|
MarksMan posted:I've been re-watching all of GoT starting at Season 2, in order to brush up for the new season. I just finished watching Joffrey's wedding at the beginning of Season 4, and am I the only one who so thoroughly enjoys watching him die a terrible death? I think he's the most hated character in TV or movie I've ever seen. I also love Cersei having to see it happen in front of her eyes. Only thing that sucks is watching Tyrion go through all of that, then being accused. Do Joffrey's on-screen acts match up to what happens in the books, or did they invent new horrors for him for the screen? You uh, you probably shouldn't relish in watching a child painfully suffocate to death.
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 04:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 9, 2024 10:31 |
|
|
24-7 Urkel Cosplay posted:You uh, you probably shouldn't relish in watching a child painfully suffocate to death. Ignore this guy. gently caress Joffrey..
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 04:49
|
|
|
24-7 Urkel Cosplay posted:You uh, you probably shouldn't relish in watching a child painfully suffocate to death. A "child" who is a sociopath, psychopath, and one of the most evil characters I've ever seen portrayed on TV? I think when you are that level of evil, your age doesn't get to shield you...if you aren't supposed to get satisfaction from Joffrey being killed, I can't possibly imagine who in the world would deserve it. rydiafan posted:Ignore this guy. gently caress Joffrey.. I concur MarksMan fucked around with this message at 05:04 on Mar 17, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 05:00
|
|
|
GRRM posted:I mean, Joffrey, as monstrous as he is – and certainly he’s just as monstrous in the books as he is in the TV show, and Jack has brought some incredible acting chops to the role that somehow makes him even more loathsome than he is on the page – but Joffrey in the books is still a 13-year-old kid. And there’s kind of a moment there where he knows that he’s dying and he can’t get a breath and he’s kind of looking at Tyrion and at his mother and at the other people in the hall with just terror and appeal in his eyes—you know, “Help me mommy, I’m dying.” And in that moment, I think even Tyrion sees a 13-year-old boy dying before him. So I didn’t want it to be entirely, “Hey-ho, the witch is dead.” I wanted the impact of the death to still strike home on to perhaps more complex feelings on the part of the audience, not necessarily just cheering.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 05:05
|
|
|
Ok, well that's great that is how he thought of it and intended it, but I don't think I'm the only one who was satisfied seeing him go. He also still said he didn't want it 'only' to be, "Hey-ho the witch is dead." So obviously he intended it to be that on some level. Again, his age does not get to shield him from being responsible for all the evil, cruel things he did. I take no pleasure in seeing children die normally, but he is just a despicable character -- one of the most despicable I've ever seen portrayed. He ordered the deaths of hundreds of children himself, as well as women. He led Sansa, another child, to believe her father would be let go -- alive -- and then beheaded him in front of her while laughing. He ordered the death of all children of Roberts. He killed the butcher's boy and the wolf to save face. He crossbow'ed a woman to death, just because. MarksMan fucked around with this message at 05:17 on Mar 17, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 05:11
|
|
|
GRRM straight up says in that quote that he expected people to celebrate Joffrey's death.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 05:34
|
|
|
Blind Melon posted:GRRM straight up says in that quote that he expected people to celebrate Joffrey's death. I honestly don't see how you could feel sorry for his death, or feel bad about it. Maybe I'm just messed up, I don't know...
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 05:38
|
|
|
Blind Melon posted:GRRM straight up says in that quote that he expected people to celebrate Joffrey's death. he expected that because he knows his audience (read: you) most typically lacks the ability to critically analyze the content they consume. He is clearly saying he was trying to invoke thoughts and feelings beyond just base violent satisfaction.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 05:43
|
|
|
Ok captain dumb dumb head. I sure missed the sympathetic reading of Joffrey's death you got me there!24-7 Urkel Cosplay posted:he expected that because he knows his audience (read: you) most typically lacks the ability to critically analyze the content they consume. He is clearly saying he was trying to invoke thoughts and feelings beyond just base violent satisfaction. IRONY! Beyond AND INCLUDING base violent satisfaction. Blind Melon fucked around with this message at 06:05 on Mar 17, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 05:59
|
|
|
About Book Joffrey, he alienated Robert by cutting open a pregnant cat and bringing the cat's fetal kittens to him.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 06:12
|
|
|
That whole "forcing hookers to beat each other to death before killing the other with a crossbow" thing was a show invention, I think
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 06:46
|
|
|
