they absolutely don't represent the rest of the show; if you're not feeling it at first I'd suggest just powering through the early episodes, because poo poo gets real quite fast (around the time of the little girl plotline, and you'll know what I mean when you get to it). e: AFAIK this is because the show was being made alongside the book it's based on or something, but other than the premise and the initial few episodes almost nothing is shared between the two - the show runners decided (or where given permission, or whatever) to do their own thing and it turned out awesome. e2: Other things to know - Murphy, Octavia, and Kane are the best characters in the show, and absolutely pay very close attention to every scene with Kane in it for the first season for an excellent reward in later seasons. Also keep paper and a pencil handy to keep track of kill counts. 
WarLocke fucked around with this message at 01:50 on Apr 9, 2016 |
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Apr 9, 2016 01:46
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Pro tip: it's in the many hundreds.
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Apr 9, 2016 02:55
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WarLocke posted:e2: Other things to know - Murphy, Octavia, and Kane are the best characters in the show, and absolutely pay very close attention to every scene with Kane in it for the first season for an excellent reward in later seasons. Also keep paper and a pencil handy to keep track of kill counts. Except for most of the first season, you won't really like Murphy or Kane, although Octavia is alright during the first season. However, both Murphy and Kane turn out to be quite good characters.
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Apr 9, 2016 03:13
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This episode was pretty good but I'm a little disappointed at Ontari. The other episodes made her look so bad as. A remorseless efficient killer who'll do anything to get her throne. Cue this episode where she's a bumbling fool who has no plan beyond killing those kids and thinks she can kill everyone to get her way. I thought she'd be a smarter character than this.
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Apr 9, 2016 04:14
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Bitchface was expecting your man to give her the commander upgrade, now she's stuck in petulant teenager mode.
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Apr 9, 2016 04:16
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Dalael posted:This episode was pretty good but I'm a little disappointed at Ontari. The other episodes made her look so bad as. A remorseless efficient killer who'll do anything to get her throne. Cue this episode where she's a bumbling fool who has no plan beyond killing those kids and thinks she can kill everyone to get her way. I thought she'd be a smarter character than this. While she does seem to be a remorseless killer, I think that she has been lead around by the Ice Queen and now King and needs them to actually tell her what to do.
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Apr 9, 2016 04:18
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These Arkadians are in a really precarious position here with an evil robot in all their heads and literally all their neighbors trying to kill them, on any other show I would think, "This is bad but I know deep down that they'll survive the season" but here? lol
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Apr 9, 2016 04:42
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Well, the ALIE Hive Mind upgrade may or may not come with massive bonuses to accuracy and intelligence. Either way, effectively functioning as a single hyperintelligent entity with over a hundred bodies that you can coordinate perfectly has got to increase your chances of survival in pretty much any scenario, so... 
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Apr 9, 2016 04:50
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I really like Ontari  That eye business was brutal. Adding a voice to the countless others that Murphy shrugging his shoulders and bullshitting his way through everything was amazing. As for pike, I'm glad that story wrapped up but it was a little disappointing to have an authoritarian leader and a borg cult in the same place and not have them clash at any point. Seems like a missed opportunity. From the episode previous, but Lincoln's death kind of sucked. It didn't really advance too much, I thought that his death might be a turning point for Bellamy but Bellamy apparently turned before his death anyway? Then I thought maybe it would be to juxtapose Pike's refusal to turn himself in to spare his people with Lincoln's response to the same situation but nothing really came of it. It doesn't even really seem that Octavia's character has gained anything from it aside from more hatred for Bellamy, who was already out of the game when Lincoln died. Just a little disappointing for a major character to die in a relatively inconsequential way. It's made a bit worse knowing about the dispute with the showrunner, seems a little petty. I know some fans tried to spin into a racial injustice, but that felt forced and kind of like an effort to piggyback off the Lexa thing in my opinion.
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Apr 9, 2016 06:23
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MMM Whatchya Say posted:I really like Ontari Lincoln's death may matter for more than just octavia. Something about that Luna girl who's the only other weird blooded person who could take the Heda position other than Ontari. Lincoln was apparently the only person who knew where she was.
