|
In my Ming game I managed to get military points when I used war taxes because I had a golden age active while I had the free war taxes age reward. The UI said the cost was -5 MIL so that's what I got. Has anyone else had negative power costs before?
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 01:15
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 17:26 |
|
|
Huh, that's cool. Wartaxes are on a 2 year cooldown though right, it's not something you can just spam every war? (I have more than 1000 hours in this game and had maybe pressed that button once before this expansion) I vaguely remember someone talking about the inverse in terms of power costs- horde razing actually costing after a certain point.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 01:19
|
|
|
Ming is ridiculously stable now, you can easy faceroll your way to victory if you wanted to do a WC run with them.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 04:16
|
|
|
Unless the tooltip is lying, tributaries count towards WC as well. So, uh, if you've ever wanted that achievement now's the time.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 04:38
|
|
|
My Khan died right as I declared war on someone and I got a succession crisis with 29 Pretenders rising. Only 12 actually rose and I got the succession crisis over popup the next day. Huh?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 05:02
|
|
|
Mantis42 posted:Unless the tooltip is lying, tributaries count towards WC as well. So, uh, if you've ever wanted that achievement now's the time. With Three Mountains being a thing the standard World Conquest achievement is like going for second place in a race.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 05:42
|
|
|
Wow this is so stupid. Ming is way too overpowered. As Shimazu I had to go through the godamn gauntlet only to leave ashikaga with one 3 development tile out in northern ainu land. I cant form japan until no daimyo are left but because ashikaga is a tributary of ming I would have to fight a loving juggernaut that is entirely stable. What was the loving intention with this? Who thought it would be more fun to watch a totally stable huge chinese unfuckable empire just chill with everything on lockdown rather than a chaotic clusterfuck that used to be the east. And this is AFTER a war with ashikaga and ming earlier. I just defended 20ish stacks as they landed (destroyed like 6 stacks and he still had 80k MP and 110k raised. like 60 mercs) but because ming had 70 ships and 16 of which are carracks, being aggresive isn't even an option. SnoochtotheNooch fucked around with this message at 06:02 on Apr 9, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 05:53
|
|
|
SnoochtotheNooch posted:Wow this is so stupid. Ming is way too overpowered. As Shimazu I had to go through the godamn gauntlet only to leave ashikaga with one 3 development tile out in northern ainu land. I cant form japan until no daimyo are left but because ashikaga is a tributary of ming I would have to fight a loving juggernaut that is entirely stable. What was the loving intention with this? Who thought it would be more fun to watch a totally stable huge chinese unfuckable empire just chill with everything on lockdown rather than a chaotic clusterfuck that used to be the east. All you have to do is defend. As long as you keep destroying their landing parties, you can eventually white peace with them and then take whatever you want from the tributary. They look big and bad but they're terrible at mounting a naval invasion. I was in roughly the same position as you, and they never even got an army into my land.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 06:09
|
|
|
Shaman Ooglaboogla posted:Ming is ridiculously stable now, you can easy faceroll your way to victory if you wanted to do a WC run with them. I would like to try a WC. Can I get some more in depth hints for this? Had a close run once with Ottomans, but have never played east of them.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 06:20
|
|
|
SnoochtotheNooch posted:Wow this is so stupid. Ming is way too overpowered. As Shimazu I had to go through the godamn gauntlet only to leave ashikaga with one 3 development tile out in northern ainu land. I cant form japan until no daimyo are left but because ashikaga is a tributary of ming I would have to fight a loving juggernaut that is entirely stable. What was the loving intention with this? Who thought it would be more fun to watch a totally stable huge chinese unfuckable empire just chill with everything on lockdown rather than a chaotic clusterfuck that used to be the east. Can you not become a tributary yourself?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 06:31
|
|
|
Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Can you not become a tributary yourself? They offered to make me a tributary just before I ate usegi but I declined and had a long war holding them off until my manpower was gone. Now they have -30opinion from trust and wont let me offer to be their tributary. I guess what pissed me off is after I killed like almost 60k troops (corned and wiped them out) they still had +2 stab, 70 prestige and 7 war exhaustion. They immediately got into a defensive war with korea, kicked their rear end and had absolutely no problems. What the hell does it take to break ming's stability now? Its just lame that I have pretty much no hope of ever invading.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 06:36
|
|
|
You can tributary yourself, vacuum Ashikaga, and then break away. You don't need to declare war to break off as a tributary, you just tell Ming to go gently caress themselves. E: or not
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 06:38
|
|
|
