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OgreNoah posted:I found the Cities, Dreams and Nightmares lecture that China gave at Michigan. He starts here Ceramic Shot posted:It's just hard for me to take him seriously as someone who cares about politics, intelligent and qualified as he may be. He strikes me as the kind of person who's chosen a side because it's fun and interesting to debate on an abstract level rather than out of real conviction.  That's the one thing that I would never assume about him. Is there something obviously... capricious about him that I'm missing? From what I've seen and read he's politically quite active, not someone who just talks about these things. It's such an odd perspective that I feel I must be misunderstanding what you mean. Ceramic Shot posted:edit: I think it also explains why I really liked The Traitor Baru Cormorant more than some Mieville works even though the former could easily be labeled as a low-fantasy queer theory economic thriller: it was character-driven and explored an interesting, conflicted, striving character with specific, understandable goals. While we've got a lull in Mieville news, is there anything out there that might, in some capacity, scratch the same itch? In my case I like fantastic settings that illustrate socially conscious ideas. I've been quite fruitfully working through China Mieville's own recommendations here for the past few years, but I'm wondering if there might be anything else new and interesting along those lines, and I figure fans of Mieville are the people to ask.
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Jan 24, 2017 06:37
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Oh wow that's incredibly exciting! I always imagined if they adapted it they'd play with focus a lot. Not conspicuously blurring out the other city, but just shooting it so that only certain stuff is in focus. However they do it, they can't just have the actors pretending. The viewers need to experience the world like a local does, and fully get used to it, so that the eventual breaches manage to be really shocking. If they go all out with the premise it could look really cool and the visuals could add a lot to the story. If they gently caress it up it could be really terrible. But no sense dwelling on that, China Mieville is getting an adaptation! That's awesome! Thinking about it, I'm actually most excited to see how they portray Ul Qoma. More totalitarian, but more prosperous, Soviet backed, was it explicitly Muslim? It's been a while since I read the book, but it gave my that vibe at least. That's a city I want to see. Especially in contrast with run down but Western oriented Beszel. I'll probably enjoy it even if they skimp out on it, but really characterizing those two cities is possibly the most important thing to make a good adaptation (maybe after finding a way to present un-seeing in an immersive way). Eiba fucked around with this message at 06:47 on Apr 19, 2017 |
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Apr 19, 2017 06:44
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For an alternate take, I loved weird anti-climax ending of The Scar, but it's still not my favorite Bas Lag book because of the generally meandering plot. Iron Council had the best ending though and is the best. 
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Jul 22, 2017 02:08
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Embassytown and The City and the City are his best books to me because he just takes the concept and goes really crazy with that specific idea. No distractions or anything, just pure whatever it's about. Contrast that with the everything-that-passes-into-his-head approach of his Bas Lag books, Kraken and Railsea, in which anything can happen, so there are dozens of lengthy digressions introducing new weird ideas over the course of the book. It can result in a crazy colorful grotesque world (and... Kraken), but I love his full novels with one focus best. Embassytown still has a lot of neat sci-fi concepts all over the place, I guess, but it's still way more focused and down to earth somehow than when he's writing fantasy and he's free to just do whatever the gently caress. Don't get me wrong, a book consisting of a dozen random ideas China Mievelle had is a fantastic book, but there's something satisfying about how tight Embassytown and The City and the City are.
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Jul 23, 2017 02:58
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mdemone posted:I bounced pretty hard off PSS a couple times — will I lose anything by starting with Embassytown? Which is kind of sad because if you end up loving Embassytown there's nothing else Mieville does that's quite like it. But also nice because you're in for some novel experiences if you keep going with him. If you want to keep going with his Bas Lag series you could probably even go straight to The Scar to see if you like it any better. You wouldn't miss out on much as all the Bas Lag books are pretty self contained. Though if you want to go on to Iron Council you might want to give Perdido Street Station another go just because PSS describes the city in much more detail. The Scar doesn't take place in New Crobuzon so it's not an issue.
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Oct 7, 2017 02:33
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I don't think any of the endings are remotely as depressing as Perdido Street Station. I understand that people didn't think the Scar had a satisfying ending, even though I loved it, but it wasn't so... uncomfortably troubling as PSS. I think there's a strong distinction that should be drawn between a "bad" ending and a "miserable" ending. The ending of PSS was pretty good in a lot of ways but holy hell was it miserable. Iron Council had a great mix of emotions but for me the potential more than made up for what was (in-universe) disappointing about it. It really worked for me and is the best ending I could imagine to a book like that.
