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Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

sokatoah posted:

Is it possible to get decent 2.1 sound without running though amps and receivers and head units and god knows what other gadgets I see talked about here?

The Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 would probably make you happy. Can be had under $150, and would sound a hell of a lot better than those Logitechs. Does it have to be 2 POINT ONE? There are some reasonably priced active monitors out there. Around $200 - $300 would get you sound that would kick those Klipchs' rear end. No sub, but really all computer speaker subs suck and you won't find anything truly good for less than a few hundred.

The reson why you'd want to get a receiver + bookshelfs (or whatever) is for upgrading in the future. It just makes it easy, if one day you're like "hey I want new speakers" you can go get nicer ones and hook them up to that same receiver and hear the difference. With powered speakers, if you ever want to upgrade, you'll have to start all over again.

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Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

androo posted:

e: ohh, just realized there are wireless systems out there. How does this look?

Do not get Logitech speakers. They sound like rear end. What is your budget?

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

steckles posted:

I'm interested in giving tubes a try now. Does anyone have any suggestions for tube amps that are of reasonable quality and price? I'm looking to spend a thousand or less. Preferably less.

Any particular reason for wanting to go tubes? Do you want your sound to be accurate or sound a certain way, because tubes are not accurate. They simply distort the sound, but if that sound is what you're after...

Solid state isn't meant to "sound" a certain way, just amplify the signal.

That said, I've heard those Monitor 7s and they're nice, albeit a bit forward and bright. Maybe a tube would make them sound better even to me, so it's worth looking in to.

$1,000 isn't a whole lot, but this is what immediately came to mind: Onix SP3 Tube Integrated Amplifier

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

WanderingKid posted:

:science::words:

Ah, thanks. You clearly know much more about this than myself.

I still like that Onix amp...

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Achates posted:

... a nice pair of speakers ... my high end being about $150.

Sorry to break it to ya but...

Ok, I'm kidding. Kind of.

I would look at these guys. Use the remaining $50 to get a decent used receiver.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Toothy posted:

I'm considering whether or not to buy a Harman Kardon AVR145 Receiver off craigslist.
http://electronics.pricegrabber.com/home-audio-receivers/m/27284857/details/

I noticed that there are only 40W per channel. Now, I have two full-range speakers that deliver decent bass, but I don't know if 40W will suffice. Is that wattage common for a 5.1 surround receiver? Is Harman Kardon generally considered a good brand, or should I stick with Sony or Pioneer?

Why are you looking at surround receivers if you only have two speakers? You could get a much better stereo one (used) for less money. Well, actually, how much is the craigslist listing for?

When you say full range, are they floorstanding? How many drivers? 40W should be enough to drive even large speakers very very loud, but you'll be using a lot of the wattage and there won't be much overhead so you'll be driving the amp hard most of the time.

edit:

Boner Slam posted:

Both can be good, both can be bad.
It's one factor of speaker design but not the only one.

Yeah. Also, for the same amount of money, you will generally get better quality sound from bookshelves than floorstanders (because floorstanders have more cost in extra drivers and more material for the enclosure). There's very few floorstansders in the $500 range that are any good but there are certainly some quality bookshelves in there.

Pibborando San fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Jul 30, 2007

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Toothy posted:

All of the little speakers hook up to the sub through RCA ports, I think. Would it be stupid to try and hook the leftover center and surround speakers up to this Harman receiver? I'm not even sure how I would do it---strip the wires? Will they instantly blow out if I put 40w through them?

Do not use those sad excuses for speakers with your big ones, ESPECIALLY not for the center channel. It is extremely important that the center channel match the left and right speakers. This is really the only case where you NEED matching speakers or else when people talk or sound pans from left to right (or vice versa) it will change in weird ways and totally ruin the immersion. The surrounds and sub can be whatever you want, but the front three should be from the same speaker line ideally. You said they were made, so finding a matching center might be impossible unless you had your brother build that for you too.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Toothy posted:

Is the center channel vital in a 5.1 setup? If it were absent, would dialogue instead emit from the front L&R or would it be all echoy and poo poo?

