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Uroboros posted:You got me man, have only gotten to play competitive Eldar once in 8th.  For 155pts, but linked fire so you're always taking minimum 2 for 310. Painfully aware of not enough LoS blockers on the table being a relatively short range army and the main hills were pretty much on opposite corners, though I have now realised that auto launchers are unlimited use and definitely worth the trade-off of 2d6 s4 shots. They move far enough to pretty much always get an angle on you and if one can see you they all see you.
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Feb 15, 2018 03:47
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Artum posted:
Honestly, you don’t have many options. 155 is dreadfully cheap especially when you consider these stratagems. It should be possible to keep a Contemptor hidden, but ultimately every other option is worse. You could forgo vehicles entirely if they are just getting massacred and focus on playing a more infantry heavy force keeping something like Plasma Exterminators in Reserve to strike at the vehicle if it makes itself vulnerable.
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Feb 15, 2018 04:30
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I'm not sure how I feel about the way they've been 'fixing' main battle space tanks this edition. The conditional double-shot (along with non-imperium tanks generally not ignoring Heavy move and fire penalties) really encourages all of these mobile armored units to sit real still the whole game. That and non-fliers really hating even the weakest assaults really makes them feel fragile. Possibly very thematic though, with how powerful infantry weapons are in the setting? Also yikes, some vehicles just end up miles ahead of others on their cost-to-impact ratio.
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Feb 15, 2018 04:34
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Uroboros posted:Honestly, you don’t have many options. 155 is dreadfully cheap especially when you consider these stratagems. It should be possible to keep a Contemptor hidden, but ultimately every other option is worse. You could forgo vehicles entirely if they are just getting massacred and focus on playing a more infantry heavy force keeping something like Plasma Exterminators in Reserve to strike at the vehicle if it makes itself vulnerable. Sadly plasma exterminators pretty much bounce off, it takes a 295pt squad of 5 overcharging to kill one but given 1s and 2s will kill the Inceptors you're basically guaranteed to lose that whole unit killing a single tank that costs half as much.
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Feb 15, 2018 04:39
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So, is there a point range where assassins become better/worse? My friends and I are going to stay at 500/1000 points for the foreseeable future, and I’ve been thinking that I’d like to include an assassin or two in my Scions heavy army. Are the vindicare worthwhile at that point range? I feel like I’ve read they are not so hot once you get into the bigger 2000 point stuff.
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Feb 15, 2018 04:54
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Artum posted:Sadly plasma exterminators pretty much bounce off, it takes a 295pt squad of 5 overcharging to kill one but given 1s and 2s will kill the Inceptors you're basically guaranteed to lose that whole unit killing a single tank that costs half as much. They would be more for holding in threat. I have no idea how many CPs your opponent is running but you don’t have to overcharge, and they are good for murdering lots of other things, while being able to avoid getting picked off. Unfortunately there isn’t much in the Marine armory that can move and reach out without penalty meaning getting in close keeping your opponent on the defense is your main option, but at the end of the day if there isn’t terrain you’re going to lose. TheArmorOfContempt fucked around with this message at 05:15 on Feb 15, 2018 |
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Feb 15, 2018 05:13
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Rules question: I was playing last night and my opponent had 3 long lines set up in his deployment area, the first of Necron warriors, then flayed ones, then more warriors. I teleported to his left flank with my terminators and Lysander and after a failed charge, he eventually (and stupidly as it turned out) charged me with his flayed ones. However, since they were stretched so far out, only a handful could reach the fight. So he had 5-6 units in the combat area (within an inch of units within an inch of my units) and a tail stretching back 6-7 more units. When I killed some of them, he began by selecting units killed from the back of the daisy chain, which stretched a good 12" or so away from the combat. Is that how it's supposed to be done? Seems wrong to me.
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Feb 15, 2018 05:17
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Wouldn't a normal Sicaran be really good against a Fire Prism? The rule on the gun reads: Attacks made with this weapon suffer no penalty to its hit roll when targeting units with the FLY keyword. In addition, every wound roll of 6+ made with this weapon increases the AP of that individual wound to -3. My read on that is that you would ignore any to-hit penalties against targets with fly regardless of source, which against Eldar could be incredibly strong. Obviously it's a relic and you have to keep it alive to shoot but it's a decent starting place.