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Nov 4, 2017 05:20
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This Census Taker was miserable and disconcerting. I loved it. I like how, even though it was set in a fantasy word, it wasn't an exciting world. It wasn't fun wish fulfillment like most fantasy or over the top grotesqueness like most Mieville. It was very dull and mundane, but setting it in another world worked because it was odd and confusing, as an uncaring world would be from the perspective of a child. If it is set in the Bas Lag world, that connection is one that doesn't really improve or mean anything to This Census Taker, but it does make the world of Bas Lag that much richer, paradoxically by emphasizing how dull it can be. And just to clarify, I've used the word "dull" a couple of times- This Census Taker was never boring to me. The story and setting were really compelling. It just wasn't your typical Bas Lag book with whimsical horrors dancing out of every page. Cardiac posted:So you are saying he wrote a world where Marxism is not inevitable? And that's where the book ends, with defeat for now but also a promise that the past is still with us and revolution is still in the air. It sounds like Mieville's distaste of Tolkien's idea of one time miraculous change fixing everything at the end of a fairy tale might have inspired him to create a fantastic ending where the status quo prevails, but the need to constantly fight against it is reinforced. Reading October, he seems really fixated on the brilliant potentiality of revolution. October abruptly ends when the Bolsheviks seize power. It's not the story of Bolshevik rule, it's the story of the revolution- the sudden change that shatters society and throws everything into the air. Anything could happen next.
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Nov 25, 2017 01:08
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Peel posted:I didn't like the Bas-Lag hints in TCT, they reduced the sense of alienation and mystery. Like I said before, the connections do nothing for the story of This Census Taker, but they make the world of Bas Lag more interesting.
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Dec 2, 2017 18:23
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Tekopo posted:So I’ve read PSS, The Scar, Iron Council, Embassytown and TC&TC. What next? This Census Taker is probably my favorite outside of those. Railsea is also pretty good. You could read Kraken, I guess?
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Jan 14, 2018 06:55
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Oasx posted:There is a trailer out for The City and the city: https://youtu.be/h9Ds23M9-RE I still can't believe a China Mieville work is getting a TV adaptation, but The City and the City is the most plausible one to adapt I guess.
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Mar 29, 2018 02:17
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I thought Iron Council's anti-climax was fantastic. It ended with the defeat of the revolution, but an vivid and visceral promise of a future revolution in the form of that incredible frozen train, motionlessly poised to hurtle once more towards the city. It might be because I really liked that image, but I was left really satisfied with Iron Council. I should mention I also didn't dislike the Scar's ending, but I get that it has way more of a "what even was the point of all this" vibe.
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May 21, 2019 01:04
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I honestly don't have much interest in more Bas-Lag books. It's a great setting, but he's done it already. Mieville has always been great at doing fresh unexpected things really well. Embassytown and The City and the City are my favorites of his. I wish he would just write whatever crazy creative thing he wants. Musing about communism is nice and all, but it's not exactly imaginative. Edit: Though I will say, if This Census Taker was in fact a stealth Bas-Lag book, I wouldn't mind more like that. I just want to see new perspectives.
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Jun 5, 2022 04:37
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Sandwolf posted:I just finished TC&TC earlier today, I loved it. China does a unique creative setting like no one else. This Census-Taker is pretty good too. If you really want to read The Scar before Perdito Street Station I don't think you'd be too lost or anything. But you'll definitely want to get PSS to introduce you to New Crobuzon before you go for Iron Council, which is also about that city but isn't as descriptive.
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Jun 27, 2022 07:55
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Sandwolf posted:The City & The City has some unnatural aspects but I’m not sure I’d describe it as Sci-fi or fantasy. It’s more like Balkan speculative fiction.
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Jun 2, 2023 21:14
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Categories and genres are broadly useful for communication and setting expectations for new things in your mind quickly. There is no reason to be a stickler about anyone's definition after they take the time to explain it, but on the other hand if you have a non-typical personal definition you should be prepared to not be understood in some contexts.
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Jun 3, 2023 16:46
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