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Bodacious posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xc8uS-KJX2w Things that have me worried: - Making him into a more standard engagement tank instead of focusing on his unique ability to force engagements with hook. - Skills that focus on increasing the "utility" of hook such that it becomes just another skill shot you throw out when its off cooldown to make use of its secondary effects. Essentially changing the focus from hitting precision hooks to just hitting any hook. - Vile gas being changed to an on-attack effect is in line with their desire to make him into a more "in your face" tank but the implication that he has bad waveclear in his current state makes me think the devs don't know what their talking about. Guess people were complaining about hook too much.
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Nov 29, 2018 02:39
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Didn't they also say at Blizzcon that Sylvanas is getting a rework in December? Something about making her more of a pure damage dealer (and I assume finally changing the building disable trait). Either way, with their current schedule of alternating reworks and heroes there won't be a new hero until at least January.
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Nov 29, 2018 02:43
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Sylvanas is the only non-weird (Murky/Aba/Vikings) specialist to need a rework right?
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Nov 29, 2018 02:45
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Ok I watched the video. I hate the trait change, it goes from one of the few abilities in the game that weren't win-more into something extremely generic. Really really bad. Slam adding the slow baseline now makes his kit more standard for a tank which is lame. They're basically designing these heroes by formula at this point which makes the game feel stale. Basically what I expected. I assume fishing hook is going to get removed, and I'm guessing flea bag will too (I will miss flea bag more than fishing hook). No Wave fucked around with this message at 02:50 on Nov 29, 2018 |
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Nov 29, 2018 02:47
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BattleHamster posted:- Vile gas being changed to an on-attack effect is in line with their desire to make him into a more "in your face" tank but the implication that he has bad waveclear in his current state makes me think the devs don't know what their talking about. I can actually speak to the logic behind that change. Right now, Stitches relies very heavily on Slam for his waveclear, but they wanted to change the functionality of Slam to be less of a DPS/AOE supplement and more into something that has a strategic use - hence the slow that was added to it, along with its cooldown increase. However, that left Stitches without sufficient waveclear strength, so his Trait was changed to make his attacks into mini-Slams so he could still beat up waves effectively without using Slam itself. It's much less "making Stitches into an in-your-face tank" and more "we know you guys love to send Stitches to the solo lane, so we're making sure you can still do that".
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Nov 29, 2018 02:50
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BattleHamster posted:
That's because they don't, the dev's can't even beat their own bots
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Nov 29, 2018 03:08
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BattleHamster posted:Guess people were complaining about hook too much. The next time you get grabbed from the fog of war and Gorged into a 5v1, I hope you’ll look back on this post. Nobody liked the pull-and-flip poo poo on Garrosh either.
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Nov 29, 2018 03:08
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Dire Human posted:The next time you get grabbed from the fog of war and Gorged into a 5v1, I hope you’ll look back on this post. I like both of those things (Stitches is just a watered down Pudge and Pudge is great) and taking the pull from Garrosh was some of the lamest poo poo they've ever done to a character.
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Nov 29, 2018 03:13
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They really should've just switched the locations of Decimate and Groundbreaker/Wrecking Ball instead of removing the pull from Groundbreaker. The problem was that you could pull and throw and taunt - cut out one of the steps and Garrosh isn't nearly as overpowering.
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Nov 29, 2018 03:25
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Kalko posted:This is interesting because a few weeks ago I was watching Fan as Yrel say she dumpsters Fenix in lane, then he proceeded to demonstrate exactly that. Then later in a game I tried to do the same thing but... I'm not Fan. I meant pushing as in actually pushing. You just cannon the wave and q it then leave and sit on the base until next wave. Though I can kill them if they aren't perfect on their knock backs. Most people in low gm high masters aren't Fan either haha SSJ_naruto_2003 fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Nov 29, 2018 |
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Nov 29, 2018 03:43
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Yardbomb posted:I like both of those things (Stitches is just a watered down Pudge and Pudge is great) and taking the pull from Garrosh was some of the lamest poo poo they've ever done to a character. Yes, I’m sure you like doing them. Extreme range on a no-risk displacement ability is just as unfun as extreme range on no-risk burst damage, or did we start liking Chromie now?
