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Powershift posted:Your highway cruisers will obviously get larger batteries, but something like the bolt is really more of a city car, and i personally wouldn't want to take one out on the highway any more than i would a spark or sonic. Well, you heard it here first: a 2500lb five-seat sedan with 140 horsepower is not suitable for the highway
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Jan 11, 2016 00:03
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Sagebrush posted:Well, you heard it here first: a 2500lb five-seat sedan with 140 horsepower is not suitable for the highway You forget, he makes his living picking up free filing cabinets.
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Jan 11, 2016 00:11
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Sagebrush posted:Well, you heard it here first: a 2500lb five-seat sedan with 140 horsepower is not suitable for the highway I'm not saying it's not suitable, more inappropriate. the closer you get to a square wheelbase, the more skittish a car gets, the more steering input is required. with a narrow track the car usually tries to jump between deep grooves worn in the road. That's not even considering road noise and stuff like that. Their fuel economy advantage is lost on the highway as well. They're perfectly capable and safe for highway duty, but their dynamics are designed for the city, and i can't imagine somebody making regular highway trips would choose something that sucks at it for reasons beyond initial cost.
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Jan 11, 2016 00:16
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Ola posted:Speaking of autopilot, Tesla just just officially announced Summon, the feature where the car drives itself out of the garage etc. That bit you bolded is far enough away that any Model S capable of doing so will be wearing vintage license plates.
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Jan 11, 2016 02:07
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Powershift posted:You are adding a significant amount of rare materials when you pack more batteries into a car. The average person doesn't drive more than 100 miles in a single trip. they can definitely tell the difference between the 4.4kwh battery in the plug in prius, the 16kwh battery in the volt, and the 23kwh battery in the focus, as they directly translate to a 18, 40, and 76 mile range, and that again will probably be where 90% of the population gets off the bus. Very few people (other than all those goon grandfather clock delivery men) drive more than 40 miles a day. quote:Your highway cruisers will obviously get larger batteries, but something like the bolt is really more of a city car, and i personally wouldn't want to take one out on the highway any more than i would a spark or sonic. You are being ridiculous.
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Jan 11, 2016 02:09
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drgitlin posted:Very few people (other than all those goon grandfather clock delivery men) drive more than 40 miles a day. 23% of commuters drive 20+ miles each way, in the US, which seems like more than "very few" to me.
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Jan 11, 2016 04:03
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I drive about 30 miles each way for my commute. The nearest real city is about 40 miles away in the opposite direction.
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Jan 11, 2016 04:17
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Godholio posted:I drive about 30 miles each way for my commute. The nearest real city is about 40 miles away in the opposite direction. How's the grandfather clock business?
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Jan 11, 2016 04:58
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Nah, just a hellish state that shouldn't exist. We only have one decent bar in town.  And a walmart. 
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Jan 11, 2016 05:30
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http://www.businessinsider.com/elon...ent=%23Farikhan More reaching forward-looking statements from the Master of Musk.
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Jan 11, 2016 05:54
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drgitlin posted:That bit you bolded is far enough away that any Model S capable of doing so will be wearing vintage license plates. As soon as I can summon a car to my location from anywhere with the press of a smartphone, Uber/Google/ZipCar will make it so much cheaper to just call a car when you need it then for you to buy one to sit idle 99% of the time that people will stop buying cars.
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Jan 11, 2016 06:15
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It'll be interesting to see the car summoned over a distance that requires it to charge itself. At least it'll come with a massive overhaul of the mapping software. Now it tends to suggest long nonsensical detours for charging and it doesn't account for weather and topography. And we can just leave the problems of an empty car driving itself across the continent alone.
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Jan 11, 2016 07:35
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Powershift posted:I'm not saying it's not suitable, more inappropriate. the closer you get to a square wheelbase, the more skittish a car gets, the more steering input is required. with a narrow track the car usually tries to jump between deep grooves worn in the road. That's not even considering road noise and stuff like that. Their fuel economy advantage is lost on the highway as well. Ooo Kayyy I daily-drive a fourteen year old Ford ZX2. It weighs 2400lb and had 130ish hp new. It is perfectly comfortable to drive at any reasonable highway speed. It gets about 32mpg in all-highway driving vs 25 or so in the city. It is certainly not skittish and doesn't have any problems jumping between grooves on the road  What are you smoking?
