The HTPC Thread - Dont buy an HTPC - The Something Awful Forums

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Inspect Your Gadgets > The HTPC Thread - Dont buy an HTPC

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Randi Challenger posted:

coreAVC and a good codec pack will do wonders without dedicated HD hardware decoding.

I guess I'm nitpicking, but it's the processor (and software) that's going to determine if you can handle HD.

Saying a motherboard can handle HD playback indicates that is has some significant role in determining if you can playback HD, which isn't really true.

# ¿ Feb 14, 2008 16:56

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# ¿ May 9, 2024 11:03

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Mr FancySocks posted:

I see, althought I am a little confused then.
From the MA69GM specs/reviews :
edit: I understand that the processor + software do most of the work, but surely the mobo's integrated also has work to do?

I'm not sure why they're claiming that, but the only chipsets that do true hd video processing are the ati 24/2600 (3850?), and the 8500/600/800 GT series. The x1250 video chipset doesn't offer any kind of substantial CPU usage reduction for HD that I've heard of, which is confirmed by a lot of people on avsforum who use that board. Don't get me wrong, it's apparently a great board for HTPCs, but it's still processor dependent for HD decoding.

The upcoming nvidia/ati (780g/8200) onboard chipsets have the hd processing capabilities that mimic the standalone cards. Of course those still require playback software that supports hardware decoding (PowerDVD only at the moment).

Crackbone fucked around with this message at 19:29 on Feb 14, 2008

# ¿ Feb 14, 2008 19:09

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

bacon! posted:

The extra cooler is because the cpu is OEM, and doesn't come with a cooler. Plus, I heard the stock cooler was loud...this Scythe has been universally recommended as being efficient/quiet.

Also, thanks to this thread: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=2771589 I took another $32 off the total price.

Edit:
Should I just get this instead?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103210
$10 more, but $20 off the total price if I drop the cooler. The reviews say its quiet

Actually you should probably be buying this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103194&Tpk=5000%2bblack

The reason being is that the multiplier is unlocked, so with literally a couple of keystrokes you can make this chip run at 6000 speeds with no problem at all.

# ¿ Feb 15, 2008 00:26

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

bacon! posted:

So thats a better deal than this one:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103242

Is the multiplier not unlocked on that one?

To my knowledge, the Black edition is the only chip that an unlocked multiplier in the Athlon family right now. The 5400+ isn't a bad deal either. It really comes down to if you want to piss around with O/C'ing (although multiplier changing is about as easy as it gets).

# ¿ Feb 15, 2008 15:18

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

vanilla slimfast posted:

For recording and playing back broadcast HD content (mpeg2), that cpu and video combo should be fine. For playback of high-compression hd content (x264), however, it will probably struggle.

An e8400 should be able to brute force high end x264 content just fine. I've got an e2160 at 3Ghz which can play 1080p x264 fine.

# ¿ Feb 17, 2008 03:44

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

VulgarandStupid posted:

Cross-posted from the SH/SC parts thread:

I've been out of the parts game for a little while now. I'm considering building an HTPC soon. Now, I currently have a half-assed HTPC. It's an Athlon 64 3000+, 2GB DDR400, 7900GS. That is currently adequate for running all of my emulators, 1080P downloaded content, etc on my big screen. However, a few things are bothering me. It's ATX and in a vertical case. I haven't seen an HTPC cases that are ATX that I like/fit my requirements. Also, the on-board USB ports blew on my mobo, which is annoying me. I was considering just buying an mATX motherboard, but apparently 939 boards are going the way of the dingo. I like the Antec NSK2480 case and have found a site to get it fairly cheaply. So my questions are: What would be better, an AM2 system running a lower end X2 or a Intel system running a Celeron Conroe of similar price? Also, which graphics card is generally considered the cheapest, yet can still handle any HD content you can throw at it and has HDCP?

Either chipset on the low end is going to be fairly interchangable. For what it's worth though, Intel, AMD, and Nvidia are all introducing mATX board with onboard graphic chipsets that do HD decoding (and should all handle HDCP no problem). You can get one 780g chipset now here, and it should be available everywhere by the end of March. The Nvida 8200 chipset is supposed to be soon (AMD chips), but reportedly has some heat issues. The Intel solution is due around June/July.

Also, where did you find a cheap NSK2480? Was it mwave?

