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THS posted:our tools are now apps and memes, not unions and strikes. Boo!
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Feb 7, 2020 07:11
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Impermanent posted:being ready to jettison every possible socialist gain on the altar of fighting climate change is actually counter revolutionary. something got into the water supply and now western leftists think the problem with capitalism is factories. I hope you're talking about people I have never heard of, because otherwise it looks like you've been infected with a serious case of first world chauvinism. I've seen essentially no one advocating for getting rid of universal suffrage, legalized unions, minimum wages, the eight-hour workday, or the right to food, housing, recreation and healthcare to fight climate change. What I see being advocated for is making stuff more expensive through sharp fossil fuel use reduction, which admittedly sucks a lot when implemented by liberals without adequate compensation in minimum wages, entitlements and accessible infrastructure. But when talking about first world people who earn several times the minimum, their consumption privileges have an anti-socialist nature, because their lifestyles are physically impossible to generalize without destroying the world. The consumption they have been able to negotiate for themselves is not a socialist gain, it's a privilege that functions the same way as all other social privileges over lesser social strata do. The pious wish that everyone else could also live like them should not be taken seriously, because it's scientifically impossible except through an imperialist-fascist effort that would require the largest genocide in human history by orders of magnitude.
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Feb 7, 2020 09:19
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https://twitter.com/jacobinmag/status/1225675560426209284?s=20
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Feb 7, 2020 09:47
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Climate change is gonna gently caress us loose and distented regardless, the question that gives depressives like me constant diarrhea is that we have no way of knowing how bad it'll be. Theres a hundred autofeedback cycles just twitching to get into gear and we're gonna get like a couple of years warning time on any of them before they go and we get to the "literally venus" stage. Constantly worrying aboyt the clathrate gun going off is stupid and self-destructive, but it and thermohaline disruption and all that is gonna go off at some point, if we dont achieve the radical change we constantly faff on about im these ere thread
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Feb 7, 2020 12:49
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im doing a factory uprising at the jerk factory
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Feb 7, 2020 12:57
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imo the most worrying thing about bernie's campaign is the assumption it'll bring out non-voters, because that's also been the strategy of a bunch of other social democratic parties over the past decade and it's failed miserably. iowa showed some promise i guess.
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Feb 7, 2020 13:20
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Still pretty funny that he was in power for a single day before the backlash made him resign and act like this was a surprise to himself. "Oh wow those fascists who voted me in are bad people? Whoaaaa boy that's bad I can't let that happen."
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Feb 7, 2020 13:29
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exmarx posted:imo the most worrying thing about bernie's campaign is the assumption it'll bring out non-voters, because that's also been the strategy of a bunch of other social democratic parties over the past decade and it's failed miserably. iowa showed some promise i guess. obama campaigned on nebulous change and hope and w/e and was the first democrat to win Indiana in 40 years, and be one of only like 5 to ever do so, so idk about that StashAugustine posted:Unironic critical support for the Goths Democratically-Elected Visigothic GF
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Feb 7, 2020 14:59
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Easy to forget the economy had just cratered and the Iraq War was a self evident disaster by that point even to most morons, and the republicans nominated a cancerous dullard who explicitly stated that he didn’t understand the economy and whose signature policy position was WAR GOOD
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Feb 7, 2020 15:03
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I should add that I don’t necessarily disagree with you, peanut. just think there were contextual factors that likely played a bigger role than Obama’s campaign strategy on its own
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Feb 7, 2020 15:05
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GalacticAcid posted:Easy to forget the economy had just cratered and the Iraq War was a self evident disaster by that point even to most morons, and the republicans nominated a cancerous dullard who explicitly stated that he didn’t understand the economy and whose signature policy position was WAR GOOD as opposed to 2020 when everything is going just swell
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Feb 7, 2020 15:15
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Cybernetic Vermin posted:as opposed to 2020 when everything is going just swell It's going great for the people who caused 2008.
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Feb 7, 2020 15:28
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Cybernetic Vermin posted:as opposed to 2020 when everything is going just swell is there physically snot running out of your nose at this exact second, by any chance?
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Feb 7, 2020 15:57
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Cybernetic Vermin posted:as opposed to 2020 when everything is going just swell yospos bitch!
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Feb 7, 2020 16:14
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Wow, Governor Northram pivoting towards taking on the financial industry. Didn’t expect this. Not sure why he’s starting in a neighboring state tho 
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Feb 7, 2020 17:26
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Justin Trudeau will solve Canada's national debt the only way he can in minority government.
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Feb 7, 2020 17:31
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uncop posted:I hope you're talking about people I have never heard of, because otherwise it looks like you've been infected with a serious case of first world chauvinism. I've seen essentially no one advocating for getting rid of universal suffrage, legalized unions, minimum wages, the eight-hour workday, or the right to food, housing, recreation and healthcare to fight climate change. I think part of the confusion is that, here in the West, usually when things get worse for us it means we have to work harder (i.e. pick up a second job, do at least 60 hour weeks every week, etc). If I can work less to survive but the downside is that I don't have access to plastic crap and internet-of-things gizmos and can never own a car, I would love that. I don't know about everyone else. If everyone has to accept a 3rd world lifestyle in the "the vast majority of people work 90 hours a week at a sweatshop" way gently caress it I'm turning into a reactionary gently caress that poo poo. Right now rent is the expensive thing and elaborate petrochemical-and-silicon geegaws with planned obsolescence are the cheap thing, and that's the opposite of how it should be.