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Apr 9, 2016 06:30
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Dalael posted:Lincoln's death may matter for more than just octavia. Something about that Luna girl who's the only other weird blooded person who could take the Heda position other than Ontari. Lincoln was apparently the only person who knew where she was. Yeah it's true, we don't know the full results yet. I was thinking after the previous episode that we don't really know what the impact would be, but this latest episode made it seem fairly inconsequential. Pike got pretty quickly removed through separate circumstances and the only direct result seemed to be Octavia beating the poo poo out of Bellamy. Which was fine. The Luna thing throws a kink in the works but I don't think that's an advancement of the plot as much as it a kind of chain yanking 'your princess is in another castle' type thing. Lincoln knew where she was, but they never said he was the only one who knew. I feel like the logical progression is Indra being like "yup, BoatKru is to the east" and the plot surging on.
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Apr 9, 2016 06:38
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This show is loving great.
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Apr 9, 2016 10:18
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It's almost shame Pike didn't get to take Kane and the others back to Arcadia, only to find out it had been overrun by zombies while he was out.
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Apr 9, 2016 10:31
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Liked the episode much better than the last cause of them starting to converge the different plots. I thought the doctor mom lady was going to do a fake-out and spit the chip out and let Raven die because yes they're friends but is one life really worth saving if it means effectively killing everyone else?
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Apr 9, 2016 11:32
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WarLocke posted:The first few episodes can be very YA and generally bad, but they absolutely don't represent the rest of the show; if you're not feeling it at first I'd suggest just powering through the early episodes, because poo poo gets real quite fast (around the time of the little girl plotline, and you'll know what I mean when you get to it). [and others] Sounds cool, thanks!
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Apr 9, 2016 14:52
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MMM Whatchya Say posted:I really like Ontari I want to hate Murphy, but his refusal to die in the face of increasingly dangerous circumstances is just so endearing. MMM Whatchya Say posted:From the episode previous, but Lincoln's death kind of sucked. It didn't really advance too much, I thought that his death might be a turning point for Bellamy but Bellamy apparently turned before his death anyway? Then I thought maybe it would be to juxtapose Pike's refusal to turn himself in to spare his people with Lincoln's response to the same situation but nothing really came of it. It doesn't even really seem that Octavia's character has gained anything from it aside from more hatred for Bellamy, who was already out of the game when Lincoln died. Just a little disappointing for a major character to die in a relatively inconsequential way. It's made a bit worse knowing about the dispute with the showrunner, seems a little petty. I know some fans tried to spin into a racial injustice, but that felt forced and kind of like an effort to piggyback off the Lexa thing in my opinion. I wonder how the Alie Borg Collective would have affected things if not for the plot this episode that took Pike out of the picture. I imagine that he would have found himself with vanishingly little influence over the people of Arkadia, which would have been interesting to see. raditts fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Apr 9, 2016 |
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Apr 9, 2016 15:05
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Yeah it seems like there were a lot of things they could have done with pike and the zombie men. It's maybe a bit cliche in its own way but they could have forced pike's crew to work with the Rebels when they realize they're the only ones with minds left. E: suppose the audience would still need the catharsis of seeing pike get what's coming to him though.
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Apr 9, 2016 15:57
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It could be interesting to see Pike interact with the Allieborg, but once he ventured so far from Arkadia his card was punched for a dance with the Grounders (pretty sure that's a mixed metaphor but whatever). The Allieborg could only take over once he was gone, because he had shut down Jaha on Abby's behest and probably would have been very suspicious of a sudden heel turn on her part. Once he was gone Jaha forced Abby to take the chip/blue pill and they got the chip maker out of Pike's office. Really liked this episode and Clarke nearly being run over by Jasper's Great Escape and then immediately joining him was perfect. 
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Apr 9, 2016 16:46
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hollylolly posted:Really liked this episode and Clarke nearly being run over by Jasper's Great Escape and then immediately joining him was perfect. loved that bit. Thinking about the perspectives of the individual characters and how chaotic it was to both of them is really amusing to me. Clarke shows up with her important mission to see everything going to a special kind of hell and jasper is about to get away when suddenly he has to deal with clarke going on about Lincoln and a Luna. Good stuff. I liked the whole episode in general actually. Better than the previous one and the stories coming together is pretty satisfying.