# ¿ Feb 19, 2008 20:33

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Saukkis posted:

I don't think HDCP is necessary currently. A Blu-ray movie may require it, but I haven't heard of any that does it.

Yeah, dfn already covered this, but it has to be stressed that 1080p from Bluray is not possible without A) a fully compliant HDCP video card/monitor/tv, or B) something that strips the HDCP protections.

# ¿ Feb 22, 2008 20:58

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

OldSenileGuy posted:

I'm using a 1.66Ghz Mac Mini Core Duo with 1GB of ram as my HTPC. It can handle 720p HD material fine usually, but in the past couple days I've noticed on some HD movies when there's a lot of action going on, there will be slowdown and/or stuttering. Will adding another GB of ram help alleviate this problem, or is it something that can only be fixed by having a faster processor or video card?

Stuttering on high action/movement scenes is almost certainly the processor. More ram is unlikely to help, and video cards don't really touch HD decoding (unless they are specific models using specific software).

Can you grab a dashboard widget that will track your cpu/ram usage? It would be an easy way to verify what's being overburdened.

# ¿ Feb 26, 2008 18:00

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

For what it's worth, Nvidia's new 8200 chipset is due out on March 4th, which is their mATX solution, with an integrated video chipset that does onboard decoding.

Even cooler is there are big hints that Nvidia will release a codec pack that will utilize full GPU decoding on all HD formats (MPEG2, VC1, x264). So no more PowerDVD required!

# ¿ Feb 28, 2008 18:22

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Randi Challenger posted:

Well this is pretty good as I have to wait for 8500s to get back in stock and settle down in price. If I can find a nicely priced 8200 based mobo that does on board decoding, that'll straight tits. Do you have any links to articles or anything that I can read up on?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=990188

They're definitely going to be HDMI solutions available. I'm trying to get clarification from a guy about this supposed Nvidia codec. Either way, onboard cards capable of HD decoding is really awesome. Apparently the Intel solutions are due soon as well.

# ¿ Feb 28, 2008 20:50

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Strict 9 posted:

I posted this in the SHSC parts thread, and got a response that it was my processor causing the problem ...

The weird thing is that I swear my system used to be able to handle those files just fine. Do I really need a new system to be able to handle 720p videos?

I didn't say you needed a new system to play 720p, I said I'd suspect (based off my old system experience) that you're probably seeing high CPU usage on x264 720p files - I recall a couple doing 69-80% on my old Athlon 3500.

You didn't specify what resolution these new video are at. If they're 1080p stutter free playback is out of the question. If they're 720p, are the stuttering in general or only in high action scenes? Are all of you files now stuttering, or just the new ones?

You can always download a widget to see CPU/Ram Usage (or just open up task manager) to see what's actually being taxed on your system.

And Nathan's right, it could be a codec issue, have you updated recently?

# ¿ Feb 29, 2008 18:44

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Strict 9 posted:

Why hello there.

Actually, to begin with I should double check to make sure those videos are in 720p, but I am fairly certain they are. The stuttering occurs almost instantly and seems to have nothing to do with the action on-screen. Only the "new" files are stuttering, but I don't have any old x264 files to compare with unfortunately. Xvid and such files are still playing fine, as are my DVDs.

I'm not sure how I didn't think to check for updated codecs. I think my fear is that I must have spent hours tweaking settings based off advise at avsforums.com and didn't want to risk losing that.

I'll do a codec update and check my task manager to see what exactly is being used. Thanks for the advise.

"Tweaking"... does that mean you're doing some sort of postprocessing on these files through something like FFDSHOW? What's your player software setup?

# ¿ Feb 29, 2008 19:59

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Juriko posted:

You really shouldn't be post processing ay HD files. It is ridiculously cpu intensive and can lead to a lot of issues. Processing makes sense when upscaling but that is about it.

Exactly the sentiment above. That's why I asked about postprocessing. While I read AVS as well, those people who postprocess are usually obsessive freaks with "golden eye" syndrome. If you're doing anything other than playback of x264 files through FFDSHOW, turn off the other junk.

# ¿ Feb 29, 2008 22:23

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Fifty Three posted:

I am attempting to output video from a Radeon HD2600XT to my Mitsubishi WD-62327 DLP HDTV, via DVI-D cable. Nothing ever goes as smoothly as one would hope, though.