Well, I'm assuming your 5.1 amp has separate speaker terminals for L, R, C, LS, RS, and Sub. So with no center channel it would still route the center channel audio to the center channel speaker terminal. But since there'd be no speaker connected to it... I guess you'd be missing out on a lot.

Are you running a 2-speaker set-up or some kind of weird 4.1 for some odd reason. Why not just use a stereo amp then? I do.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

BFD Zio posted:

Thoughts on these please

Looking for a 5.1 speaker setup only, got a 'nice' Pioneer receiver that I bought 2 years ago already..just need new speakers.

Any suggestions too...I am looking to buy TODAY...~$200 nothing too special, cheaper is better always.

I would be willing to spend some more if anyone can point out a good setup with some tower speakers (maybe buy all seperate)?

The only setup with towers ANYWHERE near that price would be the Radiient Helios 5 channel system for $399 w/ shipping (was $499). Radiient is basically slightly higher end Insignia stuff, which is evident from the speakers' design. That means they'll probably sound pretty decent. At least MUCH better than any HTIB.

Better than that would be the x-series speakers by Onix. If you want tower fronts, it would be $680 at the cheapest. These will probably sound significantly better than the Radiient stuff.

Neither of these include subs but that should be the last thing on your list.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Cuw posted:

My price range is up to $400 for a 2 speaker set of hopefully somewhat decent sounding bookshelf speakers. I know I shouldn't expect massive low end kick from these but some bass presence would be nice. I was looking at the x-series from AV123.com but I can't possibly have those before I go back to school, and it is a pain in the rear end to ship things when I am at school so if I didn't like them a return would be nearly impossible. I have heard good things about the Axiom M2 series but again I don't know where to find decent unbiased reviews.

Here's some speakers that will kick major rear end: the Totem Mites, used on Audiogon for $400.

They're nice little bookshelves that will sound GREAT, and will probably integrate well with a good sub down the road.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances
Yes, the way to get the best sound quality to the speakers would be to use a digital audio out from the computer into a stereo receiver with digital in. What sound card is in the computer already? Or, is this a hypothetical computer? If so, get a Chaintech AV-710 soundcard. Around $20 and has good quality sound (MUCH better than on board at least, and you won't find better without spending over $150 probably).

Option A: You get a receiver or integrated amp that has digital audio in. Run an optical cable from the Chaintech to the receiver.
Option B: You can't afford a good new receiver so you get an older used one that doesn't have digital in (like me). Run a mini-to-RCA cable from the rear-surround out of the Chaintech (the black one next to the optical, it has the best sound quality) to some input on the receiver.

As for speakers. Towers are the way to go if 1) you are willing to spend close to $1000 for something new and decent, or 2) are willing to spend close to or above $500 for something good and used. You will get a much better value going used in... well, all cases. I got a pair of Energy C-9s, which were $1,300 new, for $550 on eBay. They were in perfect working order and are great.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Zand posted:

Thanks so much for your help guys! What are the brands of receivers to avoid? I'm probably going to get a cheap one and a pair of bookshelf speakers. Any brands of speakers to avoid?

Totally dependant on budget. Some brands may have really good cheaper stuff but over-priced high end stuff, or some may have really good valued higher end stuff and crap cheap stuff. Anyway, what would be your budget for the speaker and amp?

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Zand posted:

probably around 200-250 for it all.. and I kind of want a sub too but as far as I can tell some of the bookshelf speakers already have really nice bass.. but I love bass a lot and it is important. Really just wanting 2 speakers + sub

Oohh... sorry to break it to ya but $200-$250 is about what you would pay for low-end entry level sub, not to mention speakers and amp as well. You've got a couple options here:

1) Get a computer speaker set-up like the Klipsch ProMedia 2.1. For computer speakers they're good but in the grand scheme of speakers, pretty crap.

