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80k posted:-tito-, I presume that the company match is then taxed upon withdrawal in retirement like a traditional 401(k) then? Thanks for the great info. 80k
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Jul 11, 2008 03:25
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This is a really timely thread, thanks. I'm 35 and just getting started in my first real, good-paying job, so I have no retirement savings apart from a tiny 401K from my previous crappy secretary job. My current employer is matching 3% (and I'm maxing that) deductions to a "simple IRA". I got no guidance about what this means except "call this guy at Morgan Stanley, everyone in the office uses him." It's up to me to decide what to do with the money, with no real advice from anyone including this guy. My first two checks have been garnished but I haven't even been able to make up my mind where to put the money. Partly because I don't know what to do, partly because I've never trusted/understood stock investing, and it's hard to overcome that prejudice given recent events. I'm also constrained in that I want to try to stick with green or eco-friendly investing. I'm going to start by reading every link you've posted so far, but in the meantime if you have any guidance I'd appreciate it. 
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Jul 11, 2008 21:32
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alucinor posted:This is a really timely thread, thanks. I'm 35 and just getting started in my first real, good-paying job, so I have no retirement savings apart from a tiny 401K from my previous crappy secretary job. The best thing you can do for yourself is read every link and all the basic books noted here. Investing well is really not hard at all, but it's a different world from most other things you likely do, so you can't really go into it intuitively. You don't need a financial advsior to make smart calls, but you do need to do a bit of basic reading.
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Jul 11, 2008 22:05
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If anyone is looking for a great book about all of this, I highly recommend Jim Cramer's Stay Mad. I know, I know, it's Jim Cramer, but it's not like he's recommending individual stocks in the book. It's unflinchingly honest and does a really good job explaining retirement savings and the options you have.
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Jul 12, 2008 16:23
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gently caress. I'm so tempted to cash out the equities in my long term accounts (Roth IRA/401(k) and just go into straight asset protection right now. I think Monday is going to be pretty bloody. My plan right now is to wait for a rally to sell into and then park my money someplace safe for the next year. Intellectually I know that after being down 20% from the peak I should sit things through and not realize my losses, but drat I don't see things improving anytime soon
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Jul 13, 2008 21:17
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I'll be starting a Roth IRA soon for retirement purposes and I want you guys to critique the portfolio I'm thinking of creating: 45% Vanguard Total Stock Market 45% Vanguard Total International Stock Market 10% Vanguard Total Bond Market Index As you can see, it has a 90/10 equity/bond allocation. I dislike the Target Retirement funds offered by Vanguard (as well as other fund families) because they have really low international exposure. Also, I like to keep the number of funds to a low number.. I don't want a portfolio of 10 funds. I have a question as well: What do you guys think about a High Yield bond fund in place of the Total Bond Market fund? I assume it would probably be worse over the long run.. high yield bonds seem to be more correlated with the equity market.
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Jul 13, 2008 22:43
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I recommend that everybody takes a look at the work of economist Laurence Kotlikoff. He's done a tremendous amount of work on how people spend over a lifetime. He's concluded that too many people are oversaving (and missing out on spending over prime years) and, much more visibly, too many people are undersaving. For example, for anyone who goes to the gym, look at the people on the treadmills. They're mostly in great shape or skinny--and also the people who need to be on a treadmill the least. The same applies to many people who oversave. Also, I'm not sure that long-term investing works at all. It's easy for a Siegel to come in and study the past and say it'll happen again. Truthfully, the stock market was never intended to be a long-term investment vehicle, especially for the average person. Finally, I'm leery of the projections of people needing $1m+ for a comfortable retirement. There are only $10m millionaires in the world, most of which popped up in the last 20 years and only after going through one of the greatest bursts of global growth in modern times. How many people putting $5k into an IRA annually are going to join them, even with future inflation? How many will even get half-way there?
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Jul 13, 2008 23:29
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Modern Life Is War posted:Stuff Yeah, but what's the alternative, dude? What do you suggest? That the average person should save nothing for retirement and just work until death?