If I use any resolution above 720x480, I get green specks and broken lines over the blacks, and weird other colors all around. However, I can use the desktop and watch videos etc. just fine, despite the graphical silliness. Because the TV cannot do 720p, but can do 1080i, my only options when outputting 1920x1080 are 29i Hz and 30i Hz. I've also tried anti-overscan resolutions such as 1776x1000@30Hz and 29Hz, with the same green screwiness as 1080i. It's probably worth noting that checking "alternate DVI operational mode" reduces the green dots, but not completely.

There's an excellent chance I'm completely missing something and loving up here (including, but not limited to, choosing the wrong thread to ask for help in), so feel free to persecute me. Once you're done with that, please help.

Edit: It seems like the weirdness happens for all 29-30i resolutions, and none of the resolutions for which my TV is capable of 59-60Hz.

I just looked up your TV, and all the sites I went to say it's a 720p set. I don't see where you got 1080i from - have you tried 1280x720 yet?
Additionally, there's no point in trying to feed an interlaced signal to a natively progressive set - all you're doing is forcing the TV to resample the image for progressive display.

Crackbone fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Mar 4, 2008

# ¿ Mar 4, 2008 03:57

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Fifty Three posted:

Yeah. I get yellow text along the bottom of the screen, reading, "No 720p- change output to 1080i for HD."

The input labels on the back, as well as the owner's manual, all say 480i/p and 1080i only. Not sure why everywhere on the internet says otherwise. :/

Attempting to force anything above 720x480 at a refresh rate above 30i Hz, by the way, yields the same message.

Well, I found this:
http://www.highdefforum.com/archive/index.php/t-10742.html

Which confirms what you're saying, and what I'm saying.

I don't know what to tell you - a set that is natively 720p, but will not accept a 720p signal? That's some serious design retardation right there, and it makes me think the set is going to have a really hard time dealing with HTPC output.

Crackbone fucked around with this message at 04:31 on Mar 4, 2008

# ¿ Mar 4, 2008 04:26

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Peacebone posted:

I have a question about getting the right resolution with my Vizio VX32L TV from my HP Laptop. Now on the specs page for the Vizio it says that running HDMI from the computer it only accepts 640x480 resolution. My computer resolution doesn't go down to 640x480 and I'm trying to get it to display the resolution properly so I can use the TV as my monitor for my laptop.

The weird thing is that even if it the resolution is off it still displays 720p HD stuff fine when played through VLC player at full screen. Anyone have any ideas on how to get the right resolution. My videocard is a Geforce 8400M GS

Where did you read that it only supported 640x480? The manual for that TV has these resolutions listed as supported.

code:

Resolution Refresh (Hz) H.Freq (kHz) V.Freq (Hz) H.Sync V.Sync Pixel Freq (MHz)
640x480 60 31.5 59.94 N N 25.175
640x480 75 37.5 75.00 N N 31.500
720x400 70 31.46 70.08 N P 28.320
800x600 60 37.9 60.317 P P 40.000
800x600 75 46.9 75 P P 49.500
800x600 85 53.7 85.06 P P 56.250
1024x768 60 48.4 60.01 N N 65.000
1024x768 75 60.0 75.03 P P 78.750
*1366x768 60 47.7 60.00 P N 85.500

What happens when you try to hook up the monitor without VLC running?

# ¿ Mar 11, 2008 13:54

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Boywunda posted:

Would my old system be able to handle 720p/1080i playback?

CPU - Pentium 4 3.0
Video - Saphire X1950
RAM - 1 GB DDR2

I'm thinking about using it as my HTPC, and use my Quad Core for gaming. The only thing I really want to be able to do is play downloaded HD content as well as install a Tuner card for PVRing HD content. I currently have a XBMC for all my media streaming, but doesn't handle HD and I really want to watch my downloaded HD media, as well as possibly PVRing HD content as well.

You might be able to handle 720p, but 1080 is going to be a stretch.

# ¿ Mar 13, 2008 22:14

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Jowogra posted:

Im looking into to getting HDTV for my HTPC, but hooking up a HD cable box would be a pain and not work well, so im looking into getting a Cablecard, i know i need a adapter to hook up the card to the PC, and the PC has hdmi out.

But what i dont know, is if i need a different tv tuner card for the HTPC, right now i have a haupauge 500 i think, anyone know of any specific ones that do work, or a list of ones that do work with it?

Edit. Link to current tv tuner card http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815116628

You absolutely CANNOT use a cablecard to watch/record HD cable on a regular PC. You have to have specific PCs from OEM vendors with special bios that enable the use of HD cablecard tuners.

