Cog05 posted:

Not grognard:
1. Preferring an older version of a gaming system over a newer one

Grognard:
1. New system is raping my childhood.
2. Spends 5 minutes in Border's thumbing through new system, posts negative review on his blog
3. Imagines contrived or niche situation not covered in new system's rules, proving it's a tabletop MMO
4. The rpg industry can not survive without me and my gaming group of portly, neckbearded manchildren.
5. Happily plays a half-demon/half-elf psiwizard/monk/warrior/5 other classes character in old system
6. New system is "like an anime" if a fighter can do more than declare he is swinging his sword every round.
7. Updates role-playing community on exotic pipe tobaccos he has purchased.

Red_Mage posted:

http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/community/gaming/dnd/theRapeAndMurderOfTheForgottenRealms

opaopa13 posted:

"I tried to roleplay a wyrmling disguised as a beautiful human female, and after that all my players stopped wanting to roleplay."

The General posted:

This is the problem with gamers today. In the olden days, if there were no rules for it, you failed. Everytime. But no, you wussies can't handle a little failure in your games and just hand out success like halloween candy.

Etherwind posted:

Basically John Wick is really good at what he does.

John Wick posted:

Hi guys. Been a while, eh? Yeah. I know. Trust me, I know.

I hear a few of you have been wondering where I've been?

You see the scars on my face? Smell the dust in my beard? See the ragged horse I rode in on?

I've been away, friends. Far, far away, on a magic journey that led me from the bleak, cold desert to a place where they serve nothing but milk and honey, breakfast, lunch and dinner.

I've tasted a moment of paradise, just enough to give me the strength to return here, and share with you the its sublime beauty.

I'm not sure if I have the skill to convey it all to you, but I'll try.
I'll try.

If you've been following this column for even a short while, you know that I love stories.

You know the people who love animals more than they love people? Well, that's stories and me. Some of my best friends are stories. More often than not, I've trusted stories more than I've trusted people.

And, one of these days, I'll have to take up Mona Hall on her offer, and write down the story she gave me, of a long forgotten fairytale who gets approached by The Mouse. "I can make them remember you again," The Mouse tells the long forgotten fairytale. "Just sign right here on the dotted line, and they'll never forget you again." I owe her for that one. Maybe one day, I'll find the words to tell it.

Another of my favorite stories is Percival, the tale of a simpleton who becomes a knight, who loses his innocence, then by finding it again, heals a wounded king. Those of you who have seen Terry Gilliam's The Fisher King (starring Robin Williams and Jeff Bridges) know the story.

It's a great story, one that continually finds its way back into my life, no matter how much I try to forget it. And it always amazes me how I don't recognize Percival, even when he walks right up to my face and shakes my hand.

He's never upset that I don't recognize him. In fact, it's happened so many times, he's come to expect it.
(I'm terrible at names and faces, by the way.

If I don't recognize you, please don't take it personally. I do my best, really I do.)
So, yes, I've been gone for months. Not a peep.

Where have I been?

My friends, I've been lost in the Wastelands.

And their acrid, dusty air made the sweet nectar of the Grail that much sweeter.
* * *
One of those stories that's been with me so long, I don't even remember where we met, is a little tale told to me by Stan Lee. Yes, you know it well. He's a friendly chap. A friendly neighborhood chap. Goes by the name of Spider-Man.

A wonderful lesson comes out of that story. Not a new lesson, but then again, there are few lessons in this world that don't have long, gray beards.

It's that "Great power, great responsibility" lesson we keep hearing about - the lesson we keep hearing about, and keep ignoring.

Why do I say that?

Have you taken a look around lately? Specifically, at the internet.

Just before I got lost (one of the key steps in the wrong direction), I lost my temper at somebody who decided to write a review of ORKWORLD. Instead of being a responsible adult, instead of pointing him toward the incredible review written in PYRAMID, I told the shmuck to blow himself. Not that he didn't deserve it, the whole thing was flame bait to begin with.

(Any review of any game that includes the sentence, "The rules are broken. I didn't actually play the game, but I skimmed through the rules, and I can tell" is flame bait.

But, hey, if you disagree with me, that's fine. Just go check out the review in PYRAMID. It's just, fair, and well written. Three qualities that the review at rpg.net doesn't have.)

But, frankly, I should have known better. But the whole thing was just another straw on that poor camel's back.

(Just how many straws does he have on his back these days?)

It didn't help that I made such a stink in this very column about Ken Hite getting the only review copy at Gen-Con, that I plugged his column, said a bunch of very nice things about him both here and at Gen-Con.

. and then found the review of my game ran almost exactly two paragraphs.

Three whole columns devoted to that D&D 3E game, and my book gets two whole paragraphs.

Of course, the review follows Gareth Skarka's Underworld paragraphs, and begins with the phrase "If you liked Underworld, you'll like Orkworld!"

In other words, Ken, my game and Gareth's game are pretty much the same thing. Oboy.

(And all of you who think I only bag on people who say negative things about my games, pay close attention here.)

Ken's review was almost entirely complimentary. Unfortunately, it fails as a review.

It tells you next to nothing about the game - other than the fact that if you like Underworld, you'll like Orkworld. Not that the two games have next to nothing in common.

Not that the people who didn't like Underworld will now pass on Orkworld.

Not that people who did like Underworld will buy Orkworld and get pissed off because it isn't like Underworld. Not that people who liked Orkworld will now go and try Underworld and get pissed that they aren't the same game.

Not that Ken Hite, the one and only person in the whole world who got a review copy wrote exactly less than one hundred and fifty words about my game and three whole columns about that poorly laid out, poorly illustrated, poorly designed, two-hundred and eighty page RULEBOOK they called DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS THIRD EDITION.
Let me tell you something about that book, all right?

When's the last time you bought an RPG that was nothing but two hundred and eighty pages of RULES?
You know when?

Nineteen eighty-five. That's when.

Because that's the last time an RPG could get away with being two hundred and eighty pages of rules.

IF D&D3E ANY OTHER NAME ON IT AT ALL IT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE JOKE OF GEN-CON.

IT'S A TWO HUNDRED AND EIGHTY PAGE RULEBOOK!!!

No, check that. I'm entirely wrong. I'm ranting so hard about this that I completely forgot something. It's not just a two hundred and eighty page book of rules.
BECAUSE THE STUPID THING COMES IN THREE VOLUMES!!!

THAT MAKES IT AN EIGHT HUNDRED PAGE RULE BOOK!!!
ALL YOU SUCKERS WHO BOUGHT ALL THREE BOOKS PAID FOR EIGHT HUNDRED PAGES OF RULES!!!

Did you even look at the thing?

I mean, the PLAYER'S HANDBOOK has black and white art in it.

With all the art resources Wizards has, they can't afford to fill that book with FULL COLVER ART???

Wizards has dozens of artists on staff, ready and willing to paint full-color pictures for D&D 3E, and instead, the art director has them drawing black and white pictures for a book that's FULL COLOR.

And the quality of art. I mean, the fellow who did all that painting is very nice, but he ain't no Terese Neilson. He ain't no Rebecca Guay. He ain't no Bill O'Connor. He ain't no Drew Str.

Drew Str. oh hell, the guy who did the cover of the Star Wars RPG. Yeah, that guy. And, ladies and gentlemen, he is a far way away from being Tom Denmark. This is WotC's premier product.

There is no excuse not to have the best drat artists you have painting this book.

Instead, they settled for someone who is simply above standard. Very, very good artist. A talented fellow who has a very lucrative career ahead of him. All my best to him and I hope he finds all the best success in the world.
But, he's still no Micheal Whalen. Or Brom. Or the guys they have over at LucasArts doing concept sketches for Episode II. Some of the best artists in the world are doing concept sketches for Hollywood. Why not hire them?

You're gonna sell 350,000 copies of this book, why not spend a little extra money to make it LOOK NICE???

And then there was the layout. Who the hell did they hire to do the layout on that book? It looks like they scanned a piece of loose-leaf notebook paper, dyed the lines in Photoshop and dropped it in the background.

It's like they said, "Hey! I've got an idea! The typeface is already crunched and difficult to read, why not drop in a bunch of lines that are the same color as the type and make it MORE DIFFICULT TO READ! How's that sound?"

Idiots.

Ryan Dancey fooled you all. Every single last one of you. You all sucked on the big tap of Fool-Me-Three-Times and Ryan Dancey danced all the way to the bank.

And what do you have?
You have three two hundred and eighty page rulebooks. Eight hundred pages of rules. Congratulations.

And all I hear about on the internet is how innovative that game is.
You know, I can't tell you how innovative that game is BECAUSE I CAN'T READ IT! MY EYES START BLEEDING ON PAGE FOUR!!!

But the whole internet is singing the praises of this game. Ken Hite is doing it - even though the book Tom and I put together gets about a hundred and fifty words - rpg.net is doing it, the whole stinkin' world is doing it.

