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Trimson Grondag 3
Jul 1, 2007

Clapping Larry
i assume it has been noticed that half the cast of next gen is in this for some reason?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt7297456/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast

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Gravy Jones
Sep 13, 2003

I am not on your side
So this game is pretty drat good and a lot of fun. Played a ridiculous amount of hours over the last few days. It's just so loaded with "stuff" (which I could see being an issue for those who want a more pure tactical experience) that each mission feels like it's only little movie. The presentation/animation really helps with this as well.

Parenthesis posted:

I got one of these mission types yesterday, and when the mission started there actually was an extra soldier. It may have been caused by either one of the many mods I have installed, or my resistance orders, but I can't recall it having happened before :shrug:

I have this as one of the region perks. Happens maybe one in three or four missions. I also now have one where a random advent troop shows up as well. Which feels really weird (especially when he evacs with the rest of the team). Would be cool if they could become permanent squad members.

Taffer
Oct 15, 2010


Gravy Jones posted:

I have this as one of the region perks. Happens maybe one in three or four missions. I also now have one where a random advent troop shows up as well. Which feels really weird (especially when he evacs with the rest of the team). Would be cool if they could become permanent squad members.

I really hope a mod for this shows up. I had a stun Lancer in one of my missions who was a complete beast, he got 4 kills and 2 assists and tanked like 15 damage (thanks to a well deserved heal). He was the first advent who showed up in my squad and I was really sad I couldn't keep him :(

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes
Hmm, I was planning to play again on Legendary as soon as I finished my first game, but the victory lap was so long here I have kind of lost motivation. In the end I was just ignoring missions that popped up while scanning and waiting for the shadow projects to end. The problem is that there's no real need to push the story missions - in fact in some ways it's a bad idea to do so - but that leaves you with a pile of story missions and all the Shadow chamber research to do at the end. The geoscape was rather lonely with all the Chosen dead. Ideally there should be actual reasons to progress the story before sitting on Plasma, but scaling down the time needed for shadow projects based on your research level could be a quicker fix. Maybe even make them instant, like the way autopsies do after killing enough aliens.

Also, is there a shortcut for jumping to the geoscape? I thought there was but I can't recall it and it doesn't seem to be listed in the keybinds menu which is making me doubt myself.

Sylink
Apr 17, 2004

I keep getting crashes mid iron man mission then the save is reverted to before the mission, which makes no sense for Ironman.

Exposure
Apr 4, 2014

BlazetheInferno posted:

Okay, one thing's been bugging me.

One of the Resistance-given "rescue our operative VIP" missions, that doesn't involve the Lost. Generally just rewards the VIP and some intel, you find the guy then it turns out to be an ambush so you need to survive X turns.

At the start of that type of mission, Bradford mentions that the resistance has an operative in the area to assist with the rescue. That suggests an extra soldier somewhere. There isn't, or if there is, he's well-hidden, and not indicated on the map or the rewards list pre-mission. Is that line just a red herring that should be ignored? Is Bradford lying to me?

They appeared to change those missions late in development: all of the resistance op missions have faction leader specific briefings mentioning the same thing, and there's leftover encounter data for specifically spawning a Reaper/Skirmisher/Templar in the field on those missions.

You could probably jury rig the Gather Expedition/Rescue Survivors missions to using them again, although I'd have no idea if it would properly grant you another hero soldier or if it would result in a Specialist or Ranger cosplaying as one of the faction heroes in the mission.

Parenthesis
Jan 3, 2013

Trimson Grondag 3 posted:

i assume it has been noticed that half the cast of next gen is in this for some reason?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt7297456/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast

It has and it rules :haw:. Too bad they didn't get Patrick Stewart into the game.

