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crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
What's the LW era he rants about?

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crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
honestly guys when i'm this tired it would help if you put it in quotes or code or something. just saying it would lead to less 'are you serious?' posts.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
Valid point, I suppose that anything even slightly grognardy should be considered reposted from some other site

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
Can someone explain to me, very plainly, the GSL? It's when other companies want to make material for the 4 ed system, right? What's the deal?

Also, this fighter mess is the truest thing I know personally. My group wasn't a bunch of min/maxers at all but we quickly realized that going straight fighter past the first two levels was a huge mistake. And that clerics could do anything better than the rest of the party.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
No Book of Vile Darkness? I was kinda hoping for a book for evil PC's, because I imagine people would buy it. It doesn't have to be nearly as gruesome as the third edition was though. But hey, it's their game.

See what I did there? Even though I'm a little disappointed I didn't write a 5000 word blog post bitching about how Wi$ards sold out to the masses.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
That's true. I don't play enough to even start thinking about how I'd change stuff!

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
Is it double racism if you kill a black orc like in warhammer fantasy?

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
magic grognards are my favorite grognards

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
I have a couple questions about what WOTC means by "core".

I have the PHB, DMG, and MM. I'll call these Core1.

Does the Ebberon Player's guide rely on material outside Core1? Does it use races from PHB2, monsters from MM2 etc...?

To get 100% out of Ebberon do I need five "core" books?

To get 100% out of next years setting will I need eight or nine "core" books?

Eleven or Twelve the year after?

Piestrio

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

RagnarokAngel posted:

Does no one share books? I mean in my group its not mandatory but highly advised everyone own the PHB1. After that usually theres at least one copy of any book among our group and we just pass it around during the pre game warm up.

You forget that the grognard in his natural habitat has no friends and none of them have money after they spend it on anime and dew

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

plarp posted:

How dare you charge for additional content, wizards. HOW DARE YOU! THIS IS A SLAP IN THE FACE

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

RocknRollaAyatollah posted:

He was the same friend who went on a rant about the loss of prestige classes and about how Dragonborn are just Dragon Disciple without any of the "work".

hahahahaha

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

clockworkjoe posted:

The D&D game has failed to produce a widely success mass market introductory product.

This actually made me do a double take. That's a first in this thread.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
close it, it's over

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
Cnt. - Count (number of people rating this class).
Avg. - Average (mean) value assigned by those voting for the class.
SD - Standard Deviation
Med. - Median
Mode - Mode
Min/Max - Showes the range of votes, i.e. the highest and lowest vote the class recieved.
Spread - how many points between the Min and Max.
Comments - The spreads are set every two points so Supreme includes all 8-10 average counts and Weak includes everything below 4.

I feel dirty. What does median/mode for a class mean?

crime fighting hog fucked around with this message at 16:20 on Jun 28, 2009

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
I always thought of HP as a mix between actual damage, fighting spirit, energy, etc. We joked once that for every HP you lost you got one small cut.
"How big of a cure spell do you need?"

"I've got 56 cuts"

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

lighttigersoul posted:

And I wouldn't doubt that 4th ed makes characters quicker and easier - the entire system is streamlined and simplified and dumbed down to make it more accessible and hopefully to sell more. If only all those little bars with all their colors didn't look so much like Hotkeys in World of Warcraft.

This is pretty much it, guys. I hate 4e because I can't spam my favorite ability because of the 15 second cooldown or whatever the gently caress it is

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

The General posted:

Abstract this: A level 1 barbarian dwarf has a really great chance of still standing after being hit with a loving BALLISTA BOLT.

Well, he's a PC so that means that he's just naturally lucky. It doesn't mean in my head that he got hit dead on and he still only took, what, 2d10? I don't remember, but that there goes some of his luck. Perhaps think of it that when your HP finally gets low to the point where that last hit knocks you out/kills you, that is the one strike it takes to kill most people.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
WE'VE STRUCK OIL! BEAUTIFUL GROGNARD OIL!


OZGODUSA (1 month ago)
Can't believe this clown destroyed FR. Down with Chris Perkins!

highpriestrsw2 (1 month ago)

I almost picked up the 4E guide just to read it. I might now. I own the 2E and 3E guides as well. I'm not a big fan of 4E I think it has really hosed up D&D. I have never been a big fan of Forgotten realms but now that I'm guessing my favorite setting will never have anything new for it in RPG form (Dragonlance) I'm starting to read the reams books. 30 years of history right down the shitter all in an effort to impress people who play MMOs. Way to go WOTC! Did you even think this poo poo out?

Markum1972 (6 months ago)
Anyone know of any groups that are devoted to the preservation of the Forgotten Realms? We have a mass group of more than 20 players with 5 DMs every other week. We plan on continuing the Forgotten Realms world evolution old school style. In the talks of opening an online group for it.
charleshoskinson (7 months ago) Show Hide

Good work Wizards, you have completely hosed up FR. Everything is now a living breathing sack of poo poo. How could you destroy the Red Wizards of Thay? How could you destroy Haulrua?

rioma1 (7 months ago) Show Hide
drat man! great dressing skills! lol

FRAvenger (7 months ago) Show Hide
You've really ruined the Realms. I just want to know Chris, Did you do this, To leave your mark on the Realms? Is that all it was?