And you know what that says to me? It says, "Screw you, John Wick. Screw you and your screwed up notions of what gamers want. Yeah, you wrote the L5R RPG and won every single industry award for it and made it one of the best-selling RPGs of all time. Yeah, you wrote the storyline for L5R, and all those kids who carry banners on their back during Gen-Con, all those kids who make the L5R tournament LARGER THAN THE MAGIC TOURNAMENT AND THE POKEMON TOURNAMENT COMBINED, who make Ryan Dancey a whole @!#$-load of money, who -

I'm getting ahead of myself.

I'm tipping my hand. I'll have to slow down here for a moment. Let the rant run out. Get back in control of myself.

There we go.
. count to ten.
. stop and take a breath.
. there we go.

Wanna know where I've been for the last two weeks?
That's where I've been.

The Wasteland.
Just try writing anything with that going through your head. Go on. I dare you.

I know what you're thinking.

Sour grapes? Heh. You don't know the half of it.

You are absolutely right. I'll admit it right up front. Absolutely truthful. Ain't no way to get around it.
But that's what's in my head. I'll be honest about it. I'll tell you the whole, ugly, naked truth: I HATE D&D Third Edition.

Why?
The same reason I hate STAR TREK: Because the best-selling RPG on the market isn't the best RPG on the market. It's just the one with the best name recognition.

However, let's get something else out in the open: D&D3 is a good game. I'll say it again: D&D3 is a good game.
And three times, just to make sure. D&D3 is a GOOD GAME

Is it the best game? No. It isn't. I don't think anyone will dispute that.
The layout makes the book difficult to read.

I understand there was a lot of information to cram into two hundred and eighty pages, but they could have chosen a friendlier font and they could have chosen not to put lines between the lines to make the job of reading it even harder.
It already has 50 pages of errata.

It doesn't have THE BEST artists in our industry between those covers. The art is wonderful, but it isn't THE BEST. And when you have the budget, you go for nothing but THE BEST.

The logo is indistinct and difficult to read.
The cover has rhinestones pasted onto it.

It's difficult to read.
It isn't organized very well.
It's difficult to read.

(Tell me something, would you? What alignment is Darth Vader? Chaotic Evil, you say? Well, that makes sense. He is evil; he kills people. But is he Chaotic? He wants to bring order to the galaxy. He loves his son. Shows signs of regret bringing him before his Emperor. Maybe he's Neutral Evil, then. Right? Hm. Or maybe - just maybe - he's Lawful Good. Don't believe me? Check it out. Vader's actions are all but selfless. He's serving the needs of the Empire. He is unconcerned with personal power or gain. He follows a strict code [I don't think anyone can argue the Dark Side of the Force isn't strict on its followers] and [once again] wants to bring order to the galaxy. That sounds like Lawful Good to me. Sure, he has to kill a few people to maintain that order, but when's the last time a Paladin got chastised for killing a few orks, eh? And those rebel scum. Trying to topple the status quo. That sounds a bit chaotic to me. And do you think they evacuated the Death Star just moments before Luke blew it to pieces? How many people did Luke Skywalker murder when he blew the first Death Star up?

And, as Kevin Smith reminds us, the second Death Star wasn't quite complete just yet. That means there were people working away on it when Biggs and Lando blew it to pieces. Innoncent bystanders. All dead. Lawful Good rebels fighting for freedom, right? Wrong. Fighting to restore power to the aristocracy. Or, am I mistaken when I remember that both heroines bore some royalty in their nomenclature? The Rebel Alliance, fighting for truth, justice and restoring a couple of pretty princesses back to power. Yeah.

That's what Lawful Good is all about. And don't forget to kill some orks on your way out. They're worth 50 XPs a piece.)

It still has Character Classes.
(Let me ask you a question. In my years of professional service to the human race, I spent three years as a camp counselor for pre-teens with emotional and family problems, two years as a pin jockey in a bowling alley, another three years as a camp counselor, a few weeks as a singing waiter, a few years as a professional storyteller and singer in a sea shanty group, taught storytelling for three years, two years as assistant manager at Wal-Mart, delivered pizzas, was in a punk band, a blues band and a rock 'n' roll band, worked late night grocery and maintenance and produce at Cub Foods in my home state of Minnesota, worked a year on the Union Pacific Railroad as a switchman and breakman, worked security, served as an office assistant for a foster family agency, looked after developmentally disabled adults, worked as a janitor, tried my hand as staff writer and [part-time] assistant editor at a games magazine, wrote over 1,000,000 words of game fiction, source material and rules and even worked sixteen hours at McDonalds. What character class do I fit into?

(What's that? Three dimensional characters with backgrounds and past careers and such don't fit into character classes? Well, what kind of characters fit into character classes? Be careful with your answer; you may not like it.)

(And for those of you who think you're clever by calling me a "bard," please don't. There are real people walking around with that honor. They go to a school in Wales - St. David's, I think its called - and they memorize long passages of stories and family histories to earn that title. I have not.

(Here. Three quick examples. A couple of friends asked me if I wanted to play in a D&D game. I said, "Sure. Why not. Let's see how it plays." So, here are the two characters I wanted to make.

(First, I wanted a young noble who, at the age of ten, found he had sorcerous abilities. This, of course, meant he was a sorcerer. His father, the king, was elated, but his wise men notified him there was only one way his son could be a sorcerer: if his mother slept with a dragon. That meant my character was a bastard, cast out and ostrasiced by his family and friends. He still has his sorcery, and he's looking for his true father. And when he's strong enough, he's gonna come home and he's gonna free his mother [locked up in the tower], and defeat his tyrant father. Sound like a fun character to play? Well, you can't. There are no rules for royal characters. I wanted contacts and money and other noble stuff.

I can employ in any other rpg on the market but neither the PH or the DMG have rules for playing noble characters. I have to play something else.

(So, I decided to play a bard. A young man who goes to bard school, but his heart is more in wooing women than learning old songs that nobody sings anymore. "Where's the charm person spell?" he asks. They ignore him and teach him a seventeen hour story about people nobody's ever heard of. He steals a couple of songbooks, runs away from the school and becomes a rogue. Well, guess what? I can't play that character, either.

Spuh. That was it. If I can't even make the character I want to play, two characters that are entirely legitimate and within the boundries of standard generic fantasy, then I just won't play. I mean, I can make those characters in GURPS, why can't I make them in D&D?

(Why? I'll tell you why with one word: character classes. Stupid, idiotic, restrictive for the purpose of being restrictive character classes.)

The fact of the matter is, that game has sold enormously well. Has it deserved its sales? That's not for me to say.

However, and this is important here, pay close attention:
I DO THINK THAT ANY GAME THAT BEGINS WITH THE SENTENCE, "WELCOME TO THE GAME THAT HAS DEFINED THE FANTASTIC IMAGINATION FOR TWENTY-FIVE YEARS" DESERVES NOTHING LESS THAN A .357 HOLLOW-TIP BULLET STRAIGHT THROUGH THE SPINE.

As if no other game in twenty-five years has contributed anything to the industry.
Every innovation that's in those books, and The Wick means EVERY INNOVATION is from another game.

There is nothing new in the PG. Absolutely nothing. You can go through, point-by-point, and find every "new rule" in another game.

Not bad for a game that has "defined the creative imagination" for the last 25 years.
It's a presumptuous statement that goes right up there on the top of my list, right next to Sen-Zar's "We had to make this game."

We've mocked the guys who wrote Sen-Zar. Mercilessly. But then, when D&D pulls the same @!#$, we ignore it, and sing its praises high unto the rafters, agreeing like the mindless, slack-jawed pod-people we are.

Well, not me. I calls 'em as I sees 'em. D&D3 is not the holy grail. It is not manna from heaven. It is not the perfect, end all be all game. It is just as wacky and flawed and screwy as it's always been, and always will be.
And, frankly, its still about as much fun.
No question about it: D&D is a helluva lot of fun.

But it isn't brilliant game design. It's still the same game it was when it was the butt of every gamer cliché we know. It's still the clunky, old-school, simple-minded, hack 'n' slash game it's always been.

Just like when the Academy Awards brought out Jane Fonda, welcoming her back to the fold after her two-decade long lunacy period of being married to that strange fellow who owns Atlanta, expecting all of us to be fooled.
Well, I wasn't fooled. Not by Jane (she'll always be Barbarella to me) and not by D&D (she'll always be Barbarella to me, too.)

It's still D&D, folks. The game you were mocking two years ago. The game you complained about two years ago. The game you fought over two years ago. The game you refused to play ever again two years ago.

It's still D&D.
It's okay to like it. It's even okay to love it. I'm not about pissing in people's punch.

But I am about calling a spade a spade, and that game is the damned Ace. Hell, it's the whole damned Royal Flush of Spades.