Tollymain
Jul 9, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
has anybody done a "THIS MAN IS YOUR FRIEND / HE FIGHTS FOR FREEDOM" poster w a skirmisher yet because if not get on that

Verviticus
Mar 13, 2006

I'm just a total piece of shit and I'm not sure why I keep posting on this site. Christ, I have spent years with idiots giving me bad advice about online dating and haven't noticed that the thread I'm in selects for people that can't talk to people worth a damn.
i decided to try to do the entire blacksite with a single reaper (and her bondmate that immediately evaced just to get some cohesion) and it turns out if you blow up a couple pods, every pod runs at your stealthed character at full speed. now when its a stealthed reaper with +mobility PCS, its not a big deal, and i had a fun time blowing them all up with a 10x10 loving forklift nuke or whatever, but man they really didnt give much thought into the stealth part of this game and its really annoying sometimes

you also cant stealth a character that's carrying an objective like the blacksite vial and there was a chosen assassin chilling near the evac so that was a harrowing mission all things considered

edit: also, fatigue isnt just linked to actions. the bondmate literally ran from start to the evac with no fighting and got tired, the reaper with 15 remote start kills and 40 turns didn't. they have more or less the same max will

Verviticus fucked around with this message at 12:06 on Sep 6, 2017

Maluco Marinero
Jan 18, 2001

Damn that's a
fine elephant.
It's funny cause the tracking skill for Reapers shows off just how primitive the line of play system can be. The reaper concealment radius is just ridiculous considering their movement range and what they can contribute without even leaving concealment.

Iron Crowned
May 6, 2003

by Hand Knit

Parenthesis posted:

It has and it rules :haw:. Too bad they didn't get Patrick Stewart into the game.

Who would he voice? Bradford's Dad?

Attack on Princess
Dec 15, 2008

To yolo rolls! The cause and solution to all problems!

Maluco Marinero posted:

To add to this, the game is primarily about stacking high probability on good events, and reducing probability on bad events, if you boil it down.

What this essentially means offensively, is you should be using guaranteed damage and effects as much as possible (grenades, 100% shots, many abilities), and also using those guaranteed actions to get you more high probability actions (blow up cover to allow higher probability shots, or flanking opportunities). You should also being using those guaranteed/high probability actions to DENY or reduce the chances on bad events.

Killing enemies is the one true 100% way to avoid damage. After that, locking down particular abilities can be useful, Flashbangs deny Faceless and Stun Lancers their melee attack for example. Psi Stasis allows you to ignore an enemy for a whole turn (which is basically a full battle usually). If you can't guarantee a kill (even if it's 70+ chance), then you should be making sure to take your shots from full cover that isn't in flanking distance.

The game is balanced around you only engaging one or two pods at a time maximum, because if you engage more than that the likelihood of you taking incoming fire is far higher, so Phantom Rangers or Reapers in the expansion pack are ridiculously powerful as you can scout aggressively with far less risk of double activation.

You could do it that way, or you could tank it and pay the iron price for your victories. :haw:

I tanked my way through the expansion on commander. Nanoscale on everyone, armor upgrades first, skipped mimic beacons, grenades and flashbangs everywhere, rangers and templars as immunity tanks followed by grenadiers with 1-3 dots of armor and a massive pool of health. Half my guys were always in the infirmary, but it was pretty loving dope going deep instead of relying on alpha strikes and pulling back to overwatch. Near the end, I was purposefully activating three pods at a time just to feel alive. I lost a couple of colonels along the way, but my biggest problem was low will and managing negative traits. 7 of my colonels, two of which were faction dudes, had wills in the 30s after the hunter got 'brutal'. The hunter was the last Chosen alive when he got the trait, and I was keeping him alive to try the new avenger defence mission.

I'm trying legendary next, but I'm worried I've picked up a lot of bad habits with using half-cover and leaving my dodge-lords out of cover.

Attack on Princess
Dec 15, 2008

To yolo rolls! The cause and solution to all problems!
If I put my old guys in the character pool and remove their nicks, do they get new nicks when they rank up in the next game or does it stay blank?

Serephina
Nov 8, 2005

恐竜戦隊
ジュウレンジャー
We're talking about base game to a guy who got hit but handed to him on Veteran. WotC and intentionally tanking up guys to be silly does not apply

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

Iron Crowned posted:

Who would he voice? Bradford's Dad?

The civilians. :v:

e: Alternately, the secret boss, the Burglord.

