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MassRayPer posted:Did I say what their intentions are? I have no doubts WWE's intentions aren't altruistic, however, they have actually changed. They have actually cleaned up. I have also never seen the kind of racist policies that TNA levied against Truth and Konnan in WWE. Both companies have had racist storylines, but the kind of policies TNA has engaged in in the past are on another level of racism than WWE. Since you don't want to bring up the past, let's tally a list of both companies offensive storylines today. WWE Overt racism - none that I could see. Misogyny - Coming from the company's top babyface (attacks on Vikie's weight and appearence, calling Eve a Hoeski) Tasteless angles - nothing at the moment TNA I don't watch the product but from reading results, there is nothing that stands out. Anyone want to chime in? budreck fucked around with this message at 23:51 on Feb 10, 2013 |
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Feb 10, 2013 23:49
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budreck posted:Since you don't want to bring up the past, let's tally a list of both companies offensive storylines today. When did I say I didn't want to bring up the past? You can't note a company is changing if you ignore the past. In this case I don't give a poo poo about storylines. They can be distasteful, but bad storylines are usually just a sign of bad judgment, not actual beliefs. I have been talking mostly about business practices and treatment of talent, but sure, go ahead and ignore that and bring up storylines something I have barely mentioned. I'm not sure if this is some kind of bizarre strawman or if you just aren't reading other people's posts.
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Feb 10, 2013 23:54
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jeffersonlives posted:If you don't blame WWE on Benoit and NOAH on Misawa to a great extent I really don't know what to say. As someone who knows nothing about Japanese wrestling, what exactly led up to Misawa's death? Was he already having problems leading up to the match?
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Feb 10, 2013 23:55
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An Actual Bear posted:As someone who knows nothing about Japanese wrestling, what exactly led up to Misawa's death? Was he already having problems leading up to the match? It's really shrouded, no-one really talks about it, so we don't really know. All we know is he died in the ring. We don't even know, officially, the cause of death other than "he took a suplex and didn't get back up".
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Feb 11, 2013 00:00
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An Actual Bear posted:As someone who knows nothing about Japanese wrestling, what exactly led up to Misawa's death? Was he already having problems leading up to the match? Misawa was taking the same dumb head and neck bumps he'd always taken having been diagnosed a few years earlier with neck problems comparable to those that forced the retirement of people like Steve Austin, DDP, and Edge. It was common knowledge he shouldn't have been continuing to wrestle in anything more than the Giant Baba comedy role, but he did because he "needed" to for business. VogeGandire posted:It's really shrouded, no-one really talks about it, so we don't really know. All we know is he died in the ring. We don't even know, officially, the cause of death other than "he took a suplex and didn't get back up". Yes we do, the cause of death was a shattered C-1 and C-2 that led to a severed spine.
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Feb 11, 2013 00:01
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MassRayPer posted:When did I say I didn't want to bring up the past? You can't note a company is changing if you ignore the past. In this case I don't give a poo poo about storylines. They can be distasteful, but bad storylines are usually just a sign of bad judgment, not actual beliefs. I have been talking mostly about business practices and treatment of talent, but sure, go ahead and ignore that and bring up storylines something I have barely mentioned. I'm not sure if this is some kind of bizarre strawman or if you just aren't reading other people's posts. You sound angry. Looking at how TNA treats its current roster in the past year, the company has gone out of their way to assist Jesse Sorensen in his recovery more so than necessary. Another example I can think of is facing criticism for not re-signing D-Von. Fans basically flooded Dixie's twitter calling them out on letting this one slip by. Dixie responds by signing him and having him booked as a prominent focal point. Again, it's not the wisest decision to listen to fans over hiring practices but instances like these show that she at least means well and is nowhere near Vince levels of actual scumminess, she's just stupid.
