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Amused to Death posted:I wouldn't call Rommel a hero, perhaps a brilliant tactician at best, though some argue a good part of that in itself was just taking seriously risky and possibly stupid moves that happen to pay off because the allies were performing terribly. Aside from being a great general, Rommel was a pretty good person as well, inasmuch as somebody who fought for Nazi Germany could be a good person. Wikipedia quote:Rommel is regarded as having been a humane and professional officer.[4] His Afrika Korps was never accused of war crimes, and soldiers captured during his Africa campaign were reported to have been treated humanely.[5] Orders to kill Jewish soldiers, civilians and captured commandos were ignored.[6] Late in the war, Rommel was linked to the conspiracy to assassinate Adolf Hitler. Since Rommel was a national hero, Hitler desired to eliminate him quietly. He forced Rommel to commit suicide with a cyanide pill, in return for assurances that Rommel's family would not be persecuted following his death.
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Apr 4, 2013 18:56
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Yea Rommel was basically the most respectable German military leader they had not just under the Nazi rule but in it's modern history in general. He constantly ignored orders to go with the genocides and even his POWs spoke decently of him. Dude wasn't a holy saint or anything but he very much did embody the concept of a good soldier.
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Apr 4, 2013 19:24
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Yes, Rommel was a great leader, and a professional soldier who followed the rules of war. It doesn't make him a hero though. He still got dragged down with it, but had he taken a more active role in the July 20th plot then maybe he could be a hero, maybe. That would never happen though, he was too much of a professional soldier, treason was out of the question.
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Apr 4, 2013 20:04
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At the risk of prolonging the derail, while I think Rommel was fairly noble and a very human guy, and while it's pretty clear he was no fan of Hitler or his policies, I think calling him a hero goes a bit too far. A good man in a very tough place, maybe, but he was still complicit in and actively aided Hitler's regime far more than he ever seemed to hurt it. It's easy to see the small ways in which he tried to help as being great heroic triumphs in the context of many of his peers, but that only means so much when his peers were perpetrating the most famous example of genocide in modern history.
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Apr 4, 2013 21:02
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Can we, instead, just agree that his place in history is pretty clear and whether or not you want to call him a hero is your own choice? Please, let's just get back to laughing at crazies.
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Apr 4, 2013 22:08
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If Rommel had ever found himself leading a panzer group on the Eastern Front I highly doubt his reputation would have remained so clean. His legacy was fortunate in that he was only ever stationed in a barren desert full of nothing and France, whose population the Nazis didn't utterly despise. EDIT: What the hell I honestly thought I was in the Nazi Germany thread in ask/tell. Whoops Shimrra Jamaane fucked around with this message at 22:37 on Apr 4, 2013 |
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Apr 4, 2013 22:14
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totalnewbie posted:Please, let's just get back to laughing at crazies. Indeed. C'mon Connecticut goons, Malloy signed the gun control legislation today. You have to have something juicy on your feed.  And someone linked to this which is too long to capture in a screen shot, but something about some Columbine father. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4874281742165&set=a.2290080298744.133235.1451076434&type=1
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Apr 4, 2013 22:30
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This just showed up on my feed.  What MTV "star" died? I haven't heard anything about it so I guess the media isn't obsessing about it?
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Apr 4, 2013 22:36
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:This just showed up on my feed. Someone from a show named Buck Wild, which is supposed to be the West Virginia version of Jersey Shore. I only know about it because I grew up close to where it was filmed, so it's been all over my Facebook news feed.
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Apr 4, 2013 23:04
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jackofarcades posted:Don't let people get away with the idea that poor people caused the housing crisis. Banks betting huge on toxic mortgages caused it. No you see it was the government forcing banks to give out those loans. Forcing them! I heard this at work today and am in no position to say anything in response even though I know its all kinds of wrong. Does anyone want to provide a break down of the factors, or link me to somewhere that does?
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Apr 4, 2013 23:10
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Anniversary posted:No you see it was the government forcing banks to give out those loans. Forcing them! There's no fighting that. It's the most insane, delusional, stance to take. No matter what you say it'll keep going to "NO THE drat GOVERNMENT WAS FORCING BANKS TO GIVE OUT THOSE LOANS", they're people who legit think the government is some evil shadowy cabal who sent jackboots to muscle banks to give loans to anyone with dark skin because something something affirmative action.