2) Get two bookshelves and a used integrated amp or receiver now. Save up for a good sub down the line. This will ultimately yield FAR superior sound quality than any computer speaker system and leave room for component upgrades down the line. Better value over all.

Assuming you want to pursue option two, first look around your local craigslist or something for used speakers in your range. Ebay is another resource and so is audiogon. Oh look what I found! A pair of B&W DM 600 S3s for $200. If you can afford that right now, BUY THESE!!! They will blow you away.

If you miss your opportunity there, consider the Athena AS-B1.2s for $100. They won't be as refined as those B&Ws, but they'll sound drat good non the less.

I'll look around some for any good deals on stereo receivers.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Zand posted:

OK, probably one of the last questions here, can anyone recommend a decent receiver now for around 100 bucks (or cheaper)? 5.1 support would be nice in case I wanted to upgrade :) Really though it isn't necessary, should I just check places like goodwill/thrift stores and get an older receiver/integrated amp?

The cheapest good 5.1 receiver I'd recommend would be the Panasonic SA-XR55. But that's around $200. On eBay, here's a Denon DRA-295 receiver that would be great. Might end under your budget if you bid smart. Here's an Onkyo TX-8211 receiver, and an old school Onkyo A-7070 integrated amp around your budget.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

munchies posted:

...decent tower speakers...don't want to spend more than $400-500 on the pair.

Why do you have to make this so hard? Ok, kidding.

$500 is right around the cutoff between crap and reasonable stuff. Talking new there. If you look around for used deals you may be able to score something pretty nice. Here's a good deal on audiogon for some Acoustic Energy Aegis Evo 3s, would be pretty good. Also some KEF Q 55.2s. Also good. They are these.

Right at $500 new are the Energy C-300s. I've actually demo'd these and they're quite impressive for the price. Would not hesitate to suggest them to someone for their first towers.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Cuw posted:

Should I continue to save for good front speakers, such as full size towers, or should I half-rear end a surround sound setup, I would really only need a center channel since I have 2 small speakers I can use for rears?

Use the speakers you just got for now until you've got enough saved up (say $500 at the least) to get good mains. Actually, save up a bit more so you can get good fronts and a matching center channel. Remember it is CRUCIAL that the fronts match the center. Not so much for the surrounds and sub.

geera posted:

I know home theaters in a box are generally considered to be total crap, but Circuit City has a 7.1 Onkyo system for $500 which seems pretty good to me and has good reviews on the CC website.

No it's crap. At least the speakers. Put less than $200 of your budget into a decent receiver like the Panasonic SA-XR55 or an Onkyo, or Yamaha or H&K, etc. Then spend the other $500 on the Energy C-300s I linked above.

You will then have a great sounding stereo set-up which you can add to with speakers from the same line down the road.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

munchies posted:

Can anyone recommend a good stereo reciever. I'm strictly going to be using it for music. What I picked out was the Onkyo TX8522

I am going to be pairing them with the Acoustic Energy AEGIS Evo 3's that Pibborando San linked to. I've been reading reviews all day and I haven't read one bad review of them. So thanks for that Pibbs.

No prob! For music, I would actually go for this NAD C320BEE that just showed up on audiogon. Onkyo is good and for HT, perfectly acceptable, but NAD stuff is probably the best budget equipment you can get for music applications. The place where I demo'd the Energy C-300 were running them off that NAD unit. Sounded fantastic.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

munchies posted:

hmm.. I was trying to stay under 300 for the reciever

Oh ok. Buy this now then. Here's some reviews.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

American Jello posted:

I've got a problem outputting to my receiver with my Macbook (core duo with all software/firmware updates). Whenever the power to my laptop is plugged in, it creates a humming noise. As soon as I pull the plug and run on battery power, the hum goes away. Aside from running on battery power all the time, does anyone have any suggestions?

