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totalnewbie posted:It's not inconceivable. Sven can put out a shitton of damage and if they manage to push out lanes and win a good teamfight, they could probably throne you before megacreeps did their work, or at least rax you and get their own megacreeps. The fact that they held out for 20 minutes against megacreeps is probably enough testament to that fact, as usually megacreeps will win the game in a few waves at most. Yep! We won by forcing a fight that caused them to glyph while sven killed everyone and then doing it again as soon as everyone respawned. We had waited until everyone had buyback so the Sven couldn't gain anything off of the win.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:05
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Doom is such a loving retarded hero.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:06
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mikeraskol posted:I think me and Lets!Get!Weird! got shouted down about this before but I totally agree here. All this poo poo should be done already, but even more so now, within the next 3-4 months or something. Maybe this is overly entitled, but to me Valve has no excuse for not having all the heroes ported over and all but the most troublesome in Captain's mode when they are swimming around in the community's 30 million dollars. Everyone except Pitlord is now in pretty much and chances are there might be a multi hero update when Techies is released because Pitlord was being worked on for ages. The rest are new heroes that basically noone has played or tested on any real level. TB, LC, Phoenix and ES don't have to be in captains mode for the game to be complete, especially since heroes are moved in and out of CM from time to time when Icefrog changes them significantly and wants to test out changes. Are you going to tell me the game is incomplete because Broodmother isn't in CM? Asuron fucked around with this message at 22:09 on Jul 22, 2014 |
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Jul 22, 2014 22:06
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Up to the Elves posted:Doom is such a loving retarded hero. I feel like this should be the thread title. He really is an absolutely moronic hero.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:07
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Valve's corporate structure, or lack thereof, is simultaneously their blessing and curse. Highly motivated people get some really high quality poo poo done, but when motivation fails there's no output at all. Then there's the whole fact that people have different jobs. Implementing a new hero takes a combination of concepting, programming, modeling, animation, voicework and localization to get done, and no one has all those talents at once. If only one programmer is working on the project at any one time, he may be busy on any one of the millions of other high-priority things people constantly complain about.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:11
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Asuron posted:Are you going to tell me the game is incomplete because Broodmother isn't in CM? I'm going to tell you exactly what I said in my first post on the topic. Everyone hero should be ported over, including the ones that are apparently "pretty much in" like Zet and Winter Wyvern (how they are pretty much in I have no idea). Every hero possible should be in CM. If Brood needs to be out while Icefrog tinkers that's fine, though I don't see how you can twist what I said to mean the game is incomplete because she's not available in CM.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:14
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Asuron posted:Everyone except Pitlord is now in pretty much and chances are there might be a multi hero update when Techies is released because Pitlord was being worked on for ages. The rest are new heroes that basically noone has played or tested on any real level. TB, LC, Phoenix and ES don't have to be in captains mode for the game to be complete, especially since heroes are moved in and out of CM from time to time when Icefrog changes them significantly. Yes they do have to be in CM for the game to be complete, there's no reason any of them shouldn't be in CM when there's plenty of bullshit heroes already. Porting these heroes increases the number of strategies teams can run, and makes games more interesting by decreasing the potential for dominant strategies. You can't just ban Lycan when you want to stop a push strat, you have to ban our Lycan or TB, or take one of them, or take ES and Phoenix so you can just kill them over and over. Techies is probably going to get ported soonish, but with Valve it could also take until Diretide in November. Winter Wyvern and Zet haven't been worked on beyond voice acting as far as anyone can tell, and Pit Lord and Oracle are probably languishing development hell since there's been no indication of further work done on them in months. Why do you people keep having faith in Valve? They will poo poo on it every single time. mikeraskol posted:I'm going to tell you exactly what I said in my first post on the topic. Everyone hero should be ported over, including the ones that are apparently "pretty much in" like Zet and Winter Wyvern (how they are pretty much in I have no idea). Concept art for Zet leaked, obviously means he's coming in tomorrow (or in 2020 when people have moved on to a different game)
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Jul 22, 2014 22:14
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Asuron posted:It was punished as I've explained to you by VG and Newbee who ran drafts that had heroes who drop off if they don't win in twenty minutes. You're not counting supports like Alche, AA, SK, Tide, Skywrath, Lich or Rhasta who are basically cores because they're powerhouses that scale too drat well. Newbee relied on that most of the tournament, even if they made less greedy picks to counter VG (and even then, they had Brew Doom Ember in that last match). Maybe I'm wrong, I hardly watch competitive matches. What I do know is that greedy picks aren't healthy for pubs, because they sure as hell are easier to pull off in an uncoordinated team than what Newbee did.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:16
