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Dawgstar posted:You have to wonder what Tony was thinking. If this had been at the pork store or the Bing, he probably couldn't have let that slide but since he was surrounded by people he didn't especially care about if he looked 'weak' in front of, sure, yeah, food fight. I am pretty sure they were alone in the kitchen? Although as Jerusalem pointed out in his digest of the episode Carmella at some point came along and watched them having a food fight. It's not really clear if she witnessed the argument beforehand? Solice Kirsk posted:Artie is basically Tony's only real friend in the world and I think he holds onto that for the same selfish reasons he holds on to Carmela. He lets Artie get away with tons of poo poo even in public. Even against other made guys. Yeah I feel like this scene is important in telling us about Artie's character. He really is shockingly hotheaded. That's not a bald joke, btw. I am going to watch Pax Soprana and maybe also Down Neck tonight 
crispix fucked around with this message at 20:19 on Mar 24, 2019 |
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Mar 24, 2019 20:15
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Artie crossed a line when he beat up that one guy who was scamming his restaurant but even then Tony had his back before the follow up petty b.s. Artie even technically came out way ahead with that $50k loan he lost in exchange for clearing Tony's tab. Sure it was scummy as hell for Tony but any other situation Artie wouldve basically ruined his life. Plus we got to see the face of someone who suddenly realizes Furio is there to destroy them. pentyne fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Mar 24, 2019 |
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Mar 24, 2019 22:38
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Everybody Hurts is one of my favorites. Luxury Lounge is consistently named as one of the bottom episodes but I actually quite enjoy it. Going through each season's episode list and it's very hard to name the "worst" episodes (though I'm anticipating the write-ups for Boca and A Hit is a Hit, which I do identify as two of the weakest episodes of the series) I may as well be the first of what will be many people to bring up that weird transition in Cold Cuts. If I'm not mistaken, that episode is also the only one where the credits start rolling before the fade to black. It's one of my least favorites in terms of editing but otherwise a solid episode.
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Mar 25, 2019 00:34
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For All Debts Public and Private doesn’t fade to black until the credits are over.
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Mar 25, 2019 00:44
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I’m early in season 3 on my rewatch and that weird rewinding thing when Tony faints after talking to Noah is a pretty dumb editing choice too.
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Mar 25, 2019 02:06
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Mahoning posted:For All Debts Public and Private doesn’t fade to black until the credits are over. Ahh you're right!! "You're telling me you never pondered that? The back thing of Notre Dame?" I love how in that one, Chris says "the guy with the sombrero?!?" and Tony at first admits he can't tell, but then surmises it probably is because it'll enrage Christopher further and make him more likely to follow through- it ends up not mattering, as Chris is lucid enough to realize that regardless of the truth of what Tony is saying, he's fully cognizant of the reason why Tony would tell him that and that makes him accept it unquestioningly, even acknowledging the possibility that it might be bullshit.
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Mar 25, 2019 02:12
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Re-watching it again for the first time in awhile,with girlfriend whose never seen it. She got upset last night when I made her finish the Season5 finale as like 3 in the morning, her favorite character and all. I relate to the show in a different way at this point, specifically Christopher's struggle. Beyond that, my late father's favorite entertainment was always mob-related poo poo (Goodfellas, Godfather, The Sopranos). Growing up on Long Island and him bartending La Parma restaurant I'm sure he ran into his share of people. I always felt he had a real connection to the social aspect/sense of humor. I never really watched the final two seasons as much as I had seen the earlier seasons. The super long dream sequence of Season 5 I feel like almost killed the show itself- that it was so non-Sopranos like and to me very convoluted and 5 scenes too long, along with other storylines being pretty uninteresting and boring as gently caress it was like alright let's end it. Gandolfini probably wanted to call it earlier than later, go out for most part immortal. Specifically Meadow's relationship with Finnius also. I really wish they would have showed Tony B squeezing on Phil and his kid- that would've been a tremendous scene in my opinion even with the show not being up to the standard it was. I mean the first couple seasons, every scene your basically enraptured with. knox fucked around with this message at 02:21 on Mar 25, 2019 |
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Mar 25, 2019 02:17
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Kevyn posted:I’m early in season 3 on my rewatch and that weird rewinding thing when Tony faints after talking to Noah is a pretty dumb editing choice too. Just wait for the slow mo sweep fade moment when Carmela tells the teacher she's going back to Tony. edit: La Parma rules. That, Volare, and Club Lucky are my favorite Italian places to take visiting friends. Solice Kirsk fucked around with this message at 02:27 on Mar 25, 2019 |
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Mar 25, 2019 02:21
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Sorry, the Test Dream is amazing television  Solice Kirsk posted:Just wait for the slow mo sweep fade moment when Carmela tells the teacher she's going back to Tony. COMPAGNIE TOMMY posted:I may as well be the first of what will be many people to bring up that weird transition in Cold Cuts. Open the floodgates! 
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Mar 25, 2019 02:24
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Ha, I read that and for some reason it didn't click that we were talking about the same thing. I thought Cold Cuts was really early in the show.
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Mar 25, 2019 02:29
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COMPAGNIE TOMMY posted:Sorry, the Test Dream is amazing television Sure but the context I am talking about it in is the best television there has ever been- namely the first 2-3 seasons of the show. Solice Kirsk posted:
Gang knox fucked around with this message at 02:41 on Mar 25, 2019 |
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Mar 25, 2019 02:38
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I present to you the best line delivery in the entire run of the Sopranos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhDq-70caV0
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Mar 25, 2019 03:11
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La Scarola was the place I was thinking of in Chicago. I'm just not reading well at all in this thread today.
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Mar 25, 2019 03:26
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There were some dumb sub plots and all but some parts of the show were just golden. I particularly liked how Christopher and Tony's relationship was depicted, and ultimately ended. It really showed a hosed up part of Tony's personality that he could have a quasi-son in Chris as AJ wasn't made for the mob life. To finally murder him for disappointing him by getting into drugs is really sad.
denzelcurrypower fucked around with this message at 06:18 on Mar 25, 2019 |
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Mar 25, 2019 04:38
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Tony really did fit the profile for sociopaths only having occasional empathy for babies and animals. I think it really was the branch through the car seat that sealed Chris's fate.
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Mar 25, 2019 04:42
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Midgetskydiver posted:Tony really did fit the profile for sociopaths only having occasional empathy for babies and animals. I think it really was the branch through the car seat that sealed Chris's fate. That's also why I think it really was the horse that he killed Ralph over. Everything he was saying could have applied to Tracey, but he didn't care about her the same way he cared about the horse.
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Mar 25, 2019 05:02
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Solice Kirsk posted:That's also why I think it really was the horse that he killed Ralph over. Everything he was saying could have applied to Tracey, but he didn't care about her the same way he cared about the horse. I think in the commentary for that scene Chase specifies that it is Tracy Tony is talking about.
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Mar 25, 2019 05:14
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There's a scene where they specifically (and rather clumsily) have Tony literally see Tracey when Meadow is walking towards him. I think they weren't making any bones about what the parallel was meant to be in Tony's mind.
