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Aardvarklet
Aug 12, 2008

I Wish I Was posted:

Unless they've changed from ten years ago, I don't think OTC prenatals of any brand are as good as the prescription ones. You might want to do a side-by-side ingredient comparison and make sure that you're not shorting yourself on important nutrients to save money.

Yeah, I've tried several kinds now. I take some other supplements in addition to the prenatal, so I feel fairly confident about it. The doctor actually told me not to bother with a prescription vitamin, but I asked for one anyway because my sister-in-law had mentioned that hers were coated, which was something I wanted. I might switch back to those once I'm actually pregnant.

I just want to throw out a "good luck" to everyone in here...hopefully we'll all wind up over in the pregnancy thread together at some point.

And Chickalicious, I broke down and used that test you sent me early last month! I have no self-control.

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Chickalicious
Apr 13, 2005

We are the ones we've been waiting for.

Aardvarklet posted:

And Chickalicious, I broke down and used that test you sent me early last month! I have no self-control.

Ha! I've made a deal with myself that I won't test until I'm officially late. I was peeing on anything remotely shaped like a test a couple months ago.

grendelspov
Jun 12, 2008

I have a penis.

That said, all of this thermometer stuff sounds nice and all, but my wife and I just went and grabbed some ovulation test kits at Walgreens. Daughter number one was conceived in the first month of "trying" and number two was conceived in the second month of "trying."

Despite the fact that I have a supercock and didn't need it anyway, I think that the too-expensive litmus test for hormonal levels was dead on.

Of course, some couples just have trouble conceiving. Could be male or female issues. If it doesn't happen for a long time I'd Nth the fertility doctor recommendations.

Aardvarklet
Aug 12, 2008

grendelspov posted:

I have a penis.

That said, all of this thermometer stuff sounds nice and all, but my wife and I just went and grabbed some ovulation test kits at Walgreens. Daughter number one was conceived in the first month of "trying" and number two was conceived in the second month of "trying."

Despite the fact that I have a supercock and didn't need it anyway, I think that the too-expensive litmus test for hormonal levels was dead on.

Of course, some couples just have trouble conceiving. Could be male or female issues. If it doesn't happen for a long time I'd Nth the fertility doctor recommendations.

Heh. Supercock.

I think if we go more than 6 months without any result, we might buy one of those fancy kits. I hear you can get a good deal on ebay and just buy the disposable test strips to go along with it.

I heard somewhere that the chance of conceiving in any given cycle, even if you do everything "right," is something like 20%...anyone know more about this?

Sally Slug
Jul 8, 2005

Ride, Sally, ride!
Yeah seriously never buy ovulation strips or pregnancy tests at the drugstore unless you're in a pregnancy scare panic. You can get them for so so much cheaper on Amazon or Ebay. If you are a compulsive tester like I was (and will be again) having strips instead of the regular tests will stop you from bankrupting yourself.

qentiox
Nov 8, 2005

I like dragons.
I just wanted to say that we used Natural Family Planning for both contraception and conception, and it worked well in our case; we got pregnant twice in the span of 3 months. We didn't use the thermometer though, just the cervical mucus checks.

Good luck to everyone trying!

Papaya
Apr 4, 2005

I'm a creepy furry who feels entitled to other people's babies, but only if they are white. Yiff!

Aardvarklet posted:

I heard somewhere that the chance of conceiving in any given cycle, even if you do everything "right," is something like 20%...anyone know more about this?

Something like this. I visit one of those "omg baby dust :downs:" boards and they had a long written out explanation as to why this is true, but I REALLY don't feel like going and searching for that post in all that garbage.

Basically, even if everyone is 100% fertile, you still have to account for the fertilized egg to bounce around just right and implant correctly and not too soon or too late or be blighted or all this other crap so that lowers the odds right then and there, not even accounting for people with fertility issues.

Crabsurd
Dec 19, 2006
Here's another one chiming in for trying. We're on about three months right now and it's been SO disappointing when the period appears. I'm not doing any of that temperature tracking or anything, I feel like that would make it more of a chore than it is.

