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It's not even fabricating ideas. We as audience members are invited to "like" and connect to the droid characters as much as anyone else in the original movie. Indeed reviews at the time did sometimes criticize how the robots seemed more "real" and "lifelike" than the human characters. This holds through the OT- the droids have as much emotion as anyone. (Consider the sadistic torturer in ROTJ- "You're a feisty little one, but you'll soon learn some respect.") And in TPM this pretty much continues. For plot reasons, the battle droids are controlled from the spaceship's central computer and disabled without it, but they say things like "Uh-oh" and "Wait, uh, this does not compute, uh... you're under arrest!" and so on. They're stock character types as much as anyone else in the movies. This is because in Star Wars everyone is a stock character type. The farmboy, the princess, the noble knight, the scheming politician, etc. There is no difference between the "organic" and droid characters in this regard. They fight, they quip, they run when someone shoots at them. Like, there are movies which do go into the differences between humans and machines and the former having qualities that the latter cannot, etc. The Star Wars series is not that.
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Oct 6, 2016 18:25
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prove to me that anakin is not a robot from AOTC on. It would explain his speech/acting and I think is more poignant because we watch a boy become a robot become an evil robot.
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Oct 6, 2016 18:27
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There are no people in the prequels.
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Oct 6, 2016 18:46
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Did any of the EU ever explain what happened between the gang and a bounty hunter on Ord Mantell?
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Oct 6, 2016 18:52
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rear end Catchcum posted:prove to me that anakin is not a robot from AOTC on. He's acting like James Dean in Rebel a Without A Cause. You now have a choice. You can accept that there is no real difference between humans and replicants, or you can start getting weird thoughts and surreptitiously zoom in on footage of Dean's pupils for traces of the reptilian shapeshifting ("the tezzor solution").
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Oct 6, 2016 18:55
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:He's acting like James Dean in Rebel a Without A Cause. People keep saying this and now I never want to watch it.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:02
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Red posted:Did any of the EU ever explain what happened between the gang and a bounty hunter on Ord Mantell?
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Oct 6, 2016 19:05
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RBA Starblade posted:People keep saying this and now I never want to watch it. Well that certainly wouldn't be the first of your problems. Memes have caused you to hyperfixate on things that were never a problem in any other film, including the original Star Wars trilogy. You are upset because you were told to feel upset. You don't even know why.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:16
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Oh, what the hell.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:16
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:Memes have caused you to hyperfixate on things that were never a problem in any other film, including the original Star Wars trilogy. You are upset because you were told to feel upset. You don't even know why. I was wondering when you'd write another chapter.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:18
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RBA Starblade posted:People keep saying this and now I never want to watch it. it's actually a really good movie OP also yeah here's anakin (go to 1m53s and 3m47s) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2E1QdvCC0Eg Waffles Inc. fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Oct 6, 2016 |
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Oct 6, 2016 19:23
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quote:it's actually a really good movie OP I'm sure it is but I can't stand that style of acting at all.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:26
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I haven't followed this thread closely since the film released. What is the point is being made by viewing the robots as people? Thanks and I'll take my answer off the air.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:30
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RBA Starblade posted:I'm sure it is but I can't stand that style of acting at all. acting like a real teenager who is emotionally stunted and prone to outbursts and completely full of turmoil over the role he's supposed to play and his own experience with reality? because hayden probably read the scripts and saw anakin as that exact guy and thought, "oh james dean in rebel without a cause is basically the benchmark for that character so i should take some notes" Rebel Without a Cause synopsis posted:After moving to a new town, troublemaking teen Jim Stark (James Dean) is supposed to have a clean slate, although being the new kid in town brings its own problems. While searching for some stability, Stark forms a bond with a disturbed classmate, Plato (Sal Mineo), and falls for local girl Judy (Natalie Wood). However, Judy is the girlfriend of neighborhood tough, Buzz (Corey Allen). When Buzz violently confronts Jim and challenges him to a drag race, the new kid's real troubles begin. I mean come on temple posted:I haven't followed this thread closely since the film released. What is the point is being made by viewing the robots as people? Thanks and I'll take my answer off the air. the "point"?