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Mar 25, 2019 06:22
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Season 1, Episode 6 - Pax SopranaTony Soprano posted:Why don't we walk down there and gently caress them all? Tony meets with corrupt cop Vin Makazian to get another update on his On a different day, Tony attends a therapy session where he brings out coffee he brought for both of them, demonstrating that he is aware/remembers that she prefers decaf. A little uncomfortable with his familiarity, she makes pleasantries and asks about the college trip, but he brings up Carmela instead and the fact she is jealous of Melfi. When asked why, he admits she didn't know Melfi was a woman, and with more of his unwelcome familiarity half-jokes that it is Melfi's fault for calling and talking to her. So Melfi twists it around on him, why did he come and see a female doctor in the first place? Tony's answer is simple enough: Dr. Cusamano suggested two Jewish guys and an Italian, so he went with the Italian. Melfi won't let him get away with the jokes though, pushing through his joking familiarity with the actual thing he is paying her for: psychological aid. His mother, his wife, his daughter are all Italian, and maybe be coming clean with her he is coming clean with them? It's a helpful point, but Tony is beyond that today, he's having fun and - probably unconsciously - is being flirty with her as he asks her a pertinent question for a change, one that will be asked many times in the future: why did she choose to take (and keep) him as a patient in spite of being aware of who and what he is? Tellingly, we don't hear what if any answer she provides. Like Tony, Junior Soprano is also having a good time in an inappropriate manner. Mikey Palmice breaks up a local poker game run by a guy called Sammy Grigio, beating up Sammy in spite of his namedropping capo Jimmy Altieri, since Sammy doesn't actually pay any cash to Jimmy and therefore the game is open for the taking. Having put the word around that things are different with Junior in charge, he rejoins Junior who is being fitted for a suit for the celebratory dinner to mark his ascent to the top. He asks after his tailor's family, and the old man reveals that his grandson Dominic (his namesake) is dead, committing suicide at only 14-years-old after getting hooked on drugs. Junior is horrified, while Mikey demonstrates that same toxic fascination with death Jackie Aprile complained about, as he excitedly realizes this is the suicide at Patterson Falls he read about recently in the papers. When the tailor seethes that the animal who sold the drugs is still walking the streets, Junior sees an opportunity to use his power for what he thinks of as good.   Junior continues his rounds, meeting next with Livia at Green Grove. She looks at him with a kind of bemused pride that obviously enormously strokes his ego. In his benevolence he tells her he is going to gift the place a proper coffee machine so he can drink when he visits her. Livia herself seems to have settled in despite her resistance, greeted and greeting an old man on a walker who comes shuffling by. When he mistakes Junior for a new resident, Junior snaps at him to keep moving and grabs his own coat, clearly not wanting to stay too long and get mistaken by the staff as another resident. Livia offers him her blessing but then, because she can never resist herself, quietly notes that she hopes he doesn't get taken advantage of like her dear, departed Johnny was. Junior scoffs at the idea, nobody ever got over on his brother Johnny and nobody will get over on him either. Perhaps his ego isn't entirely unjustified, because when Livia does try to do so by "innocently" bringing up Hesh, he immediately grasps that she is trying to get him to tax Hesh in order to get back at Tony as revenge for putting her in this retirement community. It's almost flirtatious itself as he gently, mockingly accuses her and she smirks back she has no idea what he is talking about. The important thing is though, she's planted the idea in his head. After all, Hesh was always Johnny's friend and Tony's mentor, he and Junior were associates at best. An excited Irina leaps onto Tony in bed to have sex, but to both their confusion he isn't getting an erection. Tony attempts to make small-talk about her job which confuses her even further, since when has he ever given a poo poo about that? When she goes back to attempting to arouse him, his frustration at his own inability manifests as rage and accusations, as he rolls out of bed complaining that she treats him like a dildo. The idea of this fat, middle-aged father being used as a sex toy by the sexy young Russian is hilarious and deeply pathetic, and she reacts with a fury by pitching a lit candle at his face and then going for a lamp to beat him with. He restrains her, calling her a "communist oval office" so she smacks him with her tiny little fists and then rushes into the bathroom as he sits - almost looking like an angry toddler, grumpily snapping that she burned him. All because he couldn't get his dick hard. Christopher doesn't have women issues, he's the young Turk as he slips into the back of Satriale's with a smile for everyone, including some flirty jostling with a female worker named Andrea. He heads into the back room where Tony and the other mobsters, including Georgie the hapless bartender/bouncer as The Bada Bing are playing Hearts. Georgie is far from the hapless idiot here, in his element. Chris lets Tony know that Hesh is outside, which is strange, why doesn't he come in? Chris explains that he really wants to talk to him OUTSIDE, which can't be good news. The fact that Hesh wants to walk and talk when he meets him outside worries him even more. The news IS bad. Junior has informed Hesh that he owes backtaxes, he has to pay him 500k as well as 2 points monthly on his loansharking. Tony is horrified, Hesh worked alongside his father Johnny Soprano, and was never taxed because Hesh's loansharking resulted in plenty of opportunities/cash for the Family (consider that Tony getting involved in the lucrative HMO scheme in The Pilot came out of the deadbeat owing Hesh 250k from loans to finance gambling debts owed to the DiMeo Family). He's surprised when Hesh tells him it's a reasonable enough request, but what he balks at is the figure. When Tony expresses surprise, Hesh lays out an important fact Tony may have forgotten when he engineered putting Junior in place as a figurehead. Junior is the Boss, and what the Boss says goes, even if shits all over what went before. What Hesh can do, however, is just what Livia did to Junior, plant ideas in his head. He says the figures Junior is asking for means it might make more sense for him to retire from loansharking and sit on the royalties from the 6 gold records he wrote (or rather, stole from some black kids signed to a record label he owned). Like Junior with Livia, Tony sees right through Hesh's manipulation but does what he wanted anyway, saying he'll need some time to consider his approach but wants Hesh to sit tight until he makes his move.   That night at the Soprano house, Tony dreams (to the tune of What Time Is It) of getting an incredible blowjob from... Dr. Melfi! Startled awake when Melfi speaks to him with Irina's accent, he twists around to see Carmela in bed with him, asking if he is all right. Weirdly enough, he doesn't explain that he just dreamed that his therapist with the voice of his mistress gave him oral sex. Time passes and Tony takes his troubles to New York, literally and figuratively. As a bored and upset Carmela waits at their table at a restaurant, he chats at the bar with John Sacrimoni, who makes his first appearance. The Underboss of the Lupertazzi Crime Family, Johnny Sack is the number 2 guy in one of the most powerful organized crime organizations in the country, beneath only Carmine Lupertazzi. The meeting is essentially Tony asking Johnny Sack for a favor, one Johnny is keen to give as Tony's presence has only confirmed valuable information he has suspected: Junior is a figurehead and Tony really is the one running the DiMeo Crime Family from behind the scenes. Tony wants Johnny to step in as an outside figure, one that Junior respects, and act like Hesh came to him looking for assistance. Johnny will suggest some amicable compromise, one where Junior doesn't feel disrespected but Hesh isn't taken advantage of. He heads back to a clearly fuming Carmela, where we discover thanks to a nice gesture from Johnny in the form of singing waiters that this is Tony and Carmela's 18th Anniversary, and she's less than pleased to be sharing it with Johnny loving Sack.   Coming near to tears, she reveals that this night (her anniversary!) was special to her, and she'd gotten all excited thinking they might book a room at the Plaza like last year and spend it together, just the two of them. Instead Tony was over at the bar talking business while she was left alone eating veal. Tony is initially pissed at her, the unspoken implication that he's made the token gestures and spent the money and that alone should be enough to gloss over any other issues. But to his credit, when he grasps just how upset he is, he offers what appears to be a heartfelt and genuine apology. The trouble with Tony, as Carmela probably well knows by now, is that it is difficult to tell if Tony is ever actually being genuine, and even if he is whether it actually means anything. They return home where Tony's attempts to be genuine falling flat finally prove too much for him and he begins ranting at her, what else can he do? Carmela admits that she resents him, or rather the fact that he has changed, and admits she worries that she disgusts him ("you skeeve me" is her exact phrase). When he objects that he could never skeeve the mother of his children, she points out that this is her point: he looks at her as the mother of his children, just somebody he chose to procreate with rather than a woman in her own right. Tony grasps that this is about sex, or rather the fact that they aren't having any, and reminds her this is a side-effect of the Prozac. When she notes that another woman she knows who has been on it for years would hump anything that moved or didn't, he tells her that Dr. Melfi explained it affects different people differently. That's the last straw for Carmela, who as we learned last episode is intensely jealous of Melfi in a way she isn't of his extra-marital flings, who storms out of the car. He'll have no luck on that front anyway, as his next therapy session sees him informed by Melfi as he pulls out the coffee again that she can't accept gifts from him, it's unprofessional. "It's just coffee!" he protests, but she insists. In a forced bit of writing that makes her look incredibly unprofessional in spite of what was just said, she takes a phonecall from her mechanic who warns she needs to replace the entire starter on her car. She tells him she'll get a second opinion, hanging up again. This will payoff later in the episode, but it is an extremely clumsy addition to the show and could have been handled in a far more elegant fashion. Tony tries to casually reveal he's gonna stop taking the Prozac, trying to pretend things are going so well he doesn't need it anymore. She quickly gets to the root cause, which is that his libido has diminished. When she suggests it may not be medication, his guard is immediately up, so he offers a possible physical cause and asks if he has had his prostate checked. His joke causes her to laugh, and again he's probably unconsciously flirting with her as he laughs along, enjoying the intellectual stimulation he feels he isn't getting elsewhere. She explains that depression can be a cause of impotence, and establishes that he is still capable of erections, so whatever the problem is, it isn't physical. Carmela is getting her own therapy, as Tony arrives home to discover a Roche Bobois truck filled with furniture in the driveway as she redecorates, having gone on a spending spree. They have an argument, with Tony complaining about her spending and her taking the chance to passively-aggressively snipe by insisting she'll send it all back while he snaps back that he never said that. It's attention-seeking behavior, she is looking for a fight while a confrontation is the last thing on his mind. Things go smoother at work, as he joins Junior, Hesh and Johnny Sack for a sitdown outside Satriale's, with Pussy and Mikey flanking either side of the table as they chat. They all get to put on an act for Junior's benefit, as Tony sides with Junior to complain about New York coming down to stick their nose in, and at Hesh for going to them instead of him. Johnny massages Junior's ego while laying out that he's only come in because Hesh is also a friend of the Lupertazzi's and they just want to ensure he isn't getting hosed. Hesh is quick to chime in that he never said hosed, he agrees with Junior's demand he just wants to negotiate the figure. They all make a point of making their little arguments and then all turning to look to Junior, as if waiting with baited breath for his guidance to solve their problems. Junior enjoys the attention, and magnanimously proclaims that he will drop the back tax to 300k and only ask for 1.5 on the loansharking. Hesh, unable to help himself, leaps immediately in with a counter of 250k and instantly regrets it. Junior ponders for a second, then agrees, cracking a joke that everybody dutifully laughs at. The lesson that Tony learned from Dr. Melfi continues to pay off, as Junior has just halved his demand and dropped the ongoing by a quarter, while simultaneously feeling like a big shot who everybody respects. Everybody is happy.   