How are you connected to the receiver? If it's with a mini-to-RCA cable, then you've got a ground loop problem with the power supply. Does your receiver have optical in? If so, run an optical cable from the laptop to the receiver. Should fix the ground loop problem and should also sound much better as there's a 99% chance the receiver has a much better DAC than in the macbook.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances
I would get a cheap external DAC and run an optical cable from your laptop into that. Then run stereo RCA cables from the DAC to the receiver. On board sound SUCKS so this will 1) fix the ground loop, and 2) sound much better.

The Silverstone EB01-B at Newegg would be good enough. Connects via USB. Or the Entech Number Cruncher 205.2 which would have better sound quality. You'll need to get a wall-wart for that Entech though. This one would work. You'd run an optical out of your laptop to the Entech.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

American Jello posted:

I only paid $35 for the receiver, these solutions are a little out of my budget. How much would a PCI sound card with a good DAC be for an HTPC? I'm pretty sure I could piece one together from spare parts back home.

Most of them will be more than the units I listed. The only cheaper one I'd bother with is the Chaintech AV-710. I use it now and it's a big step up from on-baord. An external one like the Entech (which I will probably be getting soon) would be a bigger step up, but for now, the AV-710 should be fine. Run the cable from the rear-surround out (black one next to the optical). It has the best DAC (for some reason).

edit: If you get the Chaintech, read this guide.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

American Jello posted:

For the time being, where is the optimal place to put my computer and iTunes volume?

I use foobar and keep both it and Windows' volume at max. I control output volume with whatever amp I'm using. If you have your computer's volume low, you'll have to turn your amp up more which unnecessarily pushes it harder than you need to and raises the noise floor.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Umm, not really. You don't need a dolby digital decoder for stereo music. You need a simple DAC, but I thought you were gonna go for the Chaintech? The DACs I listed before would be the cheapest, and not total crap.

And just a heads up. You might want to watch this auction. A Pioneer Elite A-35R. It's definitely the nicest integrated amp you can get under a few hundred new.

edit: Basically those things you linked are pre-amps. You would use them if you had dedicated power amps for each channel.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

holmes9mm posted:

I found these Sony SS-B1000's at Circuit City that look similar to yours. Thoughts?

I've never heard a Sony speaker that I liked, and those look terribly cheap and lovely. Just go for these if you absolutely can't spend over $100. See if you can find some used ones elsewhere for less first.

The_Angry_Turtle posted:

I was wondering how well this technology ages because at 10 years old it seems like I could just bust 100 bucks on a mediocre newer model amp and get better quality.

This is flawed thinking. Better quality? Like sound-wise? You won't find better deals in audio than old, used vintage stuff. I'm using a pre-amp and power amp that are almost 20 years old (but you wouldn't know it because they look like they could be brand new). The sound is just as good as it was back then and for the money I spent (around $500), they kick the crap out of anything you could get new for that.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances
If you don't need EAX, the Chaintech is the best card bang-for-buck wise anywhere under $100.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

ChaoticSeven posted:

I didn't really get any advice so I decided to spend an inordinate amount of money on this: http://www.svsound.com/products-sys-sbs_black.cfm

and the Onkyo 505. Hopefully it stomps rear end and junk. I've read the sub does, at any rate.

Yeah that system should kick some rear end. That's $1,300 ($1,475 for 7.1) with receiver though, so I guess you decided to stretch your budget a bit eh? That sub is especially nice at any rate, so you could upgrade your mains down the line and still have sweet bass.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Nimrod posted:

I picked up some Klispch RB-51's and a Yamaha A/V receiver (I forget which model) today. I've got a question though. If i'm not 100% sure whether i'll ever plug the system in to a TV, would it be a better idea to trade my receiver in for a straight up stereo receiver, or are the differences minimal?

Why wouldn't you be able to use a stereo receiver with a TV? I do. If you mean the one you got is surround and you just care about stereo, then yes, a stereo receiver for the same price will be better quality, generally. And with your question, I'm assuming you're using this for music mainly? If then I would recommend against Klipsch. They are MUCH brighter than neutral and I think just generally a bit over-priced. Good for home theater, but for dedicated music, there are much better.