Maybe hackers will figure out how to circumvent the bios lockout eventually, but right now it is not possible.

# ¿ Mar 21, 2008 02:23

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

dfn_doe posted:

You can use an ATI Occur external HD cablecard tuner box... Not sure what availability is on those right now, but AFAIK it's the absolutely only way to get cablecard tuning on a box not equipped as such from the OEM.

The only way those will install drivers/show as a tuner in Media Center is to have the special bios that allows the whole thing to work.

Where have you seen differently?

# ¿ Mar 21, 2008 03:57

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

dfn_doe posted:

I'm not sure what you're talking about, but the ATI Occur is an external tuner box which is connected via USB and is/was intended to be sold as an add on for existing systems. AFAIK it doesn't require any specific OEM computer or "special bios" to be used, although I'm not sure if ATI ever even managed to ship the thing.

I think you are referring to systems which come equipped with a cablecard tuner *card* not the external tuner box. I could be totally wrong, but I think that is what I read last time I looked into it.

No, the ATI Ocur is exactly what I'm talking about. The reason you can't just buy one alone is because of the OEM/bios limitations.

If you could buy a cablecard tuner standalone the HTPC community would be on fire talking about it. You CAN'T use one without buying specific pre-made PCs.

# ¿ Mar 21, 2008 14:28

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Evil Kaneval posted:

My main PC is getting fairly old - it can play 720P without any problem but has trouble with 1080P. I'm looking at turning this into my HTPC and getting an entirely new setup for my office. I was wondering what hardware aspect of my current setup is the bottleneck that results in crap 1080P playback. Is it my AMD 64 3200+ processor (2.21GHz)? Is it my one GB of RAM? Or is it my video card - GeForce 6600, 512MB. Just curious what minimal upgrade I could perform to get 1080P working well without stutter.

Thanks.

Ram doesn't have any bearing on it. You have two options:

1. A faster processor - something along the lines of a Core 2 Duo chip running at 2.6 - 3.0Ghz. People may say less but high-bitrate 1080p files need a lot of horsepower. I'm assuming that's a socket 939 chipset, and no chip you can easily acquire will be fast enough.

2. A new video card with HD video decoding capabilities. Currently the Geforce 8500/8600/8800 series, the ATI 2400/2600/3xxx series cards offload the HD decoding from the processor to the card. They're all PCI-E cards to my knowledge.
If you go this route you also need a copy of PowerDVD Ultra, which is the only software that can utilize the HD decoding capabilities of these cards right now.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2008 13:46

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Evil Kaneval posted:

Thanks for the response. So something like this combined with PowerDVD Ultra would enable me play 1080p x264 movies without a problem? I think that would be the cheapest route.

It would give you the horsepower, but you also need to consider that you'll need a Blu-ray drive unless you're dealing with :filez:

, which we'll avoid. Also, Bluray discs need a HDCP protected path, which means your display device will need to be HDCP compliant otherwise it will force a downrez of the signal.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2008 22:20

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

dealmaster posted:

I thought if the display wasn't HDCP compliant no image would be displayed at all.

Theoretically it can also force the signal to downgrade to 480p - but a black screen is possible as well. I don't know PowerDVD handles it because my setup is HDCP compliant.

# ¿ Mar 24, 2008 23:18

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Saukkis posted:

I believe that would also require using Vista.

You're probably right, I hadn't thought of that, since I've been using Vista for quite a while now.

# ¿ Mar 25, 2008 03:50

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Fifty Three posted:

Hardware acceleration is enabled in PowerDVD, but one line of the "information" tab reads:

Video Accelerator: DirectX VA (not in use)

What video card are you using, and do you have "filter paks" installed?

# ¿ Mar 26, 2008 23:27

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Mr. Boogalow posted:

I've been researching building HTPCs and am almost ready to take the plunge.

What I'd like to do is convert all ~700 movies / TV series that I own into a digital format (I can convert to .iso files using Aimersoft's DVDRipper) and store / play them on a HTPC. All of the movies are SD, but I plan on buying HD movies through Amazon Unbox. I have no interest in ripping TV shows or movies from cable, at least not right now.