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Feb 15, 2018 05:20
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That's legit as far as I can tell. Daisy chaining is a dumb thing that looks dumb but if they're still in coherency he should be good to pluck from the back. It's what you'd do if your guys were 3"away instead of 7", right?
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Feb 15, 2018 05:22
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TheBigAristotle posted:Rules question: First point of order: The difference between "model" and "unit". A unit is a group of models (sometimes just one). That's exactly how allocating wounds works, though if we're going by the letter of the rules he should be declaring that this guy in the back is taking the wound, then rolling for it, then this next wound, then rolling for it, etc. But that's even dumber, so nobody does it. In general though, that's how it works. He could have killed himself out of combat, by having no units left within 1" of yours, too. Each option serves a different purpose when all is said and done.
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Feb 15, 2018 05:22
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Deified Data posted:That's legit as far as I can tell. Daisy chaining is a dumb thing that looks dumb but if they're still in coherency he should be good to pluck from the back. It's what you'd do if your guys were 3"away instead of 7", right? Technically coherency doesn't matter until the Movement Phase. You can kill yourself right the hell out of coherency and nothing cares until that unit gets picked to move next turn. You're required to move as close as you can to coherency if you're not already in it, but that's the only stipulation.
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Feb 15, 2018 05:24
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Strobe posted:First point of order: The difference between "model" and "unit". A unit is a group of models (sometimes just one). That's the video games talking lol, but thanks for the answer
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Feb 15, 2018 05:27
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Pendent posted:Wouldn't a normal Sicaran be really good against a Fire Prism? The rule on the gun reads: Oh yeah, great point. Sicarans are super points efficient and made to Dick up flyers. Being an assault weapon also means it is pretty great against everything.
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Feb 15, 2018 05:33
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Uh, none of the elder tanks get negs to hit them from fly. They do get negs to hit from vehicle equipment and craftworld specific traits...Does that sicaran gun ignore those BECAUSE of the FLY keyword? I wouldn't think so... Like would the gun also ignore a cover bonus just because the unit has FLY? DiHK fucked around with this message at 05:52 on Feb 15, 2018 |
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Feb 15, 2018 05:49
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DiHK posted:Uh, none of the elder tanks get negs to hit them from fly. They do get negs to hit from vehicle equipment and craftworld specific traits...Does that sicaran gun ignore those BECAUSE of the FLY keyword? Yeah, the strict reading of the rule is that if the target has FLY, you ignore negative modifiers. No qualifiers.
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Feb 15, 2018 05:53
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Nuts. Is that the gun that looks like a gatling or the autocannon looking thing?
DiHK fucked around with this message at 06:04 on Feb 15, 2018 |
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Feb 15, 2018 06:01
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DiHK posted:Nuts. Is that the gun that looks like a gatling or the autocannon looking thing? That's the Accelerator Autocannon. It's an assault weapon as well for added fun. Waaaaait. You can advance and shoot at targets with fly with no penalty to hit the assault weapon. It doesn't specify that the penalty would have to be from the target. That's loving hilarious and potentially really strong. Pendent fucked around with this message at 06:10 on Feb 15, 2018 |
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Feb 15, 2018 06:05
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DiHK posted:Uh, none of the elder tanks get negs to hit them from fly. They do get negs to hit from vehicle equipment and craftworld specific traits...Does that sicaran gun ignore those BECAUSE of the FLY keyword? Cover is a modifier on the save, not the hit roll, so I don't think it would ignore that, but it does kind of own that it would ignore hit penalties that had nothing to do with FLYing, even if it came from a wizard power or something.
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Feb 15, 2018 06:09
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Forge World sucks rear end at rules: Exhibit A
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Feb 15, 2018 06:16
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Strobe posted:Forge World sucks rear end at rules: Exhibit A Yeah, this is pretty dumb and probably not intended to be honest. That line in the rules has always sort of bugged me for being so vague but I hadn't actually thought about how strong it could potentially be.