Don't call it anything other than what it is. It's Dee and Effin' Dee.

It don't matter how many numbers they put behind it. It will always have those stupid alignments that never made sense, it will always have character classes that keep you from making the character you really want to make, it will always reward murder and genocide with profit and power (XPs), and it will always be clunky, awkward and unbalanced.

(Not that I have any interest in "balanced" games but there are folks out there who complain that games I design aren't "balanced" but go on to sing the praises of D&D3. Listen here, buddy. Tell me about it the next time I see your fighter and he's using a longsword instead of a rapier. Wanna know why? Because a longsword does a d8 worth of damage and the rapier only does a d6.

"Aha!" you say. "But the rapier does more damage on a critical hit!" To which, I answer: "So what? Your rapier does a crit on an 18 - 20 and my longsword does a crit on 19 or 20. That means you crit 15% of the time. I crit 10% of the time. And, in the meantime, 100% of the time, I've got a better chance of doing more damage while having an only 5% less chance of getting a crit. Nice game balance there. And don't ever ask me to handle a light axe. D4 that crits 5% of the time. Why in the world would I ever waste my time with a light axe???

(But I digress.)
Yes, this has been my Wasteland. Watching the internet sing the praises of D&D3, claiming it the savior-messiah of gaming.

Folks, it wasn't all that good. It wasn't bad. But, it just wasn't all that good, either. At least, not from my point of view.
And it's funny.

I was at the Berkeley show a few weeks ago, listening to everyone talk about it. The Hero guys told me, "Yeah. It's dressed up Hero." I heard the Chaosium guys say, "Yeah. It's just dressed up BRPS." I even heard someone say, "They just stole a bunch of ideas from Rolemaster."
Funny. No one said they stole anything from L5R or 7th Sea.

(Maybe that's because there's nothing worth stealing from them? One never can tell.)
Its kinda like when every racial group in the world claimed the trade federation aliens in Episode One sounded like them. I heard Native Americans say it, I heard Chinese say it, I heard Japanese say it.
Funny. No one said they sounded Irish.

(Maybe that's because nobody wants to sound Irish? One never can tell.)
The fact of the matter is, D&D3 looks like a lot of different RPGs. There's just nothing new or innovative about it.

I mean, think about the games that have come out lately. Think about the way Unknown Armies handles magic (pornomancy all the way, baby!), the way Feng Shui handles combat (I have to admit, brutes - I mean, mooks are a wonderful idea)

the way Hero Wars handles myth (do I have to say anything here?), the way Orkworld handles hunting -
. sorry . - and the way Conspiracy X handles psychic powers (and if you haven't seen this one, you are missing something).

And think of some older games, and the innovations they made. Cthulhu. Chill. Traveller. Over the Edge. The World of Darkness. GURPS. Hero. Rolemaster. All of these games provided essential building blocks the designers up at WotC used to create the new D&D.

And, let's face it, there is nothing new in those books. Nothing.
The Saving Throw system (your traits give you bonuses) comes right out of Runequest.

Skills are not a new thing. Not even the way they handled skills (making each one a separate ability) is a new thing. I mean, come on. It wasn't even new when 7th Sea did it. Go check out TMNT (and other Palladium books) to see what I mean.

The magic system is still the same old clunky, non-linear, non-sensical magic system. Although, I have to admit, this is one place I felt the game really fell flat. I mean, I miss all those funky names for the spells. Now they read like chemical formulae.
The bonuses thing is cute, but again, nothing new. It's straight out of Pendragon. Identical in nearly every way. Nothing new.

And did I mention they didn't do anything about alignment. Orks - sorry - "orcs" are still chaotic evil.
Chaotic evil and tribal. I'd like to see how that works. A culture of sociopaths sounds a bit oxymoronic to me.

And did I mention half the art is black and white? In a color book, half the art is black and white.
In case you missed that, let me say it again.
IN A FULL COLOR BOOK, NEARLY HALF THE ART IS BLACK AND WHITE.

That's not just bad art direction. That's a waste of money.

So, to recap:

1. D&D3 is a hardbound, full-color book with at least half of its full color pages covered with black and white illustrations.

2. It's mechanics, while improving previous editions, are not innovative, fresh or new; simply patchworks from previous innovations.

3. It is poorly laid out and requires a total of 3 books (a total purchase of sixty dollars) to play.

4. It is a rulebook comprised completely of rules.

Something unseen in this industry for nearly a decade.

My conclusion?
If D&D3 is a rules set for generic fantasy roleplaying. And, like every other generic fantasy game that has released in the last ten years, it should financially fail. However, this is not any other generic fantasy game.

This is Dungeons and Dragons. And because of that, it will succeed.
Despite the fact it is nothing more than eight hundred pages of rules and not a single paragraph of world.

Despite the fact the rules are not well organized or explained.

Despite the fact the combat rules require the use of miniatures.

Despite the fact gamers have been complaining about this kind of book for the last ten years.
Despite this fact, because it was Dungeons and Dragons, this game will sell almost 350,000 copies by the end of the year while Orkworld will probably sell about 3,000.

Sour grapes?
You bet your sweet dowmga.

* * *
I promised you we'd get out of the Wastelands.

But before we did, I wanted you to get a look at where my mind's been the last two weeks. And, to be honest, there's one more step into the Wastelands before we can take our first step out. Just one more. I promise.

I need to tell you one small fact about Ryan Dancey.
See, I know Ryan. And Ryan knows me. It ain't no secret we haven't always seen eye to eye.

I won't get into that here. That's private stuff between me and Ryan.

But, I will tell you a quick story about me and Tom Denmark that involves Ryan in a weird kind of way.

It goes something like this.

Me and Tom and Morgan Gray (more on him later) are sitting outside a coffee shop. I'm eating a turkey sandwich with cranberry sauce. Never had it before, it's pretty neat.

They're smoking. Had that before, it ain't neat.
(Something The Wife said to me just the other day. "If I was married to a smoker," she says, "I'd pour a capful of Drano into my food. Just a cap a day. And I'd eat it right in front of my smoking husband. He'd say, "What the hell are you doing?" and I'd say, "I'm killing myself. Very slowly. And you're gonna watch." She's just amazing. Okay. Back to the story.)

"We should do it," Tom says.
"We should do it," Morgan says.

"You two are crazy," John says.

They're trying to convince me to do something I promised myself - and others - I would not do.

And that, my friends, is write an adventure using the d20 System.

"It's like when CCGs first took off," Tom says. And he's right.
"We've got to get on there quick, before we're just another adventure," Morgan says. And he's right.
"I can't," I say. And I'm right.

See, I know Ryan.

Worked with him for five years. And there's a proud little part of me that doesn't buy into all this d20 hype. I won't. It's a fad. Besides, I won't write something for d20, even if it is for a quick buck, because that'll prove that Ryan was right.

I'll be just like everyone else jumping on the bandwagon.

Everyone else so eager to prove that Ryan Dancey was right about the game industry: sooner or later, everything will be d20 whether game designers like it or not.

The fans will demand it. Game companies have to either make d20 products or go out of business.

The more d20 products there are out there, the harder it will be for anything else to make a mark in the market.

And, if I jump on the bandwagon, Wick Fanboys (hi guys!) will shout "Sell Out!" and throw eggs at my house.

Besides. I already made Ryan Dancey plenty of money. When they sold Five Rings Publishing to Wizards of the Coast, there were a bunch of people who saw a whole lot of money.

No-one on the design team was on that list of people. Not me, not Dave Williams, not D.J. Trindle, not Rob Vaux, not Matt Wilson, not Matt Staroscik.
Not one of us. Not one red cent.

"I've already made Ryan Dancey a lot of money," I tell them. "I'm not interested in making him more."

That's when Tom Denmark looks me in the eye with a smile on his face and he tells me:
"Then it's time you let Ryan Dancey make you a lot of money."
And, my friends, that was only the second time in recorded history John Wick couldn't think of anything to say.

To top it off, Morgan says this:
"Besides, the book we'll do will kick the @!#$ out of anything they're gonna do."

Then, he goes on to tell me that Ryan said D&D fans will hold the Player's Handbook up to the rest of the industry and say, "The bar just got raised." He smiles.
"Let's do a book the D&D players hold up to Ryan and say

'The bar just got raised.'"
I won't count that as the third time. It was just an amendment on the second time.

So, there I am. Sitting there. Thunderstruck. Dumbfounded. Flabbergasted. Discombobulated.

. So, what do I say?
"All right," I say. "Let's steal Ryan's customers."

Ryan once said that he intended to use the PLAYER'S HANDBOOK as a weapon against the rest of the industry.

He said he'd print a full-color, hardbound two-hundred plus page book for only twenty bucks, and the fans would hold that book up to the rest of the industry and say, "Why can't you make something this good?"