Saukkis posted:

Those are most likely for bi-wiring, you won't need it. I've never heard of someone using bi-wiring, so why do the ability seem so common with speakers? Would think the accountants would have stopped the practice by now.

A lot of people do bi-wire. They're audiophiles and generally are taking advantage of the two posts on each speaker for "bi-amping" which can have benefits.

Pibborando San fucked around with this message at 21:38 on Aug 27, 2007

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

WanderingKid posted:

With actives you don't have to worry about wiring stuff and setting crossovers and so forth.

:what:

Not that you're wrong, but what passive speakers have you messing with wiring and setting the crossovers between drivers? You just connect them to your amp...

That is technically the only difference between passive and actives. Whether they have a built in amp or not. I like passives because that allows a lot of upgrade and sound tweaking possibilities down the line.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

Captain Keekles posted:

Sorry, but I don't exactly get it. Wouldn't I still need some sort of receiver? Or are their cheap speakers I could plug the stereo connection into?

Thanks.

For powered computer speakers, no. For headphones, yes, you will need a receiver.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

PhilintheBlank posted:

I just recently got a bonus from work. Now, while that may not seem like much of anything, I teach instrumental music in a public school. I have decided to buy myself a really nice stereo system. one worthy of a music nerds collection. I have a couple of ideas on what I want to buy, but I just want to ask you if there are any strong recommendations. I'm looking at spending $1500-2000 dollars or so. Any takers?

Is that for the WHOLE system, as in, you don't have any components at all right now? pim01 is right that at your budget, there's much more personal preference options than simply something being better than another, so I will just give some general budgeting advice.

With $2000, I'd do $1000 on speakers, $200-300 on amping, $300-400 on pre-amping and $500-600 on a nice source, OR ~$100 on a cheap transport and $400-500 on a good DAC.

Are you going digital (CDs) or analogue (vinyl) or both?

edit: I also recommend you start with the best bookshelf speakers you can get for $1000. That will satisfy you much more (with music) than say $600 bookshelves and a $400 sub. Save up and down the road you could add a nice sub for music (maybe the $600 - $1000 range) to fill out the lowest of frequencies.

edit2: Kind of relating to this, I've got my own speaker inquiry.

So I've had my Energy C-9s for almost 5 months now, and I still like them quite a lot. When I first heard them, I was BLOWN AWAY (going from the Insignia bookshelves). Now they still are great, but more and more I find myself thinking "well, they could be a bit better in this regard". Since I'm finally working again, I've decided to go about planning the next step. I'm very much considering getting bookshelves and a nice sub, due to 1) size (the C-9s are HUGE in my small room) and 2) better sound quality for the price vs floorstanders.

I listen to or am open to most every kind of music (except for almost anything on top-40 radio stations or pop country) so the speakers should be able to handle anything well and not have a predisposition to any particular genre. Basically, be really neutral, like my DT 880s which I love. I like the C-9s overall signature, except for a few things:

1) The highs can be slightly harsh and sibilant sometimes
2) The mids feel a bit too dry and lack that effortless realism and life I've heard on higher end speakers (like the B&W CM7, oh what nice mids)
3) The mid-bass sounds a bit bloated in the spectrum and a bit boomy
4) Not much sub-bass (this is what the sub will be for though)

Now there are things that necessarily aren't bad about them, but I'd like:
1) More precise imaging and positioning (the C-9s aren't bad but I don't quite get that "close your eyes and 'see' the performers in their exact place" thing)
2) More soundstage depth (the Energy's are a bit flat in this regard)
3) Transparency, and for the speakers to "disappear" (I still feel like I'm listening to speakers and not an actual performance with the C-9s)

Okay, so it sounds like I want the best speakers there are basically, but I'm going to have to limit my budget to $1,000 - $1,200 for the pair. Used is A-Ok. Can it be done?!