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Feb 11, 2013 00:15
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budreck posted:You sound angry. It is angering that a company has gotten away with treating minority and female talent as less than its white talent. It's angering that the women still make very little money. It is angering that after six years they still have no wellness policy. It is angering that they let drug addicts work matches while on drugs. You say they haven't done anything scummy in the last year? They filed that lawsuit against WWE which prevented WWE from signing anyone remotely connected to TNA and forced talent to either re-sign with TNA or work the indies because WWE couldn't even talk to them. As for the Devon thing, come on. It's pretty clear they worked the newsletters and Devon was never a free agent. They haven't gone above and beyond with Jesse Sorensen, they've done the same thing wrestling companies do in this situation, which is treat him like a human being and actually take care of him. Something they haven't done in the past... if you were black or a woman. Luckily no non white males broke their necks while in TNA. Above and beyond is Vince paying to save Paul Bearer's life when he wasn't under contract and there was no company edict to pay for life saving surgeries no way related to the business. Edit: Why does it make me mad? Vince gets called out for every scummy thing the WWE has done, and some things that there is no evidence he did, like covering up a murder a wrestler wasn't charged with. That is while running a legitimately large company with hundreds of employees. He should be held accountable, he's in charge. He looked the other way or worse on steroids. He wasn't proactive enough on concussions. He's let really questionable poo poo appear on their TV. But, this is in a company where it is actually large enough that stuff goes on outside of his knowledge. Where things actually get delegated to divisions. Dixie Carter has said TNA is small and has very few employees because they couldn't afford them. There isn't that kind of corporate bureaucracy. If people are going to take Vince to task for what WWE has done, Dixie needs to be held accountable for what goes on in a much smaller company that she runs. MassRafTer fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Feb 11, 2013 |
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Feb 11, 2013 00:23
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Is the Chris Jericho DVD worth getting? He's one of the wrestlers I'd really like to learn more about. Same question goes for the Jake 'the Snake' Roberts DVD.
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Feb 11, 2013 01:01
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Breaking the Code? yeah, it's one of my favorite WWE documentaries and is pretty thorough with his entire career up to that point. it's a fun watch, and if you're only interested in the documentary portion, it was up on Netflix Instant Stream last I checked. provided you're in the US, anyway. I haven't seen the Jake Roberts DVD so I can't comment.
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Feb 11, 2013 01:12
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Jericho's doc is unflinchingly honest about the frustrations he went through and he how felt he deserved some of the blame for things not coming together in the WWE right away like he'd hoped in terms of card spot and whatnot.
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Feb 11, 2013 01:18
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MassRayPer posted:Dixie Carter has said TNA is small and has very few employees because they couldn't afford them. There isn't that kind of corporate bureaucracy. If people are going to take Vince to task for what WWE has done, Dixie needs to be held accountable for what goes on in a much smaller company that she runs. But the point some were trying to make was that while Vince is a noted control freak known to have his hands in everything Dixie is regarded as the opposite. A hands off owner who delegates resposnabilities to others while she largely shakes hand and answers questions. Certainly this doesn't clear her of all guilt in TNA's wrongs because theperson in charge should be held accountability for the actions they allow to happen. But the context does matter and a leader who is largely ignorant of the problems is less reprehensible than the one who has his hands in the problems. Assuming these two impressions are fair ones. There's a difference between a politician who stays ignorant of the crap his constituents go through do to his policies or those of his cabinet and one who actively and deliberately puts them through it. They're both guilty but of different things. The reason to bring up that WWE's positive changes not being altruistic is again context. WWE has strengthened its Wellness Policy and done things like rehab in direct response to the poo poo they got and the poo poo they stand to get. It's reasonable to say TNA doesn't have these same pressures so they've made no real efforts to match the same actions. This doesn't how malice in one and concern in another, it shows two scummy businesses doing the bare minimum of what they need to do to survive. You're essentially assigning moral value to WWE's progressive changes even when acknowledging they were likely purely business decisions. Meanwhile all the systematic problems still exist in WWE. People get tested for drugs and get paid rehab if they need it but polished or huge physiques are still pushed, a brutal schedule is still in place, and the wrestlers still lack any job security or health insurance. So all the causes for the problems remain, WWE has just applied nicer band aids. In the same way someone could argue that women are treated better because there are no more bikini matches and they're booked as wrestlers. But this would ignore that they're till marginalized and booked in misogynistic ways so the real problems still exist. For the record I think most of the criticisms against TNA are largely valid if not slightly exaggerated by some - which you can probably also say about WWE.