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valve has literally defined the meta for 4 years solely on their inability to actually finish the loving game
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Jul 22, 2014 22:18
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mikeraskol posted:I'm going to tell you exactly what I said in my first post on the topic. Everyone hero should be ported over, including the ones that are apparently "pretty much in" like Zet and Winter Wyvern (how they are pretty much in I have no idea). Every hero possible should be in CM. If Brood needs to be out while Icefrog tinkers that's fine, your ridiculous assertion to the contrary. I was referring to all the classic Dota heroes who are basically all in at this point except for Pitlord and you also understand Winter Wyvern and Zet are really new right? I thought I was being pretty clear about that but I guess not. And no, not every hero should be in CM, because CM is for competitive play and when Icefrog feels a hero is balanced he puts them there, not before and not just because people think a game is incomplete because they're not. Phoenix hasn't even been in CM since inception in Dota 1. This is how he has operated for years, I don't know why you think his method changes just because he works on Dota 2 as well now? Heroes go in CM when he thinks they're ready, not before.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:19
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Up to the Elves posted:valve has literally defined the meta for 4 years solely on their inability to actually finish the loving game Don't worry...I'm sure they'll add the last five heroes by TI5...  
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Jul 22, 2014 22:20
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Up to the Elves posted:Doom is such a loving retarded hero. He is but thats why I love him so much.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:20
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Asuron posted:I was referring to all the classic Dota heroes who are basically all in at this point except for Pitlord and you also understand Winter Wyvern and Zet are really new right? I thought I was being pretty clear about that but I guess not. 1. Every hero in Dota 2 has been in for at least six months, which is more than enough time for icefrog to determine what should be in and out of CM. We've had balance patches since everyone got ported, we have pub winrates to give them an idea of what needs to be changed, and yet we still have heroes sitting on the sidelines because... 2. Winter Wyvern and Zet were introduced to Dota over two years ago, that's not "really new" by any means, especially since Earth Spirit was ported into dota 2 six months after being introduced in dota 1. Angrymantium fucked around with this message at 22:27 on Jul 22, 2014 |
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Jul 22, 2014 22:24
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Elman posted:You're not counting supports like Alche, AA, SK, Tide, Skywrath, Lich or Rhasta who are basically cores because they're powerhouses that scale too drat well. Newbee relied on that most of the tournament, even if they made less greedy picks to counter VG (and even then, they had Brew Doom Ember in that last match). I dont mean to be a dick, but you should watch more games. EG and DK were the two big, greedy teams, and they lost to VG's and NewBee's aggressive pushing and ganking. AA, SK, Skywrath, Lich and Rhasta are absolutely not cores (though you could argue Rhasta is too strong in general), Tide is a core because most teams run him offlane rather than support, and Alch is versatile enough to be played in many different ways. When EG tried to run greedy 4 core lineups with Zai hardfarming in the jungle, they got smashed in under 20 minutes. They're being punished plenty.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:27
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I think that making 'game completed' synonymous with 'All heros ported from Dota 1' is a bit of an arbitrary distinction to make, especially considering how far Dota 2 has jumped ahead of its progenitor in terms of hat density.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:28
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Angrymantium posted:1. Every hero in Dota 2 has been in for at least six months, which is more than enough time for icefrog to determine what should be in and out of CM. We've had balance patches since everyone got ported, we have pub winrates to give them an idea of what needs to be changed, and yet we still have heroes sitting on the sidelines because... 1. Again Phoenix hasn't been in CM since he was created. Heroes go in CM when Icefrog feels they're ready and you're gonna have to deal with that decision friend because he's been doing this long before Dota 2. You might think they're ready, he obviously feels otherwise. 2. I couldn't tell you why Earth Spirit got in first other than to theme their update, but even now I wouldn't put him in CM because he'd break the game so loving hard it wouldn't even be funny even if he is weaker than before. You don't see good many good players on ES anymore, but the ones who are out there show the hero is still goddamn broken in good hands and if he hits CM right now it's just gonna be stupid.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:29
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NmareBfly posted:I think that making 'game completed' synonymous with 'All heros ported from Dota 1' is a bit of an arbitrary distinction to make, especially considering how far Dota 2 has jumped ahead of its progenitor in terms of hat density. I think game completed is a poor choice of words, as this is a constantly updating game that will never be "complete." I just think that as I sit here today on July 22, 2014, all the heroes should have been ported by now.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:34
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Oh god, if Phoenix makes it into CM in his current state, he would be banned in every match. He shouldn't be put into CM yet, he needs more nerfs.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:37
