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Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Interesting with the implications that advanced prosthetics, robotics and bionic technology where Hell is clearly ahead of the mortal world seems to be Asmodeus' specialty. ...makes sense.

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Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Happy Landfill posted:

Good news everyone! According to the closed captions, all of Fizz's dogs made it home safe :kimchi:

also they're called quieves



yeah, i kinda assumed they were fine since they tore that dude apart pretty quick.

Space Cadet Omoly
Jan 15, 2014

~Groovy~


Ghost Leviathan posted:

Interesting with the implications that advanced prosthetics, robotics and bionic technology where Hell is clearly ahead of the mortal world seems to be Asmodeus' specialty. ...makes sense.

If you want to make the best vibrators you have to have the best tech, it's only logical.

Megillah Gorilla
Sep 22, 2003

If only all of life's problems could be solved by smoking a professor of ancient evil texts.



Bread Liar
Just heard there was an animatic for the latest episode which got leaked which has a scene that was removed from the final version.

When we see the flashback to the circus fire and Fizzarolli crawls out of the fire and sees Blitzo run away, there's a cut to another tent with fire spewing out the door. We see his sister, Barbie Wire runnning of there, just ahead of the flames. Then Blitzo says, "Mum" and runs off to the tent.

It also never actually clicked with me before that Blitzo's white patches on his face were scars from where he was burned.


edit: all from this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5o8q2QPlW8&t=91s


It also cleared up why Blitzo pushed the imp with the cake away and accidentally started the fire in the first place. His dad, who treated Blitzo like crap and favoured Fizz, gave him a birthday card with "Wish YOU were my son" on it.

Megillah Gorilla fucked around with this message at 07:31 on Sep 14, 2023

Pyrotoad
Oct 24, 2010


Illegal Hen

Flopsy posted:

I actually really like the direction of a bunch of these characters being initially shown as "villains" only for it to become clear down the line they're just people Blitzo hosed over who are understandably bitter about it. I really do want to see Verosika get her moment in the sun because from what little we heard about it Blitzo really did a number on the poor girl. Bad sex life, stealing from her, mocking her for her work as succubus (I mean what else is she supposed to do?) Just really nasty stuff all around. The only bad things Blitzo has to say about her are her drinking problem and her literally being a sex worker. Top it off with it being implied she developed the drinking habit as a way to cope with him and it spiraled from there.

The seeds for Verosika getting her turn have definitely been planted - "A reckless heartbreaking freak" was not how I expected her verse in Ozzie's song to end. She starts out exclusively mocking his bedroom failures, but by the end the real source of her anger and hurt comes through.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Also, really, Verosika is a succubus from a society where having in a loving relationship is seen as a sign of weakness and betraying your values, that she went to the point of being in a presumably monogamous relationshop with Blitzo, where everyone who hears about it is shocked he managed to land her, and he managed to gently caress it up was probably a hell of a betrayal for her.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Pyrotoad posted:

The seeds for Verosika getting her turn have definitely been planted - "A reckless heartbreaking freak" was not how I expected her verse in Ozzie's song to end. She starts out exclusively mocking his bedroom failures, but by the end the real source of her anger and hurt comes through.

honestly. my guess is verosika found him genuinly funny or something and they were happy but then blitz was blitz and wreacked that poo poo.

MJeff
Jun 2, 2011

THE LIAR

Pyrotoad posted:

The seeds for Verosika getting her turn have definitely been planted - "A reckless heartbreaking freak" was not how I expected her verse in Ozzie's song to end. She starts out exclusively mocking his bedroom failures, but by the end the real source of her anger and hurt comes through.

I think they were laying the foundation from that from her first appearance. Verosika has always been presented as genuinely angry and hurt by Blitz. Somebody else pointed it out, Blitz is just insulting her job and her drinking problem and she's like "dude, you ditched me and stole my car and my credit cards!" and Blitz is just like "drat, get over it, bitch. 🙄"

Although she does get a dig in at his sister being in rehab. And then she and her succubuddies give a bit of the ol' opposite-of-consensual touching to Mox, so, y'know. She's not perfect, either. But, it is hell.