Well, friends and neighbors, I have seen D&D3, and I can tell you this:
I'm doing a d20 Adventure.
I've seen the best WotC can do.
It was s***.

I'm gonna blow their socks off.
And they'll hold that book up at the steps of Wizards Central and shout at the top of their lungs: "Why can't you make something this good?"

I've taken my first step out of the Wasteland.

Thanks to a guy named Percival, hiding in the skins and clothes of Tom Denmark and Morgan Gray. They showed me something I'd forgotten:
Gaming is about fun. Providing a tool for others to have fun.

I'm back. Back in the saddle, ready to finish what I started

Namely, ready to finish Warhamster for John Kovalic, ready to finish The Book of Villains for Green Knight, and ready to finish The Flux for myself.

And a few other things as well. More on them later.
Take good care of yourselves. Don't get lost in that Wasteland.

It's a nasty place. And the only guy who knows how to get out is a funny lookin' pair of fellas living in the Bay Area.

And I owe them much.
(PS: I will update Orkworld.com this week with a few goodies. And, next week, I'll show you what's up with Warhamster. Boy. It's been a long road. See you on the other side.)

Etherwind posted:

Ages ago I posted a challenge for the grognard of John Wick. shotgunbadger made a passable entry but I wasn't really very convinced by it.

That, on the other hand, is grade A, purestrain grognard.

I now owe Evil Mastermind

The General posted:

d02

A silent wail posted:

It fails in just about every aspect of a game,and it is more of a rule playign game than role playing game.

Frist off it is way to liniar.You just get better in everyway.THere is no way in avoiding it.I mena no mater what you are, you have have hit points and levels.

It is over comlicated,and simplist at the same time. IT is harder to hit a mmman in plate armor.And hammers and swords tear chaim mail the same way. Then you have the detail of when you can atack,and what range weapons have,and how far you can move.

Classes, are jokes. really.From how hits points.skill points,and bonus powers are moved about. In the end in boils down to this.

levle systems do not work.They may work on paper, but a level 12 fighter or even mag doesn't need to fear having a sword swung at them, or even getting stabed. Also with the way hit points work, your either fighting as if nothing happened or are out cold.Nothing in the middle.

the flaw of rolling a d20 is also that the best fighter in the word, taking up his most magical sword, misses 5% of the time.ALso so all fighters are just as good with all weapons they use.We all know that training with hand to hand weapons will make you great with a bow.Also if your good with guns, you must know how to use a sword.


In the end, d20 is too many rules, and not enough rules at the same time.Has too many strick rules, while leaving many feild wide open with no reason. I am ranting here,and know this dosen't make much sense to many people.BUt in the end I would like to see one come with a good reason d20 is a good system.

Pangalin posted:

quote:

First: Oh look. Palladium haters showing up to take a dump. It must be that time of the month again.

Second: Given how dramatic and whiny some folks get online about Palladium, it really is no surprise to me that KS basically ignores people and does whatever suits him.

I mean, why should he bother trying to cater to you? Nothing he ever does is going to be good enough. Fans of his games can't be fans like fans of other games; no, they're "zombies", "fanbois", "more money than sense" and all sorts of other derogatory comments. His games can't actually be liked; no, Palladium is strictly kept alive by begging shamelessly, clearly nobody could actually enjoy playing his games. If he changed his system, it wouldn't be enough; hell, there isn't a single system out there that doesn't have detractors. He starts selling pdfs of his games, just like a chunk of people complained about; he doesn't get any credit for finally accepting that bit of technological innovation.

It might be disappointing but it makes sense to me that he focuses on the folks that actually _like_ his games. Heck, look at the whole 3.x vs 4E thing. People feuding left and right, the 3.x fans can't actually agree on what the problems are with the rules and what the solutions are... why should he even _think_ about opening that can of worms for his games? Guardians of Order got slammed by fans for doing d20 versions of their games and d20 fans slammed GoO because GoO didn't really understand the system and claimed that d20 wasn't actually balanced.

Up until then, GoO had a fairly loyal fanbase. After that, it started disappearing and they didn't really pick up any new ones.

Why should Palladium run the risk of alienating their fanbase in the same way? Especially when it's _that_ fanbase which has managed to keep them going through some rather rough times.

I realize my random once a year response to Palladium haters isn't going to change a thing. But still... can't you just let it go? Great, you hate the game, you hate the man, whatever. So what? Nobody forces you to buy their books.

Next time you feel like posting a response about how Palladium games shot your dog, shaved your cat, screwed your sister, and ate all you ice cream... why not go post a response or start a thread about how awesome the last game session you had was?

It'd make rpg.net a much happier place to hang out at.

Kobold Bravery posted:

through roleplaying I assert my superiority over people richer and more popular and less talented than ME and the whole table applauds ME

Maddman posted:

Search is down at RPGnet, but I once got into an argument with a grognard who was demanding to know what would happen if a human farmer and an orc minion had to fight it out, since they were both minions. And how dumb it was that the farmer's punch is more deadly than the orc's axe, since they only had 1hp each.

I tried to explain that no one gives a gently caress about what happens if an orc minion fights a peasant, but he just couldn't wrap his mind around the idea.

Seftir posted:

I like the guys who think that since it's going 'mainstream' that their groups will just be filled with frat boys or something

Mikan posted:

The rest of the thread is just as amazing. I really need to stop reading it.

Amish Ninja posted:

Also, the whole "mongols on horses with bows breaks the game" argument is completely retarded. It really proves how much the gaming den thinks 4e is a video game where the DM has no say in what happens. "We, the players, are just going to sit outside of every dungeon and snipe enemies to death. If they chase us, we'll kite them. If they hole up, we'll burn their fortress down. If we are ever forced to enter, we'll just leave and take another quest. CHECKMATE, BITCH."

Ugh.

SweeneyTodd posted:

In grognard land, though, social contracts don't exist, and if people act like dicks it's either because their GM didn't take a "strong enough hand", or the rules don't explicitly say "don't be a dick".

RagnarokAngel posted:

They need hardcore power. Blood spilt on a weekly basis, character sheets cast into the fireplace every hour, the lament of players who just got unlucky but failed due to no fault of their own.

This...this is true roleplaying.

shotgunbadger posted:

Aren't they portrayed as cunning and highly intelligent with the skills to use long forgotten and amazing technology, but are only perceived as savages because no one really wants to go check on them so most mainlanders go 'oh, they live in a jungle and hunt, freaking animals', like the do the Halflings?

opaopa13 posted:

Those of you with a copy, lets turn to page 34 and look at the drawing accompanying the Dragonborn race. Does anything jump out at you? The female Dragonborn has boobs. Boobs. WHY THE gently caress DOES A REPTILE HAVE loving MAMMARY GLANDS?? Can you explain this for me? Purely within the context of this fantasy realm, do female dragons wear giant brassieres to keep their massive, scaly, dragon-titties from flopping around while they’re devouring entire villages??

walkerp posted:

WotC fans are sort of like poor children who have convinced themselves that their drunken, abusive father really loves them. Questioning that kind of denial can bring out a lot of anger.

jgbrowning posted:

I'm not a fan of the minion concept in D&D, mostly because I consider it philosophically troublesome in relation to the other design philosophies of the game. I know it bothers others, and I wonder if there would have been a better method of meeting the goal of making the PCs feel powerful (and having enough bodies on the board to push, pull, slide, and threaten) without creating an entirely different "how tough is this thing" abstraction that is in philosophic conflict with the core abstraction of "how things are hurt" in the rules set.

Minions take two different kinds of damage, unlike other creatures. Damage when the PCs are around (1 hp of which is fatal) and damage when the PCs aren't around (which they've managed to survived to live to see the PCs eventually).

As I said earlier, this type of abstraction is indicative of a change in the type of role-playing game D&D is. It's moved towards a game in which the world exists only in relation to the PCs, as opposed to what it has traditionally been, a game in which the PCs interact with a world that functions independent of them (be that at an abstracted level).

Both styles can be a lot of fun to play, but they are different styles.

Riidi WW posted:

"traditionally" here of course meaning "since 3rd edition, when i started playing"

Seftir posted:

Isn't it obvious to everyone how well 4.fail is selling though? Say what you want about it's quality but WOTC must be making some good numbers.

Maddman posted:

I remember a good number of grognards saying that 3e wasn't real D&D, that they had dumbed it down to appeal to video-gamers, and everything was too anime and video-gamey.

I can't wait for the same responses to 5th edition.

mandrake776 posted:

Why is a tarrasque more deadly than a mind-flayer? Why do I care so much about what lich archmages are doing?

Bobulus posted:

Someone translate point #4 from Grognard to English for me, please. I don't even understand what he's trying to say.

quote:

My first Paladin took a feat for Tower Shield Proficiency. >.< Of course it was a bad decision, but I don't regret it. It added depth to the character.