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Lets! Get! Weird! posted:Don't worry...I'm sure they'll add the last five heroes by TI5... Valve can't count up to 3 though.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:38
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Lets! Get! Weird! posted:Don't worry...I'm sure they'll add the last five heroes by TI5... Isn't only one of those even in Captain's Mode? I'm sure Techies was the key we were all missing to the glory though.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:38
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i wish all the heroes were ported so we can spend more time discussing important issues like concedes and missing halloween events
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Jul 22, 2014 22:48
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Zoolooman posted:Isn't only one of those even in Captain's Mode? I think he's just using it as a marker of time again, not that he wanted Winter Wyvern to be available for TI4.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:48
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mikeraskol posted:I think game completed is a poor choice of words, as this is a constantly updating game that will never be "complete." I just think that as I sit here today on July 22, 2014, all the heroes should have been ported by now. Including the ones that didn't exist on July 22, 2012?
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Jul 22, 2014 22:52
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Tweak posted:i wish all the heroes were ported so we can spend more time discussing important issues like concedes and missing halloween events i wish people wouldn't post stupid whines about their rankings on video game discussions. actually i just wish you wouldnt post 
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Jul 22, 2014 22:52
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computer parts posted:Including the ones that didn't exist on July 22, 2012? Two years isn't enough time to port two heroes? (you're not the only one that can blatantly ignore context to be an rear end in a top hat)
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Jul 22, 2014 22:53
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Zoolooman posted:Isn't only one of those even in Captain's Mode? If we're gonna be snide about Captain's Mode how about the heroes that have been in Dota 2 for years that aren't in Captain's Mode. mikeraskol posted:I think he's just using it as a marker of time again, not that he wanted Winter Wyvern to be available for TI4. Yeah it was to illustrate how hilariously slow it's been since TI2.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:53
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computer parts posted:Including the ones that didn't exist on July 22, 2012? Yes.
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Jul 22, 2014 22:53
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Is there anything that Troll Warlord is good at in 6.81? Picking him should double as a concede button.
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Jul 22, 2014 23:04
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Luigi Thirty posted:Is there anything that Troll Warlord is good at in 6.81? Picking him should double as a concede button. No. He's an irredeemably lovely hero that's completely pointless. There are some other blatantly terrible carries (AM comes to mind) but at least most of them become effective killing machines when given items. Troll is still a useless turd of a hero.
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Jul 22, 2014 23:04
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Luigi Thirty posted:Is there anything that Troll Warlord is good at in 6.81? Picking him should double as a concede button. Works okay in a push lineup, I guess?
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Jul 22, 2014 23:06
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What happened that made AM fall off from the meta?
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Jul 22, 2014 23:06
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AzureRequiem posted:Works okay in a push lineup, I guess?
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Jul 22, 2014 23:08
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ScienceAndMusic posted:What happened that made AM fall off from the meta? Comedy answer: Turns out a hero that's useless for half an hour disappears from the meta when teams GG out at 15 minutes Real answer: doooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooom
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Jul 22, 2014 23:08
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Heavy pushing lineups, early action happened. No space for a hero that's squishy as gently caress, gets nothing done on his own early on, has to take a core position and is completely poo poo before picking up several expensive items.
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Jul 22, 2014 23:09
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ScienceAndMusic posted:What happened that made AM fall off from the meta?
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Jul 22, 2014 23:10
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Has dota become too fast paced!?
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Jul 22, 2014 23:10
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I'm sure our epic friends at valve means it, when they say that cosmetics will never affect the readability of the game
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Jul 22, 2014 23:10
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AM can't contribute to the early game that well, he needs to farm a lot. It's really easy to exploit the fact that he forces his team to 4v5 most of the match before he gets his items.
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Jul 22, 2014 23:11
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I honestly thought that was the golden earthshaker totem at first glance 
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Jul 22, 2014 23:11
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ScienceAndMusic posted:Has dota become too fast paced!?
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Jul 22, 2014 23:12
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