MJeff fucked around with this message at 15:41 on Sep 14, 2023

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

MJeff posted:

I think they were laying the foundation from that from her first appearance. Verosika has always been presented as genuinely angry and hurt by Blitz. Somebody else pointed it out, Blitz is just insulting her job and her drinking problem and she's like "dude, you ditched me and stole my car and my credit cards!" and Blitz is just like "drat, get over it, bitch. 🙄"

Although she does get a dig in at his sister being in rehab. And then she and her succubuddies give a bit of the ol' opposite-of-consensual touching to Mox, so, y'know. She's not perfect, either. But, it is hell.

That dig about rehab might be twofold as she's implying that Blitzo is the common denominator for people ending up there. The latter....yeah not my favorite scene if I'm being honest. They could've just beat him up the nonconsensual part is kinda just eugh...I take solace in that at least his pants stayed on.

Flopsy fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Sep 14, 2023

Happy Landfill
Feb 26, 2011

I don't understand but I've also heard much worse

Pyrotoad posted:

The seeds for Verosika getting her turn have definitely been planted - "A reckless heartbreaking freak" was not how I expected her verse in Ozzie's song to end. She starts out exclusively mocking his bedroom failures, but by the end the real source of her anger and hurt comes through.

This new episode gives me hope that Verosika's follow-up will be really good. Seriously, I love all the character work being done this season

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

Dapper_Swindler posted:

honestly. my guess is verosika found him genuinly funny or something and they were happy but then blitz was blitz and wreacked that poo poo.

Blitz is an interesting character since, as I've put it, he's got very prominent positive AND negative traits, in the Byronic Hero tradition. He's passionate, sentimental, charismatic and genuine, but he's also mercurial and prone to mood-swings, quite possibly neurodivergent by his own admission if his hesitation to use the r-word is any indication, and has terrible impulse control- and wildly swinging self-esteem. Been said that he seems to crave love and acceptance but also doesn't feel deserving of it, and is afraid to show affection, hence he self-sabotages his relationships- he's not wrong that his relationship with Stolas isn't on equal footing, but he's also pretty clearly toying with Stolas in turn and not just to take advantage or petty revenge. (Which unfortunately can make him pretty relatable, as that's basically toxic masculinity 101. A recurring theme in this show.)

It's very easy to imagine how he might have screwed up his relationship with Verosika, especially with the hints we've gotten- that he might well have gotten insecure and resentful over her being more successful and wealthy than he is, and came to take her for granted and took advantage of her. (Hence the mentions of being terrible in bed and taking advantage of her money- running off with her credit cards for horse riding lessons and all. Feels like one of those things where Vero might well have been interested herself if he'd just asked) Thing is about turning to drug habits in particular is that it feels like something that results not just from Blitz being a toxic influence but from having to put up with an initial good relationship that deteriorated badly until they cut him off.

Also makes the last episode a clear turning point where Blitz is coming clean and clearing the air with Fizz; both stating that the disaster was a genuine accident, and that he still admits fault and feels guilty over it, being entirely sincere for once in a way that actually comes off as believable. Funny thing is it seems like he also learns a thing or two from his experiences with Fizz, and maybe having the crazed, near-feral open supremacist be the one who agrees with him seems to have him genuinely self-examining a bit.

Flopsy posted:

I wonder if they're setting us up with a couple reasonable Sins who rule wisely and don't have any overarching ambitions to contrast them with much shittier ones down the line. I get the feeling Mammon is going to be an absolute rear end in a top hat just by all the shady set up around him. I.E. i strongly suspect he isolated Fizz to make him easier to control as an asset. And I don't remember what interview I heard it in but Mammon absolutely has complete control of Fizz's finances. In other words Fizzarolli lives a luxurious lifestyle only because of Ozzie not because he has any real financial means of his own. It's a genuinely sad power dynamic that as a celebrity Fizzarolli should be more of an equal to Asmodeus but by comparison he's literally a pauper because he never sees a cent of it.

Oh, Fizz's backstory is definitely a mix of Robocop but for entertainment and celebrities who are drat near property of their studio/producer and live off perks entirely on their whims. The extortionate ransom contract Crimson was trying to pull that would render Ozzie his puppet is definitely Mammon's bread and butter.

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Oh, Fizz's backstory is definitely a mix of Robocop but for entertainment and celebrities who are drat near property of their studio/producer and live off perks entirely on their whims. The extortionate ransom contract Crimson was trying to pull that would render Ozzie his puppet is definitely Mammon's bread and butter.