Drox posted:

For my personal education what's a duskblade and what is the poster getting at with it?

shotgunbadger posted:

So wait where are these RPGPundit types coming from then? Basically I want to waste an afternoon pissing off manchildren without risking my SA account, point me to where I can do that.

Mikan posted:

RPGnet is absolutely terrible for all kinds of reasons that aren't even about RPG opinions

Mikan posted:

Oh please white knight RPGnet this should be adorable

crime fighting hog posted:

duh it's a mini wow boardgame

LordVreeg posted:

But it's got quantifiable rules and therefor is open to analysis. I'm sorry that your fave version of D&D is the most polarizing by far, but stop ascribing negative characteristcs to the other gamers who feel differently than you do.

Abyssal Maw posted:

If you haven't noticed, "analysis" is never treated as some kind of objective thing-(at least here) it's usually just cover for the expression of deep resentment and rejectionist rhetoric against the actual people playing it. It's not the game at all. The game is just a game. A rule is just a rule. A picture is just a picture. But what about the people?

Which you seem to understand, because you use the word "polarizing".

So that's real, that's observable phenomena, and it's not about people who "feel" different, it's about people acting in a certain way.
That's the issue. If you aren't a D&D player and don't intend to become one, than how could this possibly matter to you?

opaopa13 posted:

Ahahahaha, this is the best part.

http://dungeons.wikia.com/wiki/Bane_Guard_(4e_Class)

* Adds Charisma modifier to attacks against marked enemies.
* Has threatening reach, and can use at-wills for attacks of opportunity.
* Gains an additional at-will whenever he gains an additional daily.
* Can reduce any saving throw made within melee range by his Constitution modifier.

And that's before things like the level 1 Daily that's a weapon attack against Fort, deals 4[W] damage and turns the Bane Guard invisible for a turn.

Mikan posted:

Also Frank Trollman is worshipped as the best game designer ever by people at The Gaming Den but I'm fairly certain he's actually an eight year old who knows how to swear at people

happyelf posted:

yess more john wick quotes moooore

quote:

Hi guys. Been a while, eh? Yeah. I know. Trust me, I know.

I hear a few of you have been wondering where I've been?

You see the scars on my face? Smell the dust in my beard? See the ragged horse I rode in on?

I've been away, friends. Far, far away, on a magic journey that led me from the bleak, cold desert to a place where they serve nothing but milk and honey, breakfast, lunch and dinner.

I've tasted a moment of paradise, just enough to give me the strength to return here, and share with you the its sublime beauty.

I'm not sure if I have the skill to convey it all to you, but I'll try.
I'll try.

If you've been following this column for even a short while, you know that I love stories.

You know the people who love animals more than they love people? Well, that's stories and me. Some of my best friends are stories. More often than not, I've trusted stories more than I've trusted people.

And, one of these days, I'll have to take up Mona Hall on her offer, and write down the story she gave me, of a long forgotten fairytale who gets approached by The Mouse. "I can make them remember you again," The Mouse tells the long forgotten fairytale. "Just sign right here on the dotted line, and they'll never forget you again." I owe her for that one. Maybe one day, I'll find the words to tell it.

Another of my favorite stories is Percival, the tale of a simpleton who becomes a knight, who loses his innocence, then by finding it again, heals a wounded king. Those of you who have seen Terry Gilliam's The Fisher King (starring Robin Williams and Jeff Bridges) know the story.

It's a great story, one that continually finds its way back into my life, no matter how much I try to forget it. And it always amazes me how I don't recognize Percival, even when he walks right up to my face and shakes my hand.

He's never upset that I don't recognize him. In fact, it's happened so many times, he's come to expect it.
(I'm terrible at names and faces, by the way.

If I don't recognize you, please don't take it personally. I do my best, really I do.)
So, yes, I've been gone for months. Not a peep.

Where have I been?

My friends, I've been lost in the Wastelands.

And their acrid, dusty air made the sweet nectar of the Grail that much sweeter.
* * *
One of those stories that's been with me so long, I don't even remember where we met, is a little tale told to me by Stan Lee. Yes, you know it well. He's a friendly chap. A friendly neighborhood chap. Goes by the name of Spider-Man.

A wonderful lesson comes out of that story. Not a new lesson, but then again, there are few lessons in this world that don't have long, gray beards.

It's that "Great power, great responsibility" lesson we keep hearing about - the lesson we keep hearing about, and keep ignoring.

Why do I say that?

Have you taken a look around lately? Specifically, at the internet.

Just before I got lost (one of the key steps in the wrong direction), I lost my temper at somebody who decided to write a review of ORKWORLD. Instead of being a responsible adult, instead of pointing him toward the incredible review written in PYRAMID, I told the shmuck to blow himself. Not that he didn't deserve it, the whole thing was flame bait to begin with.

(Any review of any game that includes the sentence, "The rules are broken. I didn't actually play the game, but I skimmed through the rules, and I can tell" is flame bait.

But, hey, if you disagree with me, that's fine. Just go check out the review in PYRAMID. It's just, fair, and well written. Three qualities that the review at rpg.net doesn't have.)

But, frankly, I should have known better. But the whole thing was just another straw on that poor camel's back.

(Just how many straws does he have on his back these days?)

It didn't help that I made such a stink in this very column about Ken Hite getting the only review copy at Gen-Con, that I plugged his column, said a bunch of very nice things about him both here and at Gen-Con.

. and then found the review of my game ran almost exactly two paragraphs.

Three whole columns devoted to that D&D 3E game, and my book gets two whole paragraphs.

Of course, the review follows Gareth Skarka's Underworld paragraphs, and begins with the phrase "If you liked Underworld, you'll like Orkworld!"

In other words, Ken, my game and Gareth's game are pretty much the same thing. Oboy.

(And all of you who think I only bag on people who say negative things about my games, pay close attention here.)

Ken's review was almost entirely complimentary. Unfortunately, it fails as a review.

It tells you next to nothing about the game - other than the fact that if you like Underworld, you'll like Orkworld. Not that the two games have next to nothing in common.

Not that the people who didn't like Underworld will now pass on Orkworld.

Not that people who did like Underworld will buy Orkworld and get pissed off because it isn't like Underworld. Not that people who liked Orkworld will now go and try Underworld and get pissed that they aren't the same game.

Not that Ken Hite, the one and only person in the whole world who got a review copy wrote exactly less than one hundred and fifty words about my game and three whole columns about that poorly laid out, poorly illustrated, poorly designed, two-hundred and eighty page RULEBOOK they called DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS THIRD EDITION.
Let me tell you something about that book, all right?

When's the last time you bought an RPG that was nothing but two hundred and eighty pages of RULES?
You know when?

Nineteen eighty-five. That's when.

Because that's the last time an RPG could get away with being two hundred and eighty pages of rules.

IF D&D3E ANY OTHER NAME ON IT AT ALL IT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE JOKE OF GEN-CON.

IT'S A TWO HUNDRED AND EIGHTY PAGE RULEBOOK!!!

No, check that. I'm entirely wrong. I'm ranting so hard about this that I completely forgot something. It's not just a two hundred and eighty page book of rules.
BECAUSE THE STUPID THING COMES IN THREE VOLUMES!!!

THAT MAKES IT AN EIGHT HUNDRED PAGE RULE BOOK!!!
ALL YOU SUCKERS WHO BOUGHT ALL THREE BOOKS PAID FOR EIGHT HUNDRED PAGES OF RULES!!!

Did you even look at the thing?

I mean, the PLAYER'S HANDBOOK has black and white art in it.

With all the art resources Wizards has, they can't afford to fill that book with FULL COLVER ART???

Wizards has dozens of artists on staff, ready and willing to paint full-color pictures for D&D 3E, and instead, the art director has them drawing black and white pictures for a book that's FULL COLOR.

And the quality of art. I mean, the fellow who did all that painting is very nice, but he ain't no Terese Neilson. He ain't no Rebecca Guay. He ain't no Bill O'Connor. He ain't no Drew Str.

Drew Str. oh hell, the guy who did the cover of the Star Wars RPG. Yeah, that guy. And, ladies and gentlemen, he is a far way away from being Tom Denmark. This is WotC's premier product.

There is no excuse not to have the best drat artists you have painting this book.

Instead, they settled for someone who is simply above standard. Very, very good artist. A talented fellow who has a very lucrative career ahead of him. All my best to him and I hope he finds all the best success in the world.
But, he's still no Micheal Whalen. Or Brom. Or the guys they have over at LucasArts doing concept sketches for Episode II. Some of the best artists in the world are doing concept sketches for Hollywood. Why not hire them?

You're gonna sell 350,000 copies of this book, why not spend a little extra money to make it LOOK NICE???

And then there was the layout. Who the hell did they hire to do the layout on that book? It looks like they scanned a piece of loose-leaf notebook paper, dyed the lines in Photoshop and dropped it in the background.