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Nov 29, 2018 04:41
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It'd probably help if HOTS, both in terms of map design and the way hook worked, wasn't such a janky piece of poo poo. Every time you're Pudge hooked, you know either they made a good play or you hosed up (and probably both) and Pudge is shut down by smart movement and map awareness. Meanwhile, Stitches with his weird 'It feels like a homegrown SC2 mod every time the hook goes out, or clips someone' and maps that are basically 'hook down the lane, options for flank hooks are nearly zero' are deeply unsatisfying for all parties. Also, now you can see Chromie stuff coming it's fine, and the artillery role is fine too - I wish Bye Bye didn't exist, but that's because her risk/reward should be skewed in favour of not being leapt on; I'm not sure you can ever resolve that without making her Zeratul food, though.
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Nov 29, 2018 05:08
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Yardbomb posted:I like both of those things (Stitches is just a watered down Pudge and Pudge is great) and taking the pull from Garrosh was some of the lamest poo poo they've ever done to a character. Correct, instead of removing Garrosh's pull they should have instead removed Garrosh.
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Nov 29, 2018 05:11
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Garrosh is so much worse to play against than Stitches. If you get hooked it’s normally your fault for moving predictably or the Stitches just doing a really good hook. With Garrosh it’s like “well, better not engage or I’m going to be thrown into the middle of his team and blown up. Guess I’ll just wander around while our teams poke gets less efficient.” It suuuuucks. Plus getting a real good hook will rally the boys and make the whole game smoother.
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Nov 29, 2018 05:17
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Schneider Inside Her posted:Garrosh is so much worse to play against than Stitches. If you get hooked it’s normally your fault for moving predictably or the Stitches just doing a really good hook. With Garrosh it’s like “well, better not engage or I’m going to be thrown into the middle of his team and blown up. Guess I’ll just wander around while our teams poke gets less efficient.” It suuuuucks. I got to play a game today against a team with both Stitches and Garrosh, let me tell you how amazingly fun and interactive the stun-into-throw-into-taunt-into-hook combo is. And yes, I would legitimately rather be hooked and gorged a million times than ever have to deal with Garrosh making every teamfight an interminable slog of attempting to poke without actually engaging while his armor steadily goes up and if you manage to land some good CC on him oh right he has a self-cleanse too.
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Nov 29, 2018 05:26
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 Fun Fact: Tassadar is the only one that doesn't get the XP bonus because he's the only Support that's not a Healer
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Nov 29, 2018 05:54
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But the ticklebeam build is so much fun, don't kill it. 
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Nov 29, 2018 06:01
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Kith posted:I can actually speak to the logic behind that change. Right now, Stitches relies very heavily on Slam for his waveclear, but they wanted to change the functionality of Slam to be less of a DPS/AOE supplement and more into something that has a strategic use - hence the slow that was added to it, along with its cooldown increase. However, that left Stitches without sufficient waveclear strength, so his Trait was changed to make his attacks into mini-Slams so he could still beat up waves effectively without using Slam itself. Don't really know how to prove this, but I disagree with the idea the Stitches relies heavily on Slam for waveclear. It's good for fast clearing but there are lots of times when I don't think the mana usage is worth it since he does just fine with gas, autos, and devour. Anyway, the reason it makes me worried is because the way it's phrased it in the video they are "boosting his wave clear" with vile gas... which is already used to clear waves by anyone who knows a small amount about lane control and minion wrangling. They are most likely tooling around with the damage too but it made me do a double-take like do they not know you can have the enemy minions attack you to apply gas to the wave?