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Feb 15, 2018 06:19
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Strobe posted:Forge World sucks rear end at rules: Exhibit A They are also super cheap at 175. Ironically when you still compare that against the Fire Prism and all the options it has on top of it’s fantastic gun you still cant help but feel things aren’t really in your favor. Atleast Contemptors have an invuln save. The prism cannon will auto wound the sicaran...
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Feb 15, 2018 06:48
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Eldar must be getting a balance pass in March. They went completely under the radar last time (too much whining about Guard) but they're way undercosted at the moment.
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Feb 15, 2018 07:28
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Speaking of Guard, here's an army even bigger than mine: https://www.instagram.com/p/BfM0RIrnIhc/
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Feb 15, 2018 07:45
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So I heard apparently 8th edition doesn't suck so bad now? What's the dealio?
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Feb 15, 2018 08:47
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Inescapable Duck posted:So I heard apparently 8th edition doesn't suck so bad now? What's the dealio? That really depends what you didn't like about it to begin with.
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Feb 15, 2018 09:00
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Corrode posted:There is nothing at all pathetic about blowing $10 on it over an imaginary internet vendetta, in fact it's very cool and has definitely shown me! Try blaming the 30k thread, they're all toxic fuckers and this fits their MO.
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Feb 15, 2018 09:06
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Inescapable Duck posted:So I heard apparently 8th edition doesn't suck so bad now? What's the dealio? Lots of bloat has been cut, GW is doing active codex and faq care. They still gently caress it up but at least they are trying now. Melee is viable again.
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Feb 15, 2018 09:32
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Mango Polo posted:Try blaming the 30k thread, they're all toxic fuckers and this fits their MO. No one in the 30k thread has  to spare, I've seen FW prices
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Feb 15, 2018 09:47
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Artum posted:
Pendent posted:Wouldn't a normal Sicaran be really good against a Fire Prism? The rule on the gun reads: Failing that, what about a Stormhawk? It has the mobility to grab line of sight anywhere on the table, and gets +1 to hit against flyers for the las talon or +2 for the other two main weapon options. Alternatively you can drop a dread and meltavets using a Stormraven, then use Wisdom of the Ancients to reroll 1's for everything in the drop. If you get close to degrading a fire prism, the Flakk Missile or Hellfire Shells stratagems may help to tip it into the next level. No one thinks to hide from a lone heavy weapon tac marine. Regardless, this is a lot of points just for a chance to take out ~150pts of flying bullshit.
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Feb 15, 2018 09:56
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Cessna posted:Okay, you live in Nottingham and presumably play 40K... So, basically, in terms of interacting as in playing with them and chatting and stuff, lots. I'm at WW probably every week, and I know quite a few of the staff there in various capacities - some from before they worked there, some met while they work there, etc. Basically, be a normal human and talk to people like a normal human and they're just loving relieved you're not another insano with bad BO. However, even my close mates who work there are carefully stum about the details of what's going on. I've been given some details, mostly by mistake, but I always gently point it out and we make sure they don't muck it up too badly. NDAs are serious poo poo. Random staff giving out hints to folks is just... no, absolutely not. Games are big business - I'm playtesting a game at the moment, and I had to sign an NDA to get to see the NDA with the actual company in order to sign it.
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Feb 15, 2018 10:06
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Inescapable Duck posted:So I heard apparently 8th edition doesn't suck so bad now? What's the dealio? 8th rules. It's the 40K I always wanted.
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Feb 15, 2018 10:27
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Since I'm such a massive fan of smashing my own balls with a brick I think I'll try beat the Eldar again next week, problem is his hemlock is a god damned monster. It's your typical hard to hit 20-60" flyer that nukes leadership is psychic and has 16" 2d3 s12 ap4 d2 auto hits because who loving knows. He deep strike it in with cloudstrike and vaporised my aggressors then after what was left if my army shot it down to 2 wounds remaining it moved to the back of my army and vaporised my plasma Inceptors because it had lost literally none of its offensive potential.
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Feb 15, 2018 11:25
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How you know you've been in 40k too long: I just unearthed a box containing roughly 1k of Necrons I totally forgot I had. Well, now I hope their codex is gonna be decent!