It's like they said, "Hey! I've got an idea! The typeface is already crunched and difficult to read, why not drop in a bunch of lines that are the same color as the type and make it MORE DIFFICULT TO READ! How's that sound?"

Idiots.

Ryan Dancey fooled you all. Every single last one of you. You all sucked on the big tap of Fool-Me-Three-Times and Ryan Dancey danced all the way to the bank.

And what do you have?
You have three two hundred and eighty page rulebooks. Eight hundred pages of rules. Congratulations.

And all I hear about on the internet is how innovative that game is.
You know, I can't tell you how innovative that game is BECAUSE I CAN'T READ IT! MY EYES START BLEEDING ON PAGE FOUR!!!

But the whole internet is singing the praises of this game. Ken Hite is doing it - even though the book Tom and I put together gets about a hundred and fifty words - rpg.net is doing it, the whole stinkin' world is doing it.

And you know what that says to me? It says, "Screw you, John Wick. Screw you and your screwed up notions of what gamers want. Yeah, you wrote the L5R RPG and won every single industry award for it and made it one of the best-selling RPGs of all time. Yeah, you wrote the storyline for L5R, and all those kids who carry banners on their back during Gen-Con, all those kids who make the L5R tournament LARGER THAN THE MAGIC TOURNAMENT AND THE POKEMON TOURNAMENT COMBINED, who make Ryan Dancey a whole @!#$-load of money, who -

I'm getting ahead of myself.

I'm tipping my hand. I'll have to slow down here for a moment. Let the rant run out. Get back in control of myself.

There we go.
. count to ten.
. stop and take a breath.
. there we go.

Wanna know where I've been for the last two weeks?
That's where I've been.

The Wasteland.
Just try writing anything with that going through your head. Go on. I dare you.

I know what you're thinking.

Sour grapes? Heh. You don't know the half of it.

You are absolutely right. I'll admit it right up front. Absolutely truthful. Ain't no way to get around it.
But that's what's in my head. I'll be honest about it. I'll tell you the whole, ugly, naked truth: I HATE D&D Third Edition.

Why?
The same reason I hate STAR TREK: Because the best-selling RPG on the market isn't the best RPG on the market. It's just the one with the best name recognition.

However, let's get something else out in the open: D&D3 is a good game. I'll say it again: D&D3 is a good game.
And three times, just to make sure. D&D3 is a GOOD GAME

Is it the best game? No. It isn't. I don't think anyone will dispute that.
The layout makes the book difficult to read.

I understand there was a lot of information to cram into two hundred and eighty pages, but they could have chosen a friendlier font and they could have chosen not to put lines between the lines to make the job of reading it even harder.
It already has 50 pages of errata.

It doesn't have THE BEST artists in our industry between those covers. The art is wonderful, but it isn't THE BEST. And when you have the budget, you go for nothing but THE BEST.

The logo is indistinct and difficult to read.
The cover has rhinestones pasted onto it.

It's difficult to read.
It isn't organized very well.
It's difficult to read.

(Tell me something, would you? What alignment is Darth Vader? Chaotic Evil, you say? Well, that makes sense. He is evil; he kills people. But is he Chaotic? He wants to bring order to the galaxy. He loves his son. Shows signs of regret bringing him before his Emperor. Maybe he's Neutral Evil, then. Right? Hm. Or maybe - just maybe - he's Lawful Good. Don't believe me? Check it out. Vader's actions are all but selfless. He's serving the needs of the Empire. He is unconcerned with personal power or gain. He follows a strict code [I don't think anyone can argue the Dark Side of the Force isn't strict on its followers] and [once again] wants to bring order to the galaxy. That sounds like Lawful Good to me. Sure, he has to kill a few people to maintain that order, but when's the last time a Paladin got chastised for killing a few orks, eh? And those rebel scum. Trying to topple the status quo. That sounds a bit chaotic to me. And do you think they evacuated the Death Star just moments before Luke blew it to pieces? How many people did Luke Skywalker murder when he blew the first Death Star up?

And, as Kevin Smith reminds us, the second Death Star wasn't quite complete just yet. That means there were people working away on it when Biggs and Lando blew it to pieces. Innoncent bystanders. All dead. Lawful Good rebels fighting for freedom, right? Wrong. Fighting to restore power to the aristocracy. Or, am I mistaken when I remember that both heroines bore some royalty in their nomenclature? The Rebel Alliance, fighting for truth, justice and restoring a couple of pretty princesses back to power. Yeah.

That's what Lawful Good is all about. And don't forget to kill some orks on your way out. They're worth 50 XPs a piece.)

It still has Character Classes.
(Let me ask you a question. In my years of professional service to the human race, I spent three years as a camp counselor for pre-teens with emotional and family problems, two years as a pin jockey in a bowling alley, another three years as a camp counselor, a few weeks as a singing waiter, a few years as a professional storyteller and singer in a sea shanty group, taught storytelling for three years, two years as assistant manager at Wal-Mart, delivered pizzas, was in a punk band, a blues band and a rock 'n' roll band, worked late night grocery and maintenance and produce at Cub Foods in my home state of Minnesota, worked a year on the Union Pacific Railroad as a switchman and breakman, worked security, served as an office assistant for a foster family agency, looked after developmentally disabled adults, worked as a janitor, tried my hand as staff writer and [part-time] assistant editor at a games magazine, wrote over 1,000,000 words of game fiction, source material and rules and even worked sixteen hours at McDonalds. What character class do I fit into?

(What's that? Three dimensional characters with backgrounds and past careers and such don't fit into character classes? Well, what kind of characters fit into character classes? Be careful with your answer; you may not like it.)

(And for those of you who think you're clever by calling me a "bard," please don't. There are real people walking around with that honor. They go to a school in Wales - St. David's, I think its called - and they memorize long passages of stories and family histories to earn that title. I have not.

(Here. Three quick examples. A couple of friends asked me if I wanted to play in a D&D game. I said, "Sure. Why not. Let's see how it plays." So, here are the two characters I wanted to make.

(First, I wanted a young noble who, at the age of ten, found he had sorcerous abilities. This, of course, meant he was a sorcerer. His father, the king, was elated, but his wise men notified him there was only one way his son could be a sorcerer: if his mother slept with a dragon. That meant my character was a bastard, cast out and ostrasiced by his family and friends. He still has his sorcery, and he's looking for his true father. And when he's strong enough, he's gonna come home and he's gonna free his mother [locked up in the tower], and defeat his tyrant father. Sound like a fun character to play? Well, you can't. There are no rules for royal characters. I wanted contacts and money and other noble stuff.

I can employ in any other rpg on the market but neither the PH or the DMG have rules for playing noble characters. I have to play something else.

(So, I decided to play a bard. A young man who goes to bard school, but his heart is more in wooing women than learning old songs that nobody sings anymore. "Where's the charm person spell?" he asks. They ignore him and teach him a seventeen hour story about people nobody's ever heard of. He steals a couple of songbooks, runs away from the school and becomes a rogue. Well, guess what? I can't play that character, either.

Spuh. That was it. If I can't even make the character I want to play, two characters that are entirely legitimate and within the boundries of standard generic fantasy, then I just won't play. I mean, I can make those characters in GURPS, why can't I make them in D&D?

(Why? I'll tell you why with one word: character classes. Stupid, idiotic, restrictive for the purpose of being restrictive character classes.)

The fact of the matter is, that game has sold enormously well. Has it deserved its sales? That's not for me to say.

However, and this is important here, pay close attention:
I DO THINK THAT ANY GAME THAT BEGINS WITH THE SENTENCE, "WELCOME TO THE GAME THAT HAS DEFINED THE FANTASTIC IMAGINATION FOR TWENTY-FIVE YEARS" DESERVES NOTHING LESS THAN A .357 HOLLOW-TIP BULLET STRAIGHT THROUGH THE SPINE.

As if no other game in twenty-five years has contributed anything to the industry.
Every innovation that's in those books, and The Wick means EVERY INNOVATION is from another game.

There is nothing new in the PG. Absolutely nothing. You can go through, point-by-point, and find every "new rule" in another game.

Not bad for a game that has "defined the creative imagination" for the last 25 years.
It's a presumptuous statement that goes right up there on the top of my list, right next to Sen-Zar's "We had to make this game."

We've mocked the guys who wrote Sen-Zar. Mercilessly. But then, when D&D pulls the same @!#$, we ignore it, and sing its praises high unto the rafters, agreeing like the mindless, slack-jawed pod-people we are.

Well, not me. I calls 'em as I sees 'em. D&D3 is not the holy grail. It is not manna from heaven. It is not the perfect, end all be all game. It is just as wacky and flawed and screwy as it's always been, and always will be.
And, frankly, its still about as much fun.
No question about it: D&D is a helluva lot of fun.

