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Papercut posted:Being able to turn lights off and on remotely, getting usage statistics, getting end of life alerts, etc are all perfectly useful additions that aren't just your fridge pinging you to buy milk.
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Sep 6, 2020 23:45
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TACD posted:I contest your assertion that remote activation and usage statistics are worthwhile lightbulb features Remote activation has been standard at an institutional level (via time clocks, then relay panels, and now network devices) for decades, and usage statistics are useful for determining the effectiveness of various "greening" measures and even just as marketing tools to make people more aware of their habits. Whether the cost is worth it at the residential level could be debated, but you're basically arguing that building management systems aren't useful.
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Sep 6, 2020 23:56
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Watermelon Daiquiri posted:What I want is something that sticks a serial bus over the power line rather than having to rely on wireless and have to connect to and deal with each one individually DALI that I've mentioned before is mostly that. It's not quite over the power line entirely, there's a low-voltage line which is used to power sensing equipment and the "smart" parts of the lights, along with carrying the "serial" bus signal, but it's basically that. Pity that it's really expensive because it's essentially, I mean it totally is not, absolutely, would never claim even in jest, a cartel by the big manufacturers. If you want to make DALI-compatible devices you have to pay tons of money every year to the manufacturer alliance and like $30 or something equally ridiculous for each device. evilweasel posted:You want smart switches not smart lightbulbs. Smart lightbulbs add a shitload of new failure states. Smart switches break into regular switches. Smart switches can't really do sensing and low-level control on LED lights like smart lights have, or check for most types of failure (the two protocols I've mentioned before can do all that). It's good enough if you want basic addressable lighting but it's not really comparable. And your average LED light already has lots of circuitry inside anyway. They are not "dumb" devices either way, hence also why they aren't really possible to regulate via switches outside of turn on/turn off and detecting draw/short/open circuit. e: Also MCUs and SoCs (a.k.a. the little programmable computers on a single chip that you put into things) are orders of magnitude more reliable than either the LEDs, the integrated power supplies for the LEDs or the high-current control chips already built inside. If they die then it's almost always due to a hosed PSU, and in that case there's not much chance your light would still work either. In fact they're so reliable they are often used to control and monitor power supplies for more complex products such as routers and the like. They can also be hilariously overkill for their applications, though usually you try to get the cheapest possible that can still do the job, and we're talking tens of cents for something that can do a convincing impression of an early-90s PC. VVVVV Those don't generally work with LED lights unless they are designed for them, and even then it's a mixed bag at best. Basically the problem is that LED lights have their own power supplies since they run on significantly lower voltage than mains, which then fucks with whatever regulation (so PWM realistically) you're trying to do from the outside. Private Speech fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 00:02
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Cicero posted:I'd like to have smart lightbulbs for changing color temperature and dimming them somewhat at night. With regular bulbs/switches, it's just like, you can either have them at full white-rear end blast, or darkness. We had dimmer switches since at least the 80s bro
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Sep 7, 2020 00:23
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Here's the insides of your typical dumb LED lightbulb: stolen off an actual ebay listing. As you can see it's by no means a trivial device in the way a traditional lighbulb would be.
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Sep 7, 2020 00:40
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Private Speech posted:Here's the insides of your typical dumb LED lightbulb: now imagine how well it works when someone flips the light switch to your fixture with a smart light bulb
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Sep 7, 2020 00:41
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evilweasel posted:now imagine how well it works when someone flips the light switch to your fixture with a smart light bulb Again that's a totally dumb light above, no smart features of any sort, I wasn't being sarcastic. And the chips used to make smart light bulbs "smart" are designed to tolerate sudden loss of power, plus you can use capacitors to give yourself some extra time (and to deal with all sorts of other things). I guess the more "smart" you go the more potentially prone to failure it could be, if you wanted a light that can stream films via wifi or something (totally doable, but cooling would be tricky) then it might potentially end up in a bad state, but that shouldn't be the case for the sort of smart light bulbs you normally see. Private Speech fucked around with this message at 00:59 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 00:49
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OJ MIST 2 THE DICK posted:you want IEEE 1901 Pretty sure you meant X10  Broadcasting onto the AC mains has its own set of security issues, though. Especially if you live in an apartment building. Private Speech posted:Here's the insides of your typical dumb LED lightbulb: ANIME AKBAR fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 01:06
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ANIME AKBAR posted:To be fair, a CFL bulb will look basically the same. LED bulbs are no more complex. Yeah true, fluorescent isn't really any more simple, I was thinking more incandescent. Either way the point was to show that they aren't trivial devices inside.