At home that evening, Tony is using the bathroom and when he notices a nude woman in his shower which you would assume was Carmela, but when the door opens and she steps out, it is Dr. Melfi, who greets him like he is there for a therapy session. He starts awake and immediately checks to make sure Carmela next to him is actually Carmela. She wakes too, and with a mixture of surprise and hope asks if he wants sex. "No," he replies, telling her to go back to sleep, deepening her own fears that she no longer arouses him. With Irina now, he makes a painful attempt to address his obvious fascination/obsession with Melfi by suggesting that she start dressing up in business suits as he'd find that sexy. Irina is baffled, he wants her to dress like a man? He tries to explain he means like a professional which she mistakes for him wanting her to dress like a whore, and she gets emotional like Carmela in the restaurant and retreats to the bathroom again leaving him still completely at a loss for what to do. In therapy, he shows off the burn he got from Irina to Melfi and tells her a version of the above with Carmela in place of Melfi. He fails to explain adequately to her as well what he meant by "dress up", she assumes he meant sexy lingerie and he struggles again to articulate what he is trying to say, not helped by the fact that he keeps lying about the people and events in question. Melfi encourages him to continue though, liking that he is trying to work through his thoughts and feelings, unaware (perhaps?) of where this is inevitably leading. Tony is left lost and perplexed... but then calms and smiles as he finally figures gently caress it and comes out with exactly what has been on his mind the last few days: her. She's sexy but plays it down, she's gentle, not loud, sweet-sounding. She lets him express himself, wanting him to get it out, but watch her face as he takes things too far, the way it falls as he stands up and she realizes that this is more than just a comparison or a compliment. He approaches, his large frame dwarfing her as he leans down and she is trapped in the chair, moving forward to kiss her so she has to violently pull away, all while trying to maintain her professional demeanor and a non-judgemental but clearly disapproving smile. He gets the message and pulls back, and she immediately stands to get out of the trapped position. She tells him their time is up but they need to discuss what just happened, and offers him a slot later this afternoon to return. He turns her down, agreeing to return on Tuesday for their regular session, and slowly walks away as she stands watching, maintaining her composure in spite of his intimidating physical size and the fact he's clearly not happy about this rejection. Once he is gone she takes a moment, but it must be terrifying position for her to be in. Things aren't improved when she returns to the sanctuary of her home, doing some reading under a lamp when she hears several curses from outside and the sound of a car. She looks out and sees a car driving away from where it was parked directly outside of her house. Given what happened to her date recently and his own paranoia she can't help but wonder. This only worsens when she takes her car to the mechanic the next day for her second opinion, bewildered by the fact her car is now starting first time, every time. He explains that she doesn't need a new starter because she HAS a new starter, it has everything but the price tag hanging from it. Mikey Palmice and "Joey Eggs" Marino haul Rusty Irish, the dealer who sold drugs the tailor's grandson, to Patterson Bridge (where the deadbeat gambler was threatened in The Pilot) where Mikey takes great pleasure in tormenting Rusty before they unceremoniously and openly pitch him over the side (the obvious dummy is kind of endearing). Three witnesses hanging out on the bridge saw this brazen act of murder but Mikey is unconcerned, confidently approaching them and asking one what he saw as he dangles cash in front of him. The guy gets the message, agreeing that the man showed up alone saying he didn't want to live anymore and jumped. Mikey hands over the cash and leaves with Joey Eggs, whose only concern is whether Mikey paid the witness too much or not.   At Satriale's, the other capos visit Tony with down faces. Larry Boy Barese is not happy because Rusty Irish is dead, even though he was a "junkie gently caress" he was also his biggest earner and now he's hurting financially because of Junior's executive decision. Even worse, nobody came to him before going after Rusty, the first he heard was after the deed was done. Tony doesn't take kindly to them trying to play off Junior's ascent as Tony's idea only though. He reminds them they all discussed and agreed, with the mindset that should lightning strike it would be an older man without a family who took the fall. They can't deny that, but they point out their agreement was on the basis that they'd continue on as they had with Junior Boss in name only, but instead they're getting raped by him. They didn't mind having to pay out extra or have liberties taken when Jackie was in charge because it all evened out in the end. But Junior "dines alone" ("he doesn't even pass the salt!"), everything goes to him at their expense. Jimmy Altieri complains about Sammy Grigio's card game but Tony does come to Junior (and surprisingly, Mikey's) defense there, pointing out that Sammy wasn't paying any tax on it and had been sliding under the radar for far too long. Raymond Curto comes to Jimmy's defense there though, regardless of Sammy getting away with anything, the moment he said he was with Jimmy Altieri, that should have been the end of it. Jimmy and Larry have both been disrespected here. But though they admit it was a joint decision and they all have to stick with it now that it has been made, they want Junior to understand it can't be all take, take, take without giving anything back. If anybody can get that message across to him, it's Tony. Tony visits Livia at Green Grove, where she pretends not to recognize his voice before letting him in. She explains she has been avoiding the annoying Activities Director, but just like with Junior earlier it is clear she has been making friends or at least getting to know people within the community. She introduces Tony to a passing lady - Milly - who asks if she is coming to Bingo, stage-whispering to Tony that Milly is a degenerate gambler. Insider her suite, Tony is thrilled at how much it looks like her old place, only missing her broken reading lamp which he has downstairs at his house (we haven't seen the last of that lamp!). She's cuts him off though to point out the sound of water coming from the next door suite, complaining her neighbor is ALWAYS using the water. That if anything should be a sign of how Livia has settled in, the equivalent to her grumpily spying on the mailwoman at her old house, suspicious that this (black) woman was clearly up to something. Tony cheers her up by showing her the biscotti he bought from Ferrara's. She lights right up, and in a sign that she is getting over this latest miff with Tony, she only makes a token gesture of contempt by making him confirm they're the almond kind before deigning to allow him to leave them on the table. They settle down to talk, and Tony asks whether Junior has visited. Livia, whether because she just wants to stir up some dust, or because Junior has accidentally slighted her in some way, or because she just likes talking poo poo about people, dismisses his accomplishments and hardwork, saying better men than him had to work hard too. Tony speaks up in defense of Junior, but then casually mentions that he would hate to see Junior mess up what he worked so long for by forgetting about the friends who got him there. Livia is intrigued but suspicious, she can clearly see through Tony's rather plain manipulation in a way that Junior couldn't. What's really interesting is that when Tony spells it out a little clearer about the nature of the business he and Junior are in, she immediately quiets right down and simply mutters,"I don't know that world." That's half-truth, half-bullshit. She knows exactly how far she can push before going too far, just how involved she can be before too much is too much. Quite rightly, she also makes the point that if Tony has something he wants to say to Junior, he can say it himself. Falling quickly back into her old,"I wish the Lord would take me!" routine, Tony tries to cheer her up with a dance and a suggestion she consider dating one of the "older gents", and she pulls away insisting she has to go downstairs before the Activities Lady (her new nemesis) finds her, and demands he bring the biscotti with him if he wants to come have a coffee.   Carmela meets with Father Intintola at the Church to discuss the problems in her marriage. Father Phil stresses that while Church isn't a cure-all, convincing Tony to volunteer might strengthen or speed along the progress he has made in therapy. Carmela wants to talk about herself though (and to be fair, probably knows Tony would poo poo all over the idea), her own therapy coming in getting to vent to a safe person. She blames herself for the self-inflicted wound, she was so eager for Tony to better himself, but now he has a female therapist and she can't compete with her or judge her or look down on her in the same way she did the goomars she always felt superior to. She always considered them more a form of masturbation for Tony, since she couldn't satisfy his needs so it took some of the weight off of her. Father Phil lets her unload, only blinking uneasily when she points out that HE understands that thirst that men feel, something she now knows only too well after last episode. But when she starts to talk about ending the marriage he immediately steps in, that's a line he can't allow her to pursue as a Catholic. Infidelity (by a man) is okay. His mobster lifestyle is forgivable. But her ending a marriage? Unthinkable. He turns her own words against her, didn't she invite this by not performing her wifely "duty"? Didn't she basically tell Tony it was okay by looking the other way or welcoming them as a way to ease her burden? That plays to Carmela's Catholic guilt, as she accepts his admonition that she is not without sin in this (true, but a dick thing to say) and the only balm he can offer is that she pray to their Holy Lady for guidance. Tony is venting to Melfi in much the same way, a husband and wife unloading their concerns, fears, grievances etc with each other on two completely unrelated people. Carmela's spending is out of control