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Jan 11, 2016 07:35
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Sagebrush posted:Ooo In my experiences using rental cars for road trips, a louder, shorter, narrow car is considerably less comfortable, and not just in the interior space sense. The last 2 small cars i rented were a versa note and a 1.4t sonic, the note i drove the same highway about 100kms each direction 4 days in a row, and there were specific sections of road, each probably 20 years old and heavily grooved by truck traffic, where the car was seriously undone, this corner being the most memorable. https://goo.gl/maps/HD33k7k2TXB2 I've never felt it in other vehicles i've driven it with, mainly rental impalas/300s/caravans, my own 5 series, various pickups. the trucks basically ride the grooves like rails. the CVT was obviously terrible but that's creeping into everything with an ICE these days. The sonic it took over the mountains to bring parts to kelowna and while it was a fun little car to throw around, it just wasn't pleasant for crusing. it wasn't a lack of power or anything either, it just always felt like it was working really hard and got thrown around by every truck going the other way. Smaller cars are generally designed around city driving, this isn't a big secret. shorter gearing, higher steering ratios, shorter overall length prioritized over a more aerodynamic shape. The size of the battery pack and the expected range is going to be one more piece of that puzzle. The model S had a 40kwh option with 140 mile range, and a 85kwh option with a 265 mile range, i highly doubt you'll ever see that with the bolt. I would imagine once GM has a surplus of battery capability, it's going to be a bolt with the 200 mile range, and a larger more comfortable car with a 300 or 400 mile range. Frinkahedron posted:As soon as I can summon a car to my location from anywhere with the press of a smartphone, Uber/Google/ZipCar will make it so much cheaper to just call a car when you need it then for you to buy one to sit idle 99% of the time that people will stop buying cars. I can't wait for taxi companies to lobby this into a new price bracket. Don't want to get sworn at by a sex offender who has never had a shower? that'll be a $10 driverless levy.
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Jan 11, 2016 08:41
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The Bolt battery specs are out. 60 kWh!And 200 hp. http://www.theverge.com/2016/1/11/10747204/chevy-bolt-motor-battery-info-naias-2016
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Jan 11, 2016 22:05
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Ola posted:The Bolt battery specs are out. 60 kWh!And 200 hp. That's pretty drat impressive. That means at $30k after tax credits and all that, if you wanted to do an electric conversion on another car, it would be cheaper to buy a bolt and scrap everything but the batteries than it would be to buy off the shelf batteries.
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Jan 11, 2016 22:16
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Ola posted:The Bolt battery specs are out. 60 kWh!And 200 hp. Now I want one even more. Please bring the Bolt to Europe, Opel. I don't even care if you call it the Heinz or the Wilhelm or whatever.
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Jan 11, 2016 22:19
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Powershift posted:That's pretty drat impressive. Or just wait until the first one crashes! I'm thinking these battery packs are tricky to DIY with since they are liquid cooled, it's managing its own temperature, various computers are talking to each other etc. But a guy in Norway pulled a battery pack from a crashed Leaf and used it to store solar power on his offgrid mountain cabin. More info on the battery pack: Able to charge at a max rate 178 miles of range per hour on the CCS combo system, 8 years or 100 000 mi warranty. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgTAlZac34s e: can't help but think Nissan and VW are making GBS threads themselves e2: precision shift system? Is it for reverse or does it actually have two forward gears? Ola fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Jan 11, 2016 |
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Jan 11, 2016 22:24
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I am partially turned around on this.
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Jan 12, 2016 02:37
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Huh, I was not expecting to actually be interested in the Bolt. IMO it looks better than the i3 both inside and out, it's nothing special but it's not trying to be either. It looks normal for its size. It has good range and the price tag (not counting any tax incentives that may apply) is in the same range as a CPO Model S with the same battery capacity. If the lease rates are decent I might consider getting one a year or two in to do my local running around in and only use my Fiesta ST for fooling around on weekends or the occasional long trip.
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Jan 12, 2016 05:32
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Cross postin from the new car thread, new Chrysler minivan is available as a plug in hybrid with a 30 mile electric range, also looks great. http://www.autoblog.com/2016/01/11/2017-chrysler-pacifica-minivan-detroit-official/
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Jan 14, 2016 04:48
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Throatwarbler posted:Cross postin from the new car thread, new Chrysler minivan is available as a plug in hybrid with a 30 mile electric range, also looks great. quote:mated to a nine-speed automatic transmission why do they keep doing this
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Jan 14, 2016 17:25
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Summon demonstration. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2B2E9TT9X9A If it's ok for the car to be summoned across public roads, then clearly it's ok to get in the car, set destination and then go to bed in the rear seat. Why not a bottle wine and a movie before bed?
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Jan 14, 2016 19:59
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Sagebrush posted:why do they keep doing this Because a .05 mpg improvement over 200,000 vehicles = CAFE boost.
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Jan 15, 2016 01:26
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Sagebrush posted:why do they keep doing this I asked an actual auto exec at a big 3 company this and his reply was "because you retards keep buying them"
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Jan 15, 2016 02:29
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Does Ford have any full electric plans? The Energi variants are plug in hybrids, right?
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Jan 15, 2016 21:41
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smackfu posted:Does Ford have any full electric plans? The Energi variants are plug in hybrids, right? They already make a full electric focus, and work with other companies to make an electric f-150.
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Jan 15, 2016 21:44
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Powershift posted:They already make a full electric focus, and work with other companies to make an electric f-150. They used to do a electric Transit Connect too but the company that made them went bankrupt so idk what happened to them
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Jan 15, 2016 21:45
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Powershift posted:They already make a full electric focus, and work with other companies to make an electric f-150. $30k for a Focus with 76 mile range. No wonder the Bolt is getting attention.
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Jan 15, 2016 21:50
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The Focus EV is a classic case of compliance vehicle, don't see why anyone would give it a second look now. Maybe to mock it, I checked the used market to ridicule the depreciation (only fun I found was a used dealer calling 16 amps "fast charging" and also misspelling the words "fast" and "charging"). Came across this chin stroker: http://m.finn.no/car/used/ad.html?finnkode=69345756 1998 Ford Ranger EV. Can't quite figure out the actual battery capacity, but it's NiMH batteries anyway. Charging controller and batteries need servicing. Seller wants $8700 for it. 
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Jan 15, 2016 22:32
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To be fair that's almost a 20 year old truck, and way way before 'compliance' cars were a thing.
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Jan 15, 2016 22:44
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blugu64 posted:To be fair that's almost a 20 year old truck, and way way before 'compliance' cars were a thing. Oh yeah, the Focus is the useless compliance vehicle. The Ranger I came across was an interesting oddball, I remember hearing about EVs back then but didn't give two shits. If you asked me yesterday I would've said there are no factory EV pickups on the market. Apparently there is, on the used market at least!
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Jan 15, 2016 22:50
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blugu64 posted:To be fair that's almost a 20 year old truck, and way way before 'compliance' cars were a thing. It was a compliance car for the California Air Resources Board’s Zero‐Emission Vehicle mandate of the ’90s. For a long time (till the Tesla Roadster), used Ford Rangers and RAV4s were pretty much the only production battery‐electric vehicles that could be bought in the U.S.. Most of the others were leased and then crushed after CARB dropped the mandate, like the EV1.
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Jan 15, 2016 22:51
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There is still a mandate but now with crazy point system and the new compliance vehicles are all fuel cell cars, because a fast charge gets the most points per car.
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Jan 15, 2016 23:28
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Ola posted:Charging controller and batteries need servicing. Seller wants $8700 for it. Did the current owner of the NiMH patent allow production of vehicle sized batteries again, or is still impossible to get NiMH batteries for anything bigger than a flashlight?
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Jan 16, 2016 00:33
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Platystemon posted:Most of the others were leased and then crushed after CARB dropped the mandate, like the EV1. Which is another pet peevee. What 'the who killed the electric car' crowd ignores is that GM also built and sold an electric S-10 pickup concurrently with the ev1, which weren't confiscated and crushed if you bought them.
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Jan 16, 2016 00:33
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Ola posted:The Focus EV is a classic case of compliance vehicle, don't see why anyone would give it a second look now.
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Jan 16, 2016 01:49
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angryrobots posted:If you had a commute that fit within its range (40-50 miles 5 days per week), is there a price point where it makes sense used, or is it just that bad? Yes, there is definitely a price point where it makes sense for such a scenario, but it might not be realistic to expect. A used Leaf is fairly cheap, and also good. Focus EV shortcomings: 1. No fast charging. 2. Battery pack is bolted on the ICE version where there was room - in the luggage space. 3. The two previous points should do, let's illustrate #2 with an IKEA run  If you definitely only totally need it for the 50 mile commute, you can charge that commute overnight at home, you don't mind the luggage thing and you get it at a good price (half a Leaf perhaps?), then I suppose it makes sense. But if you move the goalposts around enough, anything can make sense. It's a bad car in the sense that it's a poor solution to the implied challenge measured against the competition, not bad in the sense of put put noises and doors falling off hilariously.
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Jan 16, 2016 02:33
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Bolt is a terrible name for a car. It fits a motorcycle, in the case of Yamaha, but not a car, and especially not an electric car.
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Jan 16, 2016 02:51
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Personally I don't give a poo poo about the name/branding. Just give me what I need (>100 miles range, fast charging, decent enough for a California highway. <$42,000).
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Jan 16, 2016 02:57
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