After spending a bit of time on NewEgg, this is a preliminary list of components:
*Case: Silverstone GD01B-MXR with Remote (Simply gorgeous, but I'm concerned that the LCD won't work with Ubuntu)
*Graphics Card: EVGA 320-P2-N811-AR with GeForce 8800GTS
*Power Supply: Enermax Liberty ELT500AWT
*Hard Drive: 1 TB Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 (I'd be getting more for storage and backup eventually, this is more of a start-up)
*Motherboard: ASUS Crosshair
*CPU: Athlon 64 X2 6000+
*RAM: G.SKILL 4GB DDR2 800
*The TV everything will play on: Vizio VU42LF (Already own; HD, no DVI input so I'd have to buy a DVI->HDMI cable)
I plan on installing Ubuntu rather than Windows XP/Vista and will be using MeediOS or similar.

This all adds up to about $1,300. While reading the thread I've noticed that systems are being built for half of this, though I'm not sure if those can play HD files. The only component that I'm 90% set on is the case, as aesthetics play a big part. I think I've made a list for a gaming system rather than a HTPC, can anyone offer some value engineering ideas / suggestions?

I have a couple more questions:
*Can HTPCs upconvert SD files?
*Is there a better format for ripped movies than .iso?

I agree with Dealmaster almost entirely, to add:

Motherboards with HDMI out aren't limited to it, it functions just like any other video output. Many have DVI and VGA built in as well, so that's not an issue.

HTPCs can definitely upscale DVDs, although don't expect any miracles in picture improvement. The motherboard dealmaster described does do HD decoding in the chipset, but to my knowlegdge it's windows only, and I think you indicated a Linux install. Theoretically the processor could handle HD video but my knowledge of how it performs in Linux is nil.
Finally, as long as your preferred front end can read your rips, I don't think it really matters what you put them into. You could make an argument for ripping to a higher compression codec to save space, but otherwise .iso is probably fine.

# ¿ Mar 27, 2008 22:15

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Fifty Three posted:

MSI Radeon HD 2600XT. I have the CCCP installed. Thassall.

I have no idea what the cccp pak is but if it's a filter pack it should uninstalled as they can seriously mess with hd playback decoding.

Finally, what are you trying to play? Bluray, HDDVD, mkv, etc.

# ¿ Mar 27, 2008 23:28

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Fifty Three posted:

It's the Combined Community Codec Pack, for playing all the different stupid formats fansub studios put out. I'll try uninstalling it when I get the chance.

I'm trying to play 720p H264 .mkv files with Media Player Classic.

It doesn't sound like you're doing anything wrong.

Do you have other media to try? I know there are .mkvs are sometimes encoded in a way that won't allow video card to do hardware decoding.

# ¿ Mar 28, 2008 19:37

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Kill Bodies posted:

For my HTPC I'd like to have an emulator. Now because I've been through a shitload of joypads, the only one I trust is the PS2 controller.

Has anyone seen an external bay that allows you to plug a PS2 controller in to the front of the computer? I've looked on new egg and several other sites but can't seem to find one. I've only seen the the cord type like this one. http://www.hartsunlimited.com/supdualboxwi.html

I doubt you'd find a niche port plate like that, since usb adaptors are far easier to use/buy.

You should really consider an Xbox 360 controller (wired or wireless) if you're using windows.

# ¿ Apr 3, 2008 17:11

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Vykk.Draygo posted:

Is there a difference between the regular xbox 360 controller and the ones labeled as being for windows, or would I be able to use my 360 controller in windows just by buying the USB dongle?

They're completely identical, and yes, buying the dongle will make it work.

# ¿ Apr 4, 2008 02:41

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Kreez posted:

I'm pretty sure you're completely wrong on this. The Intel G35 chipset can handle pretty much anything with it's onboard video. The G45 is coming out soon too I think, which should be even better.

No, you're completely wrong on this. The G35 chipset (along with about every video card made in recent memory) can handle outputting video at 1080p. However, the hard part is decoding the video format. The G35 has no hardware based acceleration for VC-1/x264. That's all got to be brute-force decoded by your processor. So your PC might be able to run highdef media, but it's the CPU, not the video card, that's "handling" the media.

The G45 chipset is going to have HD HWA. And somebody else mentioned the 780g AMD chipset, which also does HD HWA. Personally, after dealing with HWA, I think I'd prefer straight CPU-processing, but that doesn't change the fact the G35 onboard video doesn't do poo poo for video decoding.

