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Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Got out to Anzo-Borrego State Park with the dog over Thanksgiving.



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Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

FogHelmut posted:

That place is great. Which roads did you take?

I didnt know the name of the trails at the time, but after looking at a map - the first shot is the entrance to Plum Canyon trailhead, and the second pic is halfway up indian gorge road. I don't know the area at all and drove out from San Diego on a whim. Do you have any trail recommendations? I'd like to go back.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

FogHelmut posted:

Is that towards the south end of the park? The last time I was there, we went out of Borrego Springs down Dump Road to Borrego Sink Wash to Borrego Mountain Wash.







Then off to Ocotillo Wells OHV area which can get pretty stupid in a stock Chevy Colorado if you try hard enough, but I made it through to the Pumpkin Patch from the main entrance, which took a lot longer than advertised.





(ignore the random spike to the middle of the park, I'm guessing google maps got confused) Looks like I was further west / south than you. I drove through the Ocatillo Wells OHV park a tiny bit once, just the stuff that I could see from the side of 78.

That looks really cool! I'll go and check that out soon and bring back pics. I don't suppose anyone here has done the Mojave road, and has any tips? I'm thinking about that for Christmas break

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

MomJeans420 posted:

Those look pretty cool, although at that price I'd probably just buy a winch.

Current skill level is beginner, only done a little bit in Anza-Borrego. I'll be hitting the offroad park in Gorman, CA before I go on my more fun routes, but unfortunately work blew up so I'm not going to have time until October (planning my more interesting routes for spring 2022). So far I've been planning on the typical / tourist routes in Colorado and Utah (black bear pass, fins and things, etc.), along with some local things like Big Bear and Lake Tahoe. I won't be with someone who has a winch, but in general I think I'll be on trails with a fair amount of traffic (but maybe not always?).

Usually I'd be doing all the work on my vehicle myself so it's not the end of the world if I installed my bumper only to have to drop it in the future, but my left hand is all messed up right now so I'm paying a shop. I should have full use of my hand by October so theoretically I can drop the bumper myself to install the winch, but if I end up paying a shop to do it then a few hours of shop time is already a decent portion of the cost of a winch.

Maybe a better question is I was planning on just installing the bumper without one for right now, is that stupid?

Welcome to the Socal based, Solo off roading Taco club! I'd suggest a Hi Lift instead of a winch for a few reasons:

- at least with every trail you've listed so far, you would only need a winch if you purposefully went out looking for trouble. Most BLM/OHV trails are marked and rated for difficulty, and its extremely unlikely that you'll wander off the map into double black diamond stuff in the southwest. I cannot speak for every off road trail in the western US, but in my experience every trail had a 'should i be doing this?' section before it got to the 'poo poo.gently caress.' section. I.e. driving through lots of brush, hit the skid plate at the start of the rocks, etc. You will usually see a defeat route or a bypass for the genuinely gnarly stuff
- as a 3rd gen Taco owner, putting on a winch bumper is either very hard or extremely hard. I wouldnt want to put the bumper on now, to take it off and put the winch back on later.
- as an alternative to a winch or a comealong, I would suggest a 60" farm jack (needs to be 60". 48" always winds up being too short) with the winching kit (https://hi-lift.com/accessories/off-road-kit/) There are numerous youtube videos that show how this process is done. Yes, its a huge pain in the rear end BUT its not as big a pain in the rear end as paying for/installing a winch on a Taco. Also, at least in my experience, I never needed to get winched more than five feet or so.
- as part of the hi lift, you will want a wheel lift kit https://hi-lift.com/accessories/lift-mate/ and the off road stand (https://hi-lift.com/accessories/off-road-base/) There's nowhere on your truck that you can use a hi lift without damaging the truck or being unsafe, and You can also use this to free yourself from mud or sand - use the jack on the off road stand to lift up one wheel, stack stuff underneath it, lift other wheel and repeat.

Vampire Panties fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Jun 1, 2021

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

MomJeans420 posted:

I still have to look at jacks and recovery gear, I only have some basic items right now that were given to me so I'm not sure if I should even use them unless I can determine their age. I wouldn't mind an alternative to a hi-lift, but the x-jack doesn't seem as useful and arb's hydraulic alternative to a hi-lift looks nice but is very expensive. I'll have on sliders by the time I'm out there so at least I'll have lift points. That winching kit looks pretty cool though, I need to go spend some time on youtube.

I'm just adding a covert bumper to a GX460 so it's not as bad as it sounds. I was just going to do a bumper cut but then CBI had a sale after I came home from a brewery so I ended up paying for their bumper.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lt1W43gHeK0

I'd consider the Hi LIft to be a recovery tool more than anything. I still have the factory bottle jack in case I get a flat on a regular surface.

After all this shiling for Hi Lift, I should add - they can be crazy loving dangerous . Its safe to assume that a Hi Lift is always actively trying to murder you. They are safer than the come-along somebody posted earlier in this thread, but only marginally.

You should be thinking about air lockers instead :getin:

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

AmbassadorofSodomy posted:

As the one who posted the come long a few posts ago, what its less safe about it vs the highlift for "winching"?
Not talking poo poo, legit curious. You can get the come along with some kind of Synthetic rope which is apparently less head-chop-offy should it break compared to steel cable.