24-7 Urkel Cosplay posted:he expected that because he knows his audience (read: you) most typically lacks the ability to critically analyze the content they consume. He is clearly saying he was trying to invoke thoughts and feelings beyond just base violent satisfaction. Now that you're chiding everyone for being happy to see one of the biggest assholes in TV history die a horrible death can you do an effort post on Hollywood white washing mythical people because the Dornish aren't black, and about how it only reinforces the patriarchy because of some other cry baby bullshit. Who cares if people liked watching Joffrey die, you can be a victim of your upbringing and still have no redeeming qualities as a character. webmeister posted:That whole "forcing hookers to beat each other to death before killing the other with a crossbow" thing was a show invention, I think Blind Melon posted:How quickly we forget the afterward to A Feast for Crows. GRRM's optimism means nothing. Yeah fair enough, but it's been mentioned before and I want to re-iterate it now. GRRM only considers pages to be "done" when they're fit (such as they are) to be printed for distribution. So it's entirely possible (and if you trust other things he's said) likely he's had large chunks of characters arcs written and much (and more) of the story done already. Before they were split and published he had to cut out large sections of the stories to make them manageable books, which means he was starting from ahead already. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if he's got the majority of the book written and it spending his time now doing re-writes, re-working what he's done in the past and working with his editor to get his manuscript into a publishable state. Keep in mind even if he's finished the draft he's probably going to re-write 30-50% of it before it gets edited for the first time. I don't think fatty was happy with the past two books, so it's no surprise if he wants to get this one right and is taking a little longer. Then again I wouldn't be surprised if he's still looking at a blank page while he drools over incest slash fic on westeros.org
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 06:47
|
|
|
webmeister posted:That whole "forcing hookers to beat each other to death before killing the other with a crossbow" thing was a show invention, I think Those were actually two separate instances.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 06:48
|
|
|
Book Joff did love forcing people to duel to the death.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 06:56
|
|
|
They also pinned the Baratheon bastard cull and the attempt on Tryion's life at the Blackwater on Show Joffrey too.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 06:57
|
|
|
BlindSite posted:I don't think fatty was happy with the past two books, so it's no surprise if he wants to get this one right and is taking a little longer. Did he ever say that? I know the "Meerenese knot" gave him trouble though I still don't see why couldn't just write less about Meereen.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 07:05
|
|
|
nine-gear crow posted:They also pinned the Baratheon bastard cull and the attempt on Tryion's life at the Blackwater on Show Joffrey too. Yer, book Joffrey was wasn't as big a monster show Joffrey. Book Joffrey liked having Sansa beaten, cruel and usual punishments for criminals and killed a couple of folk banging on the gates for bread but we also learned he was desperate for attention from Robert and Cersei helped nurture the little turd. He went crying for his mummy once when someone called him out for being a bastard in front of the whole court. Book Joffrey never really got off torturing and killing hookers, Tyrion never managed to get any hookers into his room. Book Joffrey was a thirteen year old poo poo who could do what ever he wanted, show Joffrey was just a complete poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 07:14
|
|
|
Scapegoat posted:Yer, book Joffrey was wasn't as big a monster show Joffrey. GRRM posted:I mean, Joffrey, as monstrous as he is – and certainly he’s just as monstrous in the books as he is in the TV show Hmm... who to believe? I mean, I haven't watched the show, but still.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 07:37
|
|
|
Blind Melon posted:Hmm... who to believe? I mean, I haven't watched the show, but still. That was simply my perspective when watching it, murdering all Roberts bastards showed he went out his way to be a oval office.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 07:43
|
|
|
What Book Joffrey did: - Abused Micah, lied and caused his (and Lady's) deaths - Fired his crossbow at a number of starving peasants and then told the survivors to eat the dead - Ordered the deaths of all of the prisoners taken at the Blackwater who refused to swear allegiance - Abused Sansa physically, mentally, emotionally, etc. - Ruled like a tyrant: commanded people to fight to the death, mutilated people, imprisoned people arbitrarily, etc. - Ordered Ned's death (after being manipulated by Littlefinger) - Cut open a pregnant cat to see its kittens - Bullied Tommen - Cut up Tyrion's book with his sword - Humiliated Tyrion Basically, Joffrey did nothing wrong and it was national tragedy when he died.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 07:49
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:Maybe Pratchett dying freaked him out. I actually think this is probably true. Unconsciously, if not completely.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 07:54
|
|
|
I'd be surprised if it wasn't at least a bit of a wakeup call.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 08:02
|
|
|
Big Bug Hug posted:I'd be surprised if it wasn't at least a bit of a wakeup call. He shouldn't be worried, according to his Wiki, Pratchett wrote two books a year since his first book. They are nothing alike.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 08:06
|
|
|
It's possible his publisher was startled by Pratchett's death as well, and is putting pressure on him again. With all the talk of when the show will end, I wonder if they think book sales will drop if they release them after the show is over.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 15:03
|
|
|
24-7 Urkel Cosplay posted:he expected that because he knows his audience (read: you) most typically lacks the ability to critically analyze the content they consume. He is clearly saying he was trying to invoke thoughts and feelings beyond just base violent satisfaction. Finding it disturbing to see/read about a teenager gasping and choking to death is just as visceral a reaction as excitement that a character who does a bunch of horrible things is dead, neither one is about critical thinking at all.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 15:33
|
|
|
I, for one, was initially excited about it and cheered. However once that wore off I felt some sympathy as I recalled he was a 13 year old boy. I'm pretty much the perfect reader.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 15:41
