Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
nm
Jan 28, 2008

"I saw Minos the Space Judge holding a golden sceptre and passing sentence upon the Martians. There he presided, and around him the noble Space Prosecutors sought the firm justice of space law."

Phil Moscowitz posted:

What is a BSD

Big swinging dick. Means partner with massive book of business.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

CmdrSmirnoff
Oct 27, 2005
happy happy happy happy happy happy happy happy happy
I bought a couple bowties in my last Tie Bar shipment but haven't got around to learning how to tie them. BRB

edit: trip report: this poo poo is impossible and I can tie a sick half windsor in seconds

edit: okay it's been 45 minutes, I give up, I need an adult

CmdrSmirnoff fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Feb 9, 2014

WhiskeyJuvenile
Feb 15, 2002

by Nyc_Tattoo
My grandfather died and all I got from his estate were two bowties

sullat
Jan 9, 2012

nm posted:

Big swinging dick. Means partner with massive book of business.

I thought that ”rainmaker” was the term in the legal industry, while ”big swinging dick” was use in investment/finance, as befits that more vulgar profession.

semicolonsrock
Aug 26, 2009

chugga chugga chugga

sullat posted:

I thought that ”rainmaker” was the term in the legal industry, while ”big swinging dick” was use in investment/finance, as befits that more vulgar profession.

Nah rainmaker is used in finance consulting and law. BSD is just less common in general IMO.

E: also I think te funny that in eg the 1920s law was seen by wealthy families as a less money centric, more noble profession than eg business.

joat mon
Oct 15, 2009

I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.

semicolonsrock posted:

E: also I think te funny that in eg the 1920s law was seen by wealthy families as a less money centric, more noble profession than eg business.

TenementFunster posted:

just found out that after getting canned I was replaced by a licensed attorney working 31.5 hours a week making $12.50 an hour

The forward march of progress profit!

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

bone shaking.
soul baking.
The 31.5 hours a week is the best part so they can classify them as part time and gently caress them completely on benefits.

G-Mawwwwwww
Jan 31, 2003

My LPth are Hot Garbage
Biscuit Hider
There's been a large influx of veteran personal injury and immigration lawyers into family law lately.

They're loving AWFUL at it.

quepasa18
Oct 13, 2005

Mr. Nice! posted:

The 31.5 hours a week is the best part so they can classify them as part time and gently caress them completely on benefits.

I'd be curious what this guy's billing requirements are, and whether he actually works 31.5 hours like an hourly employee or if he's expected to work more.

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



I would imagine trying to shaft an attorney out of benefits and forcing him to work for less than minimum wage (since he's not getting paid for the extra time) would be a bad idea.

nm
Jan 28, 2008

"I saw Minos the Space Judge holding a golden sceptre and passing sentence upon the Martians. There he presided, and around him the noble Space Prosecutors sought the firm justice of space law."
^^^^^^^^^^^
You'd imagine, but baby attorneys are just so happy they have a job. They'll sue everyone else, but not their glorious job creators.

CaptainScraps posted:

There's been a large influx of veteran personal injury and immigration lawyers into family law lately.

They're loving AWFUL at it.

They're also coming to crim law. Terrible.

joat mon
Oct 15, 2009

I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.

CaptainScraps posted:

There's been a large influx of veteran personal injury and immigration lawyers into family law lately.

They're loving AWFUL at it.

nm posted:

They're also coming to crim law. Terrible.

My state just overhauled worker's comp to push the lawyers out of the system. Now they're spilling into family and criminal. Comp was already bottom-feeder territory, so we're not exactly getting the best and brightest.

quepasa18 posted:

I'd be curious what this guy's billing requirements are, and whether he actually works 31.5 hours like an hourly employee or if he's expected to work more.

Independent contractor.

joat mon fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Feb 9, 2014

Vox Nihili
May 28, 2008
Probation
Can't post for 3 hours!

Mr. Nice! posted:

The 31.5 hours a week is the best part so they can classify them as part time and gently caress them completely on benefits.

Joke's on them, ACA defines full time employment as 30 hours per week. This guy will be raking in the 'Bamacare dollars in no time flat.

Math Debater
May 6, 2007

by zen death robot
I've signed up to go to Thailand to teach at the end of September, but I'm thinking about sending out Fall 2015 law school applications before I go. I'm also thinking about forking out thousands of dollars to pay for tutoring before the June 2014 LSAT. I took the LSAT in February 2013 and scored 167. My difficulties with the analytical reasoning/logic games section prevented me from getting a higher score last time.

Ugh, I'm so stressed and confused about life...

Mattavist
May 24, 2003

This thread has talked you out of applying half a dozen times now. The only reason to go is if you want to keep feeling stressed and confused for the rest of your life.