I'm wondering if Ozzie's reluctance to let Fizz go off alone to see Mammon also stems from the fact Mammon uses him as a means of controlling his brother. Ozzie is shown to be a genuine entrepreneur for example. He clearly has a background in engineering and has a workshop in the palace where he can work on his inventions in addition to upkeep on Fizz's prosthetics. He also clearly has very high standards on quality as opposed to Mammon to whom safety standards are a faaaar second to getting something on the market fast. Ozzie's focus on quality has made himself and his Ring stinkin' rich if the decor and the infrastructure is any kind of indicator. I can easily see mammon envying his wealth and wanting some means of getting his hands on it. Enter the worst kept secret in hell--it's currently really vague what Fizz's involvement with Mammon entails but likely Mammon still owns him body and soul. And because of that if he for example wanted to take Fizz away he could easily and legally do so. in a weird way he could be using Fizz to keep Asmodeus under his thumb so he gets a cut of Lust's profit margins. And Ozzie understandably is really skeeved out and nervous about the guy being near Fizz alone at any time hence his overprotectiveness. In weird way while ozzie and Fizz have healthier relationship than Stolas and Blitzo they're probably having an even harder time of it due to their higher profiles and what that means for them. Mammon could technically tear them apart at any time he wants and Ozzie probably pays him off just to keep Fizz with him.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Oh, Mammon's definitely going to be a monster, we've seen the Sins so far be surprisingly sympathetic characters, but think is Gluttony and Lust are considered downright quaint as 'sins' go these days by all but the most puritan and openly bigoted, given the modern context around food and sex. Irresponsible drinking and being a horny pervert is one thing, while greed is very blatantly destroying the world.

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Oh, Mammon's definitely going to be a monster, we've seen the Sins so far be surprisingly sympathetic characters, but think is Gluttony and Lust are considered downright quaint as 'sins' go these days by all but the most puritan and openly bigoted, given the modern context around food and sex. Irresponsible drinking and being a horny pervert is one thing, while greed is very blatantly destroying the world.

I do like how they show that through the Greed ring looking almost post-apocalyptic with everyone ready to kill each other at a moment's notice and the natural environment is just absolutely ruined. There's also an interesting detail during Fizz's entrance that shows the bank doors blown off and bunch of money just spilling out and nobody's touching it. I think inflation is so through the loving roof there that loans are probably the only way people pay things off and physical money is close to useless. Hence Loan Sharks being the dominant demon class. We haven't been given any other hints about the other Sins just yet but if I had to guess who else is a major rear end in a top hat I'm leaning toward Leviathan just because Envy can get pretty nasty too.

I Am Fowl
Mar 8, 2008

nononononono
Wrath seems like a pretty alright ring from what little we've seen.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Blitz is an interesting character since, as I've put it, he's got very prominent positive AND negative traits, in the Byronic Hero tradition. He's passionate, sentimental, charismatic and genuine, but he's also mercurial and prone to mood-swings, quite possibly neurodivergent by his own admission if his hesitation to use the r-word is any indication, and has terrible impulse control- and wildly swinging self-esteem. Been said that he seems to crave love and acceptance but also doesn't feel deserving of it, and is afraid to show affection, hence he self-sabotages his relationships- he's not wrong that his relationship with Stolas isn't on equal footing, but he's also pretty clearly toying with Stolas in turn and not just to take advantage or petty revenge. (Which unfortunately can make him pretty relatable, as that's basically toxic masculinity 101. A recurring theme in this show.)

It's very easy to imagine how he might have screwed up his relationship with Verosika, especially with the hints we've gotten- that he might well have gotten insecure and resentful over her being more successful and wealthy than he is, and came to take her for granted and took advantage of her. (Hence the mentions of being terrible in bed and taking advantage of her money- running off with her credit cards for horse riding lessons and all. Feels like one of those things where Vero might well have been interested herself if he'd just asked) Thing is about turning to drug habits in particular is that it feels like something that results not just from Blitz being a toxic influence but from having to put up with an initial good relationship that deteriorated badly until they cut him off.

Also makes the last episode a clear turning point where Blitz is coming clean and clearing the air with Fizz; both stating that the disaster was a genuine accident, and that he still admits fault and feels guilty over it, being entirely sincere for once in a way that actually comes off as believable. Funny thing is it seems like he also learns a thing or two from his experiences with Fizz, and maybe having the crazed, near-feral open supremacist be the one who agrees with him seems to have him genuinely self-examining a bit.