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Sep 7, 2020 01:34
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Private Speech posted:Those don't generally work with LED lights unless they are designed for them, and even then it's a mixed bag at best. Basically the problem is that LED lights have their own power supplies since they run on significantly lower voltage than mains, which then fucks with whatever regulation (so PWM realistically) you're trying to do from the outside. Only the cheapest of cheap LED bulbs (you know, the ones with awful color temperature and a horrible CRI) don't support PWM dimming until you get into specialty type bulbs. Changing color temperature on the fly seems to be of very questionable value. I'd like to understand the use case (please supply something has hasn't already been debunked like 'night mode'). Quality smart dimmers from known companies with UL listings that can operate on local control (like Zwave or zigbee) seem to be the best way to go at this point.
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Sep 7, 2020 02:18
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The Philips smart bulbs have been handy for us as renters. The light switches in our bedroom always seems to be in a stupid spot but with the smart bulbs and a smart switch we can stick anywhere makes it much nicer. They were expensive but worth it I think.
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Sep 7, 2020 02:49
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Motronic posted:
I use warm-white lighting for when I am just hanging out at home. I prefer hospital-ward white lighting when I am cleaning or trying to find something/working at my desk. full disclosure: I personally achieve this by using warm-white LED lamps around my flat because I prefer dim lighting. the flat has cool white LED downlights everywhere, so when I need to drench the place in lighting for cleaning or to find a dropped screw I can do so. being able to set colour temp and brightness in a single downlight with dimming controls would be a better solution.
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Sep 7, 2020 02:51
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ianmacdo posted:The Philips smart bulbs have been handy for us as renters. The light switches in our bedroom always seems to be in a stupid spot but with the smart bulbs and a smart switch we can stick anywhere makes it much nicer. They were expensive but worth it I think. As a renter I get that. Different use cases for different stuff. But if it's your home that you're trying to do to a high level of reliability and finish, nothing beats having a real switch that will just work even if <insert home automation thing here> shits the bed on you.
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Sep 7, 2020 02:52
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As usual in the US, instead of solving the fundamental problem (old buildings with lovely electricals which get past code because the buildings are sooo old and it's sooo haaaard to replace them and how dare you it's an historically significant flophouse), it's patched over with glitzy crap.
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Sep 7, 2020 02:56
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Absurd Alhazred posted:As usual in the US, instead of solving the fundamental problem (old buildings with lovely electricals which get past code because the buildings are sooo old and it's sooo haaaard to replace them and how dare you it's an historically significant flophouse), it's patched over with glitzy crap. A switch being located in an inconvenient place isn't really a code issue. I mean, I have 0 smart lights in my place, but I can envision a scenario in which a person who isn't me and doesn't live in my exact apartment, would find one to be a preferable solution to extensive renovations.
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Sep 7, 2020 03:00
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Absurd Alhazred posted:As usual in the US, instead of solving the fundamental problem (old buildings with lovely electricals which get past code because the buildings are sooo old and it's sooo haaaard to replace them and how dare you it's an historically significant flophouse), it's patched over with glitzy crap. Is this in reference to smart bulbs rather than smart switches? Because brand new up to date modern buildings built to the latest code book are available for rent, and absolutely no owner is going to want you monkeying with hard wired electrical systems in the building.
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Sep 7, 2020 03:02
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Absurd Alhazred posted:As usual in the US, instead of solving the fundamental problem (old buildings with lovely electricals which get past code because the buildings are sooo old and it's sooo haaaard to replace them and how dare you it's an historically significant flophouse), it's patched over with glitzy crap. Nah, we actually just don't build lights into our rental buildings. Lamps or nothing, because you ain't got poo poo for overhead lighting.  I mean, apart from not being subject to eviction anymore, the best thing about getting to buy a place this year is that it's the first place I've lived in my adult life that actually has lights outside of the bathroom and kitchen. Ten apartments, six states, no overhead lights. 