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Apr 4, 2013 23:19
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Anniversary posted:No you see it was the government forcing banks to give out those loans. Forcing them! The short answer, I think, is that the CRA and the government forced banks only to stop refusing loan applications based solely on an applicant's home address, what was called redlining. The free market was the only thing forcing them to grant loans to anybody with a pulse. I've seen an argument somewhere that the Great Financial Meltdown(s) is the best argument available against the Illuminati, because then the people making loans would be in contact with the people employing the people who receive loans and all this wouldn't have happened.
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Apr 4, 2013 23:22
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Anniversary posted:No you see it was the government forcing banks to give out those loans. Forcing them! This link is neither, but a study from Ohio State indicated commercial properties, or properties sold as investment or speculations that were more likely to be foreclosed. That is to say, loans that weren't taken out by low income buyers. http://osu.edu/news/newsitem2151
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Apr 4, 2013 23:39
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The big problem is that anyone who believes the government was "forcing" banks to give out bad loans also believes that racism is over. Hence, banks couldn't have been discriminating against minorities in their lending practices. Therefore, any effort to make things better for minorities, even if well-intentioned, was actually just making it easier for them to get loans than white people. Until you can get someone to accept the premise that banks were/are engaging in racism, you will have a hard time convincing them that the government didn't force them into bad practices. Good luck on that.
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Apr 4, 2013 23:49
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Paul Krugman linked to a good article that broke down why it's bullshit that CRAs caused the housing crisis. Surprise, surprise the idea comes out of a Republican think tank massively redefining terms in order to create a big lie! http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/07/14/fannie-freddie-phooey/ It's kind of funny when people say that the lending companies were "forced" to give minorities loans because when you look at the statistics they were very happy to lend to them and give them much higher rates than white people even if their credit ratings were similar due to their unfamiliarity with the mortgage system. Then when the whole house of cards fell down they cried crocodile tears that the mean minorities forced them to lend out (predatory) loans. It really comes down to latent racism that minorities were trying to cheat their way out of their class. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 00:07 on Apr 5, 2013 |
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Apr 4, 2013 23:54
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Skeevy Mcgee posted:Someone from a show named Buck Wild, which is supposed to be the West Virginia version of Jersey Shore. I only know about it because I grew up close to where it was filmed, so it's been all over my Facebook news feed. Oh. Yeah this is the first I've heard of it so does this mean I can be sad about both deaths without getting on an Internet soapbox? Edit: I should add that this was originally posted by a girl I went to high school with who then married a marine and is one of those military spouses who live vicariously through their partner.
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Apr 5, 2013 00:02
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:Edit: I should add that this was originally posted by a girl I went to high school with who then married a marine and is one of those military spouses who live vicariously through their partner. Irrespective of whatever else you feel about this person and whatever reprehensible crap she posts on facebook, I think it's worth recognizing that young military spouses have pretty crappy lives, and in that sense it's sort of understandable that they grasp onto whatever emotional validation they can find in the fact that their husbands and wives are risking their lives for OUR COUNTRY (instead of admitting/realizing that they are risking their lives for nothing worthy at all).
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Apr 5, 2013 00:22
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andrew smash posted:Irrespective of whatever else you feel about this person and whatever reprehensible crap she posts on facebook, I think it's worth recognizing that young military spouses have pretty crappy lives, and in that sense it's sort of understandable that they grasp onto whatever emotional validation they can find in the fact that their husbands and wives are risking their lives for OUR COUNTRY (instead of admitting/realizing that they are risking their lives for nothing worthy at all). I grew up in a military household and served in the military as well. I've seen good military spouses and I've seen bad ones. This girl is one of the bad ones. She's one of those military spouses who thinks her husband's work and achievements are her own and she should be acknowledged for them. She's the kind of spouse who will insist that you let her go first at the BX because her husband is an officer.
