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Raenir Salazar posted:I don't see how you can make this sort of comment considering the Dems actually aren't loving anything up, and Schumer of all people is all aboard the "go big or go home" train. The evidence doesn't support this level of nihilistic cynicism anymore. The Dems are loving plenty up lol. I apologize I don't want to turn this into a USPOL derail, but seriously go look at what they've been doing with the latest COVID relief bill (reducing the payments, trying to add even stricter bullshit means testing) and how Yellen (who previously took $800K in "speaking fees" from the firm that owned Robinhood, surely no conflict of interest there  ) responded to a ton of brokerages led by Robinhood preventing free trading of certain stocks because it was losing rich people money by doing loving nothing. There's more I could nitpick too but I again I won't get into the weeds. It's not "nihilistic cynicism" to acknowledge that the Dems are doing us dirty in many ways, even if it is less ways than the GOP was doing us dirty.brb gonna start my plague cult where we all inject ourselves with COVID and then cough in people's faces in public in the name of the Lord.
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Feb 6, 2021 22:56
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'SCOTUS upholds ban on singing' is not a phrase I would've expected to read before Covid
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Feb 6, 2021 23:04
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Sydin posted:In other SCOTUS news being religious continues to make you immune to the law, which is super cool and not at all a problem that they're just allowed to have super spreader events every week and then go walk back out into the general population quote:Respondents are enjoined from enforcing the Blueprint’s Tier 1 prohibition on indoor worship services against the applicants pending disposition of the petition for a writ of certiorari. The application is denied with respect to the percentage capacity limitations, and respondents are not enjoined from imposing a 25% capacity limitation on indoor worship services in Tier 1. The application is denied with respect to the prohibition on singing and chanting during indoor services. quote:The State has concluded, for example, that singing indoors poses a heightened risk of transmitting COVID–19. I see no basis in this record for overriding that aspect of the state public health framework.
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Feb 6, 2021 23:18
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Why does the state let liquor stores operate but not churches?!? Whisper whisper Oh okay, it turns out our hospitals would instantly be overrun with people having medical crises from alcohol withdrawal, and rumors of liquor stores being shut down led to enormous “bread” lines. There is no such thing as anything similarly situated to a church. The fact that many churches flagrantly violated orders while they were valid is an argument against treating churches more leniently, not for it. Are we going to post agents inside to verify they aren’t singing despite it being illegal, when previously they were congregating and singing while both were illegal?
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Feb 6, 2021 23:45
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Judging by the Bible, God's people killing themselves with plague is exactly what He would have wanted, and who is the court to say otherwise.
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Feb 7, 2021 16:22
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Sydin posted:brb gonna start my plague cult where we all inject ourselves with COVID and then cough in people's faces in public in the name of the Lord. Sorry, Shincheonji Church of Jesus already beat you to it by a year.
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Feb 7, 2021 17:00
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VitalSigns posted:Judging by the Bible, God's people killing themselves with plague is exactly what He would have wanted, and who is the court to say otherwise. Going by the bible, people demanding to be able to be as loud and public with their religious worship is the exact opposite of how Christians should behave. At this point I'm about ready to say that "religious belief" should have to meet a threshold that shows you actually are following the religion and not just saying so because evangelical assholes are giving themselves a pass for everything. You want a religious exception? You have to actually follow the religion except for any practices that directly violate the law (ie: no killing someone and claiming it was for religious reasons).
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Feb 7, 2021 17:43
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Devor posted:Why does the state let liquor stores operate but not churches?!? There are a lot of reasons it’s stupid to compare churches to liquor stores, but this isn’t it. First of all California allows liquor sales in grocery stores. “Liquor stores” in California are more like convenience stores/mini-marts that also sell liquor. Also nobody is considering physical alcohol dependency when making these decisions
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Feb 7, 2021 17:56
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I'd also be ok with hospitals at/near capacity turning away anyone who willingly goes to church or other mass spreader events so they can focus on helping those who aren't Nurgle cultists.HashtagGirlboss posted:Also nobody is considering physical alcohol dependency when making these decisions Yes they are, because they know what happens if millions of people with an addiction are suddenly blocked from their vice.