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Apr 9, 2016 17:05
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hollylolly posted:Really liked this episode and Clarke nearly being run over by Jasper's Great Escape and then immediately joining him was perfect. "Why did you nearly run me over I'm here for something important!" "Don't care, get in the loving car!" "What the gently caress is going on here?!" "I SAID GET IN THE CAR." Everything about that scene and the sheer confused desperation of it was wonderful.
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Apr 9, 2016 17:05
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It's good because it's a role-reversal for Clarke. Usually she is the one stirring up poo poo and running to characters and saying " THERES NO TIME TO EXPLAIN FOLLOW ME" and they do it because she is Clarke.
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Apr 9, 2016 17:11
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Zebulon posted:"Why did you nearly run me over I'm here for something important!" "Don't care, get in the loving car!" "What the gently caress is going on here?!" "I SAID GET IN THE CAR." Yeah it's not often that Clarke is the one in the dark. As mentioned, she's typically the plot carrier so when she's the one who has to just kind of follow along until she's relevant it's pretty amazing.  I just can't believe that this show is basically doing the Borg and it's still awesome.
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Apr 9, 2016 18:57
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Dalael posted:This episode was pretty good but I'm a little disappointed at Ontari. The other episodes made her look so bad as. A remorseless efficient killer who'll do anything to get her throne. Cue this episode where she's a bumbling fool who has no plan beyond killing those kids and thinks she can kill everyone to get her way. I thought she'd be a smarter character than this. Actually it's perfect because you see how vulnerable she is without the AI chip and therefore dependent on Murphy to survive and vice versa. It's a deliciously symbiotic relationship.
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Apr 9, 2016 21:05
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It's also nice to have a villain in the show that isn't hypercompetent with a game-changer agenda. Ontari's basically just someone who was raised by an awful person and taught that her destiny is to rule, then finds out her destiny was stolen from her and the only person that can help her wants to survive as much as she does, but can only trust him with a short leash (heh). She's good at one thing, killing people, and not much else in the way of her toolkit, and will revert to it when no other choice is present.
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Apr 9, 2016 22:30
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WarLocke posted:Yeah it's not often that Clarke is the one in the dark. As mentioned, she's typically the plot carrier so when she's the one who has to just kind of follow along until she's relevant it's pretty amazing.  "Jasper, where's Lincoln?! I need to advance the A Plot!" "BITCH, YOU JUST FOUND THE A PLOT. GET IN THE loving CAR."Also, I like the Jaha had to be the one to push ALIE into torturing Raven. Like torturing someone into complicity either did not occur to her or is outside of her parameters in some way. ALIE in general is surprisingly interesting for an evil AI character in that she seems to think that in some way she has humanity's best interests at heart. Maybe she thinks 'preserving' them in the City of Light and removing them from the real world is the ideal solution for both humans and the world.
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Apr 9, 2016 22:47
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Spergatory posted:Also, I like the Jaha had to be the one to push ALIE into torturing Raven. Like torturing someone into complicity either did not occur to her or is outside of her parameters in some way. ALIE in general is surprisingly interesting for an evil AI character in that she seems to think that in some way she has humanity's best interests at heart. Maybe she thinks 'preserving' them in the City of Light and removing them from the real world is the ideal solution for both humans and the world. Yeah this is really loving creepy. Remember that crusader Jaha basically already started off with little regard for the singular human life when he was obsessed with finding the City of Light and saving Arkadia, and with ALIE in his head he's actually feeding her techniques that she couldn't have done on her own programming to achieve their goals.
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Apr 9, 2016 22:49
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"So we could live. And because you can row." 
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Apr 9, 2016 22:59
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How did Jaha get to be a chancellor, given that he is the most easily fooled moron in the history of humanity.
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Apr 9, 2016 23:02
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The scary part of the whole story is that I'm not sure Jaha is being fooled. I'm pretty sure he means it when he pushes ALIE to take away all free will and forcefully borg everyone. This would fit with shows most prevalent theme - "people doing unspeakable evil because they think it's the right thing to do". I just watched the episode again because I was thinking about it a little too much. The Raven stuff is fantastic and the ending is great but man, Murphy is the loving best character. "The things I do to survive...." 
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Apr 9, 2016 23:15
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I'm not talking just about Alie. Jaha has been wrong about literally everything in the show, and he's been hallucinatory since S1. Obviously him surrendering to the AI is just the final step in Jaha, the weakling, endangering human survival.
