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BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull

BlackMK4 posted:

I had my HDD replaced under the 3TB recall. The system has been slow since I got it back.


HDD they replaced it with is having issues already, fuckin sweet. Guess I'll throw this thing up for sale because I'll be hosed if I'm cutting the screen off and replacing the HDD out of pocket.

That looks like a perfectly healthy HDD to me. Interpreting SMART data isn't straightforward, some of the things that sound alarming aren't. I can explain more when I'm home and not phone posting if you like.

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BlackMK4
Aug 23, 2006

wat.
Megamarm

BobHoward posted:

That looks like a perfectly healthy HDD to me. Interpreting SMART data isn't straightforward, some of the things that sound alarming aren't. I can explain more when I'm home and not phone posting if you like.
The system stutters / locks when opening Finder fairly often. I see what you're talking about, it just doesn't perform right.

smax posted:

I'd imagine they would replace the drive again for you. Have you asked?

They won't unless it fails SMART.

I guess I'm just frustrated. :smith:

BlackMK4 fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Jan 5, 2016

wdarkk
Oct 26, 2007

Friends: Protected
World: Saved
Crablettes: Eaten
Speaking of SMART, I looked at my Fusion Drive (which I'd been a little worried about) and noticed that it was marked "failing". The HDD had one "pending bad sector" and one "removed bad sector" and the SSD had one "reallocated bad sector". Is that a thing I should be worried about?

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

Marco Arment wrote a short article on why the 2012 MacBook Pro still sells, a lot.

https://marco.org/2016/01/04/md101ll-a

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull

BlackMK4 posted:

The system stutters / locks when opening Finder fairly often. I see what you're talking about, it just doesn't perform right.

Only thing I can think of that's not a HDD problem is post-restore-from-backup Spotlight indexing, which might take quite a while if you have multiple terabytes to index.

BlackMK4
Aug 23, 2006

wat.
Megamarm

BobHoward posted:

Only thing I can think of that's not a HDD problem is post-restore-from-backup Spotlight indexing, which might take quite a while if you have multiple terabytes to index.

No backup restored. :(

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade


wdarkk posted:

Speaking of SMART, I looked at my Fusion Drive (which I'd been a little worried about) and noticed that it was marked "failing". The HDD had one "pending bad sector" and one "removed bad sector" and the SSD had one "reallocated bad sector". Is that a thing I should be worried about?

As long as the bad sector count doesn't multiply suddenly, I wouldn't worry. Just keep an eye on it. How old are the drives?

wdarkk
Oct 26, 2007

Friends: Protected
World: Saved
Crablettes: Eaten

Binary Badger posted:

As long as the bad sector count doesn't multiply suddenly, I wouldn't worry. Just keep an eye on it. How old are the drives?

Two years or so.

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull
Does either drive have any ID #187 "Reported Uncorrect"? It's a count of how many times the drive was forced to return bad data on a read. In my experience nonzero values here are the scariest thing for long term drive health.

Luceo
Apr 29, 2003

As predicted in the Bible. :cheers:



Bob Morales posted:

Marco Arment wrote a short article on why the 2012 MacBook Pro still sells, a lot.

https://marco.org/2016/01/04/md101ll-a

Many of the points in that article apply to why I've not yet felt compelled to upgrade from my mid-2012 non-retina MBP when I used to craigslist shuffle every two years to a new Mac. This MBP still feels like the perfect computer and the advances in thinness, weight, and battery life aren't what I'm interested in since it is currently just fine in all of those departments. Give me performance, since this is my only computer. If I want portability I'll take my iPad.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

Luceo posted:

I used to craigslist shuffle every two years to a new Mac.

I used to do this, but haven't found anything worth upgrading to since I got my 2013 rMBP 13" :v:

Luceo posted:

This MBP still feels like the perfect computer and the advances in thinness, weight, and battery life aren't what I'm interested in since it is currently just fine in all of those departments. Give me performance, since this is my only computer. If I want portability I'll take my iPad.

The only bad thing I can say about the classic MBP (other than the glossy screen) is the thickness. Not that it's too big to carry around but it's high enough off your desk/table, combined with the sharp front edge, that it bugs my hands/wrists. The Air is perfect for this because the front of the machine tapers down, and the rMBP isn't quite as bad because it's thinner, but it's still noticeable.

Bob Morales fucked around with this message at 14:23 on Jan 5, 2016

I Am Crake
Mar 31, 2010

There is so much beautiful in the world if you look around. You are only looking at the dirt under your feet, Jimmy. It's not good for you.

enojy posted:

Yes, definitely. I went with 8GB and started wishing I had more RAM to spare once I started using virtual machines. Premiere and Photoshop are guaranteed memory hogs as well. Are you sure it's a 200 euro difference? When I was buying, I think the jump from 8GB to 16GB was only like $80 USD.