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Jul 14, 2008 01:21
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Ravarek posted:I'll be starting a Roth IRA soon for retirement purposes and I want you guys to critique the portfolio I'm thinking of creating: Like you say, high yield bonds tend to correlate with equities; Your original portfolio looks perfectly fine to me. You might consider a slice of REIT exposure as well.
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Jul 14, 2008 02:20
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Ravarek posted:Yeah, but what's the alternative, dude? What do you suggest? That the average person should save nothing for retirement and just work until death? I think what he is advocating is moderation in one's investment strategy and not wholesale abandonment of saving or investing. If you think about it, why should you invest much more than 15% of your income on the upper-end? Why should you save and skip vacations, going out, etc. due to extreme saving and miss out on what life has to offer? When you are 65 and in a diaper or full of many illnesses, and are too old to go visit all the wonderful places you've wanted to go to your whole life...what is the point? There are many stories out there of people that have lived a hard-working life, been successful, finally retired only to be too sick (or die) to fulfill their dreams. Would you rather have a harder time in old age when you have lived a full, happy life or face regret? As with everything, moderation is key.
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Jul 14, 2008 02:22
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Modern Life Is War posted:Stuff This is one of the best posts i've read on this forum. I greatly symphathize with the ideas of people like Kotlikoff and Bodie. They have heavily influenced the way that I think about money and finances. We only live once, and the work they've done on helping us plan lifetime consumption is way too important to ignore. Hope you post more.
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Jul 14, 2008 05:08
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Let's talk allocation! I've my 401(k) for 4 years now (I'm 30) and have always maxed this and my ESPP contributions. In the past, my company matched up to $2000 a year with immediate vesting. I would max out my contributions to 20% at the beginning of the year and then changed it to like 1% once I hit the matching level. I figured that it's best to get that money into my account as soon as I could. This past year my company changed how our 401(k) works and now it matches up to 4% of my salary, but it's at 4% a pay period. I couldn't max it out early and turn it off again like I had in the past. Since my salary is less than $50,000 a year, I also got screwed out of a bit of money. Whatever. They did also introduce a Roth 401k option this year if it makes a difference. I know that looking at your account's performance too often just isn't the best of ideas, but I'm down ~7% YTD and was hoping people had some ideas as to how I should distribute. When distributions are changed, should you also rebalance? Should you rebalance twice a year or on any regular basis? I'm with Schwab and here are the funds I have to choose from:
Any ideas on how I should handle this? Do you need me to post my current percentages?
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Aug 1, 2008 14:19
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Unormal posted:Like you say, high yield bonds tend to correlate with equities; Your original portfolio looks perfectly fine to me. You might consider a slice of REIT exposure as well. How about.. 40% Total Stock Market 40% Total International Stock Market 10% Total Bond Market 10% REIT Index Should I even worry about adding commodity funds to my retirement portfolio?
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Aug 2, 2008 23:59
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Here's a question for anyone who's familiar with investing. I currently have a student loan balance of about 9k being repaid at about 4.2%, and I have about 14k in a non-retirement Vanguard mutual fund. Now, the Vanguard fund currently isn't exactly making money hand over fist, but I'm sort of reluctant to take out the money from the fund and pay off the loan balance. So....it makes financial sense at this very moment to pay off the loan. However, should I bank on the economy bouncing back and outgrowing the loan interest in the long term (20-30yrs from now), or should I just go ahead and just pay it off right now?
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Aug 3, 2008 15:43
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Rekinom posted:Here's a question for anyone who's familiar with investing. I currently have a student loan balance of about 9k being repaid at about 4.2%, and I have about 14k in a non-retirement Vanguard mutual fund. Now, the Vanguard fund currently isn't exactly making money hand over fist, but I'm sort of reluctant to take out the money from the fund and pay off the loan balance. If the 4.2% is fixed I'd consider leaving it alone; you can deduct the interest if you don't make too much. Historically, the market should return better than 4.2%. If it's variable, consider paying it off because the interest rate is only going to go up once the feds start raising rates again.
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Aug 3, 2008 18:42
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Ravarek posted:How about.. This looks like a pretty solid allocation to me; simple and diverse. I wouldn't personally worry about a commodity allocation.