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Sep 7, 2020 03:06
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Motronic posted:Is this in reference to smart bulbs rather than smart switches? Because brand new up to date modern buildings built to the latest code book are available for rent, and absolutely no owner is going to want you monkeying with hard wired electrical systems in the building. And even owners who aren't opposed in concept are probably leery about liability issues. One of my friends is a landlord and he'll let his tenants do whatever improvements they want within reason, sometimes even chipping in for the cost of materials (if, for example, they want to repaint), but obviously he wants some kind of assurance that it's done properly. I bet if you told him, "hey, I'd like to hire an electrician to install a bunch of smart switches" he'd go halfsies or something, but "I'm gonna tinker with the electricals!" is going to be a hard sell.
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Sep 7, 2020 03:41
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Steve French posted:How many of those uses need to be provided by something built into the bulb, though? Instead of decoupling it from the part that's gonna need replacement anyway The lifespan of the light emitting diodes is practically forever, and even then the stated lifespan is just when output decreases to four‐fifths of what it was at the time of first use. It’s the power supplies that usually fail early though. The smarts themselves are jellybean parts. It’s the power supply, the diodes, and the packaging that is expensive, and there is no way getting around replacing those.
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Sep 7, 2020 05:22
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Motronic posted:As a renter I get that. Different use cases for different stuff. But if it's your home that you're trying to do to a high level of reliability and finish, nothing beats having a real switch that will just work even if <insert home automation thing here> shits the bed on you. When that happens the light switch goes back to being your primary on/off doesn't it?
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Sep 7, 2020 05:25
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https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1301707401024827392 https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1301707401024827392.html TLDR "Digitally Accurate" Pregnancy Tests are both figuratively and literally garbage
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Sep 7, 2020 08:26
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Real problem with smart homes, IoT and so on is the really bad security, not whether the tiny mcu, or other electrical system will fail first.
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Sep 7, 2020 08:46
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Xarn posted:Real problem with smart homes, IoT and so on is the really bad security, not whether the tiny mcu, or other electrical system will fail first. Which is exactly why only "tech enthusiasts" fill their homes with that junk. Those of us who actually work with electronics and/or IT prefer to keep a loaded handgun near the laser printer, just in case it starts making funny noises.
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Sep 7, 2020 08:59
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The Sausages posted:https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1301707401024827392 It seems fine? It's a standard pregnancy test with a tiny bit of electronics so that it says "Pregnant/Not Pregnant" instead of 1-3 lines of various colors.
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Sep 7, 2020 09:05
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Foxfire_ posted:It seems fine? It's a standard pregnancy test with a tiny bit of electronics so that it says "Pregnant/Not Pregnant" instead of 1-3 lines of various colors. Sounds like the problem is that they are sold as "digital = better than."
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Sep 7, 2020 09:10
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I saw the photodiode reader coming a mile away.The Sausages posted:TLDR "Digitally Accurate" Pregnancy Tests are both figuratively and literally garbage We regret to inform you you have been attacked as a misogynist while you were sleeping. https://twitter.com/RealSexyCyborg/status/1301786034208825345
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Sep 7, 2020 09:11
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I just wanted an excuse to post the funny lightbulb video but goons gotta be all protective over their wifi bulbs.Private Speech posted:Even things like movement-activated lights - these days they are often radar-based thanks to inexpensive chips and technology improvements, which results in a much more pleasing performance than classic pir lights (which are based on heat sensing). This stuff was also perfected years ago in South Korea. 
