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Gooch181 posted:edit: wait why the hell did I give my undead hunter charisma instead of dex? uuuugh The minimum amount of charisma a paladin can have is 17.
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Jun 17, 2020 17:01
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Lmao that's right, thank you for reminding me and setting my mind at ease.
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Jun 17, 2020 17:04
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Looks fine, no need to optimize further unless you go full powergaming.
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Jun 17, 2020 17:08
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Rolling a paladin with decent physical stats is a little maddening because you have 30 points automatically wasted in 2 stats that do nothing at all.
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Jun 17, 2020 17:08
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That party should have no issues with IWD class or statswise, assuming you end up getting decent gear for most of your fighter-types you should be golden. While the game does have oodles of undead, Sleep might not be a bad idea for a lvl 1 spell?
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Jun 17, 2020 17:09
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Rappaport posted:That party should have no issues with IWD class or statswise, assuming you end up getting decent gear for most of your fighter-types you should be golden. While the game does have oodles of undead, Sleep might not be a bad idea for a lvl 1 spell? I considered that but figured it'd lose usefulness as the game progressed, and didn't want to risk wasting one of the sorcerer slots. I'm 100% open for suggestions for spells for the druid and sorcerer!
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Jun 17, 2020 17:45
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I would go with more wisdom on the druid. That is her spell stat. Min 15 CHA is enough. The Bard and Paladin cover your shopping bonus. Bards get so much lore, you barely need the identify spell anymore. Spells for Druids all summons are nice Sun scorch Entangle Summon Insects Wall of Moonlight Spells for Sorcerer most Evocation stuff (elemental flavoured stuff goes BOOM) is fine Grease Web Glitterdust Slow Haste You can cover Enchantment almost completely with the Bard. "Spook" is amazing with a character class with fast levelling OutofSight fucked around with this message at 07:28 on Jun 18, 2020 |
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Jun 17, 2020 17:48
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OutofSight posted:I would go with more wisdom on the druid. That is her spell stat. Min 15 CHA is enough. The Bard and Paladin cover your shopping bonus. Aw crap I must have just mixed them up. Thanks!
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Jun 17, 2020 17:53
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Got me wanting to try another IWD run now... I had tried it a few years ago and didn’t stick with it despite playing BG1/2 frequently. Maybe after I beat PoE I’ll give it a go
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Jun 17, 2020 18:06
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Feeling good about picking grease, so far.   Going to do one last loop around down to make sure I didn't miss any XP before setting out with Hrothgar. A few of my folks hit level 2, and the others shouldn't be far behind.
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Jun 17, 2020 18:46
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I really hope you picked the voice set for the male that is the same guy who voices Squidward. I'll never get tired of that. Hope you enjoy Icewind Dale, it's one of my favourite RPGs because the music and art are just so beautiful. It's a really atmospheric game.
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Jun 17, 2020 19:01
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Grease is probably better than sleep just because you spend a good chunk of the early game fighting undead, so you're one spell is mostly useless.
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Jun 17, 2020 19:11
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Suspicious posted:Rolling a paladin with decent physical stats is a little maddening because you have 30 points automatically wasted in 2 stats that do nothing at all. I always thought the game corrected ability score rolls upwards to the class minimums, so you'd actually get better rolls on Paladins and the like?
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Jun 17, 2020 20:19
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Zeerust posted:I always thought the game corrected ability score rolls upwards to the class minimums, so you'd actually get better rolls on Paladins and the like? Better totals yes, but it's actually harder to convert those points to what you want. Imagine you're rolling a fighter, you want to pump Strength, Dex, and Con. You roll 10s on everything, your stat total is 60. You can now take up to 7 points away from your charisma and 7 points away from your wisdom, and put them into the stats you care about. Now imagine you're rolling a paladin, you want to pump Strength, Dex, and Con. You roll 10s on everything, but because paladins have a minimum of 13 Wisdom and 17 Charisma, it bumps those stats up to 13 and 17. Your stat total is 70, ten points better than the fighter, but because you can't take any points AWAY from your wisdom or charisma, you're actually 14 points worse off, because those extra points went to stats that don't help you, and prevent you from putting them into the stats that do.
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Jun 17, 2020 20:25
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Skwirl posted:I feel like a mage/cleric in BG1 would be really annoying to play, I guess you have more spells to cast, but you have to wait so much longer to gain levels and it's still not enough spells to be casting them every fight. multis are only ever like 1 level behind at most so they aren't that much worse than your average caster. Plus there are those rings that give you a shitload more divine and arcane spell slots so it's not a big deal either way.
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Jun 17, 2020 23:03
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Also you're going to be using wands 90% of the time anyway.
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Jun 18, 2020 00:38
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bike tory posted:multis are only ever like 1 level behind at most so they aren't that much worse than your average caster. Plus there are those rings that give you a shitload more divine and arcane spell slots so it's not a big deal either way. But the wait for third level spells as a mage is loving agonizing.