Oh, Fizz's backstory is definitely a mix of Robocop but for entertainment and celebrities who are drat near property of their studio/producer and live off perks entirely on their whims. The extortionate ransom contract Crimson was trying to pull that would render Ozzie his puppet is definitely Mammon's bread and butter.

i took the r-word joke as a weird moment of humanity for him because he sorta realizes the nurse might actually be cognativly impared and sorta feels bad. blitz punches down but he doesnt PUNCH DOWN.

https://sharkrobot.com/collections/vivziepop?page=1
also new halloween merch. some ok stuff.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

I Am Fowl posted:

Wrath seems like a pretty alright ring from what little we've seen.

I figure it's mostly rural because regular pointlessly insanely brutal heavy metal album cover style wars regularly destroy most civilization there.

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Ghost Leviathan posted:

I figure it's mostly rural because regular pointlessly insanely brutal heavy metal album cover style wars regularly destroy most civilization there.

Also fire twisters and volcanos are part of the natural landscape.

KORNOLOGY
Aug 9, 2006
Initially I thought the fizz blitz reconciliation was a cop out, until I remembered blitz is bipolar and not so bad if he isn't in defense mode.

Aka, remembering being a scared child.

KORNOLOGY fucked around with this message at 21:01 on Sep 20, 2023

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

KORNOLOGY posted:

Initially I thought the fizz blitz reconciliation was a cop out, until I remembered blitz is bipolar and not so bad if he isn't in defense mode.

Aka, remembering being a scared child.


yeah. i feel like blitz has been headed toward a breaking point this season and this was kinda it. he was able to actually have a healthy moment and admit he hosed up and now fiz may actually be friends again someday.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

Flopsy posted:

Also fire twisters and volcanos are part of the natural landscape.

Volcanic soil IS super productive. But that probably doesn't help either.

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Dapper_Swindler posted:

yeah. i feel like blitz has been headed toward a breaking point this season and this was kinda it. he was able to actually have a healthy moment and admit he hosed up and now fiz may actually be friends again someday.

Honestly i hope this is the case. I'm reminded of a take I heard in one of those video essays examining season two. Where the maker was eagerly suggesting that Fizz took Blitzo up on his make out offer and cheated on Ozzie in that moment and Blitzo is just going to destroy their relationship. It just strikes me as so weird that first off; this the conclusion they come to when nothing obviously happened and two looking forward to that kind of scenario with an almost perverse sense of glee. Like the entire purpose of the show is for Blitzo to hit rock bottom like he hasn't been there already for years now. Then they proceeded to talk about hoping Stolas turns into a terrifying psycho and I completely checked out of it altogether. Which is sad because they were making some coherent points until apparently their fanfiction brain took the reins.

Flopsy fucked around with this message at 18:18 on Sep 21, 2023

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Flopsy posted:

Honestly i hope this is the case. I'm reminded of a take I heard in one of those video essays examining season two. Where the maker was eagerly suggesting that Fizz took Blitzo up on his make out offer and cheated on Ozzie in that moment and Blitzo is just going to destroy their relationship. It just strikes me as so weird that first off; this the conclusion they come to when nothing obviously happened and two looking forward to that kind of scenario with an almost perverse sense of glee. Like the entire purpose of the show is for Blitzo to hit rock bottom like he hasn't been there already for years now. Then they proceeded to talk about hoping Stolas turns into a terrifying psycho and I completely checked out of it altogether. Which is sad because they were making some coherent points until apparently their fanfiction brain took the reins.

jesus people are so lovely at reading media. i feel like everyone wants the characters to be worse people then they are which kinda misses the point about the show. the show is about being born with a shithand on a lovely rung on the ladder in hosed hell world that encourages the worst in people, some places worse then others, and it explores how people react.

like blitz had the really really really poo poo hand. so did moxxie. moxxie was able to overcome it because he has a support system of his wife who loves him and his boss who while lovely does care about him. like he could have easly become his dad because he has some of his traits(preening/vain/selfdestructive flair for the dramatic) but he doesnt because he learned from it and has empathy. blitz never really had that. his dad sold him for 5 and used condom. his mom died and his sister and friend/crush got super hosed up from it and he is super self destructive because of it. Loona is a mini version of him and he sees alot in her and he overcorrects because of it.