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Feb 11, 2013 01:24
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Puseklepp posted:Is the Chris Jericho DVD worth getting? He's one of the wrestlers I'd really like to learn more about. The Jericho one is probably one of the five best out there and the Roberts one is worth buying for the promos alone, especially since you can get it for $5 on Amazon right now.
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Feb 11, 2013 01:26
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MassRayPer posted:One died of complications from a TNA match. Is Vince now scummiest because of an accident?
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Feb 11, 2013 01:27
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Dixie pays for everything so it's on her when the knockouts champion needs a weekday job to get by. TNA will sign people to pay per appearance deal and not use them enough to make a living. They are allowed to take indy bookings, but can't appear on DVD so it doesn't make sense for a promoter to pay for them. Vince is a maniac and works guys to death, but at least he pays well.
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Feb 11, 2013 01:45
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STAC Goat posted:But the point some were trying to make was that while Vince is a noted control freak known to have his hands in everything Dixie is regarded as the opposite. A hands off owner who delegates resposnabilities to others while she largely shakes hand and answers questions. Certainly this doesn't clear her of all guilt in TNA's wrongs because theperson in charge should be held accountability for the actions they allow to happen. But the context does matter and a leader who is largely ignorant of the problems is less reprehensible than the one who has his hands in the problems. Assuming these two impressions are fair ones. There's a difference between a politician who stays ignorant of the crap his constituents go through do to his policies or those of his cabinet and one who actively and deliberately puts them through it. They're both guilty but of different things. Dixie Carter went to Congress to tell them all about her company and told them about their wonderful wellness policy that does not exist. She basically went there of her own accord in an act of hubris, but she went and said they did. Said they were concerned about their talent. She lied. She put the company in the public eye about this, and nothing happened. If WWE scaled back on Wellness, who would notice until the next crisis? It would keep them from signing Bruno, but not much else. They have tightened up Wellness even when they are out of the public eye. TNA hasn't even tried, and they've had some pretty public substance abuse issues with Angle and Hardy making news. People say Dixie is hands off, but most reports from the company are that it is a close-knit family. Dixie tries to keep people happy. She tries to put herself on TV and be in the middle of things. Then there's the stories she'd show off her fancy clothes to the Knockouts so she could flaunt just how rich she is. This is not someone who stays isolated from her company. To say she does goes against her own public statements too. WWE's wellness is not perfect, but since it was implemented, physiques have changed. Now Ryback is an exception rather than the rule. Guys like Orton have shrunk. People will always stay ahead of the tests, but there are reports they take Wellness very seriously now. Yes, WWE still abuses the independent contractor loophole. Both companies do. It sucks. But, WWE has at least made progress. They at least try. There will never be a pension, but at least now they offer things like Legends deals and try to give older guys pay days. (I don't blame TNA at all for not doing stuff like this.) I'd like to see TNA at least try. Stop having so many wrestlers who need outside jobs to maintain any standard of living, or having to quit the company because they don't get enough dates. Stop paying the Knockouts like poo poo. Start taking the health of their wrestlers seriously. Stop making it so hard for them to take outside dates for the ones who don't get enough dates from TNA.
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Feb 11, 2013 02:08
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MassRayPer posted:Yes, WWE still abuses the independent contractor loophole. Both companies do. It sucks. But, WWE has at least made progress. They at least try. There will never be a pension, but at least now they offer things like Legends deals and try to give older guys pay days. (I don't blame TNA at all for not doing stuff like this.) I'd like to see TNA at least try. Stop having so many wrestlers who need outside jobs to maintain any standard of living, or having to quit the company because they don't get enough dates. Stop paying the Knockouts like poo poo. Start taking the health of their wrestlers seriously. Stop making it so hard for them to take outside dates for the ones who don't get enough dates from TNA. If WWE didn't go public and have stockholders to answer to, there would be no Wellness Policy, no paid rehab and no Legends Contracts. Vince gives no shits if his ex-talents die, he just wants to make sure his rear end is covered in case they do so his business isn't affected. "Yeah, he was on meth and burned himself alive - but if he needed help, we have a comprehensive program he qualified for, being one of our former employees. It's a shame he didn't utilize it." The above statement removes WWE from legal liability. They can now apply that to anyone who dies that's no longer under contract. Dixie Carter runs a privately owned company that's not even worth a fraction of WWE. It's a vanity project run by a money mark - she has no obligation to anyone.