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Jun 18, 2020 01:10
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Things have been relatively smooth in my IWD run, until I hit the second level of Kresselack's tomb. Gonna have to try and get a few enemies at a time, because there are a shitload. I've tried to use Turn Undead on my F/cleric and undead hunter, but I think they are too low level for it to do anything.
Gooch181 fucked around with this message at 06:18 on Jun 18, 2020 |
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Jun 18, 2020 05:43
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Unless you're trying to turn mummies or something, you should have a chance to turn most low-hit die undead. It's random, though. At low level in 2nd Ed. you have no chance to destroy, just to turn.
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Jun 18, 2020 06:31
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Hmm, I wonder if the melee scripts I put on them are just instantly cancelling it. I'll have to try without that on.
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Jun 18, 2020 06:38
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Gooch181 posted:Hmm, I wonder if the melee scripts I put on them are just instantly cancelling it. I'll have to try without that on. That could very much be it.
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Jun 18, 2020 06:41
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I guarantee that’s it
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Jun 18, 2020 07:03
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Gooch181 posted:Feeling good about picking grease, so far. Grease gets interesting when you get to the 3rd major dungeon. You can have the bard throw web and the sorcerer can throw grease on top of it. That was anyone that doesn't get caught in the web it likely to get caught in their second save since they're moving through slower due to web. It's fun picking off a dozen monsters that way. I will say that you absolutely should not bother with stinking cloud with your sorcerer. There are just too many undead to bother with it when web exists.
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Jun 18, 2020 15:27
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Finished Kresselack's Tomb and have been instructed to search for a druid artifact in the next area. I have a decent nestegg of gold and there's a bunch of tempting items for sale in Kuldahar; I'm having trouble deciding if I should buy some of them, and which ones might be highest priority. I've got like 19.6K gold. Most of the fancy weapons are out of my budget, but there's some plate armor+1 and the Helm of the Trusted Defender tempting me. There's a robe that sounds like it'd give my sorcerer and extra daily cast of a level one spell, and a cloak with some damage resist. Hard choices! My crew is starting to get semi-beefy.      
Gooch181 fucked around with this message at 20:37 on Jun 18, 2020 |
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Jun 18, 2020 20:33
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Don't be afraid to turn your halfling into a melee monster if you get a +strength item I'd throw it on him first. Anytime you are having a really hard time with a mage he can run up and gib it before the battle even starts, and he gets AC bonuses for being small.
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Jun 18, 2020 20:48
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I personally have always been very fond of how 2nd edition handled multiclassing, apart from the limited race/class combinations. If I want to be a druid/thief or paladin/mage, let me. That said, dual-classing was rubbish.
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Jun 18, 2020 20:49
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Gooch181 posted:Finished Kresselack's Tomb and have been instructed to search for a druid artifact in the next area. I have a decent nestegg of gold and there's a bunch of tempting items for sale in Kuldahar; I'm having trouble deciding if I should buy some of them, and which ones might be highest priority. I've got like 19.6K gold. Most of the fancy weapons are out of my budget, but there's some plate armor+1 and the Helm of the Trusted Defender tempting me. There's a robe that sounds like it'd give my sorcerer and extra daily cast of a level one spell, and a cloak with some damage resist. Hard choices! All good shopping choices, I often buy the plate mail and the robe. You've quite a while before you get Full Plate. You're unlikely to need to buy any weapons, you should find enough of them as loot, especially longswords and axes.
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Jun 18, 2020 21:00
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I went ahead and got the plate+1, the robe, and the resistance cloak. The bag of holding was *really* tempting, I'll have to come back for that when I can.
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Jun 18, 2020 21:15
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Just a minor point, you should put helmets on your fighter/thief and druid, it might save a life one day
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Jun 18, 2020 21:17
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Theres a ton of them laying around in the Vale crypts, I'll go grab another load worth of stuff tonight. Can the druid use metal helms?
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Jun 18, 2020 21:24
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Gooch181 posted:Theres a ton of them laying around in the Vale crypts, I'll go grab another load worth of stuff tonight. Can the druid use metal helms? Should be able to, yes.
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Jun 18, 2020 21:27
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Druid's look awesome in the non-magical helm you find in the tomb just south of Kresselek's
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Jun 18, 2020 22:39
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JustJeff88 posted:I personally have always been very fond of how 2nd edition handled multiclassing, apart from the limited race/class combinations. If I want to be a druid/thief or paladin/mage, let me. That said, dual-classing was rubbish. Looping back around to 2e from 3e onwards really gave me an appreciation for how good it was, compared with the lego block charop nightmare that comes from how 3/5e handled it. Having the xp requirements based on class level rather than the overall character level makes so much more sense. Dual classing is weird, but I feel like that has more to do with how BG had to implement it vs. the original concept. In tabletop it's basically a mechanical explanation of how a character might choose to leave their current profession and learn a new skillset; you wouldn't be unable to use your first class' abilities, but your XP gains would be severely limited if you did. Also, IIRC there was no limit on the number of times you could dual class?