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Aug 3, 2008 19:23
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I'm pretty new to this saving for retirement business. I want to open a roth IRA with Vanguard but I have just started working and am just starting to have a good amount of money in my checking account. It seems like I need a minimum $3000 to open one (multiple times that to split between different funds) , which I don't have. I guess my question is how much should I have saved up before I open a Roth IRA and start contributing to it.
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Aug 4, 2008 19:04
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Day 29 in Search for Lost Hog posted:I'm pretty new to this saving for retirement business. I want to open a roth IRA with Vanguard but I have just started working and am just starting to have a good amount of money in my checking account. It seems like I need a minimum $3000 to open one (multiple times that to split between different funds) , which I don't have. I guess my question is how much should I have saved up before I open a Roth IRA and start contributing to it. I recently opened a Roth IRA at Vanguard with $1000. The only fund with a $1000 minimum is the STAR Fund, which is a fund of funds. I'm not too concerned about my asset allocation right now because I have so little money. I figure once my balance gets higher I can spread it out among index funds.
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Aug 4, 2008 19:19
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Day 29 in Search for Lost Hog posted:I'm pretty new to this saving for retirement business. I want to open a roth IRA with Vanguard but I have just started working and am just starting to have a good amount of money in my checking account. It seems like I need a minimum $3000 to open one (multiple times that to split between different funds) , which I don't have. I guess my question is how much should I have saved up before I open a Roth IRA and start contributing to it. I'm in the same situation. I recently transfered a roth ira with around $3,800 my dad set up for me a long time ago into a Vangaurd account. I just put it all in their 2050 target retirement fund. In a year or so when I have some more money in there I'll worry about making a portfolio.
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Aug 4, 2008 22:46
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I've got a question about rollovers. At my current job I'm enrolled in a Roth 401k with a 6% employer match. I put enough in to reach the match. When I leave the job and rollover the account will my contributions be rolled into a Roth IRA and the employer match be rolled into a traditional IRA? It's my understanding that all the employer contributions in a Roth 401k are before tax.
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Aug 5, 2008 01:54
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So, after a year and a half of working at my current place, I've just picked up all the 401k paperwork, and after reading this thread, and doing some Googling around, I think what we have sucks pretty hard. So, I guess I'd like to know what to do. I need to start saving, but short of a 401k and Roth, I'm not really sure what I should do. We have the Legg Mason 401k through Paychex, and my company will match 4% if you put in 5%. Looking through the paperwork, all of the stock symbols are accompanied by Classes - A, B or C, which I've found out are loaded funds. Checking the symbols on Google, the loads range anywhere from 4.5 to 5.5%, along with 1-2% expense ratios. Am I right in thinking this isn't a good thing? It seems like we don't have a whole lot of options either - 7 Equity funds, 1 international, 1 "flexible", 2 mixed income bonds/securities. Even with all the loads and what seems to be high expense ratios, should I still put in at least to get the free money? What other options do I have?
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Aug 5, 2008 05:02
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Is there a downside to going with a private financial advisor person (not sure what the term is) as opposed to working with someone in your bank? As far as I can see, there isn't, but you guys are more knowledgeable. I'm in Canada if that makes any difference.
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Aug 5, 2008 20:41
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Vehementi posted:Is there a downside to going with a private financial advisor person (not sure what the term is) as opposed to working with someone in your bank? As far as I can see, there isn't, but you guys are more knowledgeable. I'm in Canada if that makes any difference. How is your advisor getting paid? Some work off the trailing comissions and other comissions, making them (potentially) more like salesmen than advisors. Others take 1-2% per year, and some even do it for a fixed dollar amount per hour. Of course, a bank advisor may end up being aggressive in steering you towards the bank's products, so that's a consideration as well. EDIT: Panthrax posted:So, after a year and a half of working at my current place, I've just picked up all the 401k paperwork, and after reading this thread, and doing some Googling around, I think what we have sucks pretty hard. So, I guess I'd like to know what to do. I need to start saving, but short of a 401k and Roth, I'm not really sure what I should do. As a Canadian, I'm not well versed in 401k matching. I assume it works like this: If you make $100K, and contribute $5k to the 401k, the employer will give you $4k for the account "for free". It seems like that extra money more than compensates for the lovely front-load. Also, 1-2% MER isn't too bad for an actively managed fund. big shtick energy fucked around with this message at 22:11 on Aug 5, 2008 |
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Aug 5, 2008 22:07
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SecretFire posted:How is your advisor getting paid? Some work off the trailing comissions and other comissions, making them (potentially) more like salesmen than advisors. Others take 1-2% per year, and some even do it for a fixed dollar amount per hour. My advisor gets paid off commissions, so when I put into funds etc. I think she gets part of the MER (out of the fund's company's pocket, not out of my share). I can see your point that she could be acting like a salesman, but on the other hand she does get part of the profit so she has interest in signing me up for successful funds. The bank (CIBC for me) has access only to CIBC funds, which might suck (they do, it turns out).