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Feb 7, 2020 17:32
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Limerick posted:I think part of the confusion is that, here in the West, usually when things get worse for us it means we have to work harder (i.e. pick up a second job, do at least 60 hour weeks every week, etc). If I can work less to survive but the downside is that I don't have access to plastic crap and internet-of-things gizmos and can never own a car, I would love that. I don't know about everyone else. Yeah, definitely. Because of how things are set up, there's a sort of minimum pay-in you have to make to the system before you get anything for yourself, and if you don't, you get absolutely ruined. Rent, travel costs and medical care are the big ones that make you unemployable if you miss any of them for long enough, and everyone instinctively knows the costs aren't for them themselves but for maintenance of their employer's labor force. It's not an accident that something like fuel cost hikes or public transport fare hikes cause people to riot, transportation is the most obviously purely for the employer cost there is. Forcing you to shift spending from yourself to your employer when you already feel you have little for yourself is degrading, it attacks your worth as a person, and that's really what makes people mad rather than simple material poverty. Lots of people are kept in constant fear of someday not making the cut, so the idea of being forced to scrap one's car for an expensive electric or the like is terrifying. Them getting mad over liberal implementations of climate measures is totally understandable and morally right. It's just that ideological confusion about source of the fear and the solutions is a pathway for demagogues to exploit that fear toward the worst possible outcome.
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Feb 7, 2020 18:14
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good time (2017)
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Feb 7, 2020 20:00
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GalacticAcid posted:Easy to forget the economy had just cratered and the Iraq War was a self evident disaster by that point even to most morons, and the republicans nominated a cancerous dullard who explicitly stated that he didn’t understand the economy and whose signature policy position was WAR GOOD i agree but we're talking about hoosiers here, they voted against FDR and JFK
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Feb 7, 2020 20:46
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Limerick posted:If everyone has to accept a 3rd world lifestyle in the "the vast majority of people work 90 hours a week at a sweatshop" way gently caress it I'm turning into a reactionary gently caress that poo poo.
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Feb 7, 2020 21:01
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Four-Twenty posted:if only the people who made your shirt would also realize they can just become reactionaries instead of having to work in a sweatshop Yeah my take was hyperbolic and stupid, sorry. I guess what I'm saying is if the options are "burn the world" or "massive fuel tax with nothing to blunt the pain for the workers, average work-week for Americans without inheritance becomes 90 hours, bourgeois retain total control of society" I'm going to stay home and overdose on opiates on purpose. I really don't like that 2nd option.
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Feb 7, 2020 21:24
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uncop posted:I hope you're talking about people I have never heard of, because otherwise it looks like you've been infected with a serious case of first world chauvinism. I've seen essentially no one advocating for getting rid of universal suffrage, legalized unions, minimum wages, the eight-hour workday, or the right to food, housing, recreation and healthcare to fight climate change. man people have advocated for malthusian faux-socialism in this very thread. every time someone brings this stuff up as a problem your side acts like its the first time you've ever seen this.
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Feb 7, 2020 22:02
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Four-Twenty posted:im doing a factory uprising at the jerk factory why, did they run out of u?
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Feb 8, 2020 01:50
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Four-Twenty posted:im doing a factory uprising at the jerk factory Not too many folks remember the revolt at the laugh factory
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Feb 8, 2020 03:06
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Guyovich wouldn't have condoned this social fascist #BEB bullshit in the lf thread
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Feb 8, 2020 03:55
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Impermanent posted:man people have advocated for malthusian faux-socialism in this very thread. every time someone brings this stuff up as a problem your side acts like its the first time you've ever seen this. Huh, so I assumed you might be what you were railing against. Sorry! I guess I haven't learned to associate malthusianism by itself with opposing socialist gains, because that's implicit rather than explicit to the ideology, so I thought you couldn't be referring to malthusians. It's impossible for me to conceive people who self-identify as leftist and malthusian as anything but confused idealists who don't support the implicit because they genuinely think it's possible to avoid, or alternatively crypto-fascists that are just playing a rhetorical game.
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Feb 8, 2020 05:50
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Terrorist Fistbump posted:yospos bitch!
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Feb 8, 2020 06:51
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uncop posted:Huh, so I assumed you might be what you were railing against. Sorry! I guess I haven't learned to associate malthusianism by itself with opposing socialist gains, because that's implicit rather than explicit to the ideology, so I thought you couldn't be referring to malthusians. It's impossible for me to conceive people who self-identify as leftist and malthusian as anything but confused idealists who don't support the implicit because they genuinely think it's possible to avoid, or alternatively crypto-fascists that are just playing a rhetorical game. the last guy who brought this up positively referenced pol pot so yea it might be a case of people just not great at keeping their mask from slipping
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Feb 8, 2020 06:54
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/pol/ pot
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Feb 8, 2020 08:34
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comedyblissoption posted:/pol/ pot isn't that libertarians
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Feb 8, 2020 12:08
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Kassad posted:isn't that libertarians no thats this thread
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Feb 8, 2020 12:11
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Dreddout posted:Guyovich wouldn't have condoned this social fascist #BEB bullshit in the lf thread
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Feb 8, 2020 12:12
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vermin supreme is gonna poll above 15% and get into the presidential debates this year IMO
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Feb 8, 2020 12:21
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freckle posted:vermin supreme is gonna poll above 15% and get into the presidential debates this year IMO then he's gonna win
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Feb 8, 2020 12:21
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Supreme/Sanders ticket
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Feb 8, 2020 14:54
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Peanut President posted:Supreme/Sanders ticket Supanders
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Feb 8, 2020 17:08
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isn’t vermin supreme a libertarian
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Feb 8, 2020 17:54
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Frog Act posted:isn’t vermin supreme a libertarian Running as a Libertarian is what you do by default if you're a crank.
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Feb 8, 2020 18:43
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Frog Act posted:isn’t vermin supreme a libertarian anarchist
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Feb 8, 2020 18:56
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