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Nov 29, 2018 08:29
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BattleHamster posted:Don't really know how to prove this, but I disagree with the idea the Stitches relies heavily on Slam for waveclear. It's good for fast clearing but there are lots of times when I don't think the mana usage is worth it since he does just fine with gas, autos, and devour. Anyway, the reason it makes me worried is because the way it's phrased it in the video they are "boosting his wave clear" with vile gas... which is already used to clear waves by anyone who knows a small amount about lane control and minion wrangling. They are most likely tooling around with the damage too but it made me do a double-take like do they not know you can have the enemy minions attack you to apply gas to the wave? All that said, while the preview video they showed may not be representative of the finished result it looked very much like this new Stitches was able to immediately apply his trait to an entire minion wave even without needing to be attacked by them, so if the spread is that easy and generous then yeah, it looks like it may actually be a boost to his waveclear in that you can get your trait spreading across the wave more quickly without even needing to slam.
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Nov 29, 2018 10:27
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BattleHamster posted:Don't really know how to prove this, but I disagree with the idea the Stitches relies heavily on Slam for waveclear. It's good for fast clearing but there are lots of times when I don't think the mana usage is worth it since he does just fine with gas, autos, and devour. Full Slam Build Offlaner Stitches has been pretty popular for quite some time. Hell, even if you're not shoving Stitches into your offlane, he's likely to take Full Slam Build just because his damage is pathetic without it. quote:Anyway, the reason it makes me worried is because the way it's phrased it in the video they are "boosting his wave clear" with vile gas... which is already used to clear waves by anyone who knows a small amount about lane control and minion wrangling. They are most likely tooling around with the damage too but it made me do a double-take like do they not know you can have the enemy minions attack you to apply gas to the wave?
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Nov 29, 2018 16:10
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So I haven't played in months but Yrel was my absolute fave character, does this nerf just absolutely dumpster her?
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Nov 29, 2018 17:50
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This stitches rework seems uninspired, especially given the fact that there are other heroes that are begging for one
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Nov 29, 2018 18:00
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Semper Fudge posted:So I haven't played in months but Yrel was my absolute fave character, does this nerf just absolutely dumpster her? I dunno but it’s an absolutely crippling nerf. She’s still very good 1v1 and can bully most people but this makes her a lot less snowbally in the early game
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Nov 29, 2018 18:10
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Semper Fudge posted:So I haven't played in months but Yrel was my absolute fave character, does this nerf just absolutely dumpster her? She shouldn't be dead but this boots her right out of high-tier.
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Nov 29, 2018 18:34
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heres the sylvanas rework https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAmq3saNt8M
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Nov 29, 2018 19:32
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Kith posted:It's primarily a QoL change. From what I've heard, the team was unhappy with how Vile Gas was activated - they felt it was too much of a pain to micro-manage waves into damaging you, and they didn't like that it activated on damage instead of being something that the player themselves chose to use. Now you can choose when and where to deploy the trait's damage output, which IMO is a much better system than the previous setup. This seems to be on point similar to how they made raynors W activatable rather than at a damage threshold. Generally seems like they want control to be in the players hand vs. Hoping the enemy activates your skills for you. Now if they just apply that to tyraels passive...
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Nov 29, 2018 19:39
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Midnightghoul posted:heres the sylvanas rework Mind Control no longer being a channel is a pretty significant upgrade for that ult
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Nov 29, 2018 19:40
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Mind control was a very fun ability to use, and Dark Lady's call never stopped being hilarious. One-man skillshot horrify doesnt look very fun. But who cares about fun when you're "upgrading" talent trees?
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Nov 29, 2018 20:55
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No Wave posted:Mind control was a very fun ability to use, and Dark Lady's call never stopped being hilarious. One-man skillshot horrify doesnt look very fun. But who cares about fun when you're "upgrading" talent trees? Sylv's mind control is the weirdest hill to plant a flag on in terms of "how dare Blizzard change this meme-tier ability," c'mon man.
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Nov 29, 2018 21:27
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No Wave posted:Mind control was a very fun ability to use, and Dark Lady's call never stopped being hilarious. One-man skillshot horrify doesnt look very fun. But who cares about fun when you're "upgrading" talent trees? It's not an insta-death self root anymore though, big buff.