and he doesn't understand it. Melfi gets to the heart of the matter in a way that Father Phil, well meaning as he might be, did not. She got his attention, maybe that was what she wanted all along? With time nearly up, Melfi forces Tony to face up to something he'd clearly rather forget, the pass he made at her in their last session. I've seen at least one person online insist that Melfi was trying to spark Tony's romantic interest here, that she in some way welcomed it or wanted it. Television is subjective but I'd like to say that is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard, because she would be remiss as a professional not to bring up this blatant overstepping of their relationship and push him to understand not only why it was wrong, but what the underlying factors behind it were. Unfortunately for Melfi, Tony's complete lack of boundaries and misunderstanding of what is happening between them take on a decidedly sinister undertone when he smirks and asks her how her car is. Horrified, she demands to know if he stole her car and had somebody put in a new starter and is even more horrified when he not only admits it, but demonstrates zero remorse or any sense of how hosed up doing that was. He declares he is in love with her, overriding her when she tries to answer, saying with the same sincerity he apologized to Carmela with that he is in love with her and it has nothing to do with the Prozac or anything else, it's just pure love. So in return she, as gently as possible, hits him with some hard home truths. This isn't love, it's misplaced feelings based on the progress made in therapy. Tony, confused by her not following the script in his head, sits bewildered as she reminds him that this is a job for her. She is gentle, she listens, she encourages him to express himself. That's how she does her job, and he's projected on her everything he feels is missing from his wife... and from his mother. That last one is what truly gets to him (Gandolfini is superb here). For Tony (and Carmela), love between a man and a woman is intrinsically tied up with sex. So how could he possibly be in love with her if she reminds him of her mother? No no, it's as simple as he's a man and she's a woman and it's as simple as that. So the message he takes from this? She doesn't love him, and if she doesn't want him back next week then fine. It's quite the opposite though, they've made progress and it is important to continue. She can't help asking if he's had her followed though, but when it is clear he won't answer she waves it off and reminds him again, she expects to see him back next week.   Tony's admonition that things should be simple don't apply to himself, however. He attends a Little League game with Uncle Junior, where Junior insists he always thought Tony could go pro (actually Tony has always resented that Junior said he didn't have the makings of a Varsity Athlete). He attempts a longwinded parable about how Augustus created the Pax Romana by always keeping those beneath him happy and feeling welcome/appreciated. Junior doesn't have a loving clue what he's talking about, so finally Tony reminds him of a dirty joke Junior told him as a kid - two bulls on a hill see a herd of cows below, and the son says to the father,"Let's run down there and gently caress one of those cows", to which the father replies,"Why don't we walk down there and gently caress them all." Junior laughs, delighted that he told a joke like that to a younger Tony, and asks why he couldn't just come out and say this in the first place. Tony doesn't know himself, but seems genuinely appreciative when Junior actually makes a point of asking him how he is and demonstrates he's actually noticed how down he has been recently. Tony visits Hesh later with the good news, Junior actually got Hesh's 250k and split it among the capos so everybody got a piece of the back tax. Hesh appreciates the smartness of the move, and likens Junior to Harry Truman, a President who had the misfortune of replacing the beloved FDR but ended up doing a pretty good job. The two stop to appreciate Hesh's horses, though Hesh admits he hates the smell even if he thinks they're beautiful animals. Tony complains that he wouldn't even want to be the Boss anyway, who can deal with the stress? He envies the horses who have no problems, no guilt, they just go and gently caress who they want to gently caress etc. Realizing he's gone a little overboard, he laughs that he doesn't know what he's talking about. Hesh wouldn't have noticed anyway, the overriding thought on his mind is that Junior gave 50k to everybody, which includes Tony. Tony lets it hang for a bit before laughing and handing over his share, saying the thought of keeping it never entered his mind. Unlike Junior, he doesn't need prompting to know the difference between short term and long term gain... at least when it comes to his business. At home, Tony sits by his duckless pool and is joined by Carmela. They sit a moment in silence and then he assures her again with what seems like pure sincerity that there is nothing between him and Melfi (not for his lack of trying!). She cuts him off though, telling him she has things she wants to say. She wants him to stick with his therapy, and she admits that he was jealous of Melfi only because she was providing what Carmela could not: salvation for him, somebody to listen and offer help. She wants to be that person, to be in his life. Again, appearing (and probably feeling) utterly sincere he tells her she isn't just in his life, she is his whole life. The look on her face indicates that she doesn't buy this, but she also doesn't question it, because she believes this is her duty, to provide him with a support structure to help improve him as a person. At the start of the episode, Melfi mentioned Tony's wife, mother and daughter as three Italian women in his life, and herself as a kind of proxy through which he could admit things he otherwise never would. I think it's really important that Meadow isn't in this episode at all in spite of this direct reference. Because Tony throughout this episode demonstrates the often lamented issue of the Madonna/Whore complex. Men who see their mothers as untouchable, beatific figures but every other woman as a potential sexual conquest. Men who marry women they are sexually attracted to, before childbirth shifts their perspective and the wives become mothers (as Carmela complained on their anniversary). As Melfi told Tony at least twice this episode, she represents everything about these women he finds lacking: the encouraging mother who listens and acknowledges him; the supportive wife who helps him through hard times. Tony is impotent because these other women (including Irina) don't offer him what Melfi does, because when he looks at Carmela he sees the mother of his children instead of his wife. Melfi is who arouses him because Melfi is the ur-woman to him, the magical package that gives him everything he wants. Which is why his reaction is so strong when she mentions his mother, because his thoughts are so wrapped up in sex. Which is why it's also important Meadow isn't there, because that degree of weirdness I don't think Tony as a character could have tolerated. His reaction would have been violent, either towards or around Melfi, and I don't think he'd have been able to return to therapy the next week. That said, the show will still go interesting places with Meadow as an idealized female figure to Tony in season 3 with Tracee.  But as the episode ends at basically the halfway point of the season, a new wrinkle gets thrown into the mix. The show has covered the contrast and competing pull of Tony's family and Family lives, his marriage and his infidelities, his mother and his wife, his biological children and Christopher, the push and pull between old and new etc. But through it all there has been a lingering threat, often referenced but till now never explicitly seen outside of a single shot at Jackie Aprile's funeral. Something inevitable, not just within the framework of a mob drama but in real life too. Junior Soprano is toasted by Tony at a dinner filled with major mob figures both from New Jersey and New York. As they laugh and talk and make merry, they drink wine poured by smooth-faced waiters who do their jobs without breaking stride or changing expression. One in particular does a remarkable job, because the entire time he is serving drinks, a pinhole camera beneath his name badge snaps photo after photo after photo. As an instrumental version of Xzibit's Paparazzi (based on Pavane) plays, an FBI office is filled with motion as agents zip about assembling data, creating charts, laying down the intense groundwork of a major investigation into the DiMeo Crime Family. Everybody is there, from Pussy and Mikey as soldiers up to the capos and above them the Boss... Jackie Aprile. One agent steps up and takes Jackie down from the chart, to replace him with the new Boss. Tony Soprano is right there, his picture in black and white... next to Raymond, Larry and Jimmy. All four are nestled safely one level down from who the FBI firmly believe is the new Boss: Junior Soprano, sitting at the top like he always wanted.  Just like a lightning rod. Season 1: The Pilot | 46 Long | Denial, Anger, Acceptance | Meadowlands | College | Pax Soprana | Down Neck | The Legend of Tennessee Moltisanti | Boca | A Hit Is a Hit | Nobody Knows Anything | Isabella | I Dream of Jeannie Cusamano Season 1 | Season 2 | Season 3 | Season 4 | Season 5 | Season 6.1 | Season 6.2 Jerusalem fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Apr 23, 2020 |
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Mar 25, 2019 11:09
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I always thought the ending of this episode was amazing. Paparazzi really sells it.
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Mar 25, 2019 13:17
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Agree, this is one of the best endings in the whole series. And like a lot of episodes of the Sopranos, it really comes down to a great musical choice. As a Cake fan, I've always been partial to the ending of The Legend of Tennessee Moltisanti though.
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Mar 25, 2019 14:13
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I think what I love most about it is that it bears no relation to the events of the episode, but when it happens it still feels like the culmination of a lot of stuff that has been happening. The FBI has been basically around since the first episode, but only as references to a kind of nebulous thing that exists as a passive potential threat. To actually pull away from the show's central characters to see that this is very much an active thing happening RIGHT NOW has a surprising level of impact, and ties in nicely using that chart to demonstrate that at least one of Tony's strategies is paying off. It's interesting that Johnny Sack already suspected Tony was running things behind the scenes but the FBI, for all their surveillance, seem unaware.
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Mar 25, 2019 23:01
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Jerusalem posted:I think what I love most about it is that it bears no relation to the events of the episode, but when it happens it still feels like the culmination of a lot of stuff that has been happening. The FBI has been basically around since the first episode, but only as references to a kind of nebulous thing that exists as a passive potential threat. To actually pull away from the show's central characters to see that this is very much an active thing happening RIGHT NOW has a surprising level of impact, and ties in nicely using that chart to demonstrate that at least one of Tony's strategies is paying off. It's interesting that Johnny Sack already suspected Tony was running things behind the scenes but the FBI, for all their surveillance, seem unaware. It was revealed mid-series, I think, that Ray Curto was talking to the feds and that never really gets covered much aside from "this thing is happening" and this episode makes me wonder when they flipped him.