Krysie posted:

a woman's orgasm actually facilitates the movement of the sperm.

And this is my problem. This never ever happens for me during the actual act, so I hope it's not THAT important. Someone reassure me...

Longpig
Nov 23, 2004

Miss Shell posted:

Here's another one chiming in for trying. We're on about three months right now and it's been SO disappointing when the period appears. I'm not doing any of that temperature tracking or anything, I feel like that would make it more of a chore than it is.


And this is my problem. This never ever happens for me during the actual act, so I hope it's not THAT important. Someone reassure me...

During female orgasm the cervix dips down and into any waiting puddles of semen that have been recently ejected. So it probably does make a difference but I'm not sure how much... I don't think it's a deal breaker. From what I've read though, it's still fine if you get off after he does, so if he finishes you off with oral or whatever it's all good.

Krysie
Feb 12, 2009

Miss Shell posted:

Here's another one chiming in for trying. We're on about three months right now and it's been SO disappointing when the period appears. I'm not doing any of that temperature tracking or anything, I feel like that would make it more of a chore than it is.


And this is my problem. This never ever happens for me during the actual act, so I hope it's not THAT important. Someone reassure me...

I don't think any one thing is a deal breaker... I believe that it's a series of events that occur in a certain sequence for a better chance at conception. I hope I'm making sense, it's day three of a sleep strike (my 8mos old is having none of this sleeping crap... and mommy needs her sleep!)

As someone someone else posted, I don't think it necessarily MUST happen that you get off during the act... there are just certain things that it helps (and I would assume that getting off at any point during said 'baby dance' [omg, I think I just barfed a bit... that is such a nasty term] will do what needs to be done) Again, I hope I'm even quasi-clear!

Crabsurd
Dec 19, 2006
^ Yeah, I get what you're saying. Well, fingers crossed anyway.

I am trying so hard not to freak my husband out with this OH MY GOD BABIES thing. I reckon another month without success and it's ovulation kit time.

inaniloquent
Apr 7, 2007

Je suis génie.
Do any of you who are taking, or might have to take, fertility drugs think about the possibility of multiples when you go that route? Does the thought sound exciting or terrifying or conjure up completely different emotions? It's funny to imagine not easily having a child, and then BAM- six kids at once. :)

Lady googooGaGa
Nov 3, 2006

Are you freaking kidding me!?
I was really irregular. No period from May - October. Two weeks on Metformin (someone else mentioned it earlier in the thread), and I was pregnant. If you're not regular in your cycles, its worth it to get checked out.

Moms Stuffing
Jun 2, 2005

the little green one

inaniloquent posted:

Do any of you who are taking, or might have to take, fertility drugs think about the possibility of multiples when you go that route? Does the thought sound exciting or terrifying or conjure up completely different emotions? It's funny to imagine not easily having a child, and then BAM- six kids at once. :)

There's pretty much no way to accidentally end up with 6 babies. Those women who end up with a ton of kids at once knew what they were doing and they had a choice, and I'm not even talking about "selective reduction" (aka abort a few).

If you're at the point where you need fertility drugs to get pregnant, you are monitored very closely via ultrasound. You go in for these ultrasounds every few days to check the status of your follicles and see if any are ready for ovulation. Some women even have to go so far as to take a shot that triggers ovulation because their body won't do it on its own. If you're going in for these ultrasounds, you know exactly how many follicles have the potential to ovulate, so if you see 6 mature follicles up on that screen, you can potentially get pregnant with 6 babies. Fertility doctors don't WANT you to get pregnant with 6 babies, it's a tremendous physical strain on the mother and children with high risks for premature birth, and even maternal or fetal death. Most responsible individuals will drop the cycle before they even have a chance to get impregnated. They'll ovulate, but abstain from sex and just end up with a regular period.