But it isn't brilliant game design. It's still the same game it was when it was the butt of every gamer cliché we know. It's still the clunky, old-school, simple-minded, hack 'n' slash game it's always been.

Just like when the Academy Awards brought out Jane Fonda, welcoming her back to the fold after her two-decade long lunacy period of being married to that strange fellow who owns Atlanta, expecting all of us to be fooled.
Well, I wasn't fooled. Not by Jane (she'll always be Barbarella to me) and not by D&D (she'll always be Barbarella to me, too.)

It's still D&D, folks. The game you were mocking two years ago. The game you complained about two years ago. The game you fought over two years ago. The game you refused to play ever again two years ago.

It's still D&D.
It's okay to like it. It's even okay to love it. I'm not about pissing in people's punch.

But I am about calling a spade a spade, and that game is the damned Ace. Hell, it's the whole damned Royal Flush of Spades.

Don't call it anything other than what it is. It's Dee and Effin' Dee.

It don't matter how many numbers they put behind it. It will always have those stupid alignments that never made sense, it will always have character classes that keep you from making the character you really want to make, it will always reward murder and genocide with profit and power (XPs), and it will always be clunky, awkward and unbalanced.

(Not that I have any interest in "balanced" games but there are folks out there who complain that games I design aren't "balanced" but go on to sing the praises of D&D3. Listen here, buddy. Tell me about it the next time I see your fighter and he's using a longsword instead of a rapier. Wanna know why? Because a longsword does a d8 worth of damage and the rapier only does a d6.

"Aha!" you say. "But the rapier does more damage on a critical hit!" To which, I answer: "So what? Your rapier does a crit on an 18 - 20 and my longsword does a crit on 19 or 20. That means you crit 15% of the time. I crit 10% of the time. And, in the meantime, 100% of the time, I've got a better chance of doing more damage while having an only 5% less chance of getting a crit. Nice game balance there. And don't ever ask me to handle a light axe. D4 that crits 5% of the time. Why in the world would I ever waste my time with a light axe???

(But I digress.)
Yes, this has been my Wasteland. Watching the internet sing the praises of D&D3, claiming it the savior-messiah of gaming.

Folks, it wasn't all that good. It wasn't bad. But, it just wasn't all that good, either. At least, not from my point of view.
And it's funny.

I was at the Berkeley show a few weeks ago, listening to everyone talk about it. The Hero guys told me, "Yeah. It's dressed up Hero." I heard the Chaosium guys say, "Yeah. It's just dressed up BRPS." I even heard someone say, "They just stole a bunch of ideas from Rolemaster."
Funny. No one said they stole anything from L5R or 7th Sea.

(Maybe that's because there's nothing worth stealing from them? One never can tell.)
Its kinda like when every racial group in the world claimed the trade federation aliens in Episode One sounded like them. I heard Native Americans say it, I heard Chinese say it, I heard Japanese say it.
Funny. No one said they sounded Irish.

(Maybe that's because nobody wants to sound Irish? One never can tell.)
The fact of the matter is, D&D3 looks like a lot of different RPGs. There's just nothing new or innovative about it.

I mean, think about the games that have come out lately. Think about the way Unknown Armies handles magic (pornomancy all the way, baby!), the way Feng Shui handles combat (I have to admit, brutes - I mean, mooks are a wonderful idea)

the way Hero Wars handles myth (do I have to say anything here?), the way Orkworld handles hunting -
. sorry . - and the way Conspiracy X handles psychic powers (and if you haven't seen this one, you are missing something).

And think of some older games, and the innovations they made. Cthulhu. Chill. Traveller. Over the Edge. The World of Darkness. GURPS. Hero. Rolemaster. All of these games provided essential building blocks the designers up at WotC used to create the new D&D.

And, let's face it, there is nothing new in those books. Nothing.
The Saving Throw system (your traits give you bonuses) comes right out of Runequest.

Skills are not a new thing. Not even the way they handled skills (making each one a separate ability) is a new thing. I mean, come on. It wasn't even new when 7th Sea did it. Go check out TMNT (and other Palladium books) to see what I mean.

The magic system is still the same old clunky, non-linear, non-sensical magic system. Although, I have to admit, this is one place I felt the game really fell flat. I mean, I miss all those funky names for the spells. Now they read like chemical formulae.
The bonuses thing is cute, but again, nothing new. It's straight out of Pendragon. Identical in nearly every way. Nothing new.

And did I mention they didn't do anything about alignment. Orks - sorry - "orcs" are still chaotic evil.
Chaotic evil and tribal. I'd like to see how that works. A culture of sociopaths sounds a bit oxymoronic to me.

And did I mention half the art is black and white? In a color book, half the art is black and white.
In case you missed that, let me say it again.
IN A FULL COLOR BOOK, NEARLY HALF THE ART IS BLACK AND WHITE.

That's not just bad art direction. That's a waste of money.

So, to recap:

1. D&D3 is a hardbound, full-color book with at least half of its full color pages covered with black and white illustrations.

2. It's mechanics, while improving previous editions, are not innovative, fresh or new; simply patchworks from previous innovations.

3. It is poorly laid out and requires a total of 3 books (a total purchase of sixty dollars) to play.

4. It is a rulebook comprised completely of rules.

Something unseen in this industry for nearly a decade.

My conclusion?
If D&D3 is a rules set for generic fantasy roleplaying. And, like every other generic fantasy game that has released in the last ten years, it should financially fail. However, this is not any other generic fantasy game.

This is Dungeons and Dragons. And because of that, it will succeed.
Despite the fact it is nothing more than eight hundred pages of rules and not a single paragraph of world.

Despite the fact the rules are not well organized or explained.

Despite the fact the combat rules require the use of miniatures.

Despite the fact gamers have been complaining about this kind of book for the last ten years.
Despite this fact, because it was Dungeons and Dragons, this game will sell almost 350,000 copies by the end of the year while Orkworld will probably sell about 3,000.

Sour grapes?
You bet your sweet dowmga.

* * *
I promised you we'd get out of the Wastelands.

But before we did, I wanted you to get a look at where my mind's been the last two weeks. And, to be honest, there's one more step into the Wastelands before we can take our first step out. Just one more. I promise.

I need to tell you one small fact about Ryan Dancey.
See, I know Ryan. And Ryan knows me. It ain't no secret we haven't always seen eye to eye.

I won't get into that here. That's private stuff between me and Ryan.

But, I will tell you a quick story about me and Tom Denmark that involves Ryan in a weird kind of way.

It goes something like this.

Me and Tom and Morgan Gray (more on him later) are sitting outside a coffee shop. I'm eating a turkey sandwich with cranberry sauce. Never had it before, it's pretty neat.

They're smoking. Had that before, it ain't neat.
(Something The Wife said to me just the other day. "If I was married to a smoker," she says, "I'd pour a capful of Drano into my food. Just a cap a day. And I'd eat it right in front of my smoking husband. He'd say, "What the hell are you doing?" and I'd say, "I'm killing myself. Very slowly. And you're gonna watch." She's just amazing. Okay. Back to the story.)

"We should do it," Tom says.
"We should do it," Morgan says.

"You two are crazy," John says.

They're trying to convince me to do something I promised myself - and others - I would not do.

And that, my friends, is write an adventure using the d20 System.

"It's like when CCGs first took off," Tom says. And he's right.
"We've got to get on there quick, before we're just another adventure," Morgan says. And he's right.
"I can't," I say. And I'm right.

See, I know Ryan.

Worked with him for five years. And there's a proud little part of me that doesn't buy into all this d20 hype. I won't. It's a fad. Besides, I won't write something for d20, even if it is for a quick buck, because that'll prove that Ryan was right.

I'll be just like everyone else jumping on the bandwagon.

Everyone else so eager to prove that Ryan Dancey was right about the game industry: sooner or later, everything will be d20 whether game designers like it or not.

The fans will demand it. Game companies have to either make d20 products or go out of business.

The more d20 products there are out there, the harder it will be for anything else to make a mark in the market.

And, if I jump on the bandwagon, Wick Fanboys (hi guys!) will shout "Sell Out!" and throw eggs at my house.

Besides. I already made Ryan Dancey plenty of money. When they sold Five Rings Publishing to Wizards of the Coast, there were a bunch of people who saw a whole lot of money.

No-one on the design team was on that list of people. Not me, not Dave Williams, not D.J. Trindle, not Rob Vaux, not Matt Wilson, not Matt Staroscik.
Not one of us. Not one red cent.

"I've already made Ryan Dancey a lot of money," I tell them. "I'm not interested in making him more."

That's when Tom Denmark looks me in the eye with a smile on his face and he tells me:
"Then it's time you let Ryan Dancey make you a lot of money."
And, my friends, that was only the second time in recorded history John Wick couldn't think of anything to say.