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Mar 25, 2019 23:53
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I've since purchased multiple formats but my first viewing of the show was of a European rebroadcast that had much of the incidental licensed music replaced by royalty-free stock music. Subsequent viewings with the real soundtrack are very rewarding by contrast. Side note: the credits say no, but at first I thought Sammy Grigio was played by the dealer in Casino: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T84RXHhL7sc&t=9s
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Mar 26, 2019 00:45
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Dawgstar posted:It was revealed mid-series, I think, that Ray Curto was talking to the feds and that never really gets covered much aside from "this thing is happening" and this episode makes me wonder when they flipped him. I always wondered how early they flipped him. If it was pre-Jackie's death, it throws his statement about not wanting to take on extra work because of his son into a new context, as he was probably in a Pussy like situation where they were allowing him to "earn" but not commit any new crimes. I wonder if he had to hand over his 50k share from Hesh's backtax?
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Mar 26, 2019 01:09
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I don't really follow how the money flows, especially in regards to "Junior dines alone". If Chris robs a bank and gets 100k, does he give 75k to Paulie? And Paulie gives 50k to Tony? I feel like i never see Tony actually give Junior money at any point, not that it needs to be shown. But Junior gives all the captains Hesh's money. Is money flowing downhill regularly?
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Mar 26, 2019 04:31
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Everybody has to kick up to the guy above them, with differing guys deciding how much they feel is appropriate for a "taste". Obviously everybody ends up wanting to take more from those beneath them to offset what they're paying to the guys above them, which is why people like Christopher and Brendan feel so hosed because they're busting their asses and getting almost nothing for it. The lower on the totem pole you are, the less you keep, and even as you start moving up you get into situations like Christopher did where he's having to pay for everybody's meal/drinks etc. Or Ralphie happily giving Tony a taste of his racing winnings, then realizing that now Tony expects this to be an ongoing thing AND that he expects more than he was happy to give. If you haven't seen Donnie Brasco, it actually covers this in a really interesting way with all the little minor scams and bullshit they're all pulling because one of their crew gets to step up a rank and suddenly has to scramble to find more money than ever to live up to his new responsibilities. In The Sopranos itself, there's the episode where Paulie realizes that his position in the crew is threatened by Ralphie being such a good earner, and goes to some pretty ridiculous (and horrifying) lengths to keep up.
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Mar 26, 2019 04:56
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Borrowed Ladder posted:I don't really follow how the money flows, especially in regards to "Junior dines alone". If Chris robs a bank and gets 100k, does he give 75k to Paulie? And Paulie gives 50k to Tony? I feel like i never see Tony actually give Junior money at any point, not that it needs to be shown. But Junior gives all the captains Hesh's money. Is money flowing downhill regularly? In a situation where Junior is forcing Hesh, from Livia's idea to tax him as a boss maneuver, he gives his captain's a cut for various reasons. Money is going to flow downhill if people find out about poo poo retroactively, or if some type of beef is started over fairness/whatever. Money is always going to flow upward, and there's always going to be a desire to keep whatever the amount of money being made from a scheme quiet so that they can keep as much of it as possible. Like when the captains are bitching to Tony about the "specifics of the money situation" with Junior when Tony tells them he is the real boss, and he says "he doesn't know what we kick up to Jackie." I remember the scene with Christopher and Bevilacqua + other dude cracking safes, Chris tells them his cut is coming out of their share "because that's how poo poo goes." Then when Furio comes by to collect for Tony, he demands another $1k for himself- to me it's whatever you can get away with, while keeping poo poo as secretive as possible. The money is always gonna flow up, from the street drug dealers kicking up to Chris who kicks up to Tony who kicks up to boss who also pay New York.
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Mar 26, 2019 16:30
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knox posted:The money is always gonna flow up, from the street drug dealers kicking up to Chris who kicks up to Tony who kicks up to boss who also pay New York. Does Tony actually kick up to anybody in New York? I was under impression they just split stuff like the Esplanade project instead.
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Mar 26, 2019 17:11
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crispix posted:I always remember Melfi reading out Tony's apology letter to her psychiatrist, Elliott. I am reminded of it to this day every time I read something written by a dumb person trying to come across proper. And Tony was actually smarter then most of the mobsters in the show...he had some intellectual curiosity, watched history shows, corrected lot of the other guys on their mistakes, had a "semester-and-a-half at Seton Hall" etc. Dawgstar posted:Does Tony actually kick up to anybody in New York? I was under impression they just split stuff like the Esplanade project instead. Yeah, I thought Jersey was more of an independent junior partner to (forget the name) one of the Five Families. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Mar 26, 2019 |
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Mar 26, 2019 17:37
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Dawgstar posted:Does Tony actually kick up to anybody in New York? I was under impression they just split stuff like the Esplanade project instead. Just in general I've never been exactly clear on what the New York/Jersey relationship entails. Obviously everyone understands that NY is more powerful, and so they defer to people like Johnny Sack, but is someone like Sack considered to be a New Jersey capo's direct superior? Or is it more just a traditional thing where NY is respected and feared but there's no "official" hierarchy that says Jersey has to do what they say?
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Mar 26, 2019 17:38
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Basebf555 posted:Just in general I've never been exactly clear on what the New York/Jersey relationship entails. Obviously everyone understands that NY is more powerful, and so they defer to people like Johnny Sack, but is someone like Sack considered to be a New Jersey capo's direct superior? Or is it more just a traditional thing where NY is respected and feared but there's no "official" hierarchy that says Jersey has to do what they say? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeCavalcante_crime_family Apparently what DiMeo crime family was partly based on.
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Mar 26, 2019 17:40
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It was an independent Family with a Boss, something that even got mentioned as pissing off Carmine Sr. when he called them a glorified crew but still had to treat them like a separate Family.
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Mar 26, 2019 18:20
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Something that I didn't quite pick up on so much when I watched this when I was younger is just how grossly socially inept so many characters in the mob are. It's seen most clearly so far when Mikey is talking about the tailor's grandson's death in graphic detail while the man is standing right in front of him. I guess it reinforces that these people are complete sociopaths with no capacity for empathy. I have to say that it has really surprised me how much of this kind of thing was missed on me when I first watched this. I suppose I was younger and more interested in the superficial aspects of the story. At times though it has almost felt like I am watching a different show. There are still things that I miss, and thanks excellent poster Jerusalem for the episode digests - they really add a lot to this rewatch.
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Mar 26, 2019 20:13
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DarkCrawler posted:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeCavalcante_crime_family I guess that John D'Amato cat is where we get Vito's last story arc.
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Mar 26, 2019 20:20
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Basebf555 posted:Just in general I've never been exactly clear on what the New York/Jersey relationship entails. Obviously everyone understands that NY is more powerful, and so they defer to people like Johnny Sack, but is someone like Sack considered to be a New Jersey capo's direct superior? Or is it more just a traditional thing where NY is respected and feared but there's no "official" hierarchy that says Jersey has to do what they say? I think that Jersey is and always was seperate and that Jonny Sack was not so much a capo as he was an ambassador from Jersey to NY.
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Mar 26, 2019 21:52
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crispix posted:Something that I didn't quite pick up on so much when I watched this when I was younger is just how grossly socially inept so many characters in the mob are. It's seen most clearly so far when Mikey is talking about the tailor's grandson's death in graphic detail while the man is standing right in front of him. I guess it reinforces that these people are complete sociopaths with no capacity for empathy. My favorite example of this is after Tony and Christopher rob the bikers. They run out of things to say to each other really quickly and start awkwardly repeating their jokes, it's a brutal revelation on the dynamic of their relationship. "Wuwuwe're with the Vipers!" is such a great line reading from Tony. 
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Mar 26, 2019 23:26
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Your Gay Uncle posted:I think that Jersey is and always was seperate and that Jonny Sack was not so much a capo as he was an ambassador from Jersey to NY. The simultaneous desire to be in good with New York and the tension from knowing themselves that they're basically a glorified crew is really interesting, especially when Johnny Sack moves to New Jersey and they're immediately worried that the Lupertazzi Family is looking at moving in and possibly absorbing them. Once Phil gets involved it really comes to the fore, I think a big part of what made things run smoothly was the personal relationship between higher ranking members of both families, and by the time Phil is on the ascent the only personal connection is that Phil has good reason to hate Tony (and Tony to hate Phil).