Apple pricing is a nightmare :(

Edit - these prices are without the education discount, which I'll be getting, but it's still awful.

CerebralDonut
Mar 5, 2004
Question about MBPs - I am probably going to get a MBP when Skylake comes out, but am not sure whether I want to get a 13'' or 15''. I don't need a ton of power, but I do like opening documents side by side and doing some light programming. Can you comfortably do this on a 13' MBP, or would a 15' refurb be a better option? I have a home PC that I use for most of my work, I'd use the MBP whenever I goto lectures or travel on a train (maybe 2x a month).

enojy
Sep 11, 2001

bass rattle
stars out
the sky

I Am Crake posted:



Apple pricing is a nightmare :(

Edit - these prices are without the education discount, which I'll be getting, but it's still awful.

Gah! Well... I will say that my entry level 13" 2015 rMBP fits the bill just fine, but it'd be nice to be able to dedicate something more like 8GB to my Windows 7 VM so both OSes ran great at the same time. FWIW, it is pretty drat fast memory, so while you may notice some minor slowdown from swapping going on if you bounce between photo/video editing and other applications, it probably won't be too devastating. You may not even notice it in a way that isn't negligible (e.g. Safari reloading a webpage.)

I really can't speak for future. I hastily went for the 8GB config to penny pinch, and because my current similarly-specced PC had no issues with 8GB of RAM, but it's nearly five years old at this point. Also, because I was getting a steal of a deal from coupon stacking at Best Buy, and they don't/didn't sell a 16GB 13" config.

The Ass Stooge
Nov 9, 2012

a hunger uncurbed
by nature's calling

CerebralDonut posted:

Question about MBPs - I am probably going to get a MBP when Skylake comes out, but am not sure whether I want to get a 13'' or 15''. I don't need a ton of power, but I do like opening documents side by side and doing some light programming. Can you comfortably do this on a 13' MBP, or would a 15' refurb be a better option? I have a home PC that I use for most of my work, I'd use the MBP whenever I goto lectures or travel on a train (maybe 2x a month).

Depends on how much you like squinting. The 13" Retina can simulate a 1680x1050 display, which offers ample space for side-by-side stuff, but things can get pretty small. Go to a store and try them both out to see whether the 13" will work for you.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

CerebralDonut posted:

Question about MBPs - I am probably going to get a MBP when Skylake comes out, but am not sure whether I want to get a 13'' or 15''. I don't need a ton of power, but I do like opening documents side by side and doing some light programming. Can you comfortably do this on a 13' MBP, or would a 15' refurb be a better option? I have a home PC that I use for most of my work, I'd use the MBP whenever I goto lectures or travel on a train (maybe 2x a month).

I did a lot of side-by-side when I was writing my dissertation and oh holy gently caress if you want to do any word processing or working with multiple windows on the same screen get the 15." You wouldn't think the size would make that big of a difference but (at least in my experience) it really does.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

The rear end Stooge posted:

Depends on how much you like squinting. The 13" Retina can simulate a 1680x1050 display, which offers ample space for side-by-side stuff, but things can get pretty small. Go to a store and try them both out to see whether the 13" will work for you.

If you're a masochist you can use ResX or whatever and run 1920x1200 :pwn:

LPG Giant
Feb 20, 2011

I Am Crake posted:



Apple pricing is a nightmare :(

Edit - these prices are without the education discount, which I'll be getting, but it's still awful.

I have not run the numbers, but other people have compared US and EU pricing for iPhones and they found that the prices were about the same. Your comparison is missing sales tax and import taxes. And when you consider that consumer protection is way better in the EU you could say we're actually getting a better deal.

numtini
Feb 7, 2010

Tab8715 posted:

Curious, is anyone sporting the 11" MacBook Air? How is it?

I have a 2014 and I'm quite happy with it. The screen is definitely out of date, but for writing, which is what I doing most of the time, it's perfectly fine. Never had speed problems and the keyboard and trackpad are excellent. However, my take on the Air line, 11 or 13, is that if you're going to get it, you want to just go cheap. Get the base model, buy it in the refurb store, and call it a day. If it is out of date in two years, so be it. (FWIW I paid $679 for a 2014 refurb right when the 2015s came out--great time for deals.) Once you get past the base model, it stops making economic sense. If you're going to add more memory and up the storage, you might as well just spend a hundred or two more and move up to MacBook 12 or Pro Retina 13.

On the unrelated subject that everyone is talking about, if you want to do side by side word processing on a small laptop screen, you do it above/below instead of side by side. You scroll a lot, but I rewrote 30,000 words of my last novel from 3rd to 1st person that way.

Mister Facetious
Apr 21, 2007

I think I died and woke up in L.A.,
I don't know how I wound up in this place...