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Sep 7, 2020 09:25
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https://twitter.com/i/status/1302287398949142533
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Sep 7, 2020 11:24
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Platystemon posted:I saw the photodiode reader coming a mile away. "attacked as a misogynist" is the shittiest take I've seen on the whole topic, ffs this isn't reddit. https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1301838969508737024 I mean my understanding on first reading was digital tests are theoretically less reliable and also an environmental hazard, not really anything beyond that. And that was wrong. Readability wasn't really discussed in the original thread but clearly it's a very real issue. It's tragic that people out there are stuck trying to work these things out on their own. Here's hoping this turns into a healthy conversation about the intersection between gender, consumerism and technology but who am I kidding. I suppose my bad take was that women shouldn't need machines to read tests for them particularly when the gimmick tests are actually a premium item of consumerism rather than a public service aimed at assisting the underprivileged. And this was really a bad take, because research shows that in practice digital tests perform not only with greater accuracy but also greater clarity - thus they're not a mere gimmick. And also research from 1993 shows that " The primary reason for (false negatives) was considered to be the difficulty women had, regardless of socioeconomic group, in understanding product instructions and, consequently, in reading the test results correctly ". Though that does directly contradict the assertion that they are "mistakes which are highly dependant on education and socioeconomic status". Regardless of any other bullshit, in my experience pregnant people should take all the help they can get. In a sane world women of all ages would have access to healthcare services that make this a non-issue where a discreet appointment with a healthcare professional can clear up any ambiguity. Reliable tests should be freely available, and non-digital tests have no reason not to perform with the same accuracy. The Sausages fucked around with this message at 11:28 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 11:26
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So say “hey you questioned the usefulness of adding electronics to the stripe strip, but actually a lot of people have trouble reading those things and the electronics may help. Here’s a paper” Don’t say that the guy has “really enormously lovely takes”. He took it well, but come on. That’s not how to make friends. https://i.imgur.com/7xnG3B9.mp4 https://i.imgur.com/YHsCUwA.mp4
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Sep 7, 2020 12:18
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So say that. Don't say "fyi you've been attacked as a misogynist" like a MGTOW chud. It wasn't clear who that was directed at and I didn't take it well but come on - Not how to make friends? It looks like they're getting on just fine, because despite the "lovely takes" jab they're both approaching the topic in good faith.
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Sep 7, 2020 13:07
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My “We regret to inform you you have been attacked as a misogynist while you were sleeping” was a waggish way to share the twist that the utility of the digital addon is more complicated than it may appear, a revelation that happens like four dozen posts deep in the original thread, but I do object to Wu’s tack. They’re getting on just fine because Foone is good‐natured and turned the other cheek. That doesn’t make Wu’s remarks appropriate. It’s just the opposite: Foone’s chill response shows that he had good intentions and Wu’s hostility was misplaced.
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Sep 7, 2020 13:30
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that wasn't waggish at all though. The way you're doubling down makes that clear.
The Sausages fucked around with this message at 13:48 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 13:44
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The Sausages posted:"attacked as a misogynist" is unreasonable chuddy garbage For someone who objects to my tone distaste, you seem to have distaste of tone. Look, if you want to criticise me for something of more substance, chide me for not clicking through and reading Wu’s next text: https://twitter.com/RealSexyCyborg/status/1301788118329094144?s=20 Now that’s an accusation of classism rather than sexism, and it’s directed at a demographic that I do not believe describes Foone—certainly not in the plural. So perhaps Wu didn’t actually have a problem with Foone but with the persons replying to them? I don’t loving know. Twitter is a poo poo medium. Platystemon fucked around with this message at 13:59 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 13:55
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The Sausages posted:that wasn't waggish at all though. The way you're doubling down makes that clear. I think I know if I was being tongue‐in‐cheek. “We regret to inform you“ is not entirely serious phraseology. When I share where I’m coming from with someone who has misunderstood me, it’s “doubling down”. If I hadn’t, I would be letting the misunderstanding stand. You’ve trapped me as a bad person either way.
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Sep 7, 2020 14:11
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Ok I'll admit to being less than fair, but forgive me for being wary of phrasing like that.
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Sep 7, 2020 22:04
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I think the use-case for the digital is that there's kind of a critical period between the time you piss on stick and the time you read the result. Too late or too soon and the result is skewed. E: asked wife and she said the best were the by-the-dozen medstrips from amazon. Indicator was way easier to read, about the price of a digital test. The downside was that it was literally litmus paper strips so not as easy to use as the plastic tests. FilthyImp fucked around with this message at 23:50 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 23:38
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The Sausages posted:that wasn't waggish at all though. The way you're doubling down makes that clear. 
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Sep 9, 2020 20:13
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Platystemon posted:Twitter is a poo poo medium. This is the proper takeaway from this discussion.
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Sep 9, 2020 20:14
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adoration for none posted:Any off-the-shelf coffee-maker is so much better than any of these stupid coffee pod machines. They're a total scam. I only do French Press at home.
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Sep 10, 2020 07:35
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