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Feb 11, 2013 02:26
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EugeneJ posted:If WWE didn't go public and have stockholders to answer to, there would be no Wellness Policy, no paid rehab and no Legends Contracts. The first two were in response to government threats, not stockholders, and the last is more of a marketing thing than anything. It's not direct legal threats that Vince is worried about, it's getting investigated for the massively illegal things that all wrestling companies already do but get away with.
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Feb 11, 2013 02:28
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jeffersonlives posted:If you don't blame WWE on Benoit and NOAH on Misawa to a great extent I really don't know what to say. How was Benoit's health WWE's fault? He had been taking chair shots and concussing himself for almost two decades before he joined WWE. If Benoit had retired instead of joining the WWE, he probably would have still been pretty hosed up mentally/dead today.
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Feb 11, 2013 02:49
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Paulocaust posted:How was Benoit's health WWE's fault? He had been taking chair shots and concussing himself for almost two decades before he joined WWE. If Benoit had retired instead of joining the WWE, he probably would have still been pretty hosed up mentally/dead today.
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Feb 11, 2013 02:57
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Paulocaust posted:How was Benoit's health WWE's fault? He had been taking chair shots and concussing himself for almost two decades before he joined WWE. If Benoit had retired instead of joining the WWE, he probably would have still been pretty hosed up mentally/dead today. When a guy is cleared by the company for a TUE on a drug cocktail that is many orders of magnitude past any reasonable level and got the doctor ultimately thrown in jail, that's on the company. When a guy has the cognitive ability of an 80 year old Alzheimer's patient and you're still running him out there for more head trauma, that's on the company too. WWE has gotten a lot more serious about drugs, concussions, and mental health since Benoit. Before Benoit they were utterly unserious about those things, and to blithely handwave away Benoit's problems as coming before WWE is hopelessly naive. That blood is on WWE's hands.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:00
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jeffersonlives posted:When a guy is cleared by the company for a TUE on a drug cocktail that is many orders of magnitude past any reasonable level and got the doctor ultimately thrown in jail, that's on the company. When a guy has the cognitive ability of an 80 year old Alzheimer's patient and you're still running him out there for more head trauma, that's on the company too. The concussion studies were relatively new before Benoit's death. Nowinski's organization dealing with concussions was only formed a couple weeks before Benoit died. It wasn't a known problem until Benoit, football players, etc. started doing crazy things/killing themselves. Can't blame WWE for that.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:11
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Nowinski's organization has been huge towards advancing the research and awareness of concussion problems but it was hardly the first step. Nowinski himself wrote his book the year before Benoit. There was already serious discussions in the NFL about it and its not like rational people thought concussions were harmless before that. And of course WWE went out of its way to discredit Nowinski and reject his findings. So I don't really think it makes sense to give WWE a pass even if you accept the false idea that we were ignorant about concussions until Nowinski. The progressive things WWE does is cover. It doesn't matter than Congress isn't looking at them right now, it matters that WWE is always a moment away from someone actually looking at them long and hard and seeing what they're guilty of. If Randy Orton were to die tomorrow people would quote his history of concussions and questionable Wellness rap sheet. WWE has done its best to set up plausible deniability. TNA doesn't care about all of that because they know it doesn't matter because they're not important. If Kurt Angle dies tomorrow the heat wont come down on TNA, it will fall on WWE. that may not be fair but its the reality of things. WWE is the big fish and the standard bearer for the busines. No one is coming for TNA until after they come for WWE, and realistically TNA is a side business of Panda that I bet they'd just wash their hands of if things ever got hairy. WWE is WWE. None of that makes TNA a good guy. It's just more scummy business. It's cost management. TNA can get away with what they get away with because they're under the radar. WWE aren't more moral, they're just more vulnerable. MassRayPer posted:People say Dixie is hands off, but most reports from the company are that it is a close-knit family. Dixie tries to keep people happy. She tries to put herself on TV and be in the middle of things. Then there's the stories she'd show off her fancy clothes to the