Lote
Aug 5, 2001

Place your bets

Math Debater posted:

I've signed up to go to Thailand to teach at the end of September, but I'm thinking about sending out Fall 2015 law school applications before I go. I'm also thinking about forking out thousands of dollars to pay for tutoring before the June 2014 LSAT. I took the LSAT in February 2013 and scored 167. My difficulties with the analytical reasoning/logic games section prevented me from getting a higher score last time.

Ugh, I'm so stressed and confused about life...

Have you ever looked into nursing school?

For 2 years of nursing school you can land a 40k-ish base salary that usually gives you tons of overtime if you want it. For another 2 years of nurse anesthetist school you can land a 90k-ish base salary that can go up to 150k with overtime. Or you can go to law school and fight for a job where you bill 2000 hours a year in a Chicago firm that advertises 30k base starting and legal experience is required to get the job.

The only problem with nursing is that you have to deal with actual poo poo.

joat mon
Oct 15, 2009

I am the master of my lamp;
I am the captain of my tub.

Lote posted:

Have you ever looked into nursing school?

For 2 years of nursing school you can land a 40k-ish base salary that usually gives you tons of overtime if you want it. For another 2 years of nurse anesthetist school you can land a 90k-ish base salary that can go up to 150k with overtime. Or you can go to law school and fight for a job where you bill 2000 hours a year in a Chicago firm that advertises 30k base starting and legal experience is required to get the job.

The only problem with nursing is that you have to deal with actual poo poo.

Or being an air traffic controller?

fknlo posted:

Hey folks, APPLY TO BE AN AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLER HERE. Seriously, go do this. If you don't you're literally retarded.

That's 20 to 28k to go to school (plus per diem)
Actual pay is a good bit better.

The Ferret King posted:



Correct, that's just the basic pay for attending the academy after getting hired (you get a per diem too which pads out the compensation a fair amount). Above are the the paybands for 2012. Facility level depends on the complexity and traffic volume of the facility. More traffic/more complexity = more pay usually. For the purposes of new hires, the bottom of each pay band is what you'll earn. The D-grades are what you get during your training at the facility itself. CPC is Certified Professional Controller, you earn the bottom of that pay band after completely certifying.

These pay bands are shown without "locality," which is a sort of cost of living adjustment. Nationally it ranges from 14% to 28% or something like that.

Good luck guys, it's a great job.

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone



joat mon posted:

Or being an air traffic controller?


That's 20 to 28k to go to school (plus per diem)
Actual pay is a good bit better.

Don't you need to pass a background check to be an air traffic controller. And doesn't having a 6 figure debt pretty much make that impossible?

Bushido Brown
Mar 30, 2011

Math Debater posted:

I've signed up to go to Thailand to teach at the end of September, but I'm thinking about sending out Fall 2015 law school applications before I go. I'm also thinking about forking out thousands of dollars to pay for tutoring before the June 2014 LSAT. I took the LSAT in February 2013 and scored 167. My difficulties with the analytical reasoning/logic games section prevented me from getting a higher score last time.

Ugh, I'm so stressed and confused about life...

Well you can put off applying (you should) and if you're actually serious about the LSAT you can teach yourself the test for way less than thousands of dollars.

More importantly, even if you do get a decent LSAT score, you probably shouldn't go. Luckily you don't need to worry about that right now. Have fun in Thailand and enjoy job hunting when you get back.

semicolonsrock
Aug 26, 2009

chugga chugga chugga

Lote posted:

Have you ever looked into nursing school?

For 2 years of nursing school you can land a 40k-ish base salary that usually gives you tons of overtime if you want it. For another 2 years of nurse anesthetist school you can land a 90k-ish base salary that can go up to 150k with overtime. Or you can go to law school and fight for a job where you bill 2000 hours a year in a Chicago firm that advertises 30k base starting and legal experience is required to get the job.

The only problem with nursing is that you have to deal with actual poo poo.

Just go into finance if you want to make money. If you want to do something you like, do something else you like, which could be law school, imo.

mastershakeman
Oct 28, 2008

by vyelkin

Lote posted:

Have you ever looked into nursing school?

For 2 years of nursing school you can land a 40k-ish base salary that usually gives you tons of overtime if you want it. For another 2 years of nurse anesthetist school you can land a 90k-ish base salary that can go up to 150k with overtime. Or you can go to law school and fight for a job where you bill 2000 hours a year in a Chicago firm that advertises 30k base starting and legal experience is required to get the job.

The only problem with nursing is that you have to deal with actual poo poo.

Ha, what Chicago firm actually posted that?

Lote
Aug 5, 2001

Place your bets

mastershakeman posted:

Ha, what Chicago firm actually posted that?