So I have 24 trust with Ming because when they sent me "make tributary" earlier they sent it twice.... probably a bug. Now I have to wait 10 years i guess to be able to tributary myself.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 06:41
|
|
|
In my game they spammed the make tributary thing repeatedly in my face for like 5 minutes until giving up and declaring war on me. Like, every 20 seconds or so I'd get a new alert. Gotta just be a bug. There are checks in place to cripple Ming, it just seems like they're not balanced that well yet. And I think the whole stable looming empire thing is way more interesting than the Mingsplosion, this makes playing in the region way more unique, plus it makes sense historically. You just have to work around it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 06:50
|
|
|
Just saw that one of the age of revolution things is -33% liberty desire from development. Guess I'll be able keep a full sized Brazil loyal after all! btw this expansion is great. My Portugal start was much better than the few times I tried before the expansion, mainly because of an early golden age + the 50 colony growth age of discovery whatchamacallit Portugal gets helped get past that early Portugal slump. Then you hit the money singularity and never look back. I haven't had to deal with the super Ming though so I guess I have that to look forward to in a future play through. Maybe I'll even try playing them
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 07:41
|
|
|
SnoochtotheNooch posted:They offered to make me a tributary just before I ate usegi but I declined and had a long war holding them off until my manpower was gone. Now they have -30opinion from trust and wont let me offer to be their tributary. I guess what pissed me off is after I killed like almost 60k troops (corned and wiped them out) they still had +2 stab, 70 prestige and 7 war exhaustion. They immediately got into a defensive war with korea, kicked their rear end and had absolutely no problems. What the hell does it take to break ming's stability now? Its just lame that I have pretty much no hope of ever invading. Yeah, if you're a tributary, Ming doesn't get called into wars against other tributaries. You were really supposed to accept their offer at that point, and made things tremendously more difficult by not doing so. Being a tributary typically only nets a loss of between .5 to 1 monarch point per month, you maintain all diplomatic freedom, and can quit whenever. It's basically the toll you pay to enter into East Asian politics. It's pretty lame though how far Ming's influence reaches and how you pretty much have no choice but to pay that toll, or else get royally hosed by Mega Ming.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 08:12
|
|
|
Michael Bayleaf posted:Just saw that one of the age of revolution things is -33% liberty desire from development. Guess I'll be able keep a full sized Brazil loyal after all! If you're ever worried about subject loyalty in some future game, try developing their provinces some; it's a seriously broken way to keep subjects loyal
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 10:28
|
|
|
I am a united Japan (plus south korea and a big chunk of the random new world all to myself  ) and Ming is eyeing my provinces with hostility. I am going to become a tributary before they kick my rear end, but will they ever collapse on their own or should I start planning something?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 11:10
|
|
|
TorakFade posted:I am a united Japan (plus south korea and a big chunk of the random new world all to myself It doesn't sound like Ming is collapsing in the current version of the game, unless there is a 300+ development horde bordering them that isn't a tributary.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 11:12
|
|
|
Node posted:It doesn't sound like Ming is collapsing in the current version of the game, unless there is a 300+ development horde bordering them that isn't a tributary. Yeah guessed so. Also kirishitan japan is a pain in the rear end, how in the hell do I convert enough provinces before rebels pop up everywhere and shatter japan into a million daimyos AGAIN?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 11:45
|
|
|
Honestly tributaries feel a bit janky atm. China never intervenes between tributaries so you get no real security for it (which was one of the reasons people did it historically) while china's gain from it is insane to the point they're keeping up in tech with 200% penalties and mad poo poo like that. And on top of that China itself seems to be bugged since the emperor spams you with tributary requests until they hate you.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 13:00
|
|
|
They also seem to declare on some of the hordes to force them to become their tributary but never request that in the peace deal. Endless "make tributary" wars against Chagatai where Ming just peaces out with war reps and comes back every 5 years. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 13:09
|
|
|
I guess you could consider perpetual war reps some form of tributary status, in a sense.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 13:12
|
|
|
With the added bonus that they can't eat up all your other tributaries and grow powerful enough to challenge you. It's genius, really.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 13:13
|
|
|
Koramei posted:In my game they spammed the make tributary thing repeatedly in my face for like 5 minutes until giving up and declaring war on me. Like, every 20 seconds or so I'd get a new alert. Gotta just be a bug. Here is how you work around it, you become a tributary, give ming some lovely points every year while you eat everything you can ignoring AE. It's 1520 and I am eating into India with a lot of nations at over 200 AE already.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 13:30