IME come-alongs aren't designed or rated to recover vehicles, so its really easy to unknowingly exceed the limit and have it explode. The ratcheting systems and the spools on come-alongs (again, in my experience) don't handle the dynamic weight of vehicle recovery very well. The ones you've linked look to be very well made compared to the harbor freight / home depot models of my experience, but they're all rated for about 4-6k lbs. Sometimes all you need is a little drag, and thats OK, but I've blown up two separate come-alongs trying to recover vehicles that weighed less than 4000 pounds. One time the come-along broke a Nissan Hardbody free, but as the weight shifted it pulled on the drum at an odd angle. Second time the come-along was simply overloaded pulling a Bronco 2 out of the mud. In both of those scenarios, a hi-lift winch would've worked and been safer.

With that said, a hi lift still isnt really safe for lifting or winching. Obviously using a single jack to lift a vehicle 3+ feet in the air is dangerous, but also the ratcheting system can transfer energy back into the handle. Here is a link to a video showing what can happen when you lower a vehicle https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDVau7w-WIk
I couldn't find an example video, but this can also happen when you're winching a vehicle. There is also a lot of operator error that can happen with a Hi Lift, like leaving the handle down and having it come unlocked or getting your face between the jack and the handle.

Also cannot stress this enough - whichever solution, use synthetic ropes. They're far safer, they're easier to work with, and its easier to tell if they're damaged and need to be replaced.

Vampire Panties fucked around with this message at 16:10 on Jun 2, 2021

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Got the lift put on the truck and took it out last weekend. Original plan had been to drive through Joshua Tree for a shakedown, but I saw a '4 wheel drive road' sign and I couldn't pass it up.



Somewhere on the first leg of the road



Further along the road, up into the ridge



Rest Stop





Trail difficulty jumped from 2/10 to 8/10 almost instantly as the trail left the park. Hard technical rock crawling on fixed rock face with no clear lines. Took a few hard bounces and now my front end makes a clunky-clunky noise over bumps, but at least no body damage. I should've turned around and found the right trail, but it was late and I was tired. Lesson learned, no more impromptu off roading like that again. Hopefully something was just knocked loose on the truck and I can get it fixed to go back out next weekend and catch the right trail.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

MomJeans420 posted:

Vampire Panties - what lift is that, and more importantly what breed is your dog?

Fox Factory 2.5 coilovers / shocks with DSC reservoirs, SPC UCAs, Hellwig sway bars front & rear (shop guys couldn't stop rolling their eyes at the rear sway bar, but its my DD), OME EL111r springs, BAMF spring hangers with crossbar. I feel like the only misstep was the SPC UCAs - the shop manager gave an impassioned 10 minute speech about how SPC weren't meant to be used in lifts, they're designed to be used in wrecked cars to bring them back into alignment. After his speech, reading the website descriptions again, and seeing the SPC UCAs on the truck, I have very little confidence in them and I'll be looking to upgrade them ASAP. Not sure if I'm going to stay with a ball joint or upgrade to uniball. Ride quality is dramatically improved with this setup, especially on-road performance. Drove an hour up a washboard in Joshua Tree maintaining 25 mph+ and it was completely comfortable with zero fade. Its also fun pushing 3 series through turns :getin:

Flash is a Rat Terrier, although his coloring is relatively rare for the breed. He is also a very good boy & I'm very lucky to have him.


ryanrs posted:

There are a thousand lovely come-a-longs out there, and one good one made by Wyeth-Scott. You want the big one with the synthetic line. And read the manual, you need to wind the reel with tension or else the line will wedge. Don't just throw it in your trunk. Practice and learn the technique.

The Wyeth-Scott puller weighs 26 lbs and costs $400, but it's an extremely solid piece of gear. I've used it to recover my 4,000 lbs minivan a dozen times, and I've never even needed to use the pulley. I trust and rely on this puller. It is really good.

Interesting, I saw those when you linked them earlier in the thread. They look beefy, for sure, and its heartening to see the manufacturer offer to double the length of the handle, but I would need to see it in person before I felt comfortable spending that much money on a come-a-long. I've had two separate recoveries that were made 100x worse through come-a-long failure.


..and with all this talk of come-a-longs and hi lifts, I pulled the trigger on a Hiline bumper + Warn EVO 10s... *sigh* I know factually I don't need it and its a big ole boat anchor on the front of my truck, but here I am.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

Arishtat posted:

I’ve had my SPC upper control arms since Jan 2018 and they’re still going strong. Just in case I bought a spare upper ball joint as that was one of the most common failure points on SPC’s products, but regular re-greasing has kept those spares in the box. The only reason I would change now is if I threw caution (and money) to the wind and went long travel which is kind of a waste on a 4Runner because of other reasons (approach and departure angles are pretty low).

