circ dick soleil posted:So what you guys are saying is that if we give wealth and power to the neo-nazis, they will stop being neo-nazis? Someone please explain this one to me. to the extent that they're neo-nazis because their economic situation sucks and they've latched onto the wrong explanation for said situation (jews) then yeah pretty much
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Aug 17, 2015 20:24
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to be fair the nazis did institute a lot of social programs for the poor and poo poo as long as you weren't one of the subhuman races ofc hahaha
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Aug 17, 2015 20:25
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circ dick soleil posted:More than one of them were presidents of the United States of America. quote:Spencer Salisbury was a war buddy and business partner of Harry S. Truman.[1] Salisbury, along with Edgar Hinde, convinced Truman to apply for membership in the Ku Klux Klan in 1924. Salisbury claimed that Truman was actually initiated into the Klan, in contradiction to Hinde and Truman, who stated that Truman backed out and was refunded his $10 initiation fee. quote:Warren G. Harding, a Republican, was allegedly a Ku Klux Klan member. Allegations that President Harding was a member are all based on a third-hand account of a second-hand recollection in 1985 of a deathbed statement made sometime in the late 1940s of an incident in the early 1920s. Independent investigations have turned up many contradictions and no supporting evidence. Historians reject the claim and note that Harding in fact publicly fought against the Klan.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:25
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Moridin920 posted:to be fair the nazis did institute a lot of social programs for the poor and poo poo well now you are starting to sway me..
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Aug 17, 2015 20:25
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Clipperton posted:to the extent that they're neo-nazis because their economic situation sucks and they've latched onto the wrong explanation for said situation (jews) then yeah pretty much So how do you explain every historical example that proves the opposite?
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Aug 17, 2015 20:25
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Moridin920 posted:clearly fascism is left wing economically since it just cribs from Marxism if that was even remotely true they wouldn't have privatized so much poo poo. nazis were so into sucking the dick of private contractors they didn't even establish wartime economic control until like halfway through 1942. factories were working the same hours as in peace time and still producing consumer goods instead of, you know, actual weapons
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Aug 17, 2015 20:25
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im gay
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Aug 17, 2015 20:26
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Clemocracy posted:he thinks nazis, a group that supports large unions, nationalization of large industry, protectionism, and a large welfare state is a right wing organization. if nazis like the welfare state so much why are you opposed to it
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Aug 17, 2015 20:27
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circ dick soleil posted:So how do you explain every historical example that proves the opposite? what, like fascism only taking hold in countries that were economically hosed (weimar germany, interwar italy, now austerity-era greece)?
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Aug 17, 2015 20:27
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HorseLord posted:if that was even remotely true they wouldn't have privatized so much poo poo. nazis were so into sucking the dick of private contractors they didn't even establish wartime economic control until like halfway through 1942. factories were working the same hours as in peace time and still producing consumer goods instead of, you know, actual weapons to clarify I just meant that the national socialist party (nazis) cribbed marxist policy as part of their official platform to appeal to germans who were getting hosed ten different ways by the treaty of versailles. I don't think they actually gave a poo poo beyond playing off it to gain power and then expand it. that's why you get all the social programs (for pureblood germans) but none of the actual 'means of production' stuff socialists want. obv they weren't socialist and they were more what you would call state capitalist but if you ignore what they actually did and just look at their stated policy, they def have a lot of rhetoric about protecting workers and whatnot that is clearly lifted from Marxism and that's one of the reasons why it's hard to classify fascism as left/right.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:28
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circ dick soleil posted:So what you guys are saying is that if we give wealth and power to the gansters, they will stop being gangsters? Someone please explain this one to me. circ dick soleil on black america
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Aug 17, 2015 20:29
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Clipperton posted:what, like fascism only taking hold in countries that were economically hosed (weimar germany, interwar italy, now austerity-era greece)? Try neo-nazis gaining wealth and power only to double down on their beliefs, instead of abandoning them like you say they would.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:29
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Tezzor posted:if nazis like the welfare state so much why are you opposed to it because im not a nazi and welfare state is for losers
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Aug 17, 2015 20:30
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Roy posted:circ dick soleil on black america The popular belief is that some people turn to violent crime because they need the money.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:30
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Aug 17, 2015 20:30
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first they came for the nazis, and i did nothing because i was not a nazi
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Aug 17, 2015 20:31
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Clemensalad in the wiemar polling booth: "Hmm. I don't agree with his pro-large-union policy, but I do approve of his pro-jew-killing policy!”