Knockouts so she could flaunt just how rich she is. This is not someone who stays isolated from her company. To say she does goes against her own public statements too. My impression has always been that she's ever present and involved with big public stuff like promotions or important signings like Hardy. But that he bulk of the real work is left to people like Prichard, Lagana, Bischoff, or whoever. So I really doubt she really has a serious role in falsely advertising Hardy for the UK, whether that was deliberate or negligence. Or what medical bills are being paid for who. For the most part, in fact, I think this is TNA's biggest problem. There's no one at the top competently managing things so one department in TNA doesn't seem to know what the other is doing and stupid mistakes get made because there's no one to say "the buck stops here". Like I said, Dixie's not innocent even if this interpretation is true. Negligence isn't an excuse and she is the person who could say "the buck stops here". It's just a different kind of guilt than the active abuses someone like Rotten engages in. quote:WWE's wellness is not perfect, but since it was implemented, physiques have changed. Now Ryback is an exception rather than the rule. Guys like Orton have shrunk. People will always stay ahead of the tests, but there are reports they take Wellness very seriously now. quote:Yes, WWE still abuses the independent contractor loophole. Both companies do. It sucks. But, WWE has at least made progress. They at least try. There will never be a pension, but at least now they offer things like Legends deals and try to give older guys pay days. (I don't blame TNA at all for not doing stuff like this.) I'd like to see TNA at least try. Stop having so many wrestlers who need outside jobs to maintain any standard of living, or having to quit the company because they don't get enough dates. Stop paying the Knockouts like poo poo. Start taking the health of their wrestlers seriously. Stop making it so hard for them to take outside dates for the ones who don't get enough dates from TNA. Personally when I evaluate the promotions I prefer to focus on stuff like this instead of unsubstantied stories like Vince waving soiled underwear around or Dixie showing off expensive clothes. That stuff seems petty and rife for silly rumors. Even the serious stuff like Truth and Konnan's lawsuit or JBL sodomizing people in the shower seems tough to really substantiate without more knowledge we're unlikely to get. But the big, clear, systematic problems? I think those are the true problems with the industry. TNA has its share of them but that share is smaller than WWE's because that's the reality of the two companies and their places in the industry. But if TNA was a multi billion dollar global promotion that catered to millions I bet they'd be just as scummy. STAC Goat fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Feb 11, 2013 |
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Feb 11, 2013 03:19
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EugeneJ posted:The concussion studies were relatively new before Benoit's death. Nowinski's organization dealing with concussions was only formed a couple weeks before Benoit died. This is complete bullshit when it comes up for football and it's also complete bullshit when it's brought up for wrestling. CTE has been a known thing to occur in sports for 70 or 80 years. The NFL has been doing work on this stuff since the 1990s, they just don't give a gently caress about the health of their players in the same way that Vince doesn't. The American Academy of Neurology established concussion guidelines for athletes that are more stringent than what both the WWE and NFL currently have in 1997. Bennet Omalu started waving the siren on head trauma in the NFL when he did Mike Webster's autopsy in 2002. I can keep going if you want. Even locally to wrestling, Nowinski was doing concussion work years before Benoit; his book came out in 2006.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:21
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jeffersonlives posted:When a guy is cleared by the company for a TUE on a drug cocktail that is many orders of magnitude past any reasonable level and got the doctor ultimately thrown in jail, that's on the company. When a guy has the cognitive ability of an 80 year old Alzheimer's patient and you're still running him out there for more head trauma, that's on the company too. Every single wrestling promotion in the world would have done that. It's a problem of the business that needs to be addressed. Also, even if they knew he was hosed up and sent him out there, he was already hosed up, and that happened well before he got to WWE, so as much as you can justifiably call for changes in WWE's policy or how the wrestling industry operates, you can't blame Benoit's problems on WWE.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:23