I do need to do something about the front coils as the truck is awfully spongy with a full load of belly armor and a front slimline bumper plus winch on board *and* I’m probably adding a second battery to the engine bay in the next year to power accessories. I’ve waffled back and forth over committing to a permanently installed ‘hotel’ battery vs a removable box and I think that the deciding factor is keeping the trunk clutter to a minimum. Getting back to suspension I’m looking at going from what are essentially Billstein 2.0” with 650lbs progressive coils to some kind of 2.5” shock, preferably with adjustable valving and either same springs or 700lbs to account for the added weight up front. That should restore the factory rake (it’s down about an inch from the factory -1”) and cut down on the sponginess.

What do you guys think?

Thanks, but I already ordered JBA UCAs. I think I can flip the SPC on Facebook to offset most of the cost. The SPCs just look too thin on the truck.

Re: suspension - You should absolutely upgrade the springs in your truck with all of that extra weight. 4runners are good for ~1k in payload capacity, and you probably have at least half of that in steel. As to which shock to get - what are you looking to accomplish? go fast on washboards? climb up rocks better? a better daily ride?
I had Bilstein 5100s on a Jeep Wrangler and it was great for day-to-day pavement with light offroading, but they were worthless on washboards. On my Tacoma now, I went with Fox Factory 2.5 with reservoir. I chose Fox over King because Fox has more durable components but I honestly couldn't say if there is a large performance difference between the two. Did you have a specific manufacturer or model in mind?

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Well, didn't really need 4 wheel drive to get out to the rockhouse in Clark Dry Lake, but it was (sort of) fun nonetheless. In person, Meth Fortress was an anti-climatic methshed
Re: suspension chat - Truck soaked up desert road at 50 mph like it was nothing. I hit 60 for a spurt, but slowed down because I'm worried about cracking the fiberglass shell on the back. Overall I'm very satisfied with the suspension, although I'm very meh on desert stuff. I'm already thinking about larger tires for more serious trails



Vampire Panties fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Jul 7, 2021

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

MomJeans420 posted:

Dumb question but I'm sure someone on here has dealt with this before. If have a 4'x7.5' flat roof rack like this



am I better off with a 4x6ft cargo net that stretches to 8x12ft, or a 3x4ft net that stretches to 6x8ft? I'm pretty sure 4x6 is the better option as if I have cargo boxes on the roof it'll need to be at least 4ft + 2x the height of the box (or more accurately 2x the length of the hypotenuse, so potentially not much more than 4ft if it was angled just right), but then I worry about it being too loose if I don't have enough tall items up top. I don't need it to stretch the length of the rack but it does need to do the width of the rack.

I'll have proper ratcheting straps to hold everything down, I just wanted a second layer of protection and something that can hold light but large items. I don't have that much faith the cargo nets I've seen on Amazon though so I wonder if it's pointless, but I'm moving a bunch of stuff on a long drive next week and I'd rather have it and not need it then try to find one at the last minute.

*edit*
is there a story behind the obvious for meth fortress? and have you checked out Font's Point yet? Not really a challenging offroad experience in the slightest, but very cool views.


I've only had one cargo net work for me in that scenario, and I put it on top of a heavy tarp. It worked beautifully in a cross country drive through an ice storm in Iowa: https://smile.amazon.com/ROCKET-STR...25627879&sr=8-5

Thats covering a 6x8 tarp and three, 27 gallon HDX totes from Home Depot, if that helps you visualize the size.



No story on the meth fortress; I'm not sure how i even picked it out. Chrome auto filled 'rockhouse by clark dry lake' when i was searching for places to check out in the Borrego area and the Google Maps pics looked interesting. I'll have to check out Font's Point, although now that its summer I don't have a lot of interest in the desert.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

Arishtat posted:

Yeeeeah so about that 'I'll reply by Wednesday July somethingorotherth' that obviously didn't happen.

I'm 90% satisfied with my current setup which are Toytec BOSS 2.0s (Bilstein 5100s with badge engineering) paired with 700lbs progressive springs + SPC UCAs. Overall I'm very happy with the solution, but they're getting towards the end of their service life and I'm exploring my options for what is next.

For reference this is what I have which was purchased and installed at the very end of 2017:



I'm East Coast so any wheeling happens after a 2-4 hour road trip so I'm looking at a progressive setup. My wheeling time is 70% mild trails and 30% moderate off road park technical trails. No washboards to speak of and even if there were that wouldn't be a thing, the only 'racing' I might end up doing is something like rally sweep on well groomed dirt roads which the current setup excels at. I'm also not looking for a set of racing shocks that needs to be rebuilt every 20k miles so stuff like Icon is out the window.

Makes / models in consideration at this time: OME BP51s, Fox Factory Race 2.5s, Toytec 2.5s (which look suspiciously like Fox OEMed them for Toytec)

Haha no problem, I ended up canceling the JBA order anyway. If the SPCs break than I'll replace them, but I'm done messing with the suspension on this truck.