|
|
|
If cheering Joffrey's death is a crime then count me among the guilty.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 17:51
|
|
|
24-7 Urkel Cosplay posted:You uh, you probably shouldn't relish in watching a child painfully suffocate to death. lol shut the gently caress up dude, jesus
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 17:56
|
|
|
GRRM, as stated before is someone who likes to humanize his villains during their demise/ultimate humiliation. Theon is the ultimate example of this, it's really hard not to feel sorry for Theon when he breaks down into tears begging for mercy from gods he doesn't believe in or watching Cersei mentally break down during her walk. Viserys, like I said some pages ago is also someone I felt really sorry for when he realizes Drogo is going to kill him and the last thing he spends doing is begging his sister to save his life. That being said however, I felt no sympathy for Joff or Gregor despite their grisly ends, Tommen and his sister also had the same childhood as Joff and they turned out to be nice kids.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 18:02
|
|
|
I just finished my reread of Ball of Beasts, and Cersei's shame walk was definitely a lot harder to read than I remembered it, mostly because when she started off she was all "Head held high, face neutral, don't give them the satisfaction, you'll get your revenge later, YOU ARE A LION" and I knew ahead of time what she'd be reduced to by the end of it  A lot of passages were a lot harder to read with advance knowledge, matter of fact. Quentyn's final chapter ranks highly among these. I think my initial reading of GoT I was just so happy Viserys was dying that I wasn't fazed by the way it happened, but maybe that was just because I hadn't had my resistance broken down by Reek yet. e: idiotic spelling of "fazed" loquacius fucked around with this message at 18:19 on Mar 17, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 18:14
|
|
|
BillBear posted:That being said however, I felt no sympathy for Joff or Gregor despite their grisly ends, Tommen and his sister also had the same childhood as Joff and they turned out to be nice kids. This is something I like about the show -- how different the Stark children have been based on their various ordeals/surroundings. How they deal with the world differently and how it's shaped them loquacius posted:I think my initial reading of GoT I was just so happy Viserys was dying that I wasn't fazed by the way it happened, but maybe that was just because I hadn't had my resistance broken down by Reek yet. What I hate about him is that he was willing to let, "1,000 men and their horses gently caress you (Daenerys) if it meant getting him the crown," or something along those lines. MarksMan fucked around with this message at 18:51 on Mar 17, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 18:48
|
|
|
So. I haven't been in this thread for a while. But, are we getting hype?  VVVV: No I don't know, I'm asking. redreader fucked around with this message at 19:50 on Mar 17, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 19:39
|
|
|
redreader posted:So. I haven't been in this thread for a while. But, are we getting hype? That's confirmed? I was like 100% sure the role of the Hound would be played in tonight's production by Sandor's understudy Brienne of Tarth.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 19:40
|
|
|
loquacius posted:I just finished my reread of Ball of Beasts, and Cersei's shame walk was definitely a lot harder to read than I remembered it, mostly because when she started off she was all "Head held high, face neutral, don't give them the satisfaction, you'll get your revenge later, YOU ARE A LION" and I knew ahead of time what she'd be reduced to by the end of it it's crazy how much awesome stuff will be in S5. We got the Walk of shame, the house of B&W, Theon's escape, Barristan loving poo poo up ( confirmed by the actor), Drogon at the pit, Hardhome, the beheading of Janos and the idles of Marsh. We also have huge potential with Jaime in Dorne, Sansa in Winterfell and hopefully Stannis gets his battle with Roose. Oh and Jaqen H'ghar as the kindly man.  It makes me very happy that D&D decided to trim down as much of AFFC & ADWD as possible, since they can advance more plots and add some background stuff we couldn't of gotten in the books, like Hardhome.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 20:12
|
|
|
Who's that old guy in the Cleganebowl poster? Everybody knows the Mountain is a solid 15 years younger than the Hound.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 20:25
|
|
|
redreader posted:VVVV: No I don't know, I'm asking. I guess I was confused since your graphic said "loving confirmed"  No details on exact plans for Robert Strong in book or show yet as far as I know, though.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 22:07
|
|
|
GoGoGadgetChris posted:Who's that old guy in the Cleganebowl poster? Everybody knows the Mountain is a solid 15 years younger than the Hound. It is hard to keep very gigantic men confined to a TV show, man. Word gets out you've got an enormously huge guy that can talk in front of a camera, the big leagues come calling -- Peter Jackson wants him to be an orc, The Rock wants to kick his rear end at the climax of his next movie, maybe he even gets a tryout to be a super-famous monster from horror movies like Jason or the Nemesis. Playing a modest, down-to-earth gargantuan knight in a cable show is no place for a skilled colossus.
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 22:36
|
|
|
loquacius posted:I guess I was confused since your graphic said "loving confirmed" It's a 4chan meme 
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 23:21
|
|
|
paco650 posted:It's a 4chan meme That's a ban
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2015 23:56
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 9, 2024 10:31 |
|
|
In It For The Tank posted:What Book Joffrey did: Who orders all the infants of King's Landing to be killed in the books? I know Joffrey did it in the series, but I don't remember if he is responsible in the books.
|
|
#
?
Mar 18, 2015 00:44
|
|