wanting stolas to be some sociopath is loving edgy psycho doesnt work either because it goes against who he is. stolas despite what he is and his postion is just a good dude. he loves his kid, he put up with and was abused by his psycho wife and her family all so he could keep his daughter happy or at least not in any danger. and like yeah he is rich but he is a minor noble and his dad doesnt even remember him most of the time, his wife is psycho and he lives in a den of vipers. all he wants to do is feed his plants, keep his kid happy and be hosed by his boyfriend. like again i think alot of these folks just want the show to be way way edgier then it is. like personally think the humor can be hit or miss, but i like the show because i like the characters alot and want to see where they end up. like i have a bunch of artist friends who don't like the show and while i dont agree with them, they are least have their points but this poo poo always is lol.

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Dapper_Swindler posted:

jesus people are so lovely at reading media. i feel like everyone wants the characters to be worse people then they are which kinda misses the point about the show. the show is about being born with a shithand on a lovely rung on the ladder in hosed hell world that encourages the worst in people, some places worse then others, and it explores how people react.

like blitz had the really really really poo poo hand. so did moxxie. moxxie was able to overcome it because he has a support system of his wife who loves him and his boss who while lovely does care about him. like he could have easly become his dad because he has some of his traits(preening/vain/selfdestructive flair for the dramatic) but he doesnt because he learned from it and has empathy. blitz never really had that. his dad sold him for 5 and used condom. his mom died and his sister and friend/crush got super hosed up from it and he is super self destructive because of it. Loona is a mini version of him and he sees alot in her and he overcorrects because of it.

wanting stolas to be some sociopath is loving edgy psycho doesnt work either because it goes against who he is. stolas despite what he is and his postion is just a good dude. he loves his kid, he put up with and was abused by his psycho wife and her family all so he could keep his daughter happy or at least not in any danger. and like yeah he is rich but he is a minor noble and his dad doesnt even remember him most of the time, his wife is psycho and he lives in a den of vipers. all he wants to do is feed his plants, keep his kid happy and be hosed by his boyfriend. like again i think alot of these folks just want the show to be way way edgier then it is. like personally think the humor can be hit or miss, but i like the show because i like the characters alot and want to see where they end up. like i have a bunch of artist friends who don't like the show and while i dont agree with them, they are least have their points but this poo poo always is lol.

I actually welcome HB criticism if they are actually making a coherent point. I like examining things and poo poo nothing is perfect, it's good to think about this stuff. But what pisses me off is having a snit because they're too loving stupid to follow point A to point B or they have some weird sadist take on it. I think the entire point of the show is repairing relationships and actually getting excited about poo poo getting worse when it's already pretty bad is so....I don't even know how to describe it. Like relishing in narrative misery that hasn't even been hinted at yet is so offputting to me. Especially because their "logic" for Fizz having cheated is that he wipes the corner of his mouth when he meet back up with Ozzie. Like holy poo poo that's what makes you think it happened? Not that he got beat up, ran up several flights of stairs and is probably exhausted? The reach is just breathtaking.

Happy Landfill
Feb 26, 2011

I don't understand but I've also heard much worse
An animator posted a new preview for the next ep already

https://twitter.com/0Nonie2/status/1705032862972440875?s=20

:3:

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Happy Landfill posted:

An animator posted a new preview for the next ep already

https://twitter.com/0Nonie2/status/1705032862972440875?s=20

:3:

If it's for an episode I'm thrilled but I thought they were just practicing an animated shot? Not trying to be a downer just genuinely a lil' confused.

Happy Landfill
Feb 26, 2011

I don't understand but I've also heard much worse
Oops, nevermind, didn't see the animation test tag :doh: it's still super cute!!

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

Flopsy posted:

I actually welcome HB criticism if they are actually making a coherent point. I like examining things and poo poo nothing is perfect, it's good to think about this stuff. But what pisses me off is having a snit because they're too loving stupid to follow point A to point B or they have some weird sadist take on it. I think the entire point of the show is repairing relationships and actually getting excited about poo poo getting worse when it's already pretty bad is so....I don't even know how to describe it. Like relishing in narrative misery that hasn't even been hinted at yet is so offputting to me. Especially because their "logic" for Fizz having cheated is that he wipes the corner of his mouth when he meet back up with Ozzie. Like holy poo poo that's what makes you think it happened? Not that he got beat up, ran up several flights of stairs and is probably exhausted? The reach is just breathtaking.

