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The level/class speculation thread on the OotS forums had Miko at level 14, I believe, with six levels of monk and eight of paladin. There's also an interesting thread where Burlew goes in and talks about the systems behind the fight where Miko singlehandedly beat the Order down. To do it, she had to use Windstriker, and she kept using Smite Evil to keep Belkar out of the fight, so she might not be able to do it anymore.
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Jan 30, 2007 00:42
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Battlestar Ferrinus posted:Do you have a link to this? I don't really follow the GitP forums. Yep, here: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=963864 The fight also assumes that Durkon is still staying out of the battle, but Miko pulls it off mostly because of paladin features, especially the Cha bonus to saves.
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Jan 30, 2007 07:49
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hermanos posted:This thread reads like algebra to me, mostly since I know nada about D&D, but the strip is pretty funny. I'll bring my Player's Handbook to Comic-Con! 
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Jan 31, 2007 07:36
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Well, she's also allowed to fight very intelligently, which helps, and Durkon isn't participating besides as a healer, which also helps. Miko abuses her abilities and feats to make both Belkar and Haley non-factors, V isn't in the fight very long, and Elan's pretty useless. That leaves Roy as the only real participant.
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Feb 4, 2007 23:56
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Jonked posted:And don't forget the dice just 'happening' to come up with high rolls for Miko and low rolls for the Sticks, thanks to the magic of plot points! Both Miko and most of the Order are at a level where the dice are sort of a cute tradition instead of an actual determinant. It's a weakness in AD&D 3.5.
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Feb 5, 2007 11:27
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Calaveron posted:
I would think that being at the center of the stronghold of an order of paladins is a safeguard.
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Feb 8, 2007 12:16
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New Strip is Up
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Not just a +3 rapier, either, but a +3 keen rapier. I can't remember whether keen doubles a weapon's crit range or just expands it by 1, but either way, that's a crazy crit range. 16-20 or 17-20.
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Feb 10, 2007 06:58
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So Elan hits crit range 25% of the time or so, and does at least 1d6+7 the rest of the time. For somebody with his BAB, that's pretty badass.
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Feb 10, 2007 09:39
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You know, one guy with Combat Reflexes, Great Cleave, and Hold the Line really just tears the poo poo out of situations like this.
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Feb 22, 2007 05:42
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Eh, Hold the Line is easier to get.Battlestar Ferrinus posted:This strip was supposed to be moving, but I think it kinda fell flat. The discussion about the chances of rolling a 20 and dying to a massed attack felt more like a dry mission briefing than a grim, beady-eyed lecture; I wish we could've gotten to the actual fight and just shown a bunch of dead bodies afterwards if it was that important. In a way, you could look at it as a meta-joke about trying to take death or combat in AD&D seriously.
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Feb 22, 2007 06:46
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Tag Plastic posted:I don't think Roy will perma-die, but I just feel the ebb and flow of narrative demands a big setback for The Heroes right now, and a temp-dead Roy would be just that. Hell, torch the city, 'kill' Roy, and have Hinjo hook up with the Order for a while. Actually, the ebb and flow of narrative here suggests that since there are three gates left beyond this one, Xykon fails to take Azure City. Kragor's Tomb is a pretty blatant Final Dungeon.
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Mar 27, 2007 00:06
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the_steve posted:It's like he reads our thoughts. The GitP forums had a lot of the same ideas. I think some strips have arisen entirely out of the plotline speculation on there. Either that, or Burlew's a goon. Wanderer fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Apr 8, 2007 |
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Apr 7, 2007 05:58
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I've been published in KoDT twice.  I tend to agree with the general thrust of the conversation, though; the strip is great when it's about gaming and gamers, and falls right on its rear end the moment it tries to do romance/family/other plots.
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Apr 11, 2007 09:58
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clockworkjoe posted:Also, sup KODT published buddy You know, I'd like to do more, but there are only so many hours in the day, you know?
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Apr 13, 2007 17:56
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Do you do any other RPG writing?
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Yeah, but he's never carried a quarterstaff. No one in the Order does, unless you count the Quarterstaff card in the board game.
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Apr 24, 2007 14:04
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It really doesn't help that a lot of OotS fans seem to have this stubborn determined streak where they'll take some random conjecture and run with it. Witness, for example, the debates over Miko.
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Apr 26, 2007 00:01
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The Werle posted:Not to say that its impossible, but between him being the new Leader of the Sapphire Guard and having a few hundred evil backstabbing nobles who would take over the city and ruin everything I doubt he's going anywhere. Yeah, the only way I can see Hinjo joining the Order is if this arc ends with Azure City, its gate, and the Sapphire Guard all being destroyed, and if it did, it wouldn't make him a very good comedic foil.