I've been in this position, it was horrible to throw away all that money we'd spent on a cycle, but it was the responsible thing to do. I'm not willing to risk my children's lives that way, if one of them was stillborn or born with horrible issues, I would never forgive myself because it would BE 100% MY FAULT. However, some women are so desperate, both financially and emotionally, they go through with it anyway. Hence, the Jon & Kate Plus Eight's etc etc...

Aardvarklet
Aug 12, 2008

Google Embryo posted:

multiple baby stuff...

Wow, that is very interesting--I had no idea you could see how many follicles were mature beforehand. Sort of gives me a different perspective on the Octomom types out there. I wonder if most of the time they think, "no way that could happen to me." I mean, what are the odds, right? (Probably higher than I think.)

Elanore--did you experience any side effects with the metformin? My cycles are (I think) still adjusting after getting off the pill, and right now they are getting a day or two longer each time. I'm thinking metformin may be in my future if this keeps up for very long.

Moms Stuffing
Jun 2, 2005

the little green one

Aardvarklet posted:

Wow, that is very interesting--I had no idea you could see how many follicles were mature beforehand. Sort of gives me a different perspective on the Octomom types out there. I wonder if most of the time they think, "no way that could happen to me." I mean, what are the odds, right? (Probably higher than I think.)

Elanore--did you experience any side effects with the metformin? My cycles are (I think) still adjusting after getting off the pill, and right now they are getting a day or two longer each time. I'm thinking metformin may be in my future if this keeps up for very long.

Octomom is entirely something else. Not only did she know what she was doing, she had IVF, so a doctor knowingly implanted 8 embryos into her uterus. Generally, 1-2 embryos are implanted with IVF, 3 if you're older or have had major issues with miscarriage from what I understand.

Aardvarklet
Aug 12, 2008

Google Embryo posted:

Octomom is entirely something else. Not only did she know what she was doing, she had IVF, so a doctor knowingly implanted 8 embryos into her uterus. Generally, 1-2 embryos are implanted with IVF, 3 if you're older or have had major issues with miscarriage from what I understand.

Ahhhhh...I see. Wow, no wonder people have expressed concern over the doctor's role. That's just crazy.

Lady googooGaGa
Nov 3, 2006

Are you freaking kidding me!?

Aardvarklet posted:

Elanore--did you experience any side effects with the metformin? My cycles are (I think) still adjusting after getting off the pill, and right now they are getting a day or two longer each time. I'm thinking metformin may be in my future if this keeps up for very long.

I was one of the lucky ones that didn't. I am terrified of new medications. I won't even take OTC cold meds half the time unless I know like 20 people who have used that exact pill. When they gave me Tylenol 3 for my gall bladder with the bab I wouldn't even take it, because I had taken it before and could 'feel' it. I'm pretty much a pill-phob.

That said, something in my gut just told me to go with the met. I started on a half an 850mg pill (which is all it took to get pregnant, but before I knew I was pregnant I had upped to 850/the whole pill). I took it with food at the same exact time every day, and aside from some very, very mild stomach discomfort if I didn't eat the first few weeks, it was fine. No massive pooping, no horrid nausea. It got to the point where I could take it without eating and feel nothing. I have PCOS so I within two weeks started having more energy, more regulated hunger pangs (no more OMG MUST BINGE RIGHT NOW), and I even slept better. If you don't have PCOS I don't know how much it will help, but it worked really well for me, and even some other people without classic PCOS symptoms I've talked with on message boards and such. Insulin is a funny thing, and it can meddle with your hormones even if its just slightly enough to throw poo poo off.

Now I have talked to people who took like 2000mg (max) and had no results. The thing I like though, and I have NOTHING against fertility drugs or treatments, is that unlike Clomid, etc. there is a much smaller risk of multiples. They are fertility drugs, Metformin is for diabetes or insulin resistance, so you get to aside all of the side-effects and such associated with fertility drugs. If that wouldn't have worked, I would have eventually moved on to those.

jennyinstereo
Jan 17, 2007

[rocking faces since the 80s]

Sally Slug posted:

Yeah seriously never buy ovulation strips or pregnancy tests at the drugstore unless you're in a pregnancy scare panic. You can get them for so so much cheaper on Amazon or Ebay. If you are a compulsive tester like I was (and will be again) having strips instead of the regular tests will stop you from bankrupting yourself.