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Mar 27, 2019 02:09
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Phil actually locked everything down and kept it professional up until Vito "disgraced" his cousin. And then pretty much had it wrapped up again until Little Carmine runs his mouth at a sit down and brings up Tony B all over again. At least, I'm pretty sure that's when he tells Butchy "no more Butchy...no more." edit: Man, forgot how good the ending to that episode was: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLrlIpoQfQg Solice Kirsk fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Mar 27, 2019 |
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Mar 27, 2019 02:53
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Season 1, Episode 7 - Down NeckJunior Soprano posted:Whatever happened to boys will be boys? This is probably my least favorite episode of this first season of The Sopranos, which is probably down to the fact that it's also the one that most reminds me of the format of The Pilot. There are still a lot of cool moments, great character beats, interesting interactions etc but the flashback scenes - though well done in and of themselves - feel out of place and break up the flow of the current day storyline, not helped by the awkward transitions and narration that feel like something out of a first year film student's personal documentary about their family. The director - Lorraine Senna - was the first and, shamefully, only female director to direct an episode of the entire series and I hope they didn't in some way blame her for this being a "bad" episode. While her career consists of mostly network television and made for TV films, it's the editing, pacing and - in parts - writing that stands out as the problem for me. Perhaps she came onboard thinking it was a standard television drama, perhaps she did a perfectly fine job-for-hire and then moved on, or maybe she didn't mesh well. Whatever the case, she never worked for the show again, and it would have been nice to have a female director in place for a few more episodes of a show that often wanted to explore the complications, contradictions and frustrations of being a woman in such a hyper-(toxic)masculine world. The episode doesn't start strong, as it relies on child actors to open with, which is always a gamble, exacerbated by the fact they have to act like they're drunk which plenty of adults WITH real-life experience do a bad job at. AJ and two buddies - Jared and Byron - steal and drink sacramental wine from the Chapel of their school: Verbum Dei. The scene does demonstrate nicely childhood logic as well as the same twisted morality we often see with Tony and his crew: it's not a sin because it hasn't been blessed yet, and AJ can confess in Church that he stole something without actually saying WHAT he stole. Unfortunately they can't hide they're drunk when they have to run drills, with one student vomiting all over the floor. Tony is called to the school to join Carmela after stopping in on a forced work stoppage, where Christopher has used his "job" as a Union Safety Official to shut down a construction site until they pay up. Tony is half-bemused but also angry at AJ's actions, assuring the principal - Father Hagy - that AJ will be even sorrier when he gets home. But Father Hagy wants to speak further, sending AJ out into the hall and asking the School Psychologist - Dr. Galani - to speak with Tony and Carmela. He opens with a compliment and an assurance, AJ is basically what you'd expect from an 8th Grader, and even shows promise in spatial orientation in Art Class. However, he also has problems following the rules, weighing consequences, and he often doesn't think before he acts. Tony squirms as what is basically a description of himself is read out, there is no doubt that AJ is his father's son. But he's less than impressed by Galani's next suggestion, that AJ could have ADD and needs a thorough assessment to see if that is the case. Tony laughs it off, he just needs a whack upside the head, which immediately leaves everybody uncomfortable. He has to quickly explain that they do NOT hit their kids, even though he thinks it would do them good, making it clear that this is a hard and fast rule of Carmela's that he doesn't gently caress with. When it comes to the household and raising the children, she is the Boss. That night over dinner - joined by Livia and Junior - it becomes clear why AJ has a skewed sense of morality. Livia complains that they shouldn't be able to suspend him since Tony and Carmela pay them so much money, her logic being not so much that cash trumps morality but that gratitude should. Junior meanwhile is delighted at AJ getting into trouble, and he and Livia can't resist teasing that Tony was far worse as a kid: stealing cars and going on joyrides, stealing lobsters from the harbor and selling them on Bloomfield Avenue. Junior is beaming at the memory while Livia is enjoying putting Tony in his place, while he gets more furious over his authority being undermined. When AJ responds with an under the breath,"Yeah, sure" when Tony says he doesn't condone those kind of actions, Tony and Carmela are horrified and dismayed while Meadow - who cannot wait to get the gently caress to College - can't believe he'd be so stupid. Carmela lays out his punishment, while he is suspended for 3 days from Verbum Dei, he is grounded for 3 weeks. That means no skateboarding, no internet, no television AND he'll be biking over to Green Grove to visit Livia every day. "Oh, that'll be nice!" exclaims Livia, heartily chowing down on spaghetti. AJ is shocked and in tears, gasping that this isn't fair.... his actions have consequences!?! He rushes up the stairs, while Junior complains bitterly and fumes - ignored by everybody - about Tony telling HIM to shut up.   That night, Tony and Carmela share a very genuine parental moment familiar to most anybody who has had a teenager. It's colored by the reality of Tony's life, but their concern is over their son's attitudes and action. They ponder whether he knows Tony is in the Mafia and that is why he is acting out. Carmela isn't sure, but believes that Meadow knows. Tony KNOWS she knows (as a very poorly edited series of snap-flashbacks remind us) but doesn't want Carmela to know that, and changes the subject when she asks if anything weird happened on their College trip together. Instead he says a time is coming when the two of them will need to sit down and talk to her, as a family Carmela agrees, about his business. It's a nice moment of unity between them, undercut by the fact that Tony is hiding parts of the truth from her even as he talks about being open. They agree that with AJ they'll simply have to wait for the test results and figure out what to do next. With that, they turn away from each other (!) and go to sleep. I think the most interesting part of the above scene is that it is so clearly shown just how deeply and openly knowledgeable Carmela is about what Tony does. She sometimes couches it in terms of what she suspects or thinks, and Tony often tells her that there are things he won't tell her and she shouldn't look too deeply into. But here is is made very clear that she is complicit, there is no possible way she can claim ignorance or being ill-informed. All that stuff Junior and Livia said about him at dinner was news to AJ, but Carmela knew it all and knew it long before they ever got married. At therapy, Tony discusses AJ's case with Melfi, and it is really fascinating to see how he picks things up and incorporates them into his own mannerisms/mindset. The entire time he talks to Melfi, complaining about how he thinks ADD might be a scam but admitting it could be his own ego not wanting to admit something is wrong with HIS son, he is picking at his shoelaces. That very same action is something Carmela mentioned to him the previous night when discussing signs AJ might have something wrong with him. So maybe it is just a shared trait? Well notice how Tony also talks about how they'll deal with it and move on if he does have AJ, just as they'd do if he had polio? Carmela also brought up polio in reference to the ADD during the meeting at Verbum Dei and now it's his own reference to use. I bring this up because these therapy sessions have also proven of benefit to Tony to adapt and improvise his criminal lifestyle. There is an argument to be made that Tony, a narcissist certainly and arguably a sociopath, is somebody who moves through life picking up those things that he can adapt into some benefit for himself. Not just financially, but socially, professionally, personally, even to help his own sense of self-worth. Of course, it could also just be a dad worried about his son! They sit in an uncomfortable silence for a time, until finally Melfi brings up the elephant in the room: last time he was here he told her loved her and she rejected him, does he want to talk about that? Suddenly Tony the sad man who is worried about his son becomes Tony the smug rear end in a top hat, as his entire body language changes and he pathetically begins boasting about he has a young, sexy Russian girlfriend before pausing and hitting her with what he thinks is a devastating blow, asking how old SHE is. Melfi's response immediately deflates his ego, as she comments that it is interesting he hasn't mentioned having a girlfriend until now, leaving unsaid the fact that he hasn't been entirely forthcoming in their sessions. His face and body language immediately change again as he suddenly pivots back to AJ, asking for her professional advice over whether he should go hard or soft when it comes to disciplining him. She says that it's a difficult question to answer, and he shows a similar mindset to Livia by "jokingly" suggesting he gives her a raise so she can get him a more definitive answer.   