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Apr 26, 2007 19:05
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Also, the vast majority of the dragon hoard got blown up when that inn exploded, and they spent the next couple of hundred strips adventuring more or less for free. I'd also imagine the oracle didn't work for cheap.
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Apr 27, 2007 06:32
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Cone of Cold wouldn't spread far enough out to hit every paladin and cleric in that room, and Divine Grace means nobody in that room has a bad saving throw, even assuming nobody in that room has a Miko-esque character build or anti-undead weaponry. Xykon's in for a hell of a fight.
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May 4, 2007 18:25
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I feel sorry for the paladin committing seppuku.  ZorbaTHut posted:He mentioned this on the dragon - he's seven levels or more higher than Roy. Isn't Roy supposed to be nearing level 10 by now? While the strip has never sat down and deliberately stated what level the characters are, it's generally agreed that the members of the Order are all around 13th level by now, because they're all about the same level and V can cast multiple 6th-level spells in a single day.
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May 5, 2007 16:40
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clockworkjoe posted:However, my bigger concern is that Xykon is basically now a Mary Sue character, along the lines of Drizzt and company. I regret to inform you of this, but Mary Sue is the new Godwin. You fail.
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May 5, 2007 18:39
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It does kind of look like they're setting up O'chul or Hinjo to join the Order, though.
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May 5, 2007 20:20
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clockworkjoe posted:
Yes. Yes, I am. That doesn't mitigate the fact that "Mary Sue" is the most overused, least accurate pseudo-criticism you could've possibly leveled against the strip, or indeed against any creative act in any medium. clockworkjoe posted:You know, I still like OOTS, I think Xykon being so powerful isn't funny or good for the story. Happy Elf makes a good point. Why does he even need Snarl? He could already take over the world. Well, no. He's having a run of extremely good luck at this point in time. In order for him to have gotten this far, he unknowingly set Miko up to sabotage Azure City's defenses from the inside. Without Miko leaping to conclusions and killing the old leader whose name escapes me at this point in time, he would've faced a unified Azure City with at least twice as many troops. It still would've gone well for him, but the defenders wouldn't be doing as poorly as they are. Xykon's also completely failing to strategize at all, which may yet cost him. Further, were he to attack the world as a whole, one assumes he would sooner or later encounter someone who's at least on an even keel with him, or at least an adventuring party with a few levels on the Order. In AD&D 3.5, being a 20th-level sorcerer lich is a big deal, but it's not so big of a deal that you will never encounter an equivalent force.
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May 5, 2007 23:04
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godwin is the new godwin. You're an idiot.
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I can sort of see the point. Xykon's been amusingly incompetent for most of the strip so far, and when he did something right, it was handwaved, off-panel, or against offstage ciphers like the dungeon full of good monsters. In the Azure City siege, he's abruptly being written as so overwhelmingly powerful that he can go ahead and be an ADD-riddled idiot and most of the time, it doesn't matter. He's also attacking a bunch of people who we actually care about this time, and that makes a big difference. The funny thing is that Xykon's always been like this, if you look back at the earliest strips. He's always been this powerful; he busts out a Symbol of Pain on Haley and Elan, for example. When he gets defeated, it's at the last second due to a stroke of luck or his own arrogance. In his previous confrontation with the Order, he would have won if not for Haley and his own inability to take Roy seriously.
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May 5, 2007 23:37
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Samedi posted:Anyway, I don't mind when Burlew tweaks the rules or whatever. What I'm not liking is that Xykon is being written contrary to all his previous characterization. Suddenly the chaotic, lazy, supremely confident lich is being written as ruthless, efficient, and foresighted. I don't like it. He was ruthless enough to end a labor dispute by killing and zombifying a bunch of ogres; he was efficient enough to frame his killing the ogres as a net positive; and he was foresighted enough to give Redcloak the baseball speech at the end of the first arc ("...you gotta suck it up and realize it's the season that matters..."). This is just the first time he's been in a strip where his badassery wasn't done off-panel.
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May 6, 2007 22:26
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Presumably most of the paladins had a lifetime of duty before this point to fall back on, and even if they were induced to kill each other, they still fell in the defense of the throne. I like how despite the fact that Xykon's head is just a grinning skull, that is still a perfectly recognizable "ohhhhhhh poo poo" facial expression.
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May 8, 2007 02:15
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They're all ghosts, hence they're undead, hence they're immune to mind effects like the symbol of insanity. Past that, all bets are off, since as far as I know these are a new kind of "monster" that's been created for the strip.