Crackbone fucked around with this message at 18:52 on Jun 13, 2008

# ¿ Jun 13, 2008 18:50

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Alowishus posted:

Umm you sure about this? Intel's product brief on the G35 says it supports "dedicated hardware acceleration for MPEG2, WMV9, and VC1 content." The best thing about Intel chips is that they're open sourcing their drivers for Linux.

Without going into long details, MPEG2 acceleration is worthless (any processor from 5 years ago can decode it with no problem), WMV9 isn't typically used for HD video (and thus acceleration isn't that great), and the VC-1 acceleration is about the same at the early Geforce 8000 series (500/600), which is to say minimal at best. The press releases don't mean much compared to the experiences of users, of which you can read lots and lots of over at AVSforum (if you deal with asperger-videophiles).

On top of all that x264 is really the codec that puts a strain on processors, and what almost every piece of HD media uses now.

The G45 is incorporating "proper" HD HWA, that truly moves the majority of the processing to the video card. Even then you require software that supports HWA and those are few in number, and none in Linux at the moment, to reference your post.

Short version: The press release is largely marketing bullshit, x264 is the only one that truly matters if you're wanting your video card to "handle" high def material. Otherwise stick to a beefy processor to run it.

Crackbone fucked around with this message at 20:45 on Jun 13, 2008

# ¿ Jun 13, 2008 20:38

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Kreez posted:

Ok, so if G35 doesn't provide any hardware acceleration worth mentionning, and it can still handle anything thrown at it with any core 2 duo, what's the point in recommending that people buy a video card on top of that?

I mean, I'm sure some people need their processor free while watching their movies, but I'd say for 98% of the HTPC's out there, nobody is running Prime95 or something while watching their movies.
edit: I guess maybe someone might want to have the CPU free to encode from their tuner.

I didn't recommend somebody buy a card on top of that. I specifically said with all the pitfalls of videocard HWA I lean towards brute force CPU decoding anymore. The G35 is a good board, particularly because it's an Intel chipset with HDMI out that can also carry lossless audio over the HDMI port.

I used to prefer HWA video cards, but with the price of processors dropping and the speed jumping up, it's starting to become easier to just slap in a fast chip and not have to dick around with driver/powerdvd/filter horseshit.

And from a movie standpoint, you don't want decoding to do 90% on your processor because at that point anything else that happens (encoding, updates, rogue process) is going to max your processor, leading to dropped frames. Keep in mind a lot of people were and are running chips that can't handle 1080p x264 well, and a HWA card was a cheap fix to allow it without redoing your entire setup.

Crackbone fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Jun 13, 2008

# ¿ Jun 13, 2008 21:32

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

NuclearFusi0n posted:

Is a GeForce 8400GS sufficient to play 1080p x264 content on a Pentium D 3.0Ghz? It plays 720p fine right now with a crappy no-acceleration video card, but 1080p is not possible.

Low profile case, so 8400gs is the best I can find in low profile. or an ATI x1650pro?? Any suggestions for low profile cards?

In theory, yes, as the card should offload the decoding from the CPU. That chip is on the low end, so you may still see higher CPU usage than tests show (under 30% on more modern chipsets). Keep in mind you'll still need PowerDVD to utilize the GPU decoding.

# ¿ Jun 17, 2008 14:03

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Peacebone posted:

I can't get my Nvidia Geforce 8400M GS to set up a custom resolution so I can get my HDTV's native resolution of 1366 x 768. The drivers are the latest that HP has supplied with (I'm on laptop.) It's really frustrating because at 1280 x 720 I would think it would display fine on the TV (Vizio VX32L) but only some of the screen shows up (can't see some of the taskbar/etc). I'm hooking it up via HDMI from my laptop. I'm wondering if a VGA cable would solve the problem but I doubt it since it has to do with Nvidia's control panel. Anyone have any ideas?

Most TVs have natural overscan, which is completely normal. The video processor in the TV can probably only accept 720p (most don't accept odd variants of resolutions like computers can), which it then internally scales to 768p.
A VGA cable is not likely to have any effect. Your best option is to find the overscan correction settings in the nvidia control panel and play with them. After that you can try custom resolutions using powerstrip, but frankly it's not worth the hassle for most people.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2008 22:30

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Kreez posted:

Sounds reasonable. I think I'm just going to ignore hardware acceleration, it doesn't seem worth the $120 I could save by not needing to buy a top of the line processor.