:canada:
The (fresh) El Capitan install on a new HDD went without a hitch.

Also, my Track Pad worked, so a USB mouse is unnecessary, and it saved my Wi-Fi settings. Didn't try my keyboard since I unplugged the dongle though.

How do I turn three finger dragging back on? I can't find it in the three trackpad tabs.

v - Thanks. I don't understand why it isn't in the Trackpad icon in System Preferences with the rest.

Mister Facetious fucked around with this message at 03:10 on Jan 6, 2016

Pivo
Aug 20, 2004


Mister Macys posted:

How do I turn three finger dragging back on? I can't find it in the three trackpad tabs.

Accessibility -> Mouse & Trackpad -> Trackpad Options ...

Double-tap and drag works for me, too.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through

Mister Macys posted:

The (fresh) El Capitan install on a new HDD went without a hitch.

Also, my Track Pad worked, so a USB mouse is unnecessary, and it saved my Wi-Fi settings. Didn't try my keyboard since I unplugged the dongle though.

How do I turn three finger dragging back on? I can't find it in the three trackpad tabs.

v - Thanks. I don't understand why it isn't in the Trackpad icon in System Preferences with the rest.

Pretty sure it used to be, but they moved it with either Mavericks or El Capitan, I think. Probably want to get rid of it entirely for some reason but moved it there to placate nerds and simultaneously move people away from it.

Which I don't get because it is literally the biggest reason why I feel comfortable taking my MacBook some place without a mouse.

Pivo
Aug 20, 2004


It's a third way to do something. Double-tap and drag works, so does clicking and dragging. I have it enabled but I must admit I never use it, double-tap and drag works well for me.

smackfu
Jun 7, 2004

LPG Giant posted:

I have not run the numbers, but other people have compared US and EU pricing for iPhones and they found that the prices were about the same. Your comparison is missing sales tax and import taxes. And when you consider that consumer protection is way better in the EU you could say we're actually getting a better deal.

The other two factors are exchange rate changes since the product release, and Apple's preference for round pricing. But at the moment, that is probably helping Euro prices. Like an iPad Air 2 is selling for 499 EUR in France which is only $536. If it was the same price in Euros on the Oct 2014 release dates, that was the equivalent of $630 or so at that time.

So, relative to the dollar, iPads are priced very nicely now. And Apple is probably making less money on them, because that price includes sizable amounts of VAT.

mediaphage
Mar 22, 2007

Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through

Pivo posted:

It's a third way to do something. Double-tap and drag works, so does clicking and dragging. I have it enabled but I must admit I never use it, double-tap and drag works well for me.

Sure, but I have really strong feelings about it being the best way. Tbh, I feel like double-tap and drag belongs much more in the accessibility features than three-finger drag.

japtor
Oct 28, 2005
Plugable announced some TB3 docks and dual display adapters:
http://plugable.com/thunderbolt-3

And not Mac hardware cause Apple probably won't give a gently caress about this use case (yay BootCamp?), but Razer showed off a TB3 GPU enclosure/dock (it has USB ports and Ethernet too):
http://www.razerzone.com/gaming-systems/razer-blade-stealth#gpu-support

Chilled Milk
Jun 22, 2003

No one here is alone,
satellites in every home

japtor posted:

And not Mac hardware cause Apple probably won't give a gently caress about this use case (yay BootCamp?), but Razer showed off a TB3 GPU enclosure/dock (it has USB ports and Ethernet too):
http://www.razerzone.com/gaming-systems/razer-blade-stealth#gpu-support

Dare we finally dream of external GPUs that are actually feasible. And drop in/BYO as well?

Matt Zerella
Oct 7, 2002

Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)
So this looks pretty great for the MacBook

http://www.macrumors.com/2016/01/06/satechi-type-c-usb-hub-updated/

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

I hate dongle + a billion things hanging off it :(

Matt Zerella
Oct 7, 2002

Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)

Bob Morales posted:

I hate dongle + a billion things hanging off it :(

I hear you but the big thing is it supports passthrough charging. I've been keeping an eye on my usage habits and I hardly ever plug anything into my laptop. Still waiting on the Skylake update but this kind of changes things for me on the Macbook.

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


It needs a short length of cable though, the plug sticking out the side is just asking to damage the port.

japtor
Oct 28, 2005

The Milkman posted:

Dare we finally dream of external GPUs that are actually feasible. And drop in/BYO as well?
Yeah pretty much...albeit only in Windows unless Apple plays ball.

Anyway some more docks, Dell showed off the TB and USB stuff they announced a while back:
http://www.slashgear.com/dell-outs-usb-c-and-thunderbolt-3-docks-and-macs-can-play-too-06420821/

trilobite terror
Oct 20, 2007
BUT MY LIVELIHOOD DEPENDS ON THE FORUMS!

japtor posted:

Yeah pretty much...albeit only in Windows unless Apple plays ball.