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Oct 6, 2016 19:32
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RBA Starblade posted:I was wondering when you'd write another chapter. You have dismissed the acting in a celebrated classic film you haven't seen. Pause to consider what has led you to this.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:34
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temple posted:I haven't followed this thread closely since the film released. What is the point is being made by viewing the robots as people? Thanks and I'll take my answer off the air. The two main droids introduced in A New Hope are based off of two peasant characters from Akira Kurosawa's film Hidden Fortress. Similar to that film, R2 and 3PO serve as comic relief and the (initial) driver behind the plot's movement. They participate in the plot of most of the films, but generally serve us as observers/narrators, along with inoffensive comic relief. In the Star Wars universe, droids are programmed robots who accept their jobs and go about them until they're destroyed or reprogrammed. Contrary to that, R2 and 3PO appear to have some measure of free will - R2 moreso than 3PO. R2 actively does what he wants, while 3PO remains in denial. The thread's discussion centers around whether droids are unthinking automatons or free-thinking, sentient beings. The answer is the former, but the two star droids are an exception - but still not quite sentient.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:34
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Waffles Inc. posted:acting like a real teenager who is emotionally stunted and prone to outbursts and completely full of turmoil over the role he's supposed to play and his own experience with reality? I guess so. I feel bad for Hayden now though. He wasn't lovely, I just didn't like what he was channeling. quote:You have dismissed the acting in a celebrated classic film you haven't seen. Nah.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:35
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Red posted:Oh, what the hell.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:35
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There are other free will droids besides r2 and 3po
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Oct 6, 2016 19:36
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Waffles Inc. posted:it's actually a really good movie OP Wow, damned if Christensen wasn't spot on in imitating that. I can definitely say I'm equally repulsed by both performances. I'll save the ham for Christmas dinner.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:36
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euphronius posted:There are other free will droids besides r2 and 3po Are there? I've read conflicting stuff about R5-D4, and I think I understand IG-88 to be part of a weird hivemind thing. I also don't count Grievous as a droid. Other bordline droids (EV-9D9, for example) are following programming, even if that programming is just perverse.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:39
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General Grievous is a cyborg. What the other droids are doing is their jobs. You wouldn't deny that you have free will just because you obey your boss, would you? temple posted:I haven't followed this thread closely since the film released. What is the point is being made by viewing the robots as people? Thanks and I'll take my answer off the air. The argument tends to go something like this: Simplicio. A failure of the prequels is that the Jedi are not heroic and the Republic is not inspiring. Salviati. This is the point: the Republic and the Jedi are depicted as morally ambiguous if not outright villainous, and it is their own moral failure that leads to their downfall. Simplicio. What villainous acts do they perform? Salviati. One example is that, in contradiction to their doctrine, they dehumanize their enemies. Consider Obi-Wan's line, "If droids could think, we wouldn't be here, would we?" Simplicio. What is wrong with that? Droids cannot think. They are machines, property, objects. Salviati. Droids are people.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:47
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Red posted:The two main droids introduced in A New Hope are based off of two peasant characters from Akira Kurosawa's film Hidden Fortress. Similar to that film, R2 and 3PO serve as comic relief and the (initial) driver behind the plot's movement. They participate in the plot of most of the films, but generally serve us as observers/narrators, along with inoffensive comic relief. Bongo Bill posted:General Grievous is a cyborg.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:54
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Red posted:Are there? I've read conflicting stuff about R5-D4, and I think I understand IG-88 to be part of a weird hivemind thing. If you apply your same arbitrary definitions to the non droid characters you would find that many bipedal human animals are also not people. What free will does Aunt Beru display she was merely functionating the vegetable smoothie program.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:57
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The point here is that you are upset at a 'style' that you have only ever encountered/noticed in a single film. 'Style' is in scare-quotes because your complaint has nothing to with the formal or technical qualities of acting. So you can instantly shift from blaming Hayden Christensen as a person to blaming a style of acting that is entirely unfamiliar to you. Neither of these things is the actual reason you feel upset. You do not know why you feel upset.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:59
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What about the tie fighter pilots? People or droids? They are merely effectulizing the tie fighter programs.
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Oct 6, 2016 19:59
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euphronius posted:If you apply your same arbitrary definitions to the non droid characters you would find that many bipedal human animals are also not people. What free will does Aunt Beru display she was merely functionating the vegetable smoothie program. Huh. I think you've got me there. Goddamn. I mean, I assume it's reasonable to assume humans onscreen are humans with free will until explicitly informed they are not, and thus, have free will. I would also theorize all living organisms onscreen abide by the same rules. But that's likely specious. So with that scope, I think I have to consider that all droids are sentient, bound by programming (chains).
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Oct 6, 2016 20:03
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Red posted:So with that scope, I think I have to consider that all droids are sentient, bound by programming (chains). I think the existence of restraining bolts probably is enough to make the assumption that all droids are like Threepio and R2. Its obviously a piece of equipment that is commonly used on other droids aside from R2.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:07
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:The point here is that you are upset at a 'style' that you have only ever encountered/noticed in a single film. 'Style' is in scare-quotes because your complaint has nothing to with the formal or technical qualities of acting. Nah. For everyone else, it's interesting to see what he was going for (and actually succeeds at). I still find it insufferable though.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:07
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Basebf555 posted:I think the existence of restraining bolts probably is enough to make the assumption that all droids are like Threepio and R2. Its obviously a piece of equipment that is commonly used on other droids aside from R2. Possibly. They may also be used to counteract existing programming.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:10
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Is my toaster a people?
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Oct 6, 2016 20:19
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Red posted:So with that scope, I think I have to consider that all droids are sentient, bound by programming (chains). Humans have programming too, it just isn't downloaded into us via USB port. Instead, its reinforced at every stage of life, but the directives reinforced in childhood tend to be the strongest.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:20
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Steve2911 posted:Is my toaster a people? Does it complain about suffering and cry out in pain?
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Oct 6, 2016 20:21
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euphronius posted:Does it complain about suffering and cry out in pain? Yes.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:22
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euphronius posted:Does it complain about suffering and cry out in pain? Yes but I also just fired it out the airlock so problem solved.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:23
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I'm always fascinated by the contortions people will do to ignore the fact that droids are people. But then again, denying the personhood of others just because they appear different is a time-honored tradition.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:24
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This thread got me woke for real
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Oct 6, 2016 20:28
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Are droids people, though?
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Oct 6, 2016 20:34
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rear end Catchcum posted:This thread got me woke for real It's a shame that wokeness doesn't get rid of obnoxiousness.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:36
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rear end Catchcum posted:This thread got me woke for real reappropriating phrases used by minorities to exclaim sarcasm on the internet, man you got this poo poo down to a science.
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Oct 6, 2016 20:45
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