I have Fox Factory 2.5 with remote reservoir and DSC clickers and they're amazing. I had the same considerations - anywhere (legal) off-road is hours of driving away. Also the freeways in socal are worse than some dirt roads. Washboards are totally A Thing out here, though, which drove the remote reservoir upgrade. If you do go with Fox, I'd highly recommend the DSC clickers; being able to adjust the fast/slow rebound compression on the fly is just great. I didn't think I would mess with them once I got them dialed in, but it's easier than locking a hub or airing down a tire, and there are noticeable results between each click. Specifically, I'll stiffen the slow rebound and soften the fast rebound all the way down for freeway rides (to soak up smaller bumps / uneven payment) but i'll flip the settings when I get into the desert (to keep control through the washboards and soak up the bigger dips). I seem to hit the bumpstops frequently at freeway speeds, so I upgraded those as well:shrug:

I researched OME BP51 before choosing Fox. Sourcing the BP51s at the time of purchase was tough, and I read that people were needing to get them serviced absurdly quickly. From my very limited understanding, they are more like King in terms of performance, service intervals, and reliability. That was all Tacomaworld :goonsay:, for whatever that's worth.

I almost certainly would've gone with the Bilstein b8000 If they had been available, but I don't know if those actually exist for sale right now. A friend of mine told me that Bilstein was hit hard by the covid supply shortages, and they decided to double down on 5100/6100s production instead of fully running the b8 line.

FogHelmut posted:

Any thoughts on the Bilstein 6112?

I can't speak to 6112 specifically, but I had 5100s on my JKU before my current Tacoma. They were fantastic and it's my understanding that the 6112 is effectively a bigger beefier version of the same shock. IMO they're the best non-rebuildable shock you can get.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

FogHelmut posted:

Yeah for the price, I think I'd rather go with the 6112 than the Fox 2.0. Going to the next level up seems to double the cost, and I'm not interested in that. Just trying to have a nicer ride both on and off road, and the 6112 seems to fit the bill. And despite the rebuildability of the Fox, the service life the Bilstein should last as long as I keep this truck.

I do plan using them to lift 2". I don't think I'll need to add control arms or diff drops or anything else for that, but probably will need the sway bar relocation brackets. Only other thing is to add a leaf or blocks for the rear. I don't want to harsh the ride, and I don't think a 1" to 2" block is going to give me any trouble with stability or axle wrap for such a small block. Definitely do not want to spend on a whole new set of leaf springs - unless that's entirely worth it.

I think ultimately just less body roll on the street and less jostling on speed bumps and dirt roads is what I'm after.

This is a 2019 Chevy Colorado for reference.

Yeah thats how I upsold myself :rolleye: to the 2.5s - they weren't that much more than the 2.0s, once I'd already justified that price to myself. Next time I would probably go with the Bilsteins as well.

For your truck, what about an add-a-leaf? Slightly more expensive than just a block, but it would give you a significantly better ride. For body roll, I installed a rear sway bar and its a night and day difference. Of course, that really negatively impacts the articulation. (and of course of course, there are sway bar disconnect kits).

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

ryanrs posted:

I have never been on a group 4x4 trip. I only off road solo. So I've always wondered, when you're driving in a group, isn't it just one horrible, insane dust cloud? How does that work? Especially with Jeeps, who seem to make a point about taking off the roof and doors. It does not sound like a fun time, unless you're the lead vehicle.


Yes and no. Most places outside of SoCal / US Southwest dont have miles and miles of empty dirt. However there are dirt roads everywhere, which are awful in groups, but the group slows down when you get on the trail. Usually trail riding in groups a lot of waiting while the vehicle up the line gets over whichever specific obstacle. Also in my experience, trails outside of Socal didn't really have dust. They were a mix of hardpacked dirt, mud, grass, gravel, and rock scree. I was more worried about a truck throwing a rock through my windshield or radiator than I was I was about dust.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

FogHelmut posted:





The Bilstein 6112 don't come with or seem touse a shock boot. Is that weird? I know cool people like to look cool without them, but all of Bilstein's other shocks come with the boot.

As I found out when I put Bilsteins on my previous ride, shock boots aren't really a thing anymore. The seal around the shock shaft is good enough that it doesn't need it and the shock shafts are strong enough to take direct hits from rocks and such. However, a shock boot can trap dirt & water against the shock seal and ruin it.


it makes sense, but i was a little disappointed. I thought I was getting shock boots as well :shrug:

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

Paulie posted:

Couple of vidyas of the samurai doing it's thing. As you can see I didn't have time to get the lockers installed prior to the trip. I have a spare front housing that's loaded with a spartan locker and RCVs that's just about ready to go, but I didn't want a rush job and forget something. Plus it was fun seeing how it did with manual steering, open/open with just the suspension, tires, cage and tcase gears.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1vNiyHJQFM

^^ lost a mirror and got a few new dents, but all good otherwise

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7PHva5Je4g

With the manual steering it was really difficult to do anything in the rocks; it was more like point, floor it, hope for the best, hold on for dear life. I would have had less trouble on both of these trails were it dry, but I can't wait to get back out there again with the lockers and power steering installed and walk everything.

:perfect: This is fantastic, thank you. Its nice seeing liberal application of the long pedal to overcome obstacles :kiss:

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

FogHelmut posted:

Was sitting at the top of Maple Springs where it meets Main Divide road doing a shakedown run since I installed the Bilsteins and am driving to Flagstaff and Sedona Thanksgiving week, and a Rivian drove up. The guy works at the HQ in Irvine and was testing it out. He said it was his first time driving off road, then he casually went over an obstacle that a lifted Tacoma and Silverado Trail Boss were having issues with.