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Feb 7, 2021 18:01
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You can’t close “liquor stores” and expect everyone to get their fix at a grocery store because a lot of people live in food deserts and the liquor store is the only thing in walking distance.
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Feb 7, 2021 18:12
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Evil Fluffy posted:I'd also be ok with hospitals at/near capacity turning away anyone who willingly goes to church or other mass spreader events so they can focus on helping those who aren't Nurgle cultists. Again liquor is widely available in California and beyond that... Platystemon posted:You can’t close “liquor stores” and expect everyone to get their fix at a grocery store because a lot of people live in food deserts and the liquor store is the only thing in walking distance. Beer and wine and malt liquor available at non”liquor store” convenience stores will do just fine. People don’t need hard liquor or they explode Like I said there are plenty of very good reasons liquor stores are different, but it’s not this
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Feb 7, 2021 19:01
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Evil Fluffy posted:I'd also be ok with hospitals at/near capacity turning away anyone who willingly goes to church or other mass spreader events so they can focus on helping those who aren't Nurgle cultists.
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Feb 7, 2021 21:29
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HashtagGirlboss posted:Again liquor is widely available in California and beyond that... You can get your liquor at grocery stores You can get your religion over Zoom Religious services and baptisms available remotely at non "church" locations will do just fine. People don't need breathing distance religion or they explode
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Feb 7, 2021 21:47
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After five centuries, the Pope quietly agreed with protestants and said Christians could pray directly to God because the pandemic made priestly confession hazardous.
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Feb 7, 2021 22:18
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Surprised nobody's started an app yet that allows you to order an independently contracted pastor to your door to provide on demand religious services.
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Feb 8, 2021 03:04
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Devor posted:You can get your liquor at grocery stores Lmao I don’t know what point you think your making but whatever. Liquor stores are a bad analogy for religious services for a lot of reasons, such as you don’t typically spend hours in a liquor store in close contact with other people singing and chanting and sharing communion and on and on. But liquor stores in California aren’t necessary to prevent people from going into alcohol withdrawal, that’s just a dumb point to try to make about liquor stores when there are other better reasons to explain why liquor stores are less problematic than churches
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Feb 8, 2021 03:10
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Also, getting a drink, dependent on alcohol or otherwise, is not a constitutional right.
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Feb 8, 2021 03:28
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Dead Reckoning posted:Also, getting a drink, dependent on alcohol or otherwise, is not a constitutional right. This is also really dumb. Freedom of association is also a constitutional right but nobody seems to be suggesting that banning conventions is somehow an overreach
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Feb 8, 2021 03:46
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Sydin posted:Surprised nobody's started an app yet that allows you to order an independently contracted pastor to your door to provide on demand religious services. should it be called preachr or preacharound
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Feb 8, 2021 04:26
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HashtagGirlboss posted:Lmao I don’t know what point you think your making but whatever. Liquor stores are a bad analogy for religious services for a lot of reasons, such as you don’t typically spend hours in a liquor store in close contact with other people singing and chanting and sharing communion and on and on. But liquor stores in California aren’t necessary to prevent people from going into alcohol withdrawal, that’s just a dumb point to try to make about liquor stores when there are other better reasons to explain why liquor stores are less problematic than churches I'm aware that liquor stores are much less dangerous being open for numerous reasons - but even granting the assumption that they are equally dangerous, temporary closure during a pandemic for a liquor store would increase mortality, but for a church would decrease mortality. And liquor stores come up because Gorsuch made the stupid loving comparison in the first SCOTUS ruling that overturned COVID restrictions. https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/20417510/20a87.pdf quote:Indeed, the Governor is remarkably frank about this: In his judgment laundry and liquor, travel and tools, are all “essential” while traditional religious exercises are not. That is exactly the kind of discrimination the First Amendment forbids. This is all founded in conservative grievance that religion is not put ahead of literally preventing deaths in a pandemic. Previous SCOTUS rulings have noted that the Constitution is not a suicide pact. But apparently it does allow negligent manslaughter in the name of organized religion.