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Jun 19, 2020 07:13
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Zeerust posted:Looping back around to 2e from 3e onwards really gave me an appreciation for how good it was, compared with the lego block charop nightmare that comes from how 3/5e handled it. Having the xp requirements based on class level rather than the overall character level makes so much more sense. I'm looking at the 2ed players hand book, dual classing is a single page and says "a dual class character is one who starts with a single class, advances to moderate level, and then changes to a second character class and starts over. the character retains the benefits and abilities of the first class but never again earns experience for using them. there are some limitations on combining the abilities of the two classes but as long as the minimum ability and alignment restrictions are met, there are no restrictions on possible character class combinations" It follows up with "but if he uses any of his previous class's abilities during an encounter, he earns no exp for that encounter and only half exp for the adventure.....the only values that can be carried over are hit dice and hit points.....the character earns no additional hit dice or hit points while advancing in his new class" This carries on until they reach equal level with the previous class then the restrictions are lifted and now abide by the current class restrictions and can gain Hit Die and hit points again. There is no limit to the number of classes the player can take as long as they have the ability scores. Their book example is a cleric who reaches level 3, has a 17 in str, and decides to switch to a fighter. He keeps his 3d8 hp, 14 hp, until he reaches fighter level 4, at which point he rolls 1d10 for hp. Now he's advances as fighter with the spells of a 3rd level cleric. there's a weird feature where you can reverse it if level drained, like if it was a 4th level cleric dueled to a 3rd level fighter hit with a level drain attack it drops the player to a 3rd level cleric. Since both classes are equal you could choose to level as the cleric instead with the fighter abilities stalled. pentyne fucked around with this message at 07:52 on Jun 19, 2020 |
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Jun 19, 2020 07:44
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I feel exactly the opposite re: 2 and 3 e. 2e sucks and 3e is way better. Especially levelling up, where in 2e fighters just roll for hit points and occasionally pick another weapon skill, the end.
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Jun 19, 2020 12:18
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Chairchucker posted:I feel exactly the opposite re: 2 and 3 e. 2e sucks and 3e is way better. 3e got too crazy with the splat books and hundreds of classes for an unlimited number of permutations but it was pretty straight forward if you built towards a goal in mind. NWN2 is a good example of a in-game system for explaining the basics of the leveling system but without knowing 13 int for feat X and dip 1 level into class Y for any class using sneak etc. you can build a useless character very quickly. That power gamey stuff was painful to try to figure out and my biggest problem with Pathfinder KM. It looks and plays like a modern BG2 style game but everything going on under the surface assumes mastery of Pathfinder 3.5e mechanics plus the game's difficulty curve is built around the same, using every exploit and advantage possible or you'll get crushed. Just trying to read the thread about it feels like reading Greek and even the people who enjoy it admit its got some truly bullshit design choices.
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Jun 19, 2020 12:32
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If I were going to talk about editions of D&D that had good Fighters, I would definitely not start with 3rd. At least 2e Fighters actually had a niche, even if you had to submit to the horrifying ideal of using your imagination to do anything more interesting than say 'I attack the guy.' E: VVV 4e Fighters were excellent. In fact, all the Martial classes were great, and 5e's regressive treatment of martials was one of the most disappointing aspects of its design. Well, behind hiring, supporting and enabling neo-Nazis and sexual predators, anyway. VVV Zeerust fucked around with this message at 15:31 on Jun 19, 2020 |
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Jun 19, 2020 14:52
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I liked fighters in 4th edition  It’s a shame there weren’t any proper 4th edition game adaptations. My group ended up spending all our time theorycrafting and planning the best skill combos instead of roleplaying anyways. It would have been pretty cool to play D&D XCOM.
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Jun 19, 2020 15:04
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The reason that I liked the 2e multiclassing system was because it worked so well with the logarithmic experience table. A single-class character with XXX experience could be effective while a multi-class character with (.5*XXX) experience in each of two classes was only a bit behind in full levels and could also be effective; my only complaints were the artificial restrictions on class combos that cannot even be modded out of IE games. 3e completely buggered this surprisingly elegant system, but 3e was all about overpowered prestige classes anyway.Fruits of the sea posted:I liked fighters in 4th edition I regret not getting to play 4e in general, I regret not getting to play a Warlord because that is very much my cup of tea, and I regret that they never made a kick-arse TRPG using 4e rules.
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Jun 19, 2020 19:41
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Yeah no matter how you feel about the system in general warlords and brawler fighters were two very great things about 4e, I was lucky enough to get to play both. It would have made such a great video game.
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Jun 19, 2020 20:07
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