Shumagorath
Jun 6, 2001

Ravenfood posted:

But why? Pretty sure the shadow chamber takes 10 power and the generator gives 3, or 10 if built on a coil. Putting the psi chamber on a coil is definitely the best use of one coil, and the other might as well be the shadow chamber unless I'm missing something big.
Shadow Chamber only takes 5. Forgot about the gate.

Shumagorath fucked around with this message at 05:20 on Sep 25, 2017

Alchenar
Apr 9, 2008

I bet Jake is really regretting concealment now because so many people have made the mistake of looking at it and assuming that XCOM is a stealth game now. It's not. Concealment is just a way for you to get the jump on the first pod and move on from there. Shadow isn't there for you to Stealth, it's so that you can get the jump on every pod.

Stop trying to avoid pods, start trying to murder them.

Paint Crop Pro
Mar 22, 2007

Find someone who values you like Rick Spielman values 7th round picks.



That being said, the rescue missions where you should be going full stealth had me on the edge of my seat the entire mission, up until the last second smash, grab, exit.

Also Pro Tip: You can't just blow up the wall to get your soldiers. I found that out the hard way.

turn off the TV
Aug 4, 2010

moderately annoying

Alchenar posted:

I bet Jake is really regretting concealment now because so many people have made the mistake of looking at it and assuming that XCOM is a stealth game now. It's not. Concealment is just a way for you to get the jump on the first pod and move on from there. Shadow isn't there for you to Stealth, it's so that you can get the jump on every pod.

Stop trying to avoid pods, start trying to murder them.

Heaven forbid people try weird gimmicks in Xcom.

PlasticAutomaton
Nov 12, 2016

Artoria Pendonut


I am so mad. For some reason my Paladin level spark bugged out and I can no longer select him to go on any mission.

Verviticus
Mar 13, 2006

I'm just a total piece of shit and I'm not sure why I keep posting on this site. Christ, I have spent years with idiots giving me bad advice about online dating and haven't noticed that the thread I'm in selects for people that can't talk to people worth a damn.

Alchenar posted:

I bet Jake is really regretting concealment now because so many people have made the mistake of looking at it and assuming that XCOM is a stealth game now. It's not. Concealment is just a way for you to get the jump on the first pod and move on from there. Shadow isn't there for you to Stealth, it's so that you can get the jump on every pod.

Stop trying to avoid pods, start trying to murder them.

they probably should have made even the slightest attempt to communicate this before making a loving cloaked unit that can re-cloak for free. nah, lets just have psychic aliens but only under certain insane conditions

and its not like concealment and shadow gently caress up pure stealth missions. retaliation missions are completely irredeemably hosed with the totally arbitrary aggro that seems to be tied to what enemy pods you can see sometimes but not always

oh my allies have been shooting this pod for two turns, but on the third turn, 30% of the time if you have vision of their friends they'll reveal your squad and aggro a different pack of civilians, better plan for this

Verviticus fucked around with this message at 13:36 on Sep 6, 2017

Sloober
Apr 1, 2011

Alchenar posted:

I bet Jake is really regretting concealment now because so many people have made the mistake of looking at it and assuming that XCOM is a stealth game now. It's not. Concealment is just a way for you to get the jump on the first pod and move on from there. Shadow isn't there for you to Stealth, it's so that you can get the jump on every pod.

Stop trying to avoid pods, start trying to murder them.

Pretty drastic if people play more than a couple missions trying to stealth it out. You have to kill stuff to level your guys faster, and what's the point of all these toys if you don't get to use them. That said I do abuse concealment advancing more on tightly timed missions, since i use the countdown timer stop resistance order to get in a favorable kill position before wiping the floor with squads.

I think my favorite missions are in the lost cities, they just seem to be so much more fun with the old style building fighting, and the lost are a fun little encounter, although i stopped caring about not using explosives early on.

Verviticus
Mar 13, 2006

I'm just a total piece of shit and I'm not sure why I keep posting on this site. Christ, I have spent years with idiots giving me bad advice about online dating and haven't noticed that the thread I'm in selects for people that can't talk to people worth a damn.

OxySnake posted:

That being said, the rescue missions where you should be going full stealth had me on the edge of my seat the entire mission, up until the last second smash, grab, exit.