Anyway, I think something is clunking with my sway bar. Everything else was torqued correctly. I really hope it's not a ball joint with the new angles, but I'm pretty sure it's the sway bar. Everything I read said just eyeball it? I should have got the longer end links instead of the drop bracket.

Electric/hybrid vehicles are going to make gas burners obsolete because of their absurd power.

You have a Tacoma, right? The sway bar could be creaking if its shifting in the bushing, but I don't know if that would make a clunking noise. I didnt want to deal with the drop down brackets when I lifted my truck, so I ended up ordering longer end links. https://overlandcustomdesign.com/products/forged-ball-joint-sway-bar-links
I haven't heard a peep from my front end under any circumstances, and the shop who installed the lift really liked them.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

FogHelmut posted:

Chevy Colorado. It's not a full clunk. Not like a ball joint. But it's not a creak. It's somewhere in between. Only hits once per side if I'm going over a bump while turning. Like if I'm turning left, it hits the right side. But not if I turn left again. I'd have to turn right, then it hits the left side, then I turn left and it hits the right side.

I really don't know anything about Chevy Colorados, but IFS is generally the same between all trucks these days. If you can see the sway bar connected to the spindle on both sides, and you can see the bushings are bolted to the truck, than its probably OK.
With your description of the timing and the need to 'reset' by turning left/right/left to generate the noise in the same spot, it sounds like something is sliding around up front. Honestly it sounds like my ancient Bronco II where the battery slid around in the tray until bungie corded it in place. I'd assume there isn't room in the Colorado engine bay for that, though, but maybe the dust cover that modern engines have?


FAKE EDIT - I went and googled Colorado IFS, and it really could be your end link. Seems like the end link goes straight down into the lower control arm, w/o an extra articulation point. To compare, the Toyota end link has two joints. If the end link had play on the attachment to the lower control arm, than I could see that back/forth being an issue.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

Ferremit posted:

Ifs works way better without a front seat at anyway. My 100 hasn’t had one for about 6 years now and it didn’t have that big an impact on the handling

Yeah i was going to mention that - the dudes who worked on my truck liked my sway bar setup and end links, but they were also like..'why are you putting a sway bar on and not taking it off'

At least for the Tacomas, most of the spindle gussets and/or LCAs eliminate the sway bar mount entirely.

I can actually sorta talk about how my truck runs w/o a sway bar, because the truck shop guys messed up tightening the front sway bar after the initial 500 mile shakedown, and the bolt on one side came loose (and cut the boot on my cv shaft and covered the whole wheel well in grease :argh:)
I didn't notice it at the time, I did hear some clunking like what FogHelmut described but not in the same pattern. On one hand, it was nice because the front wheels could soak up big road differentials better, but it wasn't as fun to drive on the street. I also had a rear sway bar installed, so that complicates things.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

DumbparameciuM posted:

Not quite that exciting unfortunately. I'm tossing up between the Yamaha Viking and the Kawasaki Mule for agri work on a very steep and windy property in rural Australia and was looking for some pointers in either direction about which one would be the better way to go. The Kawi is slightly more expensive but has the options for a closed cabin, front winch and hydraulic lift for the tray. It's also slightly more powerful. It seems like it has less clearance but possibly a better approach angle. The Yamaha is slightly cheaper but less powerful, with bigger storage capacity. Both have options for diff locks but I'm a bit of a newb in the 4x4/offroading space so any feedback regarding which would be the better option for going up steep as gently caress grass hills would be much appreciated.


ryanrs posted:

Yes, especially the ones with 200 hp turbo engines.

I don't know anything about SxS or UTVs but would love to learn. Some of them run 35" tires?!?!?!!

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Probably a vote in the wrong direction, but BFG KO and KO2s have literally never failed me. They're quiet on the road, you can get them in a ton of sizes, and they wear really well. Knock on wood, but I've never even had so much as a flat with them, and I put a hard 30k miles on a set of 315/70r17s and they were still good to go. Caveats- they can be slippery on oily roads, like socal after it rains, and they dont really self-clean in mud. However they are FANTASTIC in the snow.


And just because nobody has mentioned them itt, there are also Nitto Trail/Ridge Grapplers, which are an AT or an AT/MT hybrid. I personally haven't used them, but a friend of mine has used Nitto exclusively on his jeeps for years now. The AT especially is supposed to be a light, durable tire with good traction.

Vampire Panties fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Nov 17, 2021

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

ryanrs posted:

So speaking of tires, is there a relationship between wheel width / tire width / sidewall vulnerability? Right now I have 15x6.5 steel wheels with KO2 215/75R15 tires, generally run 15-20 psi offroad. This combo is right at the limit wrt scrubbing at steering extremes. But should I be thinking about offsets, different widths, or whatever? I don't know tire science at this level.

I guess this is mostly theoretical, since I can't imagine the difference is amazing enough to buy a whole new set of 5 wheels+tires.