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Apr 5, 2013 00:38
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:I grew up in a military household and served in the military as well. I've seen good military spouses and I've seen bad ones. This girl is one of the bad ones. She's one of those military spouses who thinks her husband's work and achievements are her own and she should be acknowledged for them. She's the kind of spouse who will insist that you let her go first at the BX because her husband is an officer. Okay, fair enough.
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Apr 5, 2013 00:45
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This was in my message thing on facebook. At first I was confused, thinking she had meant to send it to someone else.   It's a response to a comment I made, when a friend (non-mutual), posted this...  Basically, my friend and I, commented that we dislike Jim Carrey, but agree with his quote. I've been on the fence, about deleting her for awhile. She's either bi-polar, or shares everything that appears on her feed. Paintings of fairies, videos of 1960s love ballads, pro gun memes, and some of the most hateful, bigoted, memes, that have appeared in this thread. All within minutes of each other.
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Apr 5, 2013 00:47
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:I grew up in a military household and served in the military as well. I've seen good military spouses and I've seen bad ones. This girl is one of the bad ones. She's one of those military spouses who thinks her husband's work and achievements are her own and she should be acknowledged for them. She's the kind of spouse who will insist that you let her go first at the BX because her husband is an officer. I was attached to a fighter unit for a few years, and found that pilot's wives formed absolutely both sides of the spectrum, with little in between. Either they were annoying shitbags who though they were the most important wives around, or they were chill as gently caress and always fed us enlisted pukes cookies and made their husbands invite us to everything. EDIT: Now that I re-read this I see how mean it sounds. Anyways, a lot of the wives were nuts, but a lot were super chill and always brought us cool poo poo. Mitchicon fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Apr 5, 2013 |
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Apr 5, 2013 00:51
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:This just showed up on my feed. I've seen orders of magnitude more "like this if you support our troops!" pictures on Facebook than I have seen of any of the things that people supposedly care about more than the troops.
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Apr 5, 2013 00:52
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ponzicar posted:I've seen orders of magnitude more "like this if you support our troops!" pictures on Facebook than I have seen of any of the things that people supposedly care about more than the troops. Guess what? They actually don't give a poo poo about the troops once they're out of the service. Oh, and have fun being a gay/liberal/non-Christian vet. You're basically a fake  if you are.
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Apr 5, 2013 00:53
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One of my leftie Facebook friends posted a story about the Arkansas oil spill, and her far-right uncle weighed in.  So apparently the key to pushing socialist policies is to re-brand them as nationalist.
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Apr 5, 2013 01:58
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Skeevy Mcgee posted:One of my leftie Facebook friends posted a story about the Arkansas oil spill, and her far-right uncle weighed in. Nationalism is basically the only way stuff ever gets done in the US. Hell, take the new brain mapping thing. Want to add more money to it? Let's start a campaign. "Obama asked for only $100 million. The EU has already promised $1 billion for the same idea. America, do you want to fall behind France?"
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Apr 5, 2013 02:03
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Human brain research in Paris, France. I kid you not.
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Apr 5, 2013 02:38
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Bo-Pepper posted:Oh I know. I just feel like this point that conservatives don't seek to censor liberal speech must have a concrete counter. Ultimately though I'm just going to let it be. If you're still looking, here's an example of a leftist speaker being censored, presumably by conservatives. Yes, there are plenty of examples of conservatives being interrupted in the same way but it's absolutely untrue that it doesn't happen to speakers on the left. http://youtu.be/0x3cF0oXFXE Dr. Arbitrary fucked around with this message at 02:55 on Apr 5, 2013 |
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Apr 5, 2013 02:49
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Mitchicon posted:Guess what? They actually don't give a poo poo about the troops once they're out of the service. Oh, and have fun being a gay/liberal/non-Christian vet. You're basically a fake
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Apr 5, 2013 03:14
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Guilty Spork posted:If any of them cares about the troops a tenth as much as they like to pretend they do, there are several charities for helping veterans, especially disabled veterans, they could be donating to, not to mention a ton of issues they could be writing to their representatives about. But that takes effort. So much easier to click Like on a Facebook page and call it a day. The problem with the Yellow Ribbon "Are Troops" thing is that it is saying without a message. Well, what are you doing to support our troops? What do you support? It's an easy message to get behind that (mostly) everyone supports. You can get behind it, raise hell about it, and do nothing about it, then feel good about it. It is a lot of fluster without any action and it makes people feel proud about themselves.