Also Pro Tip: You can't just blow up the wall to get your soldiers. I found that out the hard way.

you can with a claymore

Tollymain
Jul 9, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
old non-wotc question, did anybody ever make a mod that lets you keep the anarchy's children kevlar torsos/pants on people

temple
Jul 29, 2006

I have actual skeletons in my closet

Advice for struggling players.

Tempest_56
Mar 14, 2009

Alchenar posted:

I also bought the Ring first, because I realised that if you start building the GTS on day 1 then all you can do with it for the rest of month 1 is train rookies and maybe get Squad Size 1 if you are lucky.

I've been considering on my next run to put off building the GTS for a while for that exact reason. Now that so much of it has been moved off, Squad Size 1 is the only thing before you hit Captain and while there's no arguing that +1 soldier is drat good I'm not sure if it's worth the opportunity cost. I'm considering going for a Laboratory second instead - getting the increased use out of your first scientist and the extra breakthroughs strikes me as potentially worth it.

I think due to the power situation it'd probably have to go Ring-Lab-Power-Comms-GTS.

Backhand
Sep 25, 2008
Man I hate evac-style missions sometimes. I'm in the victory lap and have been for a while, but for the life of I can't get any non-evac missions with Gatekeepers on them. I just want my tier 3 psi amp, drat it!

Sloober
Apr 1, 2011

Backhand posted:

Man I hate evac-style missions sometimes. I'm in the victory lap and have been for a while, but for the life of I can't get any non-evac missions with Gatekeepers on them. I just want my tier 3 psi amp, drat it!

Do the gate coordinate mission?

That is one guaranteed gatekeeper

Anime_Otaku
Dec 6, 2009
I'm on Xbox so still on vanilla, one of sharpshooters rolled shredder as a hidden ability. Will that work with the gunslinger skills? She's a sergeant so she only has lightning hands for her pistol.

Captain Oblivious
Oct 12, 2007

I'm not like other posters

Internet Kraken posted:

If you're not interested in completely trivalizing the game then you should skip psionics.

Yeah in future Ironman runs I think I would build the Psi Lab as my fourth building after rushing a Coil. I put it off way too long.

Kooriken
Dec 27, 2012

This thread is beneath my talent, but I....shall elevate it.

Anime_Otaku posted:

I'm on Xbox so still on vanilla, one of sharpshooters rolled shredder as a hidden ability. Will that work with the gunslinger skills? She's a sergeant so she only has lightning hands for her pistol.

I'm pretty sure it specifies it being your sniper rifle that shreds but I'm not 100 percent sure.

Serephina
Nov 8, 2005

恐竜戦隊
ジュウレンジャー
No poo poo, I skip psionics now on principle, I'm so sick of them and they're actually not as fun a class as the four base classes.

mrbotus
Apr 7, 2009

Patron of the Pants
So do they ever elaborate on why the Avatar Project is bad for humanity? Is it because they are going to throw all humans into a juicer to do it or what? I mean, obviously being subjugated is bad, but I'm not sure why the Avatar Project spells game over for humanity?...

oswald ownenstein
Jan 30, 2011

KING FAGGOT OF THE SHITPOST KINGDOM

Serephina posted:

I must be the only man on earth who rushes mass nanovests, probably because of Ironman reasons: I can't control the aliens getting a lucky crit, but I sure can make sure they don't land a 2nd hit on that particular guy. Crits will one-shot squaddies in kevlar, nanovests let them live. Ergo, vests are good for the unmodded game where high cover guarantees enemies will only miss or crit, nothing between. Meanwhile Medkits won't raise the dead, and poisoned/bleeding guys can just evac. There's a reason I personally rush Predator armour on ironman games!


Tips for rookies:
The game is mostly about pod management, and rewarding aggression while punishing carelessness.

For pod management: Yes, break concealment on the first pod you find, and wipe them out with overwatch fire + a grenade to wake them up. Game's designed around this, and subtly punishes you for trying to walk past pods. Once your guys get a lot of levels, there's better ways of waking pods than overwatch traps, such as killzone and leaving guys with spare actions to respond to how the ambush goes, but the core idea remains the same. If you want to repeat the ambush ad nauseum (and why wouldn't you?), get a Ranger with Phantom and have him stay hidden as long as reasonable through the mission, he can scout new pods without waking them, it's a HUGE help.