Tire width wrt to wheel width is important when you air down, because you don't want the bead busting off the wheel. Wheel offset can be important in race cars, but its mostly important here for steering articulation.
I went to BFG's website and I didn't see the very exact tire size you described, but generally speaking a 15x6.5 wheel would be the right width for a tire that size.
Since it sounds like you're running steelies, and I'm sure those tires are significantly heavier than the factory tire, the only appreciable performance gain you could get would be to get lighter wheels. And its sorta nebulous what the performance would be.


sidewalls: sidewall strength is kinda/sorta determined by the tire's load rating. For KO2s, and really most popular truck tires, theres C rated and E rated. For the KO2 specifically, a C rated tire will have a six ply sidewall. This will be a softer ride and a lighter tire, although obviously not as strong. An E rated tire will be ten ply, so a much stiffer ride and noticeably heavier. Thing is, not all tire manufacturers offer every size in every rating, so you would potentially have to go to a larger tire as well. With how little your van weighs and with the offroading you've shown itt, I wouldn't really worry about it.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

Krakkles posted:

Everything else you said is 100% correct, and the conclusions from these specific points is still very much true, but six and ten ply tires don’t really exist anymore. The KO2 E range is apparently 3 ply :v:

Huh good to know, i had no idea that ply was a rating/value on tires. That makes sense, insomuch that it seems weird that there would be a 10 or 12 layer tire in TYOOL 2021.

FogHelmut posted:

Got a set of Prothane end links and all irregular noises are gone.

:rock: do you think you crushed the bushing on the other end links?

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

kastein posted:

I liked my BFG AT KOs too other than the banana peel sidewalls everyone already called out. But that's true of duratracs too.

The real answer is BFG Krawler MT red labels on everything, as long as you don't care if you get 3 or 4 figure tire life instead of 5 or 6.

I had BFG KM2s on a Nissan Frontier and yeah, I think I got maybe 15k miles on them? maybe? and they're not as soft as those. They were great tires for the first 10k miles or so and then they got l o u d. I've thought about switching back, because I never drive anywhere and the performance is real, but I can't stomach driving something that annoyingly loud again.

Vampire Panties fucked around with this message at 06:33 on Nov 18, 2021

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

Splinter posted:

Once you get into full bumpers, I believe there are more options for rear carriers and swing outs other than Expedition One that might be a little cheaper and/or not have issues like you mentioned reported (e.g. Coastal Offroad, Victory 4x4).

I've seen some of those custom swing outs and agree it's one of the better solutions, but as someone that doesn't have the confidence to design one of these myself, I'd want someone to turn this style of solution into a kit (have a feeling this might happen at some point soon) to get more feedback/reviews before going this route.

I've heard the JW carrier can have some issues with heavier wheel/tire combos: at some point the weight causes the door to droop enough that the latch doesn't quite line up unless you kinda lift the door up a little while you close it. Not sure when this starts to become a problem. It still 'works' in that situation, but seems like a bad sign for longevity. In general there is longevity concern with having the tire mounted directly to the door, but thus far there haven't been any consistently reported issues related to this from what I can tell from postings on the GXOR FB group. I don't think the weight of your folding table will be all that significant in comparison to the carrier/spare, but it depends on what you went with.

The Wilco HitchGate Solo is another option for a hit mounted carrier/swing out, but it's not much different price wise than the Rigid. I like this solution in theory: not permanent, not supported by the door, not as heavy as a full on bumper, doesn't require welding. But yeah, price/weight wise once you're spending that much it's hard to justify not just going with a full on bumper for the added benefits (e.g. better departure angle, more protection). If I did go that route I think I'd try to keep the spare in the trunk when I don't need the cargo space, and only throw the carrier on when I actually need the space (and maybe just for longer trips, might just leave the spare at home if I just need the cargo space to haul something across town from home depot or w/e). However, I have a feeling throwing on the carrier and mounting the tire would be just enough of a hassle that I'd very quickly just end up leaving it on full-time (at which point we're back to "why not just get a bumper").

Not sure how much help that is, but yeah, it's an annoying thing to deal with when moving to larger tires on a GX. Enough so that I've decided to go with tires that will still fit in the spare location (at least when aired down: which comes with the annoyance of the TPMS warning light always being on) and see how that goes. However, I don't have KDSS, so I think I can fit something a bit larger than you can (though I do still have the factory hitch).

I went through this exact same discovery process for my Tacoma. I upgraded to the BAMF leaf spring hangers w/ the crossbar, which means I cant fit any spare under the bed anymore. I didnt want to go with the full bumper + tire carrier, because its really expensive and also total overkill for my needs. Also i live less than a mile from the beach, and maybe the first 4x4er in history to say this, but I want MORE plastic on my truck. A scratch in the powder coat is basically a death sentence here.
I've seen the Wilco carriers in person, and thats a hard pass for me. For the price, they're extremely janky/shoddy in person IMO. Also the aforementioned rust - the one I saw was heavily rusted, like it looked like a powdercoat failure. I've seen the Rigd in person and they're great, but they're really not any less expensive than getting a bumper with a tire carrier.

I somehow miraculously found these guys: https://www.rigid-armor.com/toyota. Originally I had ordered the 500 dollar fold down tire carrier, but after doing that once or twice i realized that I'm way too old to gently caress with that every time I want to open the tailgate. The owner Daniel was really gracious and let me trade it in and upgrade to the full swingout carrier, and gave me a discount. I added the rotopax mount and the fold down table, and IIRC i was 1200 or so out the door? Its EXTREMELY solid, I'm really glad I purchased it (although fair warning, the powdercoat on it seems to be poo poo and I'm probably going to have to go back up to LA to swap out an arm. I think its just a one-off though)

I was working on it today, wiring up a license plate bracket light and a brake light behind the tire carrier. I'll take some pics and post them tomorrow.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Alright here's my tire carrier. The wiring needs to be cleaned up but this is pretty much good to go. One thing I really like about this carrier versus other carriers I've seen is there's no turning latch, its just a lynch pin with a cotter pin to hold it in place. Its rock solid when its closed.



Up close



Swung open with the table folded down



At night with running lights.



I also installed these guys in the very tiny lip between the tailgate and bumper. With the blacked out taillights, and other drivers not paying attention in general, I wanted something more. I've had these on the truck for over a year and they're fantastic. A little beat up looking up close, but they've held up extremely well for being amazon specials. Also yes its a 60" farmers jack. IME the regular 48" hi-lift is juuuuuust short enough to get into really dangerous situations. If I have to break out the goddamn bloodthirsty thing, I want to do it right.

re: GX - I could've sworn I saw Lexus on the Rigid Armor website, but its clearly not there. I think there's some GX pictured on their instagram page but I'm not certain either. Its basically a one-man operation out of a workshop in Whittier CA, so I'm sure you could reach out and ask.


Now once I recover from crashing my bicycle on Monday (:doh:) I'll get out into the dirt

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

wesleywillis posted:

Anyone deal with Bay Area Metal Fab?
I want to get some poo poo for my Tacoma.
I've read some reviews and it seems like their products are quality, but just wondering about the company itself.

In TFR we've got a thread talking about companies that promote hate/authoritarianism etc.... in the gun and gun related industries.

I don't consider myself to be some sort of Dr. Wokenstein, but I don't want to support them if they're in to some racist or anti-LGBTQ type stuff.

I know nothing whatsoever of their politics but I have their leaf spring hangers on my 3rd gen taco. I'd given them a pass since they're in the Bay Area, which is a little bit foolish in retrospect. I just went and leafed through quite a bit of their website and instagram and I saw nothing political whatsoever.... but I've been wrong before.

The leaf spring hangers are top notch FWIW

MomJeans420 posted:

That sticks out a lot less than I thought it would, it looks like a pretty decent option. I guess I have the problem of where I'd store it when it's not on the GX as my garage space is limited right now. I never go to meetups but I'm thinking I should go to a GX meetup and see how the JW carrier feels in person once it's installed.

For being bumper mounted, it sits tight. And at least for me, this thing is permanent. Not just because of the wiring and reverse camera, but the weight/effort of unmounting it and taking up space in the garage. Also specifically to my taco, I had upgraded to the OME dakar HD springs and they rode like complete rear end when I only had the camper shell on. Now that I've added ~200lbs to the rear, it rides 100% better.

Vampire Panties fucked around with this message at 18:35 on Nov 30, 2021

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Took the dog for an overnight trip up to Death Valley. Although I find myself really wondering if I genuinely need a 4x4 truck, or if an AWD van would be more appropriate.

Taking a break outside of Baker



Dog sniffed out some treasure



Zabriskie Point is beautiful, but iphones must have some sort of automagic image processor for national parks; the lighting IRL was bad.




Stopped for the night

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

ryanrs posted:

I'm heading to the same area later this month in my fwd van. Ngl, reports of sand have me somewhat concerned.

I can't speak to anything outside of echo canyon road specifically, but IMO you should be fine. Weirdly didn't see any sand in my trip, like at all, but I also went the one day it was raining. Much like all of the other 'off road' trails I've seen over SoCal, seems like Death Valley is mostly natural gravel wash that has been driven/compacted into a vague trail. The only thing I'd be concerned about is large unseen rocks - there were a lot of 2-3 foot sized chunks of slag hiding in the usual wash scree. I definitely put a souvenir dent in my skid plate, and I thought I'd hit the rocker panel pretty hard but it looks like I'm ok.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

FogHelmut posted:

I want to get out to Death Valley this winter/spring before it gets too hot. Any recommendations?

I'm also open for recommendations, specifically 4x4. I struggle greatly with AllTrails and other website recommendations - a lot of people in SoCal think that a gravel road requires four wheel drive. On the other hand, I've already stumbled into double black diamond stuff once at Joshua Tree completely by accident. Reading beforehand, Echo Canyon was described as either a dirt road or a moderate trail adventure, and I could see it being either.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
I was told that Gaia was the best, but that I absolutely needed a tablet to run it... the same day that Gaia announced Apple Carplay support :psyduck:

and it sounds like we're all struggling with the same thing - finding verifiable pictures of the trail, with actual directions/locations of the trail, and a meaningful description. For what its worth, at least twice now I've headed out to 'remote' SoCal locations that were both described as difficult to find or without markers.. to find out that Google Maps had a trail straight to the place. (IIRC Smuggler's Cave and some weird thing out in Anzo-Borrego).

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

Atticus_1354 posted:

I love gaia. But I'm also a bit of a gis nerd so I realize that not everyone needs all the layers it provides. But I do find it very easy to use and there's a lot of regional Facebook groups that will share trail data that you can directly plug in to it.

I tried to use layers in Google Maps to plan out a 2 week+ road trip, and after fighting with it for hours I got this awful abomination that sorta/kinda included everything... with zero ability to send it to my phone or another device. This has actually hurt a lot of (planned) 4x4 adventures because I don't want to drive out to the middle of nowhere to find out the trails been closed, or doesn't exist, or whatever.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
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I've only carried extra fuel with me maybe once or twice, a long time ago and only for off roading trips that were at least an hour or two from a gas station. Trips to Lake Pillsbury in northern California specifically.

IMO there's really only three trails in the US west where you should really bring extra fuel - The aforementioned lake Pillsbury loop, the Mojave road trail, and the Rubicon. I haven't taken the back loop of Utah or gone up to Ouray CO yet, but its my understanding that effectively all of the major overlanding trails cross a freeway with a gas station at some point.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
This is relatively high on my to-do list for my Taco. Its simple to run a bunch of tube wherever and 1000% worth it to keep the gear oil dry.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

giundy posted:

This sounds like planned obsolesce using goretex.

Ignorant Jeep owner here, do Toyota diffs not vent up high?

Yes and no. I think most year Tacomas vent the rear diff up to the top of the frame inside the bed, which google says is 18" above the rear axle? I think JKUs are a similar height actually

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Made it out to Anza-Borrego / Canyon Sin Nombre. Extremely tame but a great day. Didn't catch a pic of the blackhawk doing canyon runs 20 feet (!!!) overhead

Weird loud trees


Jawa shot


big ole cliffies




Favorite part of the trip wasn't pictured - As I pulled into a large flat wash, I came across a group of jeeps and other straight axled vehicles mallcrawling their way through the washboards. I smiled and waved and waited for them to pass, and then I cruised up it going 50 :getin:

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
I've run BFG KOs and KO2s in various sizes collectively for something like 20 years now. I don't think they're the end-all be-all of AT tires, but they've rarely let me down and I keep coming back to them.

Pros
- wear extremely well. I've gotten serious serious mileage out of a few pairs
- very durable
- relatively quiet
- surprisingly good in snow

Cons
- heavy
- they're getting to be on the expensive side
- will not self clean properly in mud
- surprisingly bad on oily/wet pavement

I have 255/75/r17 C rated BFG KO2s on my truck now, a 2019 toyota tacoma w/ 3" lift. I had 265/65r17 E rated on before the lift. I'm looking at 35ishs now, whether thats a 315/75r17 in BFG KO2, or a 35x10.50 Kenda Klever RT. Toyota trucks have a bunch of weird poo poo about tire width because of how they do the steering alignment; a lotta dudes cut the cab mount :stare: so they can fit larger tires, but uh.... thats not just how the cab stays attached to the frame, thats what prevents the tire being crushed into your legs in an accident. No dice :colbert:

Vampire Panties fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Mar 6, 2022

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
FWIW, I have 255/75r17 C-rated BFG KO2s on my 3rd gen tacoma. I like them and they've been really good tires, but I wish I had gone straight to 34x10.5r17s KO2s. At least on tacomas, wheel clearance is more determined by width than height (within reason). The 255s didnt really hurt gas mileage at all, and I haven't ran into any real clearance issues when I've been off roading, but they're noticeably smaller than the 285/70r17 that everyone in SoCal seems to run which obviously makes my penis smaller as well :v:

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Ok this probably isn't everyone's experience with SPCs, but I'm pretty sure the ball joint in mine ate poo poo <5k miles.



I wiped a bunch of grease off it, but I'm 99% sure the joint is blown. There is a pretty solid clunk noise going over bumps, and a very subtle shimmy between the front wheels.



I've drove pretty hard around town, and once or twice out in the desert, but I'm surprised that its dead this fast. I dont need the castor of the SPCs with my existing or planned tire size, so I'm leaning towards replacing them with JBA or maybe Camburg instead of repairs.


FogHelmut posted:

Wise words about UCAs & bushing maintenance

:haibrower: I am looking at these specifically because they have bushings with grease ports that don't require loosening any bolts

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Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost
Heh I've ran BFGs for 20+ years now and shilled for BFGs itt several times, but (and a huge and literal knock on wood here) they've never let me down. IMO there are two caveats - they will break loose on a surprisingly small amount of wet pavement, and they don't self clean in heavy mud. IMO those are trivial complaints against rock solid ATs that're fuel efficient and routinely last for 50k+ miles.

Also I pulled the trigger on the JBA HD UCAs just now. The ball joint in my truck is FUBAR and I dont feel good driving around with it that way. I'll document the journey for the thread because replacing an UCA is the most mechanically advanced thing I've ever done.

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