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Nov 29, 2018 21:46
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It really wasn't, especially after cleanse was removed from so many supports. An ability that requires as little micro or precision to use as mind control doesn't really fit into the devs' vision of this game becoming Battlerite so I'm not surprised to see it go.
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Nov 29, 2018 21:49
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Dislike the direction they are going in with both Stiches and Sylv but I guess I won't know until I try them. MC change is about the only thing I can get behind but to me it seems like there is even less reason to take it over wailing arrow now (assuming that they don't change wailing arrow too). appropriatemetaphor posted:It's not an insta-death self root anymore though, big buff. It's a buff in that its more generally useful but that's already the role that wailing arrow fills really well. IMO it looks worse in the few situations where MC was a good choice, particularly against highly mobile or backline targets where the skill shot will be hard to land. BattleHamster fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Nov 29, 2018 |
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Nov 29, 2018 21:58
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MC had 11 range... To the MC haters - how much range would it have to have until you thought it was good? 13? 15?
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Nov 29, 2018 22:12
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Im mostly surprised they let her even keep some version of her trait this will not stop solo lane afk split push sylvanas's
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Nov 29, 2018 22:16
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lmao they had to give sylv the "minions explode on death" talent AND have her blow her E on a wave to make it look like she was clearing it quickly I'm reserving judgment for now but if they can't boast about Sylv's waveclear without doing that in the heavily doctored gameplay video then I'm not confident. Edit: Honestly, I kinda hate the Sylvanas rework! Banshee's Curse is cute, but it bugs me that you don't get Banshee's Curse stacks out of Ability Damage. Black Arrow feels tertiary. Why is it activatable now? Why can't it be part of Banshee's Curse? The new Withering Fire lacks the charm the current one has. It's basically a reskinned Lightning Rod with more finicky targeting instead of a cool rapid-fire torrent of arrows you can whip out when needed. Shadow Dagger is probably the only change I support (and even then I still kinda hate it). It's nice that the ability is no longer "oh you got the Black Flu so now everyone else around you is going to get it too", but it looks really janky based on that what I've seen. I could give it a pass if it at least stacked Banshee's Curse for you, but it doesn't. Mind Control is now better, but similarly to Withering Fire, the new version is so flat and uninteresting I find myself completely uninterested. It's literally just Arhi's Charm. Seriously, pop open the ability preview - they're identical. Kith fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Nov 29, 2018 |
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Nov 29, 2018 22:38
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Nov 29, 2018 23:17
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Oh no more people might pick wailing arrow instead of mind control, how terrible.
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Nov 29, 2018 23:25
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Err so a lot of people don't know Fenix is a good solo laner? Was doing some solo TL and got told Fenix is bad in lane and also Johanna is "arguably" the worst tank in the game  Also lost a game because people stood in Kael'thas' Q. Like Kaelthas isn't that good, just don't stand in his stuff.
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Nov 29, 2018 23:26
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appropriatemetaphor posted:Err so a lot of people don't know Fenix is a good solo laner? Was doing some solo TL and got told Fenix is bad in lane and also Johanna is "arguably" the worst tank in the game The only time I've ever struggled in lane as Fenix is against Zagara who has enough forms of autonomous poke damage that it keeps me from regenning shields easily. Otherwise that dude sounds dumb, but also KT is good, it's just that focusing on living bomb is stronger than the full flamestrike build everyone gravitates towards.
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Nov 29, 2018 23:36
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Kai Tave posted:Oh no more people might pick wailing arrow instead of mind control, how terrible. I'm usually about 50/50 on them, but losing the ability to walk some poor escaping bastard to their doom is a shame. Edit: Guaranteed pull I should say. Turning it from point-and-click to a slow skillshot pretty much ruins it for its intended purpose. Dire Human fucked around with this message at 23:50 on Nov 29, 2018 |
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Nov 29, 2018 23:39
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