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Aug 5, 2008 23:15
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Ok, I need some help. I'm actually pretty stressed about this. One of my friends ended up getting a job at Ameriprise and convincing me to open an account with him. He said i'd get a free start and we'd take a look after a year. After a year, he wanted to charge me $500 for the service and I took a look at my return on investment before the 'services' and after and figured that $500 was a significant enough portion to not be interested. This being said, all of my co-workers who seem intelligent have been saying i can do this stuff on my own using Vanguard. I've looked over the information posted in the OP with respect to Vanguard and I like what i see, but I'm unsure how to transfer my ROTH IRA over (my wife's would come with to). This is our long term retirement investment. For reference, I'm saving 4k to both IRAs and getting my employer match on my 401k. I'm 24 and a software engineer. The advice I'm looking for is if you all agree with this and what my first steps to move should be. I think I'll also want to move my money out of Ameriprise's money market account since the fee seems to be $40 quarterly for about 3% return. What do you think?
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Aug 7, 2008 15:54
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Gimbal_Machine posted:Ok, I need some help. You will have to set up a retirement account at Vanguard (you can do it online) and select the IRA rollover option when setting it up. The website will produce some forms that you will have to sign and send back to Vanguard. They will scan everything you send and send it back to you with an account information form. That gets everything set up with them and they will be awaiting your money from Ameriprise. Then get the rollover form from Ameriprise and fill it out. You will need your Vanguard account number address and contact info from the information form you get back from Vanguard. Send that back to Ameriprise. It should be pretty straightforward. Vanguard has a rollover department with associates that do nothing but help with rollovers so don't hesitate to call. I've done two rollovers to Vanguard so far and the only effort required on my part was filling out forms and walking to the post office.
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Aug 7, 2008 16:17
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To add to what Gimbal said, you can always call Vanguard. They are very helpful on the phone and can step you through the process. Also, they won't let your wife and your retirement money go under the same login I believe, so you should have to do everything twice. I'm not sure if that's true, but that's what one rep told me after I got married and tried to merge everything.
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Aug 7, 2008 16:25
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Dijkstra posted:Most people here if not everyone will agree. Thanks dijkstra and droo, i'm going to get started on this right away. I'll let you guys know how it goes to hopefully help the next guy who might feel a bit trapped/overwhelmed.
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Aug 7, 2008 23:49
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Vehementi posted:Is there a downside to going with a private financial advisor person (not sure what the term is) as opposed to working with someone in your bank? As far as I can see, there isn't, but you guys are more knowledgeable. I'm in Canada if that makes any difference. You should consider reading up on some of the books mentioned in this thread and others. If investing seems complex, it's because someone (an advisor? an unknowledgable family member?) is making it seem more complicated than it really is. You really can do your own investing without paying anyone else a fee. You have more than enough time to just do the research and learn to do it on your own, it will pay dividends (both literally and figuratively). Four Pillars of Investing is a great place to start http://www.amazon.com/Four-Pillars-Investing-Building-Portfolio/dp/0071385290/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1218161023&sr=8-1
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Aug 8, 2008 03:04
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Unormal posted:You should consider reading up on some of the books mentioned in this thread and others. If investing seems complex, it's because someone (an advisor? an unknowledgable family member?) is making it seem more complicated than it really is. You really can do your own investing without paying anyone else a fee. You have more than enough time to just do the research and learn to do it on your own, it will pay dividends (both literally and figuratively). Yes.. this. I'm working as an assistant to a fairly successful financial planner and let me just tell you that I wouldn't feel comfortable with any of the financial planners at my office handling my investment portfolio. It's not that all financial planners are greedy -- well, some are greedy.. but even the good ones can't do anything with your investment accounts that you can't do yourself. Not to mention that a financial planner will probably be sucking 1% a year from your portfolio without doing much in return. It is much easier and much cheaper to build a diverse portfolio of index funds for your IRA then it is to pay a 1% a year to a planner that will just dump you into a bunch of stupid rear end random funds.