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Feb 8, 2021 05:36
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Dead Reckoning posted:Hospitals turning people away because they've decided that the patient's personal beliefs disposed them to their illness or make them more challenging to treat is a staggeringly bad precedent. What on earth made you think that was defensible? If a hospital hits capacity and can't take in more people, I'd rather those getting help are the ones not actively and knowingly making the pandemic worse because they want to hang out with supply side Jesus. Of course this is America so the white wing deathcult will get preferred medical treatment while poor and minority COVID victims end up the ones suffering the most because a bunch of prosperity gospel apostates demand to be allowed to keep packing in to their cult gatherings. Evil Fluffy fucked around with this message at 05:46 on Feb 8, 2021 |
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Feb 8, 2021 05:42
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Devor posted:I'm aware that liquor stores are much less dangerous being open for numerous reasons - but even granting the assumption that they are equally dangerous, temporary closure during a pandemic for a liquor store would increase mortality, but for a church would decrease mortality. I know the context and I know Gorsuch was being a disingenuous poo poo. But the bolded claim is false. There’s plenty of true things you can say about the difference between liquor stores and churches so maybe stop hanging your argument on a point that is contradicted by reality 
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Feb 8, 2021 05:44
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HashtagGirlboss posted:I know the context and I know Gorsuch was being a disingenuous poo poo. But the bolder claim is false. There’s plenty of true things you can say about the difference between liquor stores and churches so maybe stop hanging your argument on a point that is contradicted by reality Let's have a fact finding on that in a district court, instead of Gorsuch making GBS threads out lies. And I don't trust hand-waving solutions like the guy drinking vodka to make it through the day switching to bud light that he can buy at Whole Foods, over decisions made by governors in consultation with their health departments.
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Feb 8, 2021 05:50
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Devor posted:Let's have a fact finding on that in a district court, instead of Gorsuch making GBS threads out lies. And I don't trust hand-waving solutions like the guy drinking vodka to make it through the day switching to bud light that he can buy at Whole Foods, over decisions made by governors in consultation with their health departments. Alcoholics and their needs played zero part in the decision making process because it was entirely irrelevant to that process. Holy poo poo you don’t think someone that dependent on alcohol isn’t perfectly capable of knowing to switch to any number of cheap malt liquors if they happen to live in a state that doesn’t have super loose liquor sales rules? Like we’re not even in disagreement about the big picture so I’m not sure why you can’t just accept that this line of reasoning makes no sense and is a backwards justification at best and therefore entirely worthless in swaying opinions
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Feb 8, 2021 06:00
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Worship services are much more analogous to restaurants than liquor stores: they are a non-essential service that can reasonably be performed outdoors to minimize the risk of COVID exposure. In the same way we tell restaurants that hey it's too dangerous to let patrons eat inside but you can seat them on the patio or parking lot or whatever with masks and proper distancing between tables, we should be able to tell places of worship that it's too dangerous to let worship activities take place inside but you can do them outside with masks and proper distancing between attendees. The whole "You allow [Insert completely incomparable business] to operate with less restrictions than churches so therefore you are clearly discriminating against religion" argument is entirely in bad faith and always has been.
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Feb 8, 2021 12:07
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HashtagGirlboss posted:Alcoholics and their needs played zero part in the decision making process because it was entirely irrelevant to that process. Holy poo poo you don’t think someone that dependent on alcohol isn’t perfectly capable of knowing to switch to any number of cheap malt liquors if they happen to live in a state that doesn’t have super loose liquor sales rules? Like we’re not even in disagreement about the big picture so I’m not sure why you can’t just accept that this line of reasoning makes no sense and is a backwards justification at best and therefore entirely worthless in swaying opinions You seem to be agreeing with the court that, because there was no fact finding on an issue, then it should be assumed to be in favor of the church. And I will trust statements by health officials that closing liquor stores would fill hospitals, over your suppositions that it would not. If SCOTUS is wrong, then their interference in local pandemic response is causing literal death, so in my opinion the status quo of keeping churches closed should absolutely remain in place while additional fact finding is held, if necessary. We aren't trying to sway public opinion, this isn't going up to a vote, this is me complaining that SCOTUS is killing people, and we don't have any recourse.
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Feb 8, 2021 15:55
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Devor posted:You seem to be agreeing with the court that, because there was no fact finding on an issue, then it should be assumed to be in favor of the church. Bad arguments are bad arguments, whether they're in favor of policies I support or against them. Arguments that don't stand up to basic logic are bad because they undermine your position. Make arguments that can't be picked apart by anyone who has ever been to California or known an alcoholic, neither of which are particularly uncommon traits. I'm not agreeing with the court because I think comparing liquor stores to churches is dumb. I'm very specifically telling you that this particular line of reasoning is dumb and doesn't hold up.
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Feb 8, 2021 16:51
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Evil Fluffy posted:Going by the bible, people demanding to be able to be as loud and public with their religious worship is the exact opposite of how Christians should behave. Yes, and God loves loving up vain impious people like that with disasters and plagues and horrible deaths, along with a bunch of innocent people around them who just happen to be there, the courts are merely carrying out His will here.
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Feb 8, 2021 22:46
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VitalSigns posted:Yes, and God loves loving up vain impious people like that with disasters and plagues and horrible deaths, along with a bunch of innocent people around them who just happen to be there, the courts are merely carrying out His will here. I could see Barrett putting this as an actual opinion. 
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Feb 8, 2021 23:36
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I would consider therapy sessions that help prevent suicide, especially during the lockdown, as essential services. Places of worship can be treated like that. Instead of closing churches the government could have made the more reasonable demand that a list of scientifically backed precautions are taken to prevent the spread. The SCOTUS requires such "minimally invasive" laws in order to justify infringing on constitutional rights.
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Feb 8, 2021 23:54
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I was under the impression a lot of therapy was being conducted remotely these days, and not in groups of over 200 people in an enclosed building, singing and shouting and laying on hands.
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Feb 9, 2021 18:38
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HashtagGirlboss posted:Alcoholics and their needs played zero part in the decision making process because it was entirely irrelevant to that process. Holy poo poo you don’t think someone that dependent on alcohol isn’t perfectly capable of knowing to switch to any number of cheap malt liquors if they happen to live in a state that doesn’t have super loose liquor sales rules? Like we’re not even in disagreement about the big picture so I’m not sure why you can’t just accept that this line of reasoning makes no sense and is a backwards justification at best and therefore entirely worthless in swaying opinions I mean, it seems like you don't really understand alcoholism. You're applying rational thinking to an entirely irrational thought process. Whether liquor stores should be closed, and the effects it would have, is an active area of discussion in recovery groups and addiction treatment
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Feb 9, 2021 18:47
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Anyone who think grocery stores with their usually small selection of crappy beer/wine can cover the demand that liquor stores currently meet are at best optimistic or live in states where someone can buy a handle of JD at their local Wal-Mart.human garbage bag posted:I would consider therapy sessions that help prevent suicide, especially during the lockdown, as essential services. Places of worship can be treated like that. Instead of closing churches the government could have made the more reasonable demand that a list of scientifically backed precautions are taken to prevent the spread. The SCOTUS requires such "minimally invasive" laws in order to justify infringing on constitutional rights. Religious services are not therapy sessions in the slightest. They're placebo at best and a social event for most, including (or perhaps especially) the diehard evangelical types.
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Feb 9, 2021 18:53
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FronzelNeekburm posted:I was under the impression a lot of therapy was being conducted remotely these days, and not in groups of over 200 people in an enclosed building, singing and shouting and laying on hands. That's why he didn't say church is therapy, he said it could be treated as therapy. Church can also be treated as a cure for cancer or any other faith-healing magic you want, you don't want to close cancer wards during a pandemic do you!
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Feb 9, 2021 19:23
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Does anyone in here know the constitutionality of mulligans?
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Feb 9, 2021 19:25
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Pick posted:Does anyone in here know the constitutionality of mulligans? Usually resolved at the point of a bayonet.
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Feb 10, 2021 04:32
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Liquor stores should stay open because the clerk knows all the regulars and won’t make them pull off a mask to compare with photo ID.
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Feb 10, 2021 06:06
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We all knew that these would come https://www.wistv.com/2021/02/18/live-sc-bill-banning-most-abortions-be-signed-by-governor-lawsuit-already-filed-opposition/
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Feb 18, 2021 19:50
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Where is the Abortionplex I was promised?
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Feb 18, 2021 21:32
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https://twitter.com/scotusblog/status/1363860115502354436?s=21 SCOTUS also declined to take up some lawsuits in PA over vote by mail
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Feb 22, 2021 16:11
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