I'm fairly set on the sub I want to get, which is the Hsu VTF-2 Mk 3. I don't think I need the beast that is the VTF-3, and the VTF-2 is $200 less. I'm pretty sure that will be all the sub I will need for a LOOOOONG time. Is there anything else in the $500 - $600 range that I should be looking at?

Since I hate it when I hear the sub and not the music/movie (know what I mean?) I want to be able to cross it over pretty low to prevent sound localization. Around 60Hz or something. So I'll need to find bookshelves that have a good, flat response that goes pretty low.

ANYWAY, here is what's caught my eye:
1) B&W CM1 (Demoed these; very close to what I'm after. I liked the CM7s better: richer and more prominent mid-range, but those are out of my budget unless I could find them used) - $900 new
2) Paradigm Studio 20 (I should demo these since they're in my area) - $950 new
3) Paradigm Studio 40 - maybe within budget if found used? Do they just have more bass than the 20s or is it more qualitative than that?
4) Totem Model-1 Signature - $1,000 - $1,400 used
5) Dynaudio Audience 42 or 52 - $???
6) Onix Reference 1 - $1,200 or $1,500 depending on finish, new, $700 - $900 used
7) Von Schweikert VR-1 - $995 new, $500 - $700 used

Thoughts?

Also, I think I'm going to need a new pre-amp that has a sub out so I can put a high-pass filter on the mains to integrate with the sub the best. Any 2-channel pre-amps with sub-outs?

Thanks.

Pibborando San fucked around with this message at 00:57 on Sep 11, 2007

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

dsh posted:

Is this possible?

Not that I can think of, no. I was thinking you could have the speakers in each corner of the room, facing in at the same angle, but you've got the center channel to worry about, which is very important and can only come from one place.

I'd recommend you do what I do, which is have your computer hooked up to your TV as well as your monitor, so if you want to watch stuff from your computer, you can display it on the TV and use that sound system.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

pim01 posted:

If you put the crossover point on the sub at the spot where your mains of choice fall below +/- 6dB (or a bit below), you won't really need a high-pass filter, will you? I'm kind of lucky because I've got professional gear for work, but when installing stuff for friends I usually find out the best crossover frequency with a dB(SPL) meter. Just make a nice, long, descending sine-sweep to test with :).

Well, yeah, that's a perfectly reasonable way of doing things, BUT by cutting off the extreme lows that my power amp and main speakers see, I should get more clarity as the little bookshelf midwoofers won't be straining themselves with the sub-bass stuff. This will help control bloat around the main/sub crossover point and I think give a more transparent and solid feel down into the super lows.

I was taking a look at a SVS woofer and noticed something. For subs that have a stereo RCA input and output... is the outputted signal everything above whatever you set the low cutoff to on the sub? That would be handy. Then the sub could just act as the high pass filter and I could run the output from that to my power amp. Am I incorrect?

I guess it could just be a straight pass-through, but that would make me mad.

edit: These are my front runners for mains ATM. The Ascend Acoustics Sierra-1. I've been swayed by some amazing sounding reviews and that natural bamboo looks hot. The only thing is they may have MORE bass than what I want, especially with a sub, but again, a high pass would take care of that, or maybe I could try plugging the ports.

I'm still going to demo the CM1, Studio 20 and RC-10, just because they're in my area, but those Ascends are looking nigh unbeatable for the price.

edit2: I also really like the looks of these StudioTech SP-24 speaker stands. Anyone know of any other good options in the ~$100 range?

Pibborando San fucked around with this message at 08:09 on Sep 12, 2007

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances
The only consumer filter I've seen is the Hsu high pass filter. It looks like a good solution, but at $100, just wondering if there were cheaper options.

I've seen passive ones like these, which would go between my pre-amp and power amp line-in. I think the 65Hz one would be best BUT they're only 1st order, so I don't know how much of a difference they'd make.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

pim01 posted:

I mean, look at this beautiful curve. No need for extra filters, as far as I'm concerned.

It is a nice, smooth falloff, BUT the amp is still amping and sending all that low freq power (below 50Hz lets say) to the speakers and they're still trying to make sound with it. I want to high pass the signal before it gets to the amp so neither it nor the speakers are even fretting about that subsonic stuff, which should improve the clarity of the sound.

I found these Harrison Labs FMOD filters, which are second order (the Hsu sub uses a second order low pass). I think the 70Hz one would be perfect.

Am I just being a whiny bitch? Maybe, but they're only $30, so I think I will at least give 'em a try.

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

pim01 posted:

"These may be combined to produce 24db per octave slopes if a 3db attenuator is used between them. Keep in mind that two equal value FMOD high pass modules will increase the slope to 24db per octave and the crossover point will be double the FMOD value"

If you buy two 30 Hz ones and combine them, you'll end up with a nice 60 Hz crossover. -24 dB at 30Hz would be quite nice. If you use only one, it looks like you only get -3dB/octave, which isn't really all that usefull.

Now I'm just confused about these things. It says on the summary page "FMOD High Pass Crossover Pairs Slope finalizes at 12db per octave RED label". What does "finalizes at 12db per octave" mean? I'm confused because in the description it then says "-3db" but how would combining two -3db per octave filters get you to -24db per octave?

I like that combining idea though, but why is a 3db attenuator needed?

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

pim01 posted:

so then "Fixed crossover point (-3db) high pass" would mean there's 3 dB of attenuation at the crossover point. That does seem reasonable as well (as 3dB attenuation means half the energy in the linear sense, so that would be where you start to notice attenuation).

Fixed that spelling for ya, and I think this is probably correct. A -24dB per octave slope from 60Hz sound pretty much awesome, so I think this will be the direction I go when I actually can afford the woofer.

pim01 posted:

Quote != edit, again :(

Having some trouble with the whole posting thing today?

I'm going to assume that the "need" for a 3dB attenuator isn't a need at all. Why would I want to make everything half as loud?

Pibborando San fucked around with this message at 22:28 on Sep 12, 2007

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances
oh my god, now I'm having posting issues. :(

Pibborando San fucked around with this message at 22:28 on Sep 12, 2007

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

omgwtfnoway posted:

Can I get a recommendation for a sub around the $250-$300 range? I have a Onkyo SR674 and I generally use my system to play more music than movies.

How big is your room? If it's smaller than like 20'x30' or something big like that, I think the Hsu STF-1 would be great. For $274 w/ shipping right now, I don't think you'll find a better 8" sub, or a better sub for the price.

edit: And what are your mains?

Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances
Alright, I've got my own question regarding future placement of a sub. My room's small, 10.5'x12'x8' for most of it and there's not a lot of placement options. I have chosen 3 possibilities and will probably try them all when I get a sub, but was wondering what you guys thought looked the best.

Here's an awesome mspaint of my room:



The yellow boxes would be my front speakers and the "?" boxes are the possible sub locations. The lower door is the one into my room and the upper, smaller one goes into a storage closet. I'm thinking the corner location would be the best, except it might interfere with the sound of the right main if it's blocking a rear port. The one next to the bed would be cool because I could use the sub as a table as well, but I've heard that having a sub near the middle of a wall is a bad idea. The third location to the left would make sure it was not blocking any sound from the mains, but it will block the closet door somewhat.

So, what should I do?

Pibborando San fucked around with this message at 04:46 on Sep 16, 2007

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Pibborando San
Dec 11, 2004

oh yes. two kinds... of dances

pim01 posted:

I'd go for the corner placement, if only for cabling-ease.

I'm thinking this too. And right now, my forerunners for mains are the Ohm MicroWalsh Talls, which have a very slim profile and I won't have to worry about ports. I can't believe I hadn't seen these speakers before, they look AMAZING.

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