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Paulocaust posted:Every single wrestling promotion in the world would have done that. It's a problem of the business that needs to be addressed. Also, even if they knew he was hosed up and sent him out there, he was already hosed up, and that happened well before he got to WWE, so as much as you can justifiably call for changes in WWE's policy or how the wrestling industry operates, you can't blame Benoit's problems on WWE. Benoit probably wrestled a little under half of his career matches in WWE. If you only want to call them half culpable (or 40 percent or whatever), fine, but let's not pretend that he came into WWE with advanced dementia and WWE didn't contribute anything at all to his demise over the seven and a half years he was there, either.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:27
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jeffersonlives posted:I mean, Misawa and NOAH's a little murkier because they had the records sealed fast and to some extent Misawa was NOAH, but I think it's pretty safe to say that there was no way Misawa should have been in the ring taking headdrops in his condition. Benoit, I think, goes without saying. What condition? I never heard that Misawa's death was anything but a bad botch. Edit: Derp, there's another page answering this.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:27
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jeffersonlives posted:Benoit probably wrestled a little under half of his career matches in WWE. If you only want to call them half culpable (or 40 percent or whatever), fine, but let's not pretend that he came into WWE with advanced dementia and WWE didn't contribute anything at all to his demise over the seven and a half years he was there, either. While the WWE does deserve their share of the blame for the reason you just laid out, it is worth noting that basically nobody in any legit sport took concussions with any real degree of seriousness either at the time.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:30
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jeffersonlives posted:Benoit probably wrestled a little under half of his career matches in WWE. If you only want to call them half culpable (or 40 percent or whatever), fine, but let's not pretend that he came into WWE with advanced dementia and WWE didn't contribute anything at all to his demise over the seven and a half years he was there, either. Benoit wrestled a shitton more than half his matches outside of the WWE, and it isn't the regular matches that were the problem, it was the chair/headshots he took, which he isn't taking on house shows/most RAWs and PPVs. Also, he didn't get the brain of an 80 year old dementia patient the day he commit the murders. His brain had clearly been hosed for quite some time.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:31
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Paulocaust posted:Every single wrestling promotion in the world would have done that. It's a problem of the business that needs to be addressed. Also, even if they knew he was hosed up and sent him out there, he was already hosed up, and that happened well before he got to WWE, so as much as you can justifiably call for changes in WWE's policy or how the wrestling industry operates, you can't blame Benoit's problems on WWE. You can't blame WWE for CAUSING Benoit's problems because they were obviously already in play, but you can absolutely blame WWE for their role in the continued damage. Just because you didn't cause a problem doesn't mean you didn't contribute to it or fail to address it.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:34
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STAC Goat posted:You can't blame WWE for CAUSING Benoit's problems because they were obviously already in play, but you can absolutely blame WWE for their role in the continued damage. Just because you didn't cause a problem doesn't mean you didn't contribute to it or fail to address it. Yeah, but that wasn't what I was saying. I was saying you can't BLAME them and you just agreed with me. Obviously I'd say they contributed if I agree that head/chair shots were the problem and I'm aware he took many in WWE.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:37
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STAC Goat posted:My impression has always been that she's ever present and involved with big public stuff like promotions or important signings like Hardy. But that he bulk of the real work is left to people like Prichard, Lagana, Bischoff, or whoever. So I really doubt she really has a serious role in falsely advertising Hardy for the UK, whether that was deliberate or negligence. Or what medical bills are being paid for who. For the most part, in fact, I think this is TNA's biggest problem. There's no one at the top competently managing things so one department in TNA doesn't seem to know what the other is doing and stupid mistakes get made because there's no one to say "the buck stops here". Like I said, Dixie's not innocent even if this interpretation is true. Negligence isn't an excuse and she is the person who could say "the buck stops here". It's just a different kind of guilt than the active abuses someone like Rotten engages in. I've always had the impression Dixie purposely hires certain people to be the management assholes so she can maintain her false image of being the company mom or whatever delusion she's under. Then whenever TNA does some scummy poo poo she can always say, "well that was this guy's decision, I didn't know anything.  " I'll bet she knows exactly what they're doing and hired them specifically to do it so she wouldn't have to.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:38