A common mistake for X-com vets (something you have in your favor actually, not knowing the originals) is to try and play it out as the old games did; saturating a single alien with 60-80% shots, and just relying on overwhelming number of shots to eventually kill them. This is a TERRIBLE idea in the reboots, as you only get 4-6 men instead of 8-16, they fire only once, and each guy is far more precious in the long term. Taking protracted firefights where everyone is taking pot shots at each other from behind cover will lose you the game, as dead aliens are no big deal, but dead midrange soldiers are devastating to your development. Which comes to point two: The game strongly rewards aggressive play, ie "Don't let the fuckers even have a chance to shoot back." Return fire is kinda inevitable when all you have is rookies, but as you get better tools it's possible to wipe out most-to-all of a pod on the turn you activate it. Take a ranger, run him behind the cover the Advent guy is hiding behind, and get a point-blank shot for a guaranteed kill. Or blow up the cover with explosive and shoot him with a sniper. Guaranteed actions are good! Grenades, the Specialist's Combat Protocol skill, point-blank shotguns, etc are all reliable ways to reducing the amount of return fire you take. Just make sure that the ranger running up isn't revealing new fog of war: then it's carelessness, as you can activate new pods (which you seem to have learned), and the game will kill you for it.

There are other, more specific, tips (flashbangs are godly v Sectoids etc) but I feel that's the best gameplay aspect that thedevs where trying to make.

You'll just take less deaths and wounds with nades and killing than you will with that +1 hp

I guess I might consider taking a vest on a retal with a rookie where I'm worried about the assassin just 1 shotting him...maybe...but probably not

Vests are great in LW2 where you have more inventory slots but in vanilla you just don't have enough space to deal with the cool toys

Dinictus
Nov 26, 2005

May our CoX spray white sticky fluid at our enemies forever!
HAIL ARACHNOS!
Soiled Meat
Well this is a fun bug.



Ironman Legendary, so of course I'm hosed with regards to no evac zone spawning in.

Rotten Red Rod
Mar 5, 2002

nickmeister posted:

So do they ever elaborate on why the Avatar Project is bad for humanity? Is it because they are going to throw all humans into a juicer to do it or what? I mean, obviously being subjugated is bad, but I'm not sure why the Avatar Project spells game over for humanity?...

It's pretty clearly spelled out, you find out exactly what it is if you finish the game. It's to create new super-powerful bodies for the dying elders using humans as the raw materiala, after which they will be unstoppable by X-Com.

babypolis
Nov 4, 2009

Starting with a reaper might be the only way to make gatecrasher bearable on L/I. Alpha strike the trooper pod, claymore the captain and his buddies, and chump on the sectoid. Everything else is still hugely dependent on luck

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes

Rotten Red Rod posted:

It's pretty clearly spelled out, you find out exactly what it is if you finish the game. It's to create new super-powerful bodies for the dying elders using humans as the raw materiala, after which they will be unstoppable by X-Com.

Also, as you get to the last mission they decide that once they have the Avatar recipe done they might as well kill off the rest of the useless humans.

Hats Wouldnt Fly
Feb 9, 2010

.
Redfont is my hero.

BlazetheInferno posted:

Okay, one thing's been bugging me.

One of the Resistance-given "rescue our operative VIP" missions, that doesn't involve the Lost. Generally just rewards the VIP and some intel, you find the guy then it turns out to be an ambush so you need to survive X turns.

At the start of that type of mission, Bradford mentions that the resistance has an operative in the area to assist with the rescue. That suggests an extra soldier somewhere. There isn't, or if there is, he's well-hidden, and not indicated on the map or the rewards list pre-mission. Is that line just a red herring that should be ignored? Is Bradford lying to me?

I always assumed the operative was captured by Advent, and that's how they know to set up the ambush.

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Backhand
Sep 25, 2008

Sloober posted:

Do the gate coordinate mission?

That is one guaranteed gatekeeper

I used that one for the autopsy. Still need 1-2 more for the actual psi amp.

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