To top it off, Morgan says this:
"Besides, the book we'll do will kick the @!#$ out of anything they're gonna do."

Then, he goes on to tell me that Ryan said D&D fans will hold the Player's Handbook up to the rest of the industry and say, "The bar just got raised." He smiles.
"Let's do a book the D&D players hold up to Ryan and say

'The bar just got raised.'"
I won't count that as the third time. It was just an amendment on the second time.

So, there I am. Sitting there. Thunderstruck. Dumbfounded. Flabbergasted. Discombobulated.

. So, what do I say?
"All right," I say. "Let's steal Ryan's customers."

Ryan once said that he intended to use the PLAYER'S HANDBOOK as a weapon against the rest of the industry.

He said he'd print a full-color, hardbound two-hundred plus page book for only twenty bucks, and the fans would hold that book up to the rest of the industry and say, "Why can't you make something this good?"

Well, friends and neighbors, I have seen D&D3, and I can tell you this:
I'm doing a d20 Adventure.
I've seen the best WotC can do.
It was s***.

I'm gonna blow their socks off.
And they'll hold that book up at the steps of Wizards Central and shout at the top of their lungs: "Why can't you make something this good?"

I've taken my first step out of the Wasteland.

Thanks to a guy named Percival, hiding in the skins and clothes of Tom Denmark and Morgan Gray. They showed me something I'd forgotten:
Gaming is about fun. Providing a tool for others to have fun.

I'm back. Back in the saddle, ready to finish what I started

Namely, ready to finish Warhamster for John Kovalic, ready to finish The Book of Villains for Green Knight, and ready to finish The Flux for myself.

And a few other things as well. More on them later.
Take good care of yourselves. Don't get lost in that Wasteland.

It's a nasty place. And the only guy who knows how to get out is a funny lookin' pair of fellas living in the Bay Area.

And I owe them much.
(PS: I will update Orkworld.com this week with a few goodies. And, next week, I'll show you what's up with Warhamster. Boy. It's been a long road. See you on the other side.)

That Rough Beast posted:

The bad part is Wick has made some very entertaining games and occasionally genuinely has some good advice and GMing tips. It's just so laced with bullshit that you can't really trust him at any given moment.

I get the impression like 75% of anything he says is just him taking the piss and trolling the audience but maybe that's too generous.

rex monday posted:

I can't believe I used to read and enjoy Play Dirty. I think I'd rather be kicked in the dick than ever play in a game that John Wick ran.

John Wick posted:

Jefferson Carter is a meta-human. Carter has many abilities that allow him to seek out a hero’s most precious secrets, then he uses those secrets against them.
In my Champions campaign, even if the heroes weren’t employed by US, Carter would still consider them “employees.” In fact, those heroes would be an even greater challenge to his intellect and resources.
Why has Carter gone to all this trouble?
The answer is simple.
Because he can.

Greg Stolze posted:

Your players need to trust you to run the game. You need to establish a standard of fairness and stick to it. You need to make an effort to be consistent — with the rules, with the facts of description, with the personalities of your GMCs. They need to feel that they have a reasonable chance to make assumptions and predictions about the game world: If you’re not consistent, there’s no point in doing that. If you arbitrarily throw meaningless opposition at them whenever they try something unorthodox — or worse, whenever they’re nearing success — they’ll conclude that it’s your game and that you’re just using them for your own amusement without giving anything back.

LightWarden posted:

Ugh, so much missed potential just for the sake of dicking over your players. Instead of railroading the player with the dependent, he could have let the character fashion a makeshift mask, and finish off the villain, then rush her grandmother to the hospital. What happens next? Do they wipe her memory to restore status quo, and if so, are there any complications? Do they have a falling out or do they reconcile, and the grandmother now worries about her granddaughter and keeps telling her to quit while she's still alive. Have a disease, but you're immune to the cure? Road trip time, seek out a new technological/magical cure in a race against time and astonish opponents as you stagger into battle despite pain that would fell a lesser being. This "ha ha, I screwed you over, look at how clever I am" is just bullshit of the highest degree. The only one that worked was the last one, because he worked off of a player's ideas and in the end the character made a difference.

Wick's defender posted:

I’m not sure. It doesn’t sound to me as if he’s unfairly exploiting the weaknesses of characters whose players included weaknesses; it sounds rather as if he’s finding weaknesses to exploit in characters whose players were trying to create the invincible character. That concept of the invincible character arose recently over on the forum, briefly, and Eric Ashley commented that as a referee he found such characters boring in the extreme.

Obviously, if a player allows that his character has a weakness, he accepts that “someone” might “discover” it and use it against him. That’s part of the whole “dependent non-player character” disad: Superman might be invulnerable, but he has to protect Lois Lane and Jimmy Olsen, who patently are not and are rather prone to getting into trouble. Spiderman has to protect Aunt May and Mary Jane and maybe some of his other friends, and if the villains figure out that he has a soft spot for someone, they’ll use it against him.

But if a player attempts to make a character completely unassailable, with no weaknesses whatsoever, what fun is that? There aren’t that many options for the referee. He can pull the trick Lex Luthor used against Superman or Green Goblin against Spiderman: you don’t have time to save both so which one are you going to save? But that doesn’t really hurt you; it only means you can’t do everything. So if you make a character you think has “no weaknesses” and Wick finds a weakness somewhere, what was the expectation? Either you thought you were going to run a character who could do everything and never fail at anything (boring ultimately even for the player, I would think), or you were challenging the referee to find the chink in the armor and bring down your supercharacter.

So it might be that it is exactly those boring impervious characters that Wick is targeting here, making them interesting by discovering the flaws that the players who designed them overlooked.

Or it could be that he really is just a jerk referee on a power binge looking for ways to bring gamist powergamer players down a notch.

That Rough Beast posted:

I think now Wick argues that the Play Dirty article was a deliberate satire ("And if you read between the lines, you can see how.") Being John Wick, he never actually loving says what his real point was and how you're supposed to know this, because he's got some inborn need to be some kind of nerd-Sphinx.

quote:

DNPC

For those of you who don’t recognize DNPC, it stands for “Dependent Non-Player Character”. I understand it’s a fairly common Disadvantage among players, but after this little stunt, I had a severe shortage of DNPCs in my campaign.

One of my more resourceful heroes was a young lady named Malice. She was a martial artist who had a poison touch. She was fast, deadly and very lucky. She was also a big, fat thorn in Carter’s side. She was getting too close to his secret, so he decided to retire her.

When she wasn’t running around in black tights, Malice was taking care of her aging grandmother. Grandmama was not too fond of those costumed heroes, especially that Malice girl. She looked like a hussy in that tight little costume. And what right did they have to do a police man’s job? Grandpa was a police man, after all (and the main inspiration for Malice to turn to a life of adventuring). In short, it would break Grandmama’s heart if she found out about her granddaughter’s secret.

By now, you should be getting the picture. Just show Grandmama pictures of her granddaughter getting into the Malice costume and everything will be hunky dory, right?

Wrong.

When Carter does things, he does them with style.

On Grandmama’s seventieth birthday, Malice took her out to her favorite restaurant. In the middle of the meal, one of Malice’s most hated enemies showed up on the roof with a bomb. Of course, Malice made an appearance. Her enemy (who knew she would show up) was prepared. He had a single agenda and he stuck to it. In the middle of the fight, he hit her with a paralyzing ray, ripped off her mask and threw her through the glass ceiling – right in front of Grandmama. The combined shock of seeing her granddaughter get thrown through the glass ceiling, fall fifty feet and slam to the floor was shocking enough. Add to it the realization that her granddaughter was that masked hussy was a bit too much for Grandmama to handle.

Her heart seized, and as Malice watched on, trapped in her paralyzed body, her grandmother died.

Malice retired the very next day and nobody ever bought a DNPC again.

even worse username posted:

I could buy the puppetmaster justification if the scenario there had been followed up by the villain making a play to bring the broken hero onto their side (and hey, having a PC as a mole in the villain's operation might be fun) or something along those lines. This was (allegedly) just a goofily overwrought attempt to get a hero out of the way, really as silly as if he had built a giant Rube Goldberg device. What it really is is a gently caress you to the player.

That Rough Beast posted:

In one of his stories, Wick relates that he had his players run characters through the aforementioned Over the Edge adventure where they realize they're simply fictional characters. A mastermind in the know led the characters to a room where five hooded figures were tied to chairs, and said: "This is them. These are the puppetmasters who have enjoyed your suffering and manipulated your lives. The only way you'll be free is if you kill them." The mastermind then gave them a gun. The hoods were pulled back - the figures were the players and the GM.

How does the story end? Wick archly says "I don't kiss and tell." Personally, after reading these stories, I think it probably ended with Malice's player going "I grab the pistol, point it at John's head, and pull the trigger till it goes dry." and an awkward silence falling around the table. John gave a soft cough and suggested the night end there.