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Apr 5, 2013 03:18
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The real problem is that the picture isn't about supporting the troops. It's about supporting the person who says they're supporting the troops, and disparaging people who are not the person who posted the picture.
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Apr 5, 2013 03:24
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Dr Christmas posted:The real problem is that the picture isn't about supporting the troops. It's about supporting the person who says they're supporting the troops, and disparaging people who are not the person who posted the picture. Real Heroes click "like", damnit.  EDIT: Now please forward this to at lest 50 other like minded patriots or else your a Soshalist.
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Apr 5, 2013 03:37
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Amused to Death posted:Nationalism is basically the only way stuff ever gets done in the US. Hell, take the new brain mapping thing. Want to add more money to it? Let's start a campaign. "Obama asked for only $100 million. The EU has already promised $1 billion for the same idea. America, do you want to fall behind France?" This is right on, and it's worth considering how self-destructive the cosmopolitanism of urban elites (who are overwhelmingly Democratic) is in this context.
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Apr 5, 2013 03:39
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:This just showed up on my feed. Shain Gandee. He was found dead in the vehicle with the other two and it was ruled as Carbon Monoxide poisoning. I don't know what the gently caress they're talking about.
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Apr 5, 2013 03:49
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I take it as a rite of passage that I didn't know a single thing about "Buckwild" until I started looking into Shain Gandee. I'm not saying anything about his passing, certainly wouldn't wish that on anyone, but the fact that I haven't heard of that or many other MTV shows I just was reading about makes me feel good -- not only about myself, but the people I'm surrounded not bringing it up either! ...but now I wonder what it's all about.
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Apr 5, 2013 03:53
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My mom sat me down and seriously asked me if I'd seen the new dollar bills that had IN GOD WE TRUST removed. Because of Obama. You see, because Obama ordered it.
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Apr 5, 2013 03:55
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ponzicar posted:I've seen orders of magnitude more "like this if you support our troops!" pictures on Facebook than I have seen of any of the things that people supposedly care about more than the troops. I think that's what pisses me off the most about this poo poo. The slacktivism. If people really cared about and wanted to honor the troops they'd donate their time or money to help veterans or people in the military. Volunteer at a VFW, get with the USO to send a care package to a deployed soldier, hell they could donate money to an aid agency to help make sure the kids homeboy was playing with have a school to go to. But that all takes time and effort and clicking a loving like or share button on Facebook costs neither. Its like the web version of those stupid yellow 'support our troops' car magnets -- worse actually because you had to buy a magnet with money.
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Apr 5, 2013 03:59
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Cowslips Warren posted:My mom sat me down and seriously asked me if I'd seen the new dollar bills that had IN GOD WE TRUST removed. Because of Obama. You see, because Obama ordered it. If I was God I'd be pissed that my name was on money.
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Apr 5, 2013 04:08
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Yay I got one! Man my thoughts are kind of disjointed. But, heh. I guess he didn't read the article...
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Apr 5, 2013 04:09
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Dr Christmas posted:The real problem is that the picture isn't about supporting the troops. It's about supporting the person who says they're supporting the troops, and disparaging people who are not the person who posted the picture. A lot of the people posting that stuff also seem to think that they're making liberals mad by doing that, because we are all Vietnam War era hippies who spit on them and call them baby murderers. They don't seem to have a reply when I tell that that if I hated the troops, I'd vote Republican, and cheer as they get killed and maimed invading countries in search of non existent WMDs.
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Apr 5, 2013 08:37
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ponzicar posted:A lot of the people posting that stuff also seem to think that they're making liberals mad by doing that, because we are all Vietnam War era hippies who spit on them and call them baby murderers. They don't seem to have a reply when I tell that that if I hated the troops, I'd vote Republican, and cheer as they get killed and maimed invading countries in search of non existent WMDs. You should also bring up the GOP routinely voting against any and all opportunities to help vets. For instance, a few months back they voted against a veterans jobs bill.
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Apr 5, 2013 08:50
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