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Feb 15, 2018 12:07
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Gyro Zeppeli posted:How you know you've been in 40k too long: I just unearthed a box containing roughly 1k of Necrons I totally forgot I had. Show your age - metal or plastic?
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Feb 15, 2018 12:09
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Irate Tree posted:Show your age - metal or plastic? Brace yourself: There's 3 Pariahs in there. I did update them a little at the start of 6th though, there's some of the newer plastics. Gyro Zeppeli fucked around with this message at 12:35 on Feb 15, 2018 |
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Feb 15, 2018 12:27
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Inescapable Duck posted:So I heard apparently 8th edition doesn't suck so bad now? What's the dealio? In short: - Wounds are no longer a clusterfuck of dice rolls - ranges are somewhat standardized now, with weird variable ranges usually being less than 6" for measurement ease - morale loss is somewhat useful now - no formations - characters are now designed around actually leading units with auras and buffs instead of either being "too squishy to ever do anything" or "hilariously busted", new rule that means characters cant be targeted by ranged unless they're the closest model or the ranged unit is specifically allowed to do so - flexible ally system means underdeveloped factions can take fluff-sensible allied faction units to patch critical flaws (subject to debate) - detachment system helps reign in character/elite spam - Active balance changes and tuning by GW Obviously it's not perfect, but it's an edition where horde armies are actually good and Chaos doesn't suck as bad (on the contrary, they now have 4 armies to pick from when building a list). I'm sure I've missed some stuff. On the bad side, some armies really struggle against vehicles, Imperium and Eldar have benefitted hilariously from the ally system, and deep strikes (i.e not deploying on the first turn) is extremely important and most good lists will usually have at least a few units that can do so. Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 13:04 on Feb 15, 2018 |
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Feb 15, 2018 12:55
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Neurolimal posted:- characters are now designed around actually leading units with auras and buffs instead of either being "too squishy to ever do anything" or "hilariously busted", new rule that means characters cant be targeted by ranged unless they're the closest model or the ranged unit is specifically allowed to do so* *Except Tyranids No, this is mostly not a joke. Characters that are “too big” (10+ wounds) can be targeted for shooting which includes Hive Tyrants and the Swarmlord. Also, statistics can go over the artificial limit of 10 now. Hitting things in melee with S14+ is hilarious.
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Feb 15, 2018 13:02
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Artum posted:Since I'm such a massive fan of smashing my own balls with a brick I think I'll try beat the Eldar again next week, problem is his hemlock is a god damned monster. My experience (from the Eldar side) is that Space Marines are a very good matchup, so I fear this might be an uphill struggle. The most useful feedback I can give is: - get some scouts and use them to bubble. The hemlock is on a massive base, it ought to be possible to set up so it can’t drop within 12” of your good stuff. - build a massive Death Star around an ancient with the standard that lets you shoot on 4+ on dying, lieutenant and a chapter master-ified captain. My last marine opponent did this, and having every other marine I took down open fire with rerolls on almost everything really hurt. Aggressors in particular. I don’t know the exact wording on the stratagem, but alternatively aggressors could presumably auspex scan the hemlock when it drops as well? As far as we could tell, aggressors got to double shoot on “extra” shooting like auspex scans or shooting on death as long as they’d stayed stationary on their previous turn. May not do that much because of stacked -1s, but it’s something.
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Feb 15, 2018 14:04
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Auspex scan is only against infantry iirc.
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Feb 15, 2018 14:22
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One_Wing posted:My experience (from the Eldar side) is that Space Marines are a very good matchup, so I fear this might be an uphill struggle. The Ancient's a good point, I could plan around dying and go for standard of the emperor ascendant for 3+ death attacks and ld10 on functionally the entire army, auspex scan is a no because its against drops within 12" and if I'm trying to screen 16" for the d scythes im not gonna be able to shoot it, but hitting in 5s rerolling 1s and 2s is terrible odds anyway. I think I'm gonna have to try and accept that hiding is fruitless against that army, deploy as far forward as possible then zoom up with everything leaning heavy on the aggressors and assault hellblasters.
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Feb 15, 2018 14:30
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