Anyway some more docks, Dell showed off the TB and USB stuff they announced a while back:
http://www.slashgear.com/dell-outs-usb-c-and-thunderbolt-3-docks-and-macs-can-play-too-06420821/

Unless you're talking about hardware-enabled acceleration for things like LR or Premiere and not gaming in OS X then it shouldn't be much of a problem. A 5k iMac that could tap into the power of, say, a GTX980Ti in Windows (and still output to the integrated display) would still tick a lot of boxes for me.

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade


Meanwhile here's some workstation class GPU power poo poo that'll probably only go to iOS devices:

http://appleinsider.com/articles/16...-ipads-apple-tv

The guy mentions that they have this GPU running on a PCIe board boot.. ray tracing handled in hardware on the fly and scalable? And Metal should work fine with it?

Apple needs to find a tentpole app to take advantage of this and shove this chip into either the next rMBP or Mac Pro (hah)

It's things like this that make me believe we'll get Oculus Rift running on a loving iOS device before an iMac or Mac Pro...

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Binary Badger posted:

Meanwhile here's some workstation class GPU power poo poo that'll probably only go to iOS devices:

http://appleinsider.com/articles/16...-ipads-apple-tv

The guy mentions that they have this GPU running on a PCIe board boot.. ray tracing handled in hardware on the fly and scalable? And Metal should work fine with it?

Apple needs to find a tentpole app to take advantage of this and shove this chip into either the next rMBP or Mac Pro (hah)

It's things like this that make me believe we'll get Oculus Rift running on a loving iOS device before an iMac or Mac Pro...

Apple gives absolutely zero fucks for graphics of any kind on a mac these days. They're more concerned with making a laptop weigh less than a paper plate and look attractive sitting on a table next to your iPad and iPhone. We'll have a Mackbook that can surf the internet for a week without charging first.

edit: don't get me wrong, I still like their devices for productivity type stuff but holy poo poo if graphics are important to you they really don't have much to offer. They've mainstreamed in a huge way which I really can't blame them for. Obviously they're making a poo poo ton of money shooting for the largest demographic possible and ignoring the niche users.

japtor
Oct 28, 2005

Electric Bugaloo posted:

Unless you're talking about hardware-enabled acceleration for things like LR or Premiere and not gaming in OS X then it shouldn't be much of a problem. A 5k iMac that could tap into the power of, say, a GTX980Ti in Windows (and still output to the integrated display) would still tick a lot of boxes for me.
Yeah I'd want it for general OS X usage too, like if I had a big high res screen and Mac mini or something. And I try to game in Wine cause I hate life don't really like dual booting.

Wacky alternate use I don't think is possible in OS X (as a host at least): use VT-d and dedicate the GPU to a VM to use natively.

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull

Binary Badger posted:

Meanwhile here's some workstation class GPU power poo poo that'll probably only go to iOS devices:

http://appleinsider.com/articles/16...-ipads-apple-tv

Useful calibration for interpreting that article:

1. It's by Daniel Dilger, a clueless fuckwit uber-fan best known for his old website, "MacKiDo Temple". He specializes in breathless overhyping of anything Apple does or is connected to.

2. Vendors have been doing ray tracing-on-the-GPU tech demos for like a decade now, using NVidia, ATI/AMD, and even IIRC Intel integrated GPUs. It hasn't translated into significant adoption before and I wouldn't expect it to this time either. Showing it on Imagination Tech GPUs is probably "hey we don't have limitations that prevent this in our GPU anymore" more than anything else. (They've been playing catch-up with the feature set of bigger desktop GPUs for some time.)

Binary Badger
Oct 11, 2005

Trolling Link for a decade


Yeah but is the line about being able to do it with a fraction of the power consumption of other GPUs of note?

8ender
Sep 24, 2003

clown is watching you sleep
Has anyone had a 2015 13" MBP with failing fans? We've had three go bad at work and I'm getting a little concerned. Symptoms are a terrible rumbling noise when they spin up that gets louder and louder as time goes on. We've not had any fans fail completely as they get sent back to Apple as soon as we hear "the death rumble". Maybe we got a bad batch.

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BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull

Binary Badger posted:

Yeah but is the line about being able to do it with a fraction of the power consumption of other GPUs of note?

I didn't catch that but I kinda doubt it. I mean, I can believe it's lower power, as Imagination's strength is low power design, but the flip side of that has always been lower performance and capabilities. NVidia and AMD both have perfectly good GPU hardware design teams so it seems a bit doubtful that Imagination has suddenly found some revolutionary thing they haven't.

I guess my reaction boils down to 'believe it when we see it'.

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