Drjug (8 months ago) Show Hide
WoTC is wanted for the murder of Forgotten Realms


Malsadhu (8 months ago) Show Hide
4E is a multi-planar cataclysm. No D&D campaign world will remain unscathed.

youngdragon32 (8 months ago) Show Hide
I'm a bit miffed actually. it just seems they've destroyed everything Ed Greenwood has created up until now.The now diminished Elminster no longer seems to give a drat anymore. All but one of the seven sisters (Simbul) is dead as far as I can tell, and even she seems to be in a sort of exile. Even the harpers, perhaps Elminster's biggest legacy, have been disbanded. I can't believe Ed agreed to this...

HermanTheSorcerer (10 months ago) Show Hide
This guy is such a dumb idiot, it's a shame for WotC and the whole FR campaign setting will take a lot of damage. There is just no need for these updates, they only want to make money by publishing needles crap! I will certainly ignore these retarded new version!!


I'M FINISHED!

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

Spikey posted:

What exactly did Wizards do to Forgotten Realms that is so terrible?

I love the Realms but comparatively know very little next to some people on here, but:

Abeir has come back. An entire continent returns filled with Primordial and all sorts of crazy poo poo. Good way to throw in the new races without the 'they've always been there!' excuse.
Elminster vastly depowered. Now a complete recluse.
Mystra dead.
Khelben dead.
Waterdeep now just a city instead of a city-state.
Baldur's Gate now the most popular city in FR (I think).
Haluaraa flooded, abandoned.
The Shining South (my favorite area in 3rd) dropped into the ocean. The only change I didn't like but whatever I don't really care.
Calimshan's genie's/efreet's resume their millenia old war after being released.

Basically they killed off some places that were actually kinda cool but whatever. That and most of the big NPC's are either dead/disappeared/depowered/in hiding. I like it but I guess that's cause I'm an unimaginative human being according to those 'true' role players.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

Kerison posted:

But hey, whatever, it's always been most useful as a bunch of maps and names, and I just disregard official material whenever it suits me, as anyone should.

This is it. Why can't the whiners just realize, ya know, that it's all bullshit and they can do whatever they want?

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

opaopa13 posted:

What the heck are you doing?? Don't you know that WotC has banned all knowledge of pre-4e sourcebooks? You'll get us all killed!

Perhaps from now on when I talk to grognards about previous editions I'll just pretend that pre-4th wasn't actual D&D and only 4th edition counts as 'real' d&d just to see their reaction.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

Etherwind posted:

Seftir dude sometimes I worry for your personal safety. :ohdear:

Don't worry duder all the grognards I know are fat and non-confrontational. They mostly just froth at the mouth about how 4th is WOW and then they talk about how much they play WOW and how much paladins suck in WOW, etc.

"Alex, you know I don't play WOW. You can talk to me about Magic, D&D and warhammer but don't start ranting about WOW"

"BUT I THINK PALADINS ARE A WASTE OF CODE AND THEY RUINED THE FLUFF IN 4TH REALMS..."

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
Oh god Oh dear god

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

Dystopian Rhetoric posted:

But the world is hars. Liches don't make ponies that puke a lot, they makes slaves and destruction.

Where are the puking ponies in the monster manual?

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
Scythes did piercing and slashing I thought. And they still do 2d4 if I remember right.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
Felonius posted:

Character motivations? Pffft, who gives a crap? When's my next encounter, and how many healing surges to I have left?


My players fall into this category and it's so much goddamn fun

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
the best fighter in the word, taking up his most magical sword, misses 5% of the time

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
I've played 2E back in the day. I've read into 3.5E and it's an evolved version.

4E?... a mutation. Just my opinion.

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

ZorbaTHut posted:

I sort of want to record one of our sessions and post it just to make grognards hate us :3:

i love you

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
well he is wearing a lot of diapers

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
...That was where I was going with the "Wizard casts *Cure*" analogy. If you were a Cleric in a party where the DM allowed the Wizard to have Clerical spells, wouldn't you feel a little less unique and important to the group?

Even with all of that said, this dynamic is actually a more minor concern that I have with 4E but is indicative of the direction that the game leans which is a symptom of larger issues.

Probably my biggest issue with 4E is what I call the "iron curtain" effect..

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
I played Path Finder last weekend & that game is nothing but garbage, clearly it was aimed at people not smart enough to handle 3.5's grapple rules. I also found it very hard to roleplay, PF has completely taken RP out of the new update to 3.5. I found the rules to be way too rigid, but it also didnt have enough rules for RP. I guess I will just let the children & the lazy gamers play PF or those who will just play anything Paizo shoves into their mouths! They have crocidiles for christs sake!

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
you are all unworthy of my blade

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
I'm the kind of person who plays FPSs for the sake of testing my ability to adapt to situations where I'm either outgunned or outclassed. In 3.5, I found I was quite capable of dealing with drat near anything my players could think up, and I was always able to put myself a step ahead of them with a little preparation. When I played instead of DMing, I ended up being the most flexible and reliable player in the group due to my optimization skills and solid tactical thinking. The enemies could not stand up to me unless they were 6 or more levels above me, and I even held back at times to draw things out.


I am putting this word for word on the cover letter of my next resume

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
What's all this radiant sigil brutality stuff and going infinite damage he keeps yammering about. Is he one of those players/DM's that says "if it's in the rulebook it's legal and there is nothing I can do"

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

Joe Anglican posted:

e: dammit seftir

drat i'm good

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
I like the guys who think that since it's going 'mainstream' that their groups will just be filled with frat boys or something

crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out

ZorbaTHut posted:

For me, the most obvious sign that it was a video game taken to the table was the level-dependent magic items. That takes a bulldozer to the fourth wall there.

What does that even mean? They ruined D&D because the players become aware it's a game? Jesus christ

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crime fighting hog
Jun 29, 2006

I only pray, Heaven knows when to lift you out
might start doing that