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May 8, 2007 03:03
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Volga Boatman posted:I don't think there are that many arcane spells that can hurt ghosts, really. Does banishment work on them? Great bloody giant explody fireballs work on them just fine.
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May 8, 2007 03:48
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Presumably Soon understands why she chose to do that and allowed her into the club regardless. An ethical code of conduct is necessarily flexible.
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May 8, 2007 17:24
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The question is whether or not he's prepared any anti-undead spells. He's prepared a whole lot of spells with which to kill living opponents, but I think the ghost martyrs have thrown him for a loop.
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May 8, 2007 22:57
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greatn posted:Sorcerers can cast whatever they want as long as they know the spell and have a slot left. Good point. I'm still not used to the idea of non-wizard arcane casters.
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May 9, 2007 09:06
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Backdoor Blanche posted:If Redcloak wants the war to end NOW, why doesn't he let the shadow-covered monster fight? Redcloak hates the MitS and has spent the entire comic up until this point being annoyed by it. The MitS is also so stupid that the best way to get it to do something is to order it to do the precise opposite of whatever you want it to do. I can see why he'd just ignore it in a situation like this one. rantmo posted:She Sneak Attacks, she's at least a little Rogueish. She swapped out her Bardic Lore for dice of Sneak Attack, Unearthed Arcana-styles :X
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May 12, 2007 17:41
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Durkon still needs to uncork some random moment of awesome, and that's pretty much what they'd need at this point.
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May 12, 2007 22:52
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The original plan was to let Xykon get into the throne room, with Azure City's destruction as a high but still secondary priority. Redcloak and Xykon also didn't care how many hobgoblins they had to sacrifice in order to achieve either goal. Thus, Redcloak's opening strategies aren't aimed at breaking the defenses so much as they're aimed at occupying as many of the enemy soldiers as possible while killing as many hobgoblins as possible. Now, with his change of heart, it's a happy accident that he's reduced Azure City's defenses enough that he has an obvious weakness to exploit.
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May 15, 2007 16:05
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Maybe all those nobles on their boats could come in for a last-minute save.
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May 15, 2007 18:10
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The only aces in the hole left that I can think of are as follows: - The nobles come back and retake the city. Depending on just how much force they have to throw around, this could work, although it'd be politically disastrous for Hinjo. - The ghost-martyrs boil out of the throne room with Xykon's skull on a stick and start killing hobgoblins. How much of an impact this has depends on how many ghost-martyrs there are; Soon being there suggests that every paladin to fall in Azure City's service is now a ghost-martyr, but that only covers the last seventy years or so. - V hits the castle library and comes out loaded for bear. - Durkon uncorks his badass moment. I'm having a hard time thinking of anything he could do to singlehandedly turn the tide, but I don't know d20 3.5 clerics very well. - Tsukiko has some kind of change of heart. Maybe Elan charms her or something. Other possibilities that aren't aces in the hole, but are high face cards, include Miko, the Linear Guild, and Celia's talisman.
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May 17, 2007 06:30
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Quarex posted:I suppose it makes sense to show what happens to the clone-Xykons before going back to show what happened to the real one, so that means there is probably another intermediate-strip in store (showing what happened with the hobgoblin overrun? Maybe a cut back to the nobles on the ship?) before showing, hmm, apparently Belkar dealing with the last clone. Actually, with this strip, all three of the Xykon clones have been dealt with in one way or another. Belkar is using the eye of fear and flame as a wand, the death knight got crushed by the falling dragon head, and Durkon just whacked the last one.
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May 18, 2007 02:38
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And he can, because he has the eye of fear and flame's head.
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May 19, 2007 22:58
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Assuming Redcloak heads back outside the city to do it.
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May 20, 2007 02:10
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Maldraedior posted:Theoretically, couldn't a high level fighter with greatsword specialization, a +5 Greatsword, and Great Cleave hold that breach against some piddly hobgoblins indefinitely? Or at least until the fiendish mastodon showed up? Only so many could fit through each round, and any that didn't die to Attacks of Opportunity would be slaughtered with one attack+cleave on Roy's turn. Actually, the only way that Roy would get an attack of opportunity against a charging hobgoblin is if V enlarged him or if he had two of my favorite feats in the game, Combat Reflexes and Hold the Line. Having Hold the Line and high Dexterity (which Roy doesn't seem to have; if you look at how he behaves throughout the strip, Dexterity and Charisma seem to be Roy's dump stats) generally does mean you're death on two legs in situations like this one.
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May 20, 2007 06:35
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