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Apr 9, 2016 23:19
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Yeah idk, Allie Borgs everybody up and they all instantly do what she says except for Jaha, who she seems to take advice from. It's an important distinction because I don't think he's as brainfucked right now as anybody else and is actively choosing for this stuff to happen.
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Apr 9, 2016 23:33
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MMM Whatchya Say posted:Yeah idk, Allie Borgs everybody up and they all instantly do what she says except for Jaha, who she seems to take advice from. It's an important distinction because I don't think he's as brainfucked right now as anybody else and is actively choosing for this stuff to happen. He's just a literal psychopath is all.
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Apr 9, 2016 23:54
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A psychopath would be choosing things to happen to serve his own interests... Jaha is currently just a zombie.
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Apr 10, 2016 00:07
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enraged_camel posted:Actually it's perfect because you see how vulnerable she is without the AI chip and therefore dependent on Murphy to survive and vice versa. It's a deliciously symbiotic relationship. It makes it cool for the whole symbiotic relationship, I agree. It allowed Murphy to shine in this episode. But I just expected her to be more than a bumbling fool who need direction.  hope and vaseline posted:It's also nice to have a villain in the show that isn't hypercompetent with a game-changer agenda. Ontari's basically just someone who was raised by an awful person and taught that her destiny is to rule, then finds out her destiny was stolen from her and the only person that can help her wants to survive as much as she does, but can only trust him with a short leash (heh). She's good at one thing, killing people, and not much else in the way of her toolkit, and will revert to it when no other choice is present. Its an interesting way to seeing it. I'll try and keep an open mind about this, see where it leads.
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Apr 10, 2016 00:36
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steinrokkan posted:A psychopath would be choosing things to happen to serve his own interests... Jaha is currently just a zombie. I don't think so. I think Jaha simply sees himself as the savior of the human race, and he believes that the city of Light is THE way to save humans. He's just a guy with a delusion of grandeur. Much like he ways in the other seasons, but this time he has an AI that pretty much validates his vision of himself.
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Apr 10, 2016 00:41
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Dalael posted:I don't think so. I think Jaha simply sees himself as the savior of the human race, and he believes that the city of Light is THE way to save humans. He's just a guy with a delusion of grandeur. Much like he ways in the other seasons, but this time he has an AI that pretty much validates his vision of himself. Basically this. Jaha hallucinated himself into being the messiah for his people, and drat anyone who gets in his way. If anything, Jaha is the only person who is basically not a zombie after joining the City of Light, he's actively making decisions and influencing the AI that he's working with. There's actually a cool parallel I didn't see before with him and Ontari, they both fanatical people that believe fiercely in their destiny.
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Apr 10, 2016 00:48
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Dalael posted:I don't think so. I think Jaha simply sees himself as the savior of the human race, and he believes that the city of Light is THE way to save humans. He's just a guy with a delusion of grandeur. Much like he ways in the other seasons, but this time he has an AI that pretty much validates his vision of himself. There's no way distinguishing between Jaha's vision and utter mental subjugation of new recruits. Jaha may be a voluntary zombie, but he's still a zombie.
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Apr 10, 2016 00:52
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Dalael posted:It makes it cool for the whole symbiotic relationship, I agree. It allowed Murphy to shine in this episode. But I just expected her to be more than a bumbling fool who need direction. I don't think it's a big deal that the character who has been in two episodes needs some development. E: I also don't think it's ridiculous that a young person who is in her first few days of being emperor in a really hosed up succession situation is having trouble figuring out what to do. steinrokkan posted:There's no way distinguishing between Jaha's vision and utter mental subjugation of new recruits. Jaha may be a voluntary zombie, but he's still a zombie. Allie says a thing and the mob rises, but Jaha is still sitting. He controls himself still. Also, Allie tells other people what to do, he's told Allie to things on occasion
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Apr 10, 2016 00:54
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MMM Whatchya Say posted:I don't think it's a big deal that the character who has been in two episodes needs some development. yeah you're right about Ontari. I think my expectations were just so high because so far, we had only seen her bad rear end side. As I said, I'll see where it leads. It can definitely be an interesting development.
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Apr 10, 2016 00:59
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We haven't been able to see her cool and calculating side because she was probably expecting the ascension to imbue it to her.
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Apr 10, 2016 01:02
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