A little after 9am the next morning, Tony is woken by yelling as Carmela bellows at AJ to get up while he yells back that since he's suspended and grounded there is no point. She roars orders at him about what he will do today, and they get into a screaming argument over him playing music which she never specifically forbade. All during this, a groggy Tony rolls out of bed and staggers into the bathroom and takes his Prozac, the song White Rabbit by Jefferson Airplane playing in his head as he thinks back to the 1960s and a pivotal moment in his own life. A tiny little Anthony Soprano with big teeth steps out of his little house in "Down Neck" as his Uncle Junior - with a full head of hair no less! - honks the horn calling for his father. Livia steps out and warns him to not miss the school bus or he'll have to walk through the colored neighborhood, and warns her husband as he steps out that he has to remember to pick up a pork loin when they go to her sister's for dinner. Johnny Boy Soprano (played by Joseph Siravo from Carlito's Way) is all cheer and laugher, completely dismissing her and mocking the fact she never shuts up. Livia looks less than impressed but Johnny Boy could care less, and it paints an interesting picture of their relationship given all we've heard so far is Tony's point-of-view that his mother dominated his father. Little Anthony asks them to give him a lift to school but they're busy, Johnny Boy admonishing him to pay attention to his teachers before they drive away. Little Anthony misses the bus, his little legs not getting him to the stop in time, which also means he's in place to see as Junior's car pulls up to a store across the street and one of the men sitting outside starts running for his life. Johnny Boy chases him down, and he and Junior beat the utter poo poo out of poor Rocco who owes them money and has been counting on a big gambling payoff to get him out of debt. Little Anthony can only stare, unseen by his father or his uncle, as they beat a man savagely and walk away with whatever cash he had on him. A sudden freeze-frame and fade to white completely halts the flow of the episode, as we return to the adult Tony still looking in his bathroom mirror. Carmela pops in and notes that he's up, and of course in spite of all his talk about wanting to face things as a family and get through things, and the necessity of AJ's discipline, grunts sarcastically that how could anybody sleep with all this poo poo going on. At therapy he is more open (remember what Carmela told him at the end of the last episode about resenting his openness with Melfi and not her) as he discusses his memory of his father. He's aware that the trigger for the memory is his own concern about AJ knowing or discovering what he is, and ponders with wonder how bizarre it was to see his father beat on a man, something he'd never seen him do before. He jokes about how his father would hit he and his sister "a little" but notes that this was different, and again tries to undercut the tension with a joke about being happy he wasn't a "fag". When Melfi asks for more of his thoughts on his father, Tony immediately speaks highly of him, how well liked he was and what a good guy, how he knew how to have a good time... but when he says it, his face immediately drops to the side, his hand nervously brushes imaginary crumbs from his pantsleg. He sparks up though as he moves into safer territory and begins animatedly talking about how much his father loved shellfish and would show them how to eat them, before darkening again as he recalls how his mother would never eat anything "raw" - she has no part in his cherished childhood memory. When Melfi gets him to admit his father was involved in illegal activities, she pushes him, wanting him to address it for his own good as well as showing him a way to put himself into AJ's shoes. He tries to shut down and she pushes tighter, so he goes off on a rant about how "legitimate" businesses are the real criminals. She won't let him shake it though, pushing him as to how he will react when his son finds out or asks him, and trying to get him to consider how he felt too scared as a kid to ask his father without outright telling him that this is probably how AJ would feel too.   At the Bada Bing, Tony sits out back commiserating with Silvio and Pussy. Silvio's daughter is apparently on him about the strip club being anti-feminist, while he claims the opposite: the girls are pulling in $1500 a week! Pussy agrees that boys are different than girls, and admits that even though he constantly lied about it his two sons knew and somehow ended up loving him anyway. They ponder the difficult of raising children in an information age, a plight known all too well by millions of parents across the country, mobster or not. Christopher arrives with a handful of watches, suggesting they grab one for an anniversary or other gift for the lady(ies) in their lives. He brags that he grabbed them out of a wide open FedEx van while picking up "the Chinaman's vig" and Tony is mortified: that's interstate commerce, he could have gotten 8 years in prison for a handful of watches! Christopher just jokes about, not reading the mood, and Tony storms out leaving him behind confused. For Tony, Christopher is like a son, a son that he CAN be open with about his life, as well as also taking out his aggression on without feeling guilty about it. At Verbum Dei, Dr. Galani shows AJ a series of picture cards and asks him to discuss his thoughts and feelings on each. AJ, clearly bored out of his mind, does his best to give the guy whatever answer he thinks will get him out the door. When pushed further for speculation on what might be going on within or outside of the picture, he struggles until he hits on the possibility that a missing horseman might be watching television, and excitedly begins recounting the plot of an episode of South Park. When Dr. Galani starts making notes, AJ clearly has a moment where he wonders if maybe being excited about a little kid getting anally probed and farting fire wasn't a bad choice when dealing with a psychologist. At home, Carmela is reading up on ADD, worried that AJ might end up in Special Ed. Tony comes home and his attempts to calm her down blow up into a fight as she accuses him of wilful ignorance (she has no idea he's been wracked by this in therapy, because he never tells her how he feels) and he becomes convinced that she blames him for AJ being the way he is. She gives as good as she gets, coldly telling him she blames herself since she has two eyes and know what Tony is. Coldly furious, he points out that Meadow is an Honors Student and brings up one of her Uncles as proof that her gene pool isn't pure and refined. To be fair, Carmela was pretty cold in what she told him too, but her answer is to shut down and tell him a fight isn't getting them anywhere before storming off with her books (and shopping!) upstairs and leaving him behind fuming. At Green Grove, Livia is poring over the obituaries to see if anybody she knows has died when AJ shows up. She is delighted, pinching his cheek and showing him off to another resident - Pearl - and with great pride and affection explaining he isn't in school because was a baaaad boy! You gotta wonder why AJ seems confused about right and wrong! When Pearl - a very pleasant lady - leaves with a smile, Livia enthusiastically gossips to AJ that she lost half her brain in a stroke, then suggests they settle in to play a game of Scrabble. AJ isn't keen, using as an excuse that his tests with a psychiatrist have frazzled his mind. Livia is perplexed, a psychiatrist? Just because he got suspended? AJ doesn't see what the big deal is, but Livia explains with a harsh whisper that psychiatry is nothing but.... a racket for the Jews and is in complete disbelief when he tells her that his dad goes to a psychiatrist. She won't accept it, it makes no sense, but he insists he heard Tony and Carmela talking about it. Livia processes this, perplexed... until a sudden and hateful realization dawns on her. He goes to talk about her. To complain about HER! That's how he repays the life she gave them on a silver platter? Her only son goes and tells a stranger horrible things about his own sweet, innocent mother? She weeps bitterly, exactly the kind of cruel emotional manipulation she uses to such great affect on her children - particularly Tony - demonstrating the narcissism that defines Tony too. Everything must resolve around her, everything must be some kind of slight or wound to her. The best part, though, is how AJ is too young and, quite frankly, stupid to be anything but oblivious to her manipulation as he sits bored eating his pear, probably counting the minutes till he can go home to sulk.   A clunky voice-over dialogue between Tony and AJ as a driving car pulls to a stop with a flat tire is another sign of an episode that was either rushed, undershot or both. Tony gets out to change the tire, informing AJ that he's not getting out of a dentist's visit so easily AND that in this family they change their own tires rather than calling the Auto Club to do it for them. He wants AJ to watch and learn, and takes the chance to question him about the psychologist. AJ correctly points out that he doesn't have to tell him anything that happened as it is meant to be between him and the doctor only, which annoys Tony but he can't argue with. The real heart of the matter he wants to get to is the comment AJ made at dinner recently, and after some coaxing he gets him to admit that the word around school is that Tony is in the Mafia. He talks about the weirdness of Jackie Aprile's funeral, the guys in suits taking photos and writing down license plate numbers. He mentions he found a website (not that Meadow showed it to him) which including Uncle Jackie on it, and claims a Union he ran ripped off a pension fund. Tony considers all this and then finds the best compromise he can between the truth and protecting his son. Uncle Jackie was complicated, but what isn't is that AJ loved him. Plus on that website, did he see Tony himself? No he didn't, and Tony leaves that as unspoken proof that obviously he CAN'T be in the Mafia before changing the subject back to the dentist visit and joke to a clearly relieved AJ. Back in therapy, Tony isn't relieved though. He still doesn't know how much AJ really knows and how much he should tell him, and is concerned that this could be "genetical" and AJ is doomed to be just like him or his father. Melfi deliberately doesn't speak, quietly encouraging him to keep exploring his feelings. Tony turns to anger next, what about Pussy? He has three kids, one a graduate and the other two going to Villanova, but he's a stone-cold gangster. Melfi tries to interject here to keep him on track but he's like a freight-train now: Leopold and Loeb were rapists and murderers but their father was a successful legitimate businessman. Melfi can see the source of his anger and resentment, he thinks his father is to blame for the man he became, and unspoken the fear is he himself will be responsible for what AJ becomes. He repeats a line he made to Meadow on their College trip about selling patio furniture, and she asks him if he's thought any more about the violence he witnessed his father commit. Tony can't deal with her poking and prodding without ever being direct though, and asks her to please just come out and tell him what she knows. Aware of his fragility she helps as best she can while knowing the breakthroughs are his to make, reminding him of his fears for his family in his bird-penis dream and his love of history, and pointing out that if he doesn't learn from history he will repeat it. Pushing him further, she again asks him to talk more about his family. The therapy here is reminiscent of The Pilot, used as a guide to flashbacks, and if anything it is even clumsier than it was in that first, half-formed episode: perhaps because now we've seen what the show is actually capable of at its best. He remembers playing catch with Junior, and being outraged when his older sister Janice got taken on a car-ride with his father and he was left behind. His resentment for Janice is there in the present too, as he dismisses her angrily as a burn-out living in California calling herself Vishnamantha now. Melfi gets him back on track and we return to the flashback, and little 9-year-old Tony returns inside to beg his mother for an electric organ as she clearly is close to exploding from tension and stress. She's stuck inside the house, cooking dinner, a crying baby (Barbara) at the table, little Tony begging and pleading and bargaining, then finally complaining incessantly that he never gets anything but Janice always gets whatever she wants, and why did dad take her and not him and where did they go and why can't he go and oh isn't Janice just perfect perfect perfect till Livia just exploded, reeling on him and threatening to stick the meat fork in his eye. Melfi is horrified, she said that to a 9-year-old boy? Oddly enough, for all his many issues with his mother, he laughs this off as his mother just being overly dramatic.   