What makes the Intel based P5E-VM worth $55 more than the nVidia based P5N-EM (who names this poo poo?) for someone like me, who wants nothing more than the following out of a mATX HTPC motherboard:
-A couple USB ports, ethernet port, a SATA plug or two, a PATA plug for my DVD drive, and a fan header that isn't located in the worst possible place.
-Will let me build my computer in 5 minutes, drop the CPU and RAM in, never have to think about it again. I don't need to overclock or anything, again, I'll just spend the extra money on the processor and not have to deal with buggy BIOSs, higher temps, etc. in a cramped little case.

edit: not really belonging in this thread, but are the Nehalem chips next winter going to be LGA775? Any chance they'll work with today's motherboards? Or does a new architechture imply completely new chipset/socket?

The P5E-VM charges such a premium because it's one of the only G35 board with onboard HDMI, and it can also output full lossless audio over the interface. There's nothing wrong with the nVidia solution, although if you're going for brute force playback the Core 2 chips have an edge on raw horsepower. Also, the 630i chipset is rather old. The 780g nVidia have motherboard with the onboard video cards that can do HWA, should you desire it.

And Nehalem is a new socket design.

# ¿ Jun 19, 2008 13:12

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Fuzz1111 posted:

A board that will fit your requirements, and be cheap, is actually the same board I got (Gigabyte GA-945GCM-S2L) but you wont be able to put a 333/1333fsb cpu in it (IE: Intel E6x50 or higher). You neednt have to though, the E22xx chips are plenty fast for HTPC usage even at stock speed.

The e21/2200 series are good chips, but at stock speeds they're not going to be able to handle high bitrate HD material. e4500s are faster and can still struggle on the higher end of the 1080p scale. Sure you can overclock, but then you're dealing with O/C on (primarily) mATX boards, and the added heat and noise in HTPC cases becomes a concern. There's been a lot of improvement on the software decoding side, but we're probably still a generation of hardware away from no-hassle HD decoding, especially if you factor in lossless audio.

It doesn't help either that 1080p video is encoded in so many varying bitrates - it makes straight comparisons really hard to get.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2008 14:56

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

TyChan posted:

Are those Shuttle SFF cases good for HTPC functions? Would any of the current models work for a HTPC on their own or would I have to get a separate video card too? Would the cards that can handle 1080p work fit in the case? They're a bit cramped as it is and I suspect you can't put in a double-width card in a case like that.

Depends on what you want from your HTPC. You could theoretically get a shuttle that supports a high end cpu (e8400), and do HD processing through brute force, which eliminates the need for a video card. Past that most people put a TV tuner in, although those aren't so big that you can't fit them in a shuttle case.
It's doable but you don't have a lot of flexibility that even a mATX case can provide.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2008 19:48

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

dfn_doe posted:

Note: I'm not trying to accuse or point fingers at anyone in particular, I'm just trying to make clear that some of the suggestions I'm seeing on this thread are going to result in less than ideal performance and quality. Anybody who goes with software and sits down to watch an action heavy 1080i scene will quickly understand why hardware deinterlacing and decoding is preferable.

If you're getting your material through legal sources, (ie Bluray discs), the video format on the disc going to be 1080p, so deinterlacing wouldn't be needed. The only thing I can think of that outputs in 1080i is one of the broadcast networks HD feeds. Where else are you going to get a native 1080i signal from that your PC will have to de-interlace?

Or am I mis-understanding what you mean by deinterlace? Are you talking about taking 24fps from a video source up to 60fps on a display?

And while HD cards are a great thing, there are still a lot of potental problems with utilizing it. I've seen countless thread of people who can't get hardware acceleration enabled for a variety of reasons.

Crackbone fucked around with this message at 20:42 on Jun 20, 2008

# ¿ Jun 20, 2008 20:29

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# ¿ May 9, 2024 11:03

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

dfn_doe posted:

I use all legal legitimately paid for and installed software and it JUST WORKS. anything that supports output via directshow can use the filters and they do exactly what they say they'll do. My config is as close to box stock as it comes. Anybody walking into a store to build an HTPC could buy this hardware and software and install it without fiddling with anything and it'll just do as it's supposed to.

Please quit blaming everything on piracy. It's like claiming any other piece of software works 100% of the time with no problems.

# ¿ Jun 21, 2008 01:42

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Inspect Your Gadgets > The HTPC Thread - Dont buy an HTPC

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