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Thauros posted:While the WWE does deserve their share of the blame for the reason you just laid out, it is worth noting that basically nobody in any legit sport took concussions with any real degree of seriousness either at the time. And football and hockey are and rightly should be taking all kinds of poo poo for similar head trauma issues. Paulocaust posted:Benoit wrestled a shitton more than half his matches outside of the WWE I am almost certainly sure this is not the case. cagematch.de has it at about half; they're rather obviously missing some indy matches at the beginning of his career, but I'd be shocked if it was more than a couple hundred given that he was regularly touring with NJPW for most of his early career, and that doesn't change the calculus much. WWE's tour schedule is a lot more regular than anywhere else Benoit worked, ergo he worked a lot more matches per year. He was also there for seven and a half years, and except for the year off for the neck fusion he barely took any time at all off. Paulocaust posted:and it isn't the regular matches that were the problem, it was the chair/headshots he took, which he isn't taking on house shows/most RAWs and PPVs. Did you like never see a "regular" Benoit match or something? He did diving headbutts, threw rolling Germans where he landed on his own head and neck, and took multiple other head bumps in every match. He also loved to take unprotected chairshots, something he did far more in WWE than in WCW and New Japan because of the style.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:43
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Yeah, there's no mystery as to how Benoit took all that head abuse to anyone who ever watched him. His entire style was based on head shots, stiff strikes, and abuse. I doubt there were many "easy matches". Bocc Kob posted:I've always had the impression Dixie purposely hires certain people to be the management assholes so she can maintain her false image of being the company mom or whatever delusion she's under. Then whenever TNA does some scummy poo poo she can always say, "well that was this guy's decision, I didn't know anything. You're free to hold that view and I have nothing to dispute it, but I'm also not sure what its based on. I've always gone by the idea that she hires scummy bastards because she constantly defers to the "wisdom" of scummy veteran professionals.
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Feb 11, 2013 03:52
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I remember some story/urban legend about a wrestler in the 80's masturbating under a glass table while a hooker took a poo poo on it, and a tag team walking in on it and one of them barfing and another staying to watch. I don't remember who the dude jerking off was, but I want to say the tag team was the Killer Bees. Anyone care to help clarify the details of this obviously important story?
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Feb 11, 2013 03:55
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Aesop Poprock posted:I remember some story/urban legend about a wrestler in the 80's masturbating under a glass table while a hooker took a poo poo on it, and a tag team walking in on it and one of them barfing and another staying to watch. I don't remember who the dude jerking off was, but I want to say the tag team was the Killer Bees. Jimmy Valiant, Ricky Morton, and Robert Gibson, in order
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Feb 11, 2013 03:58
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Nice, thanks. Don't know why I interjected the Killer Bees in there.
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Feb 11, 2013 04:10
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Bocc Kob posted:I've always had the impression Dixie purposely hires certain people to be the management assholes so she can maintain her false image of being the company mom or whatever delusion she's under. Then whenever TNA does some scummy poo poo she can always say, "well that was this guy's decision, I didn't know anything. Neither is really worse than the other.
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Feb 11, 2013 04:48
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jeffersonlives posted:Jimmy Valiant, Ricky Morton, and Robert Gibson, in order Just imagine a guy with a lazy eye watching a hooker poo poo while jimmy valiant jerks off.
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Feb 11, 2013 05:05
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LordPants posted:Just imagine a guy with a lazy eye watching a hooker poo poo while jimmy valiant jerks off. Easy now, I just wanted to know the bare basics not pop a chubby myself
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Feb 11, 2013 05:10
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Puseklepp posted:Is the Chris Jericho DVD worth getting? He's one of the wrestlers I'd really like to learn more about. I'll echo the previous praise for Jericho's DVD. It's informative and well done. It's been a while since I watched Jake's, but I remember it being really good.
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Feb 11, 2013 05:21
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