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Aug 17, 2015 20:31
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Tezzor posted:if nazis like the welfare state so much why are you opposed to it because it's a welfare state only for a select group of people and the economy otherwise runs on destroying everyone else where ever they might be and jingoistic nationalist fervor. also like that poster said in the end private companies still control/own everything, except the ruling party still retains control over the commanding heights of the economy.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:31
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HorseLord posted:sorry if a bunch of people declare intent to burn my city down and murder me then opposing them is self defence the lion's share of political violence over the past 50 years with death and destruction as its goal has been committed by the left so when a copper lays open your skull with a club and your brains pour onto the sidewalk just remember that you were asking for it
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Aug 17, 2015 20:32
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Moridin920 posted:to clarify I just meant that the national socialist party (nazis) cribbed marxist policy as part of their official platform to appeal to germans who were getting hosed ten different ways by the treaty of versailles. I don't think they actually gave a poo poo beyond playing off it to gain power and then expand it. that's why you get all the social programs (for pureblood germans) but none of the actual 'means of production' stuff socialists want. you could say this about virtually every leftist group
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Aug 17, 2015 20:32
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kindermord posted:the lion's share of political violence over the past 50 years with death and destruction as its goal has been committed by the left so when a copper lays open your skull with a club and your brains pour onto the sidewalk just remember that you were asking for it They were threatening to burn the city down, lol that you're actually defending these shitlers.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:33
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kindermord posted:the lion's share of political violence over the past 50 years with death and destruction as its goal has been committed by the left so when a copper lays open your skull with a club and your brains pour onto the sidewalk just remember that you were asking for it political violence as a result of the hundreds of years of oppression before that 50 year period. there's nothing wrong with standing up for yourself and fighting for your rights. The UN even acknowledges violence as a rightful action as the last resort of an oppressed people. Clemocracy posted:you could say this about virtually every leftist group not really there's plenty of unique things about fascism that make it difficult to classify with the old style left/right scale. specifically the 'good' class of citizen and the 'other' whose destruction is the focus of your economic production. it's a system of government based on the military-industrial complex, basically. Moridin920 fucked around with this message at 20:35 on Aug 17, 2015 |
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Aug 17, 2015 20:33
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Aug 17, 2015 20:34
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Aug 17, 2015 20:34
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Clemocracy posted:because im not a nazi and welfare state is for losers forums primate clemensalad saunters up to a rustic fence and puts his foot on the bottom rung. 'well, you might say i'm fiscally conservative and socially hate blacks faggots and jews"
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Aug 17, 2015 20:35
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circ dick soleil posted:Try neo-nazis gaining wealth and power only to double down on their beliefs, instead of abandoning them like you say they would. yeah no poo poo, if they make money off being a nazi then why would they give it up but it's not the rank-and-file white trash who gain the wealth and power, though, is it? it's the blokes at the head of the movement who're feeding them lies (and who were probably pretty well off to start with)
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Aug 17, 2015 20:36
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Moridin920 posted:to clarify I just meant that the national socialist party (nazis) cribbed marxist policy as part of their official platform to appeal to germans who were getting hosed ten different ways by the treaty of versailles. I don't think they actually gave a poo poo beyond playing off it to gain power and then expand it. that's why you get all the social programs (for pureblood germans) but none of the actual 'means of production' stuff socialists want. it's not hard to classify fascism as right wing at all, everyone has done except weirdo libertarians on a "hitler was a socialist" youtube comment crusade it doesn't matter what lies they spun in their marketing campaigns were, only their actual beliefs and actual actions. why is "nazis lied about things" difficult to grasp for you
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Aug 17, 2015 20:36
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kindermord posted:the lion's share of political violence over the past 50 years with death and destruction as its goal has been committed by the left lol
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Aug 17, 2015 20:36
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<3 gently caress off and die at the hands of a poor tezzor. <3
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Aug 17, 2015 20:36
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Moridin920 posted:political violence as a result of the hundreds of years of oppression before that 50 year period. there's nothing wrong with standing up for yourself and fighting for your rights. The UN even acknowledges violence as a rightful action as the last resort of an oppressed people. Which describes most leftist groups. A ton of them were racist and almost all of them failed miserably at implementing their stated policies. Groups like nazis are just a flavor of leftists. And leftists love fighting eachother.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:36
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HorseLord posted:it's not hard to classify fascism as right wing at all, everyone has done except weirdo libertarians on a "hitler was a socialist" youtube comment crusade well again the problem is 'left/right wing' is kind of useless when you have ideologies that can be left/right wing on economic issues and then the total opposite on social issues and how the government actually functions although yeah that's kind of some PoliSci nitpicking; fascism is right wing authoritarianism. Clemocracy posted:your two main arguments differentiating nazis from leftists was that they're racists and didnt implement their stated goals effectively. no, I'm saying their two main distinctions are totally embracing the military-industrial complex as a basis for their economy, and then using their nationalist superrace ideology to make war on everyone else to sustain it. that is uniquely a fascist platform. that doesn't at all describe most leftist groups, regardless of whatever domestic economic policies they might share.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:38
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i have empathy for neo nazis they're just poor people trying to hang on to something. it's a story of hardship. of struggle. a book could bet written about it even.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:39
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i'm pretty sure everybody is in favor of a welfare state that helps the people they like and doesn't help the people they don't like
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Aug 17, 2015 20:40
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circ dick soleil posted:They were threatening to burn the city down, lol that you're actually defending these shitlers. pointing out that he's justifying violence against people who threaten violence is "defending these shitlers" lol wait r u dick from the internet? 
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Aug 17, 2015 20:40
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Tezzor posted:i'm pretty sure everybody is in favor of a welfare state that helps the people they like and doesn't help the people they don't like
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Aug 17, 2015 20:41
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kindermord posted:pointing out that he's justifying violence against people who threaten violence is "defending these shitlers" lol wait r u dick from the internet? They got punched in the face oh deary me.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:41
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WobblySausage posted:i have empathy for neo nazis they're just poor people trying to hang on to something. it's a story of hardship. of struggle. a book could bet written about it even.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:42
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WobblySausage posted:i have empathy for neo nazis they're just poor people trying to hang on to something. it's a story of hardship. of struggle. a book could bet written about it even.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:42
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Tezzor posted:i'm pretty sure everybody is in favor of a welfare state that helps the people they like and doesn't help the people they don't like Well, I never thought I'd be emptyquote agreeing with Tezzor on an issue. No wonder Asia is exploding.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:42
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WobblySausage posted:i have empathy for neo nazis they're just poor people trying to hang on to something. it's a story of hardship. of struggle. a book could bet written about it even.
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Aug 17, 2015 20:42
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