|
|
|
Tahirovic posted:Here is how you work around it, you become a tributary, give ming some lovely points every year while you eat everything you can ignoring AE. It's 1520 and I am eating into India with a lot of nations at over 200 AE already.  I love it when a bug that makes something ridiculously overpowered is matched by another bug that gives crippling exploits against you. Do ming get massive coalitions annihilating them if you get enough AE piled on them, too?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 13:45
|
|
|
What do people mean when they say that AE is broken as a tributary. The AE still shows up as mine when I take stuff in a war, and in my Japan game Ayutthaya got a huge coalition triggered against it while being a tributary of Ming.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 14:58
|
|
|
I haven't gotten to play much - how are you guys feeling about the merc changes?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 15:12
|
|
|
In my current game I took Administrative Ideas early and have a lot of trade income, so I've been able to afford the more expensive mercs without a problem. Hard to tell how much of a difference the combat change makes, but I assume it's saving me manpower. I think it's fine. Along with the reduced state limit, this just makes Administrative an even more useful idea set.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 15:21
|
|
|
AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:I haven't gotten to play much - how are you guys feeling about the merc changes? Reinforcements are definitely expensive. Even with an economy matching Mings I noticed the cost. I didn't go Admin though so that could be part of it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 19:35
|
|
|
Does anyone know why my development divided by technology cost is so low? I'm up to date on tech and institutions. It's preventing me from becoming a great power.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 19:51
|
|
|
Node posted:Does anyone know why my development divided by technology cost is so low? I'm up to date on tech and institutions. It's preventing me from becoming a great power. It's because you're a tributary state.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 19:56
|
|
|
Chickpea Roar posted:It's because you're a tributary state. Thanks. How much of a penalty to the mandate counter does Ming get when a 300+ development horde borders them? Node fucked around with this message at 20:12 on Apr 9, 2017 |
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 20:08
|
|
|
Node posted:Thanks. It's a disaster that ticks up over a really long period, something like 15 years. So you'll likely be brought into conflict with them at some point during that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 20:11
|
|
|
Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:It's a disaster that ticks up over a really long period, something like 15 years. So you'll likely be brought into conflict with them at some point during that. I'm a 400 development Manchu and they were spamming me with tributary requests as soon as I broke off. Ming has 230,000 troops and I have about 60,000 so I can't fight them...
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 20:26
|
|
|
Your army is man for man much better than theirs, even if they don't have a low mandate. Time your breaking off from Ming with a technological advantage, and you should be able to end up with a possible temporary lead in the war. The disaster speeds up a lot when Ming is losing a war, so if you can do this you can try holding them off long enough for the disaster to trigger. I don't actually know how long it is when you account for the losing war modifier.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 20:38
|
|
|
I was playing around as Manchu until I had a complete brainfart. I had taken Admin ideas to unlock up to core cost reduction there and in my national set, but somehow got it into my head that what I really wanted to do was rush to reform the government. In the meantime I had mostly enveloped Ming, from Korea to just shy of Bengal. Based that game and my Aragon game (to grab its achievement and try out the Ages in a safe space), Ming really does have a good path to slamming through its reforms and keeping 20 or so tributes all game. Heck they even spawned Manufactories when I was actually trying to get that as Aragon. Earlier playing near the Ming felt kind of stupid honestly. You would wait until this super-stable blob got a single bad son to inherit the empire, and if they didn't blow 600 Mil on legitimacy (they never did), the past 2000 years of Chinese history would take up pitchforks and sunder the whole drat thing. Right now the path to destroying the Ming seems non-obvious, and getting the whole country involved in its tributes' defensive wars is probably too much, but most of the current Ming buff feels like a good correction.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 20:43
|
|
|
thatdarnedbob posted:Heck they even spawned Manufactories when I was actually trying to get that as Aragon. I think I've seen this happen in every game I've ever played. It's pretty funny really
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 20:47
|
|
|
I just got the base game and Art of War in the current sale. Is this a good resource or is there something better or more current I should be watching/reading? Apart from a few false starts with CK2 I've never played a Paradox grand strategy game.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 20:49
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 17:26 |
|
|
 
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2017 21:16
|
|