It was in this thread a few months back. I think they posted it on Craigslist.

sullat
Jan 9, 2012

Nitrousoxide posted:

Don't you need to pass a background check to be an air traffic controller. And doesn't having a 6 figure debt pretty much make that impossible?

If that were true, no lawyers would ever be able to work for the government.

Ainsley McTree
Feb 19, 2004


joat mon posted:

Or being an air traffic controller?


That's 20 to 28k to go to school (plus per diem)
Actual pay is a good bit better.

There must be some catch: Perhaps the job itself is stressful and awful in some way?

Math Debater posted:

I've signed up to go to Thailand to teach at the end of September, but I'm thinking about sending out Fall 2015 law school applications before I go. I'm also thinking about forking out thousands of dollars to pay for tutoring before the June 2014 LSAT. I took the LSAT in February 2013 and scored 167. My difficulties with the analytical reasoning/logic games section prevented me from getting a higher score last time.

Ugh, I'm so stressed and confused about life...

"I know you guys told me not to dip my balls in this scrap baler but I'm considering it again"

evilweasel
Aug 24, 2002

Debt is a problem on a background check when it indicates you're spendthrift, bad with money, that sort of thing - things that would make you more susceptible to bribes or more likely to land yourself in a really bad financial situation that you can't get out of any other way.

Student loans, when you have a job aren't that sort of problem (because you have a job!) its when you have crushing debt and no job you're hosed. So if they want to hire you that's not really a problem.

nm
Jan 28, 2008

"I saw Minos the Space Judge holding a golden sceptre and passing sentence upon the Martians. There he presided, and around him the noble Space Prosecutors sought the firm justice of space law."

Ainsley McTree posted:

There must be some catch: Perhaps the job itself is stressful and awful in some way?

Unlike law. And at least it is over at the end of the day, well unless you crash a plane.

Ainsley McTree
Feb 19, 2004


nm posted:

Unlike law. And at least it is over at the end of the day, well unless you crash a plane.

If I understand air traffic control correctly, 90% of the job is making sure your daughter stays clean and doesn't date any meth dealers

semicolonsrock
Aug 26, 2009

chugga chugga chugga

Ainsley McTree posted:

There must be some catch: Perhaps the job itself is stressful and awful in some way?


"I know you guys told me not to dip my balls in this scrap baler but I'm considering it again"

ATC actually show some of the highest job satisfaction rates IIRC. Granted, it is hard because if you gently caress up poo poo crashes.

e: i think your hours are capped strictly because you have to be "on" the entire time.

semicolonsrock fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Feb 10, 2014

SlyFrog
May 16, 2007

What? One name? Who are you, Seal?
I was talking with someone about an air traffic controller job. She said she had two close friends who were, and that they said it was in fact quite brutal (in the first 5-10 years in particular), because scheduling is very strange. Apparently, you work this bizarre schedule where you don't just work a normal 8 hour day at the same time. Instead, your work shift creeps backward or forward each day (so that you might start at 8:00 a.m. the first day of the week, 5:00 a.m. the next day, 2:00 a.m. the day after that, etc.).

Sounded positively strange. Now admittedly, if you could deal with that, I assume you would still be working fewer total hours than law.

Lote
Aug 5, 2001

Place your bets
Found it! My mistake it was $27,000 per year for those with 3 years experience. $10/hr was for recent JD grads.

http://abovethelaw.com/2010/10/a-sign-of-improvement-in-the-chicago-legal-market/

Pook Good Mook
Aug 6, 2013


ENFORCE THE UNITED STATES DRESS CODE AT ALL COSTS!

This message paid for by the Men's Wearhouse& Jos A Bank Lobbying Group

SlyFrog posted:

I was talking with someone about an air traffic controller job. She said she had two close friends who were, and that they said it was in fact quite brutal (in the first 5-10 years in particular), because scheduling is very strange. Apparently, you work this bizarre schedule where you don't just work a normal 8 hour day at the same time. Instead, your work shift creeps backward or forward each day (so that you might start at 8:00 a.m. the first day of the week, 5:00 a.m. the next day, 2:00 a.m. the day after that, etc.).

Sounded positively strange. Now admittedly, if you could deal with that, I assume you would still be working fewer total hours than law.

I think people calling it "easy" are underestimating the type of work you do.

In law you might have a desk and inbox full of garbage and while it will take you forever to get through everything you can at least prioritize and some items are less urgent than others.

In ATC everything that comes at you has a time limit and it's essential to keep hundreds of flights and bits of data separate and accounted for or people could literally be killed.