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Aug 8, 2008 04:16
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Edit: Nevermind, I should learn to read the goddamn dates on these things.
SDMX fucked around with this message at 10:41 on Aug 8, 2008 |
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Aug 8, 2008 10:37
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Thanks for the info. I ordered that book for my next batch of stuff from Amazon.
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Aug 8, 2008 18:34
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I guess I'm looking for something "easy" to invest in myself. I currently have a Roth IRA set up with Vanguard with about $12k in it that's maxed out for the year. I'm also contributing 3% (the maximum my company matches) into a 401k from work, although it's worth mentioning that I don't really plan on being there long enough to get the full vesting from it. My checking account usually has >$10k in it and I feel like it should be out doing something, but I don't really know what. The only thing I can think of is to increase my 401k contributions, but like I said, I don't plan on being at my current employer long enough to see the matching. I'm 24 so it's okay if I don't see this money for a long time.
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Aug 10, 2008 23:34
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Alright, I'm hoping to get into the retirement savings boat soon enough. Here's my situation: -23 years old -Can currently contribute ~$1500 USD per month -Have an additional $40K from last year that I haven't paid taxes on yet. Currently sitting in a ING Direct account. -Employer doesn't offer 401k -- we have our own retirement plan where they contribute 1 month of my salary for my first year of service, 2 months for my second year, and so on. But apparently the government doesn't like this one so the plan is scheduled to be phased out within the next 2-3 years. I guess I'll just get whatever amount deposited into my account at that point. -I live in Japan, where everyone is required to pay into a national pension system. My contributions to this are about $280 US per month (it's a percentage of my salary, but after my rent is taken off the top). Unfortunately the Japanese pension system isn't very friendly: basically I have to live in Japan for 25 years to collect on it. Otherwise the most I can get out of it is 3 years worth of contributions. Given the political situation here I'd say this pension system is just a black hole of money anyway... I basically expect to never see it again. -I really don't have any plans of owning a home here soon, because they're absurdly expensive and even less of a "good investment" than they are in the US. I'm going to have to check up what kind of restrictions I have from work too. I work at a securities company and we're straight-up not allowed to do futures/options transactions. All stock transactions have to be approved through compliance too. All of our securities accounts are supposed to be transferred to (domestic) approved vendors too, but I'm not sure if this is applicable for retirement accounts as well. But I'd still appreciate any suggestions. For the time being, all I earn is the 3% or whatever from the ING Direct account.
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Aug 11, 2008 13:23
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Febtober posted:I guess I'm looking for something "easy" to invest in myself. I currently have a Roth IRA set up with Vanguard with about $12k in it that's maxed out for the year. I'm also contributing 3% (the maximum my company matches) into a 401k from work, although it's worth mentioning that I don't really plan on being there long enough to get the full vesting from it. Go out and spend it? Seriously, if your IRA is maxed, and you're getting the maximum 401(k) match from your employer, and you still have $10k just sitting around, take a vacation or something. It's great to save up for the future (which you're well ahead of the curve on), but you shouldn't be sacrificing your present to have a cushy retirement. You're 24, go to Vegas and blow a few thousand dollars; travel the world for a few weeks; lay on a beach in the Caribbean for a week and don't think about anything. For a 24-year old, you're absolutely loaded; live it up.