Once people get into edgelord drama addict brain there's often no way back. It's pretty much the flipside of and reason for the people who get sad and angry at any actual conflict or negative emotion.

Macaluso
Sep 23, 2005

I HATE THAT HEDGEHOG, BROTHER!

Happy Landfill posted:

An animator posted a new preview for the next ep already

https://twitter.com/0Nonie2/status/1705032862972440875?s=20

:3:

This is really cute and well done. And also I really hope that there's a portion of the show that is AFTER Stolas and Blitzo figure their poo poo out and you get to see them dating and being cute

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Flopsy posted:

I actually welcome HB criticism if they are actually making a coherent point. I like examining things and poo poo nothing is perfect, it's good to think about this stuff. But what pisses me off is having a snit because they're too loving stupid to follow point A to point B or they have some weird sadist take on it. I think the entire point of the show is repairing relationships and actually getting excited about poo poo getting worse when it's already pretty bad is so....I don't even know how to describe it. Like relishing in narrative misery that hasn't even been hinted at yet is so offputting to me. Especially because their "logic" for Fizz having cheated is that he wipes the corner of his mouth when he meet back up with Ozzie. Like holy poo poo that's what makes you think it happened? Not that he got beat up, ran up several flights of stairs and is probably exhausted? The reach is just breathtaking.

yeah, most of their issues are they just dont like the style or humor or think its weird that everyone in hell is gay but their are no real MONSTERS there(said person is gay) all of which i can understand. i think alot of the problem is

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Once people get into edgelord drama addict brain there's often no way back. It's pretty much the flipside of and reason for the people who get sad and angry at any actual conflict or negative emotion.
this. alot of critics either want it to be edgy edgy edgy or stephen universe but with all the sharp edges sanded off.

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Dapper_Swindler posted:

yeah, most of their issues are they just dont like the style or humor or think its weird that everyone in hell is gay but their are no real MONSTERS there(said person is gay) all of which i can understand. i think alot of the problem is

this. alot of critics either want it to be edgy edgy edgy or stephen universe but with all the sharp edges sanded off.

I have noticed the fandom drama overlap between Helluva Boss and Steven Universe.

Megillah Gorilla
Sep 22, 2003

If only all of life's problems could be solved by smoking a professor of ancient evil texts.



Bread Liar
I love that the show starts from a ridiculously edgy premise (imps in hell venturing to the human world to murder people) and finds a wholesome core along the way.

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Megillah Gorilla posted:

I love that the show starts from a ridiculously edgy premise (imps in hell venturing to the human world to murder people) and finds a wholesome core along the way.

This might be a controversial take but the show is at its best when it leans into the wholesome elements. Like Exe's and Ooh's had a literal wedding massacre but it was driven by Millie coming to save her husband. Every episode that puts something sweet in it has been much stronger for it in my opinion just because it balances all the other chaos out. Does every episode need to be like that? Of course not but I have noticed something of a pattern there.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Megillah Gorilla posted:

I love that the show starts from a ridiculously edgy premise (imps in hell venturing to the human world to murder people) and finds a wholesome core along the way.

yeah i feel like the early season leans in a little to edgy at times and some of the sex jokes are kinda of duds(though“I’m not good with my hands?” joke makes me chuckle) but overall season 2 has much smarter humor


Flopsy posted:

This might be a controversial take but the show is at its best when it leans into the wholesome elements. Like Exe's and Ooh's had a literal wedding massacre but it was driven by Millie coming to save her husband. Every episode that puts something sweet in it has been much stronger for it in my opinion just because it balances all the other chaos out. Does every episode need to be like that? Of course not but I have noticed something of a pattern there.

THIS. the show works best when the characters clearly give a gently caress about each other in a lovely world.

Flopsy posted:

I have noticed the fandom drama overlap between Helluva Boss and Steven Universe.

idk those folks pick fights with anyone. did that crazy lady who wrote a 5 hour long rant about stephen universe(and multiple hour long videos on a pony from mlp) ever talk about Helluva boss.

Flopsy
Mar 4, 2013

Dapper_Swindler posted:

idk those folks pick fights with anyone. did that crazy lady who wrote a 5 hour long rant about stephen universe(and multiple hour long videos on a pony from mlp) ever talk about Helluva boss.