It's the type of work and the worker you might be that makes it "easy." If you are a data minded person and don't mind when information never stops coming at you then you'll love ATC. If not you'll probably be burned out pretty quick. It's certainly not for everyone and its irresponsible to assume that someone who feels their strengths are law/law school would suddenly make a good ATC.

Ainsley McTree
Feb 19, 2004


It seems like the kind of job where getting loaded the night before and coming in hung over with 5 hours of sleep and half-assing it wouldn't really be an option.

AKA not for law school grads

Green Crayons
Apr 2, 2009

Ainsley McTree posted:

If I understand air traffic control correctly, 90% of the job is making sure your daughter stays clean and doesn't date any meth dealers
You're a keeper.

Mattavist
May 24, 2003

What the hell, Air Traffic Controller is still a job? Don't they know we have computers for that poo poo?

MoFauxHawk
Jan 1, 2007

Mickey Mouse copyright
Walt Gisnep
Can't be that hard a job if a bunch of scabs and newbies were able to handle everything after Reagan fired them all.

Soothing Vapors
Mar 26, 2006

Associate Justice Lena "Kegels" Dunham: An uncool thought to have: 'is that guy walking in the dark behind me a rapist? Never mind, he's Asian.

Math Debater posted:

I've signed up to go to Thailand to teach at the end of September, but I'm thinking about sending out Fall 2015 law school applications before I go. I'm also thinking about forking out thousands of dollars to pay for tutoring before the June 2014 LSAT. I took the LSAT in February 2013 and scored 167. My difficulties with the analytical reasoning/logic games section prevented me from getting a higher score last time.

Ugh, I'm so stressed and confused about life...

Go to law school you miserable indecisive gently caress. You deserve it.

semicolonsrock
Aug 26, 2009

chugga chugga chugga
Update: Dungeons and Dragons and Law has been postponed a month. Tragedy. More time for people to RSVP though.

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

bone shaking.
soul baking.
Found this today and felt the need to share. http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2006/03/06/federal-judge-rejects-inscrutable-motion-cites-adam-sandlers-billy-madison/


quote:

Our first ever Law Blog Judge of the Day award goes to Judge Leif Clark of the U.S. Bankruptcy Court for the Western District of Texas.

Judge Clark signed an order last month in an apparent dispute over the discharge of a debtor in Chapter 7 bankruptcy. In his “Order Denying Motion for Incomprehensibility,” Judge Clark ruled on a motion whose title sounds ripped from pages of The Onion: “Defendant’s Motion to Discharge Response to Plaintiff’s Response to Defendant’s Response Opposing Objection to Discharge.”

In a one-paragraph ruling, Judge Clark wrote, “The court cannot determine the substance, if any, of the Defendant’s legal argument, nor can the court even ascertain the relief that the Defendant is requesting. The Defendant’s motion is accordingly denied for being incomprehensible.”

But it’s Judge Clark’s footnote, which speaks for itself, that really caught our eye:

Or, in the words of the competition judge to Adam Sandler’s title character in the movie, Billy Madison, after Billy Madison had responded to a question with an answer that sounded superficially reasonable but lacked any substance,

“Mr. Madison, what you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I’ve ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.”

Deciphering motions like the one presented here wastes valuable chamber staff time, and invites this sort of footnote.

Petey
Nov 26, 2005

For who knows what is good for a person in life, during the few and meaningless days they pass through like a shadow? Who can tell them what will happen under the sun after they are gone?
One of my closest friends is an ATC. He doesn't have a college degree, but his dad was an ATC and he grew around it, so when they dropped the B.A. requirement back in 2008 he dropped out of school and went into the family business.

As others have said to be an ATC you need to be the sort of person who gets calmer (not more agitated) the more things are going on. And you need to be the sort of person who can memorize endless maps, numbers, codes, etc, and then spit them out back from memory flawlessly with lives on the line. My friend spent a solid year training in Oklahoma, memorizing aerial maps of his air territory (about three New England states) down to an acre resolution so that he can help guide blinded planes by visual only.

Based on the stories he's told me, it sounds like the best ATCs aren't geniuses so much as they are savants, where their highly specific autism enables them to play high-stakes Flight Sim but with actual planes. If you have that bent, as he does, and if you don't mind zero control over your schedule and a rigid hierarchy (but then, this is the lawyer thread), then yeah, you can make good money with great benefits.

If anyone is seriously considering it happy to try answer questions.

Petey fucked around with this message at 04:34 on Feb 12, 2014

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Mattavist
May 24, 2003

Petey posted:

My friend spent a solid year training in Oklahoma, memorizing aerial maps of his air territory (about three New England states) down to an acre resolution so that he can help guide blinded planes by visual only.

So do they ever move around later in their career? Or are you basically chained to wherever you started out?

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply