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Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

Spinyahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

Doctor Rope

dopesilly posted:

I can completely hide Maya's UI and still use 95% of the tools with like 3-4 keys without moving my left hand (especially space bar) and I don't need to "Search" for functions by typing them out. It's like everything is 2-3 more clicks for me or 2-3 more keypresses than it needs to be for me in Blender. I will give Blender the upper hand on the functions being somewhat predictable and stable, but yeah the default hotkeys and default UX experience is still rear end imo. It's like the software never heard of contextual editing or something, so it just breaks a buncha poo poo into different tabs unnecessarily.

If you go to Edit -> Preferences, open the Keymap section, maybe the "Industry Compatible" preset in the dropdown works better for you

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HorseHeadBed
May 6, 2009
What happened with Blenderbros? I missed that whole thing.

sinky
Feb 22, 2011



Slippery Tilde

HorseHeadBed posted:

What happened with Blenderbros? I missed that whole thing.

One guy is an Andrew Taint style alpha-male dickhead
Also if you unsub from their mailing list because they spam emails every hour, he deletes your account :lol:

haddedam
Feb 19, 2024

by Fluffdaddy

(and can't post for 21 days!)

dopesilly posted:

Donut is the new fire hydrant.

I keep trying to get into Blender but despite mastering ZBrush/Max/Maya that's apparently not enough to get around it's clunky rear end UI/UX experience. Seriously this keyboard shortcut poo poo is worse than anything ZBrush did. You really gonna try to tie every functionality to the letter key it starts with in the English language? I don't wanna look at my fuckin keyboard for every function Blender, why can't you just be contextual and make logical sense based on what I click on? Just venting about my disdain for learning it, because it doesn't feel any more or less intuitive compared to when I tried it 8+ years ago.

I'd rather have Maya crash daily at least then I can keep my hand on the left side of my keyboard and not pay attention. Hell, even ZBrush maintains that mentality. For every good feature I see come out of Blender and it's community, there's 10 other things I have an issue with for a production workflow.

Same sentiment from a proffessional who used Maya all their life.
All maya shortcuts I ever need are not even filling up my numpad sized macropad. Hell the rose menu is so goddamn innovative, comfortable, fast and easy to use that it should be standard in EVERY productivity program. I can do every single most used action without leaving my homerow and moving my cursor a few pixels in a direction.
I am still considering switching to blender over the next break since Maya just adds more disfunctional bloat and bugs every update rather than anything useful. How about you add smart selection or patterned selection, eg edgeloops that works even with tris, selecting every other face or whatever other pattern, etc. How about unwrapping that can understand I want all of these similiar drat uv islands stacked and all edgeuv's snapped together etc. Or anything from the most popular scripts?

I remember over a decade ago, rumors of combining Max and Maya into one, good suite without a downside.
Instead they took the photoshop route of asking exponentially more money for a less reliable, more confusing program.
Or maybe I still haven't forgiven autodesk for corrupting my magnum opus model that could've landed me a job at RSI.

haddedam fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Mar 3, 2024

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I have three regrets
The first is to be born in Joseon.
When I started modeling I used Maya for about 6 months before switching to Blender -- at this point for the most part I don't remember enough to offer a fair comparison, and was middling at best in any case -- but it's funny that you Maya users are talking up the contextual menu, because Blender's hotkey-first approach is one thing I actually do recall finding works way better. It's a lot to get a handle on at first sure, but once I got the muscle memory down I was finding myself modeling way quicker in Blender than I could with Maya. A keystroke is just faster than any mouse movement. Blender has rose menus for a few functions but I find I don't use them; it's quicker to just use a hotkey.

And with the exception of occasionally-used functions (e.g. there is a way of selecting every other face, but via numpad) which you could still always rebind to quick favorites or a different key, everything is within a key or two of WASD.


Functionality complaints I totally accept, especially when you're used to a particular workflow. IMO it more than makes up for it in other areas and plugins fill in a lot of holes too, but as a pure modeling tool Blender's still definitely lacking some stuff compared to Maya/Max. But sorry, the hotkey/UI complaints just sound like they're coming from a place of ignorance.

Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

Spinyahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

Doctor Rope
I can't talk about 3D modelling software in general since I've only used Blender. But I know the fundamentals are the same. Meaning 3D modelling skill is different from knowing how specific 3D modelling software works. Just like programming skill and knowing a specific programming language are different skills (I'm a programmer). At some point you have to learn how to use your tool. Instead of trying to write Python like it's Java, you should embrace Python-specific features and practices to make your life easier.

haddedam
Feb 19, 2024

by Fluffdaddy

(and can't post for 21 days!)

Maya rose menu takes longer to learn but it gets you carpal tunnel way faster than any hotkey ever could.

sigma 6
Nov 27, 2004

the mirror would do well to reflect further

haddedam posted:

Maya rose menu takes longer to learn but it gets you carpal tunnel way faster than any hotkey ever could.

I don't know about that. One of the fastest modelers I ever met just remapped his hotbox menu and swiped in the direction he needed to (ie. up right, middle, left or down right, middle, left). If you use a stylus with a tablet, your chances of getting carpal tunnel are much lower. Also - one can easily remap any keystrokes in Maya, Zbrush, or really most packages.

It comes down to efficiency of workflow more than anything else. A lot of studios allow artists to use the package of their choice for making assets these days although many still stick primarily to one main package for output to the renderer. Sony famously has a custom built version of Maya which Autodesk makes specifically for them.

Personally I can't stand Blender's UI or shortcuts, but I didn't start with them either. QWERTY shortcuts are like second nature in Maya / Max / Zbrush but of course Blender doesn't use those same shortcuts. tI am sure I can remap them but ... uggghh why can't these packages use universal transform, camera, and selection shortcuts? I remember when Zbrush finally got a gizmo and so many people wondered "Why did this take so long?" I actually like that you can still switch between the gizmo and the transpose tool with the y button because some things are just still easier with the transpose tool IMO. Things like masking by topology. Again it comes down to how fast your workflow is. Keystrokes are generally faster than anything else, so it pays to learn them. However, learning shortcuts across three or more packages gets confusing quickly. R is rotate in Zbrush for example vs. e in Maya and that one always gets me. Also makes things more confusing when the keystrokes change with different versions of the same software.

sigma 6 fucked around with this message at 05:37 on Mar 5, 2024

haddedam
Feb 19, 2024

by Fluffdaddy

(and can't post for 21 days!)

Also almost all engines use qwerty row.
Blender is the only one behind the curve.

Alterian
Jan 28, 2003

It drives me bananas R isn't for rotate.

DreadUnknown
Nov 4, 2020

Bird is the word.
Well poo poo learning Blender Guru guy sucks is good to know. I'm going to have to find a better teacher for hard surface stuff then. Anyway, here's my donut progress:

Sagebrush
Feb 26, 2012

eh i dunno. he's said some chudly things, but his tutorials still do their job just fine. i don't think there's anything wrong with watching then. just be aware that sometimes he might make some lovely jokes.

DreadUnknown
Nov 4, 2020

Bird is the word.
Yeah that's pretty much what I was thinking.

Chance
Apr 28, 2002

For hard surface blender stuff check master xeon he went on to make the hardops plugin and had a lot of sculpt tutorials before.

DreadUnknown
Nov 4, 2020

Bird is the word.
Ok Ill check it out!

Gearman
Dec 6, 2011

Arrimus3D is also pretty good for learning hard surface. He definitely falls into the "if it looks good, it's good" camp for fundamental subd modeling, which is fine for most cases. He also covers hard surface modeling in a bunch of different software packages.

Edit: Andrew AKA Blender Guru's biggest crime, IMO, is sounding so happy in all of his tutorials. Everyone knows that the best and most useful tutorials are made by people at 2AM, where they're burned out, exhausted, half asleep, and sound as if they are begrudgingly recording their walkthrough for three other people on the Internet.

Gearman fucked around with this message at 13:55 on Mar 6, 2024

Khanstant
Apr 5, 2007

DreadUnknown posted:

Well poo poo learning Blender Guru guy sucks is good to know. I'm going to have to find a better teacher for hard surface stuff then. Anyway, here's my donut progress:


To be clear I think the chuddy dude is Blender Bros. Blender Guru is the Australian dork and I think his biggest sin is detailing his tutorials for a personal story you hear four times rewinding to do one little thing.

EoinCannon
Aug 29, 2008

Grimey Drawer
I made a sculpt for international women's day tomorrow







Turntable that I don't know how to embed

https://i.imgur.com/DRwmjRL.mp4

EoinCannon fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Mar 7, 2024

TooMuchAbstraction
Oct 14, 2012

I spent four years making
Waves of Steel
Hell yes I'm going to turn my avatar into an ad for it.
Fun Shoe
drat, impressive work

DreadUnknown
Nov 4, 2020

Bird is the word.
Holy drat thats good.

Khanstant posted:

To be clear I think the chuddy dude is Blender Bros. Blender Guru is the Australian dork and I think his biggest sin is detailing his tutorials for a personal story you hear four times rewinding to do one little thing.
Ah ok, I did see the "NFTs are the future video" but thats pretty bog standard techdude bullshit.

Listerine
Jan 5, 2005

Exquisite Corpse
Is there any way to implement "industry standard" keymapping in Blender AFTER a fresh install? I forgot to check the box as I was in a rush, and I can't see any option to select in the Keymaps section of the Preferences drop down, and I'd really rather not have to go through and manually rebind keymaps. Googling just finds other people with the same complaint but maybe one of you gurus knows a way?

Never mind, I found it- didn't notice a drop down menu in the top left.

Listerine fucked around with this message at 21:34 on Mar 7, 2024

cubicle gangster
Jun 26, 2005

magda, make the tea

EoinCannon posted:

I made a sculpt for international women's day tomorrow

Unreal as always. Hair is outrageous.

DreadUnknown
Nov 4, 2020

Bird is the word.
Ok I finished the donut tutorial, I realize they look kind of plastic but ehhhh.

Wheany
Mar 17, 2006

Spinyahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

Doctor Rope

DreadUnknown posted:

Ok I finished the donut tutorial, I realize they look kind of plastic but ehhhh.



Materials is also something you have to practice, just like modelling

SubNat
Nov 27, 2008

Unreal finally put the boot down on enterprise development/archvis/VFX/etc, and are rolling out enterprice licenses for non-games usage. (Applicable to companies with 1 million+ revenue, making non-games.).
Apparently they aim to combine Twinmotion, Unreal, and RealityCapture together by the end of 2025, so per now you get all 3 with a license. https://www.unrealengine.com/en-US/blog/we-are-updating-unreal-engine-twinmotion-and-realitycapture-pricing-in-late-april
Will apply from Unreal 5.4 and out. It's cheaper than Unity's Enterprise/Industry licenses atleast (Those are like 4500 usd/yr, if I recall?)

There's also something about licensing out applications to 3rd parties make you count as games, and they want the royalty cut instead. (Simulators, anything else using unreal to render, I guess? Cases where you license out instead of selling a bunch.)

Not a fan of them selling 'unreal' for 1850 usd/seat/year... But RealityCapture on it's own is 1250. Even if you have projects where it's used, only a small part of the team would generally engage with it.
The fact that you can buy TM or RC on their own, but UE forces you to get all of them just makes it blatant that they want to inflate the price with 'added value'. Why offer UE for 500-1000, when you can charge 1850, after all.

They're also removing the Pay-per-input licensing for RealityCapture, meaning that if you want to use it as a company, you have to pony up for the subscription as opposed to being able to go pay-as-you-go for smaller projects.
The flip side is that they're making RealityCapture free for anyone where UE is free, aka hobbyists, students, and anyone grossing less than the limit. So yay: I'll save dozens of dollars on projects in my spare time, dozens!

But yeah, I guess this means that anyone who's been using UE for archvis will need to start paying for it. Ditto for me, using UE primarily for VR Simulators and other 'realtime visualizations.'.

Alterian
Jan 28, 2003

Reality Capture is great. I use it a lot and teach it. Its been a pain in the rear end to teach and deal with .bat files for students to be able to use our school's licenses on their home computers. I think I'm going to finally bite the bullet and make a tutorial series on using Reality Capture.

SubNat
Nov 27, 2008

Yeah, that part is great.

The less great part is that they haven't said anything on how users will function re: build agents and the like for UE. With Unity it's a huge pain because we occasionally get bottlenecked by how many build agent licenses we have.
I hope UE just leans on the 'we just want you to pay per developer, we don't give a poo poo about build agents.' approach, because it'll be obnoxious if we need a dozen or so extra licenses just for our build and deploy environment.

SubNat fucked around with this message at 20:53 on Mar 12, 2024

Ccs
Feb 25, 2011


cubicle gangster posted:

Thats definitely a thing but I was talking about people using creative work as an escape. I think there's a generational shift where the modern gen want to make something cool and do music videos for marshmellow, but I came from an era where we were just not very well socially adjusted and used our time in front of a computer to escape from real life. Theres a patience and pace to people who came to this industry as an escape vs those that were sold it as a way to do super cool poo poo for a living. We all wanted to do super cool poo poo for a living but there was a different level of ego to it. We were thankful to be in the room, in awe of all opportunity

I mean, I like the meditative aspect of it but you really only get that after enough time in the industry. Most people start on lower budget projects that has a huge "get the poo poo out the door" mentality, and then after enough experience might move to a studio with bigger budget projects that actually give some time. My career went from having to churn out 3 shots a day in tv to sometimes spending days polishing fingers in vfx. But that was only after lots of tv productions and then on vfx projects that had the "get poo poo out the door" mentality until after a couple years finally landing on a project that had a good schedule.

As for Unreal Engine's new pricing, that sucks. Tons of tv animation studios rebuilt their pipeline around Unreal with the thought that although hiring Unreal developers and training their whole crew on lighting in Unreal was an expensive upfront cost, they would save on licenses and render times. Now they'll really only save on render times, and end up with worse quality than if they had stuck with a traditional rendering engine.

Koramei
Nov 11, 2011

I have three regrets
The first is to be born in Joseon.
Anyone tried using Cascadeur?

anatomi
Jan 31, 2015

I haven't but it looks cool. There's an unofficial add-on for Blender that makes the workflow a lot smoother.

SubNat
Nov 27, 2008

It doesn't have the "AI pose" stuff, but Ragdoll has recently released a Blender version (previously Maya only), which is amazing for secondary motion and ragdoll physics in-app, if that's what you're after.
I haven't used it much in a proper production setting or anything, and it is joint-only, but it's fun to work with for character/world interactions and the like.
Very nice to close a hand and have the fingers rest on the surface of a bottle without any more complex setup than assigning a collider, and setting up the joints.

The only thing dragging it down is the weirdo licensing where the personal noncommercial edition (99$) only lets you record/bake 100 frames at a time, to separate it from the actual commercial versions.
(I bought it before it released, so I have a 'personal' edition without that limit.) There's a trial, and free education license though.

sinky
Feb 22, 2011



Slippery Tilde
Cascadeur updated their licensing/pricing plans. If you had a basic (free) license before March 1 you can claim a 2 year Indie license :toot:

The new basic version can't export to anything so it's pretty useless.

Ccs
Feb 25, 2011


German VFX facility RISE just posted this "press release" on linkedIn which I'm 90% sure is an April Fools prank, but almost indecipherable from real AI promoters:

quote:

"REMIX AI will allow RISE to massively reduce production costs on state-of-the-art visual effects for feature film and episodic content by harnessing the power of data that is "publicly available".
RISE CTO and generative AI evangelist Robert Pinnow says "Years ago, we started replacing stunt performers faces using DeepFakes. Naively we thought we were legally constrained to only teaching the AI datasets of the principal cast shot specifically for that reason, something the actors had agreed to in their contracts on that particular show."
But as months went by and former non-profit startups like OpenAI were valued at 80 Billion USD "we learned that, since the AI is being creatively inspired like a human and not directly copying content, we could obviously throw any available bit of footage at it without having to feel guilty."
RISE, currently work place for over 400 creatives, could soon be able cut its payroll by more than 80%. "A dream come true" adds co-founder and CFO Sven Pannicke, "Our operating costs on VFX work have been 70-80% payroll, not even taking extra employee benefits like free gym memberships, bicycle leasing, health insurance and fruit baskets into account."
The backend of REMIX AI is a rapid footage download and ingestion software called HARVEST. It scans the internet for images and videos that are publicly available while not logging where it got the data from.
"We're not really interested in where our "inspiration" comes from and we'd rather not know too much about it in case legislation changes" says RISE CCO Markus Degen, continuing “Nobody seems to care about the consequences anyway, everyone seems to be more intrigued than concerned.”

Slothful Bong
Dec 2, 2018

Filling the Void with Chaos
Lmao that may be a joke, but exactly that happened at a studio I worked at last year. They decided to go all in with ML/AI stuff, and laid off the entire CG department (I think like 20 people total) while we were in the middle of multiple shows.

So yeah, someone may find that funny but that shits already happening for real.

Ccs
Feb 25, 2011


Slothful Bong posted:

Lmao that may be a joke, but exactly that happened at a studio I worked at last year. They decided to go all in with ML/AI stuff, and laid off the entire CG department (I think like 20 people total) while we were in the middle of multiple shows.

So yeah, someone may find that funny but that shits already happening for real.

What, like full vfx for tv and movies type shows? I wasn't aware AI was at a place where it could conceivably meet client demands to do that.

Do you mind me asking which studio was it?

Gearman
Dec 6, 2011

Ccs posted:

What, like full vfx for tv and movies type shows? I wasn't aware AI was at a place where it could conceivably meet client demands to do that.

Do you mind me asking which studio was it?

It absolutely cannot. Anyone laying off experienced creative staff in the belief that AI is good enough to replace them is going to find themselves underwater incredibly quickly.

Slothful Bong
Dec 2, 2018

Filling the Void with Chaos

Ccs posted:

What, like full vfx for tv and movies type shows? I wasn't aware AI was at a place where it could conceivably meet client demands to do that.

Do you mind me asking which studio was it?

Yep, a decently well-known studio that did a bit of big budget feature and tv work. Not comfortable sharing who as it seems like the company is still posting as if the CG team is still there, but if you’ve seen tons of LinkedIn posts from a western company talking about AI stuff, there’s a good chance you’ve got it.

You’re right that AI is definitely not at that point yet though. Well, maybe basic cleanup/roto/beauty work, but I haven’t seen anything useful beyond that.

As to the “why” of it all, my in-the-dark assumption is it’s due to outside investors. When you get tech investment firms dumping millions into VFX companies specifically for AI, they’ll never get the gains they want, and then the company is on the hook for showing “profitability” in the short term.

Elukka
Feb 18, 2011

For All Mankind
Do they just start giving their client the Willy Wonka experience and hope nobody notices? Like surely this would break immediately since you can't make something passable like this.

I'd also be pissed off as a client if I was paying for serious work and they tried to give me AI stuff. Guess it's time for clients to put clauses on AI use on those contacts.

Ccs
Feb 25, 2011


If it's a Toronto studio, I think I know who it is. But who knows. There's so many medium sized vfx companies. I haven't seen any of the big guys like Framestore, ILM, Weta, or DNEG say anything major about AI. And maybe the mid sized companies are selling their investors on the idea of "we're nimble, our pipelines can adapt to AI faster than the big guys!"

Anyway I hope that company burns all their bridges with clients by delivering bad work and learns their lesson.

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roomtone
Jul 1, 2021

I'm having a tough time keeping motivation to learn and pursue 3D this week. I just got a little job and paid for doing something in 3D for the first time last week so you'd think I would be high on it, but I can't shake this feeling that the things I enjoy about the process are going to be completely gone by the time I finish my education, and it'll be something else entirely, and barely anybody will be hiring to do even that.

Like, I enjoy modelling and rigging and texturing and all of that, but it just seems naive to think these things won't be 90% automated and reduced to touch-ups. It seems like a lot of the time, the entire 3D pipeline will just end up being skipped to have a genAI just make some video of a thing. Not tomorrow, but maybe in 5 years. The kind of work a small time guy could actually get.

So I'm sitting here doing my projects for college and every time I stop working I think, well, this won't be useful to me in the future at all.

I really wish I'd gotten into this 10 years ago. If the AI thing wasn't such a looming threat in my mind, I'd have basically no questions about pursuing it because I've finally found something I'm good at and don't hate actually doing. But if it's not going to lead to actual employment, am I just wasting more of my time on another dead end? This was supposed to be the new direction.

I might feel better about things again in a few days, I've been completely up and down on it for basically a year, which is exhausting, but the realities don't make me feel better - and it isn't like I can pivot to some other medium again, because every single one of them has this problem.

roomtone fucked around with this message at 23:15 on Apr 9, 2024

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