With the sudden clarity only afforded to geniuses and characters in roughly written episodes of television, Tony gasps as he realizes what has triggered this memory. A couple of Sundays after that, during The Newark Riots Tony lied to his mother that he was going out to play ball. Her only response is that he'd better take a bat considering the riots going on at Springfield Avenue, but of course he has no intention of going anywhere by foot. Hiding in the boot of his father's car, his father and Janice drive out to Rideland, an amusement park, where they are joined by Uncle Junior. The heartbroken little boy could only watch as his father brought Janice inside the park, gave her some cash and let her rush off to play with other children while he was (thought to be) left at home with a mother who threatened to stick a fork in his eye. In the present, Tony seems oddly happy about the memory as he recounts his own childhood misery. He explains he didn't confront his father about it because that wasn't something you did in his family (not to Johnny Boy at least, he felt fine doing it to Livia, which says a lot) and when Melfi asks what the point of all this, he explains that this lead to him discovering that his father wasn't like other fathers. Back in the past, a miserable little Anthony returns to Rideland on another day. Why? Presumably to wallow in his misery watching his father and sister enjoy a bond and happiness forbidden to him. Instead - after a near run-in with three black kids - he discovered the truth. His father was using Janice, his own daughter, as a front. He and other gangsters would bring their kids to the park and then congregate to store stolen goods. The State Police raid the place, shooting one gangster - Cicchi Sasso, a second cousin who got out of Vietnam thanks to the shooting - in the leg. They arrest a smug Johnny Boy and Junior and haul them away in the Paddy Wagon, while a bawling Janice and the other kids were escorted away by the police. In the present, Tony admits at the time he thought his head would explode, but it turned out to be no big deal. His mother laughed it off as no big deal, saying the cops only arrested him because they liked picking on Italians. Plus his dad was home in only a couple of hours, walking in the door without a care in the world while he and Janice were watching Ed Sullivan. He'd even had time to stop off and get ice-cream, laughing that the cops went to the wrong place and arrested the wrong guys, while Livia smirks that he obviously is in good with the "uppity-ups". What really dazzles little Anthony is that Rocco - the deadbeat he saw Johnny Boy beat the poo poo out of - is one of those eagerly and vocally cheering on his father, despite still bearing the wounds and bandages from his beating. Melfi doesn't understand this, while Tony continues to happily recount the details: his father was in violation of his parole but the charges just... went away. Which meant yes he'd been in jail, but little Anthony never knew because they told him he'd been in Montana being a cowboy. Melfi's sympathetic look makes his own face fall, he's joking about it but he knows how he felt at the time, and with resignation he admits that his own son is doomed. He gets defiant though, because he expects her to think he hated his father or felt he ruined his life, but it isn't true. He loved and was proud of his father, and grew up wanting to be like him. He hopes AJ feels the same pride for him, but that is what concerns him most... because HE doesn't want AJ to be like him. He could be anything, but he fears that he's destined to become just another Soprano mobster. Melfi asks him if he's ever communicated any of these feelings to AJ himself and he admits he hasn't, but fatalistically (and conveniently for himself) says it doesn't matter because it's all "in the blood". She admits genetic predisposition plays a part but isn't the be-all and end-all, and rather naively reminds him this is America. That makes him laugh, as he remembers one last thing. At some point after the event sof 67, a young Anthony came down one night and overheard Johnny Boy and Livia arguing about Rocco Allatore. No longer a deadbeat, he's heading out to Reno to open a sports book, generate cashflow and open a Supper Club.. and he wants Johnny Boy to run it. He's excited about the opportunity, Rocco has always had a brain and he's seen a ground floor opportunity in Reno, and Johnny Boy is smart enough to want to hitch his wagon to his star. Livia is aghast though - okies and misfits, Beverly Hillbillies, that's who you'll find in Reno. She finds the thought of Johnny Boy running a Supper Club laughable. When he complains that she's forever getting in his way, he threatens to take the kids and go by himself and she snaps, threatening to smother them rather than take them to Nevada. For a young Anthony Soprano, it's a terrifying thing to hear, in a completely different context from her threat with the meat fork.   At Green Grove, Junior startles Livia as she is working on a puzzle. Half complaining, half bragging, Junior says he hasn't visited recently because his new status makes him so busy. Livia waves off his big talk so she can quickly shift the subject to Tony, who she is still mad at after convincing herself he's going to therapy purely to talk poo poo about her. Junior, who has no idea he's an empty figurehead, is quick to come to Tony's defense now that he has what he always wanted. He tells her not to be so hard on Tony, who is heading in the right direction in spite of their past differences. Livia throws out little pointed barbs, references to his therapy in an effort to get Junior to ask a specific enough question she can "accidentally" let it slip. Before the conversation can continue though, Tony himself arrives and greets them both. Junior is thrilled to see him, even complimenting the fact he's holding onto his hair (barely) and pointing out to Livia that he's a good boy to visit his mother. She doesn't say a word though, and he senses something awkward is going on, turning down her dinner invitation and saying he'll leave them to chat in peace. She can't help but get in a barb his way too, she's irritated at him for his inflated ego as well, and doesn't mind talking poo poo about him once he is gone. They head to the dining room and Tony casually brings up the Allatores, and she brightens up to point out that they're billionaires now, thanks to that "real go-getter" Rocco. Tony reminds her that Johnny Boy wanted to go to Nevada with them, but she dismisses the idea, that never happened. He insists though, he was there and overheard it all. Livia belatedly remembers, but sees that was just a case of Rocco getting Johnny Boy worked up and he soon changed his mind. Tony won't let it go, wanting to confront his mother on ruining this chance he had to beat his "genetic predisposition". Johnny Boy wanted to go and she wouldn't let him. Livia - perhaps quite correctly - scoffs, does he really think she could have stopped his father if he wanted to do something? When was she ever able to make him do anything he didn't want to do? He complains that with a little support from her, maybe he could have gotten them out of the life. It's an unfair accusation, based on a childhood memory for a father he idealizes perhaps more so than she does herself with her "He was a Saint!" proclamations. She knows how to hit back though, better than anyone - if it bothers him so much, he should go talk to a psychiatrist, that's what people do when they're looking for somebody else to blame for the problems in their lives. He's flummoxed, but follows after her and recalls her threatening to smother "his" children, and says if she'd been born just a little later she would have been the real gangster. She gets in his face, snarling she doesn't know what he's talking about... and in spite of all this aggression the two walk on to have their dinner together.   Tony and Carmela join Dr. Ganali in his office to discuss AJ's test results. They're... inconclusive. There's no evidence of a learning disability, all his tests are within the normal range and there are no physical signs of any neurological issues... but they can't discount that he has ADD, as he shows 5 of the 9 symptoms of ADD, one short of the 6 required for a positive result. Carmela is horrified, he shows 5 signs? But when Tony hears those signs include impatience, always wanting to be on the move, rudeness and fidgeting, he's disgusted. Fidgeting? What constitutes a fidget? Carmela tries to rein him in but he demands an answer, sick of doctors who won't come right out and say what they mean. Kids fidget, kids are rude and stupid and do dumb things. When Ganali tries to reiterate that AJ is a borderline case, Tony hits back that he's not a case, he's a 13-year-old boy who made a mistake, and he's going to pay for it and he's going to be fine (basically, Junior's "boys will be boys" from the start of the episode). Revolted, he gets up and tells Carmela they're leaving. Seemingly mortified by Tony's attitude, she follows behind but then stops, turns and tells Galani... that Tony is completely in the right, and they shouldn't have to pay for any of this testing either. They leave together, a husband and wife unified in mindset for their child, and a wife who is showing her husband the support he feels his mother never gave HIS father. The only question is if he is smart enough to see it and appreciate it. In the basement that evening, Tony uses his home gym while watching a war documentary. Having worked up a sweat, he heads upstairs where AJ is working on his homework. AJ says he's depressed, but Tony - who knows what depression is - points out he's just sad and angry because he got caught and is being punished. It's a punishment that is going to stand, and AJ's right if he thinks it isn't fair: that in itself is a lesson. But Tony has taken things onboard, he is concerned about his son and he thinks he needs discipline, but he's also wary of repeating the same things that caused him to end up like his own father. So he bonds and shows love in the best way his family knows, through food. Ironically it is by preparing ice cream for them both, in the end just repeating what his own father did as a treat after being arrested in front of Janice and (unknowingly) Tony. But he's there, he's engaging and active with his own son as he take turns spraying whipped cream in their mouths and adding more treats to the desert. Johnny Boy Soprano, for all his faults, loved his children but showed it in a off-hand, distant way. Tony, in that respect at least, has a healthier relationship with his own son. In the end, isn't that all any of us can really hope for: to do better than what came before?  Season 1: The Pilot | 46 Long | Denial, Anger, Acceptance | Meadowlands | College | Pax Soprana | Down Neck | The Legend of Tennessee Moltisanti | Boca | A Hit Is a Hit | Nobody Knows Anything | Isabella | I Dream of Jeannie Cusamano Season 1 | Season 2 | Season 3 | Season 4 | Season 5 | Season 6.1 | Season 6.2 Jerusalem fucked around with this message at 13:20 on Apr 23, 2020 |
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Mar 27, 2019 12:38
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