As far as I know no. But she did talk about Hazbin Hotel fondly before deciding she hated it because a friend of a friend told her Viv eats puppies or some poo poo. Also she was weirdly hostile towards Angel's character which I thought was very strange. Basically wrote him off as one note gay joke even after his backstory was revealed. And anybody trying to point it out to her got blocked.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Flopsy posted:

As far as I know no. But she did talk about Hazbin Hotel fondly before deciding she hated it because a friend of a friend told her Viv eats puppies or some poo poo. Also she was weirdly hostile towards Angel's character which I thought was very strange. Basically wrote him off as one note gay joke even after his backstory was revealed. And anybody trying to point it out to her got blocked.

lol. that lady is a trip. like while i dont care for stephen universe even i think she is overly harsh on it. I just dont get folks who get THAT mad over kids shows(shows in general honestly) she made like 5 videos on MLP character having a redemption arc which is lol when that show straight up had the state "kill" a literal child in its final. so i think people like her hate redemption arcs. mind you i dont care for many because i think many are very badly handled(sequel trilogy) but like its not a bad lesson.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 21:24 on Sep 22, 2023

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

Dapper_Swindler posted:

lol. that lady is a trip. like while i dont care for stephen universe even i think she is overly harsh on it. I just dont get folks who get THAT mad over kids shows(shows in general honestly) she made like 5 videos on MLP character having a redemption arc which is lol when that show straight up had the state "kill" a literal child in its final. so i think people like her hate redemption arcs. mind you i dont care for many because i think many are very badly handled(sequel trilogy) but like its not a bad lesson.

Even when Lily has a few good points it gets buried her weird axes, and she has many, to grind. Example: One I think fairly solid point is Korra gets beaten up kind of a weirdly high amount in I think it's season 3 or 4 of her show and it's like, yeah, sure. But then she'll spend twenty minutes on why it's an example of some bizarre tangent that I think comes from being a frustrated writer who can't get published because nobody recognizes the Genius of Orchard Comma Lily.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Dawgstar posted:

Even when Lily has a few good points it gets buried her weird axes, and she has many, to grind. Example: One I think fairly solid point is Korra gets beaten up kind of a weirdly high amount in I think it's season 3 or 4 of her show and it's like, yeah, sure. But then she'll spend twenty minutes on why it's an example of some bizarre tangent that I think comes from being a frustrated writer who can't get published because nobody recognizes the Genius of Orchard Comma Lily.

i think alot of issues lily has is because she only consumes kids media and theirfore has the black and white morality of kids media(not all but yall know what i mean) its fine to watch kids/family stuff, alot of its very good, but its also very good to vary up your taste. i think their is also a subgroup of critics and media types who have the same issue.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Sep 22, 2023

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

Flopsy posted:

This might be a controversial take but the show is at its best when it leans into the wholesome elements. Like Exe's and Ooh's had a literal wedding massacre but it was driven by Millie coming to save her husband. Every episode that puts something sweet in it has been much stronger for it in my opinion just because it balances all the other chaos out. Does every episode need to be like that? Of course not but I have noticed something of a pattern there.

Get yourself a spouse who'll Mortal Kombat her way through a legion of gangsters to save your rear end from your horrible ex and abusive dad.

Dapper_Swindler posted:

i think alot of issues lily has is because she only consumes kids media and theirfore has the black and white morality of kids media(not all but yall know what i mean) its fine to watch kids/family stuff, alot of its very good, but its also very good to vary up your taste. i think their is also a subgroup of critics and media types who have the same issue.

Yep, basically a lot of people seem to have never watched a show for grown-ups before and have no idea how to handle it. Like some flipside of boomer brained who see animation and assume =for kids.

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Megillah Gorilla
Sep 22, 2003

If only all of life's problems could be solved by smoking a professor of ancient evil texts.



Bread Liar

Dapper_Swindler posted:

lol. that lady is a trip. like while i dont care for stephen universe even i think she is overly harsh on it. I just dont get folks who get THAT mad over kids shows(shows in general honestly)

Steven Universe is wholesome as gently caress, but some of the fans are just rabid.

I remember that poor girl who drew fan art of one character, but didn't draw her as chubby as the original and was relentlessly bullied into self harm.

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