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Aug 11, 2008 15:30
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Febtober posted:I guess I'm looking for something "easy" to invest in myself. I currently have a Roth IRA set up with Vanguard with about $12k in it that's maxed out for the year. I'm also contributing 3% (the maximum my company matches) into a 401k from work, although it's worth mentioning that I don't really plan on being there long enough to get the full vesting from it. You could just go ahead and put it in index stocks similar to whatever you have your IRA, but in a plain old vanguard investment account. No tax bonuses, but the same investment growth, so the money will be available for you in 5-10 years when you're thinking about buying a house or something. edit: general advice would also suggest having an "emergency fund" of the money - 3 months living expenses is the standard - available in something like a money market account, where you can easily withdraw it if necessary. You're right that money in the checking account does nothing - even 3% interest, which seems to be what money market accounts are doing lately, is better than nothing. onefish fucked around with this message at 17:23 on Aug 11, 2008 |
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Aug 11, 2008 17:19
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Febtober posted:I guess I'm looking for something "easy" to invest in myself. I currently have a Roth IRA set up with Vanguard with about $12k in it that's maxed out for the year. I'm also contributing 3% (the maximum my company matches) into a 401k from work, although it's worth mentioning that I don't really plan on being there long enough to get the full vesting from it. Sorry I've been gone from the thread for a while, I just found out I got a promotion and I'm being relocated, so life is a bit busy. Even if you contribute more to the 401k, matching be damned, you can roll that money into an IRA or a new 401k at your new employer. Plus you get the tax benefits today, which is always a plus. As for your current checking account surplus, the first thing to do would be to put together an emergency fund. I really liked this article for determining how much you should have socked away in a high yield savings account somewhere. The other thing you should do is put aside your Roth IRA contribution for next year. The limit will be $5,500. If you set it aside now, on Jan 1 you can transfer all of that in, and get the full year of tax free growth. Hope this helps..
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Aug 13, 2008 23:30
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zmcnulty posted:Alright, I'm hoping to get into the retirement savings boat soon enough. Here's my situation: In all honesty, I would be speaking with a certified financial planner somewhere here in the States. You have a complicated set of circumstances where it would benefit you to pay someone to make sure that you don't gently caress up. I'm honestly not too comfortable giving you any advice past that.
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Aug 13, 2008 23:32
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This thread doesn't seem to have been playing the same kind of name game that the Stock and Analysis thread has. While that's probably because not everyone has access to the same funds, I still thinks it's worthwhile. I just made my annual contribution to my Traditional IRA, so I've got 5K sitting around waiting to be allocated somewhere. I converted an old Fidelity 401K over, so I'm sort of stuck with Fidelity at the moment, but if any of you Vanguard Zealots are willing to sell me on some of their perks, I'm all ears. That said, I'm still up in the air on where to put my contribution. I'm 100% FBALX at the moment because I thought it was a safe bet when I opened the 401K a year ago, didn't realize it was predominantly stocks, and have taken the 10% YTD hit on it, along with the rest of the market. I'd like to start gearing toward small growth since I'm optimistic about the market, but I haven't felt a fund I feel that safe on. I was thinking about dropping the majority in FICDX (which is large, I know), but I'm concerned that I might have missed the whole emerging fund explosion and won't see the same kind of return on it that it's previously enjoyed. So where's everyone else allocated? How do you feel about it so far? SDMX fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Aug 14, 2008 |
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Aug 14, 2008 01:31
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SDMX posted:This thread doesn't seem to have been playing the same kind of name game that the Stock and Analysis thread has. While that's probably because not everyone has access to the same funds, I still thinks it's worthwhile. This thread is about investing, the "Stocks and Analysis" thread is about speculating. If you want to get into serious investing, your allocations should be set for decades, not months. If you're interested, check out some of the book recommendations earlier in the thread to get started. The biggest influence on your eventual net worth will be how much you can save from your profession, period. The split between how much stock and how much fixed income you have will ultimately be the biggest influence on your investment returns on that savings. After that, you can control expenses and your taxes, anything else basically comes down to speculation. Speculation is just fine, but it's a profession, investing is not. If you're interested in investing, figure out your need and ability to shoulder risk. This leads to an allocation to stocks and an allocation to fixed income. Then it's a matter of finding the most diverse and lowest cost ways you have available to you to invest in that percentage of equities and fixed income. Unormal fucked around with this message at 03:23 on Aug 14, 2008 |
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Aug 14, 2008 03:21
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