Yup. I'm buying this tomorrow:

http://www.early-pregnancy-tests.com/midstreamtes.html

It's pretty decent for $25 and I've heard that these cheapo strips can be more accurate than more expensive stuff like Clear Blue Fertility Monitors. I'm going to try them out and whenever I see a dark line, I'm heading for the bedroom.

Sally Slug
Jul 8, 2005

Ride, Sally, ride!
:woop: Does this mean that your sister has encouraged you to start trying a little sooner?

One of the cheapo tests from the dollar store detected my pregnancy before the Clear Blue test, so I have great faith in them and in the cheap ovulation strips too.

Hope you guys don't mind me hanging out in here, I'm just so excited for all of you and we're starting to think that we might aim for a mid to late 2010 baby.

Lady googooGaGa
Nov 3, 2006

Are you freaking kidding me!?

Sally Slug posted:

One of the cheapo tests from the dollar store detected my pregnancy before the Clear Blue test, so I have great faith in them and in the cheap ovulation strips too.

I got in the habit of buying the cheapo dollar store ones. I had a super faint line at 3 weeks, but none of the expensive tests registered it. At four weeks I took another dollar store one that gave me a clear line. It still took two days for a digital test to give me a positive.

jennyinstereo
Jan 17, 2007

[rocking faces since the 80s]

Sally Slug posted:

:woop: Does this mean that your sister has encouraged you to start trying a little sooner?

One of the cheapo tests from the dollar store detected my pregnancy before the Clear Blue test, so I have great faith in them and in the cheap ovulation strips too.

Hope you guys don't mind me hanging out in here, I'm just so excited for all of you and we're starting to think that we might aim for a mid to late 2010 baby.


Not too much sonner :) July is the plan. I CAN'T WAIT! I'm also trying to lose some weight before we try. Fingers crossed!

Aardvarklet
Aug 12, 2008
Jenny, I'm glad you showed up! If you didn't show soon I was gonna come over to the preg thread and get on your case. I'm so pumped for you that you're going to start in July! That's coming up soon.

I'm adding the site that you bought from to the OP.

jennyinstereo
Jan 17, 2007

[rocking faces since the 80s]

Aardvarklet posted:

Jenny, I'm glad you showed up! If you didn't show soon I was gonna come over to the preg thread and get on your case. I'm so pumped for you that you're going to start in July! That's coming up soon.

I'm adding the site that you bought from to the OP.

:D My birthday is July 7th and we're going away for the long weekend so maybe we'll start then ;) What a way to celebrate Independence Day haha

And yeah, that site is awesome. They have even BIGGER packages with like 50 test strips. It's crazy.

ScottK
Jun 28, 2006

Google Embryo posted:

I'll just say good luck to all those who are trying, and if you haven't gotten pregnant and have been trying for 6 months - 1 year, it's time to involve a doctor.
My wife and I started trying to get pregnant last September. We found out she was pregnant at the beginning of November. She went to the doctor the next day, found out her HCG levels were very low (like 18), and she then had a miscarriage (or "chemical pregnancy") a few days later.

We took a month off and then started trying again. Her period is very irregular when she is not on the pill (35-39 day cycles), so this made it more complicated. We did use the ovulation strips. Last month the doctor prescribed her a small dose of Femara.

Anyway, on this past Sunday she took a pregnancy test and it came up positive! She went to the doctor on Monday, got another positive, and they took blood. Tuesday we got the results and her HCG levels were 249, which they said is more like what it should be if you are 3 weeks pregnant, as opposed to the 5 weeks that we think/know she is (ovulation was on April 19th or 20th, with her first day of her last period on April 4th).

So needless to say, we are both extremely stressed and freaking out. She went back to give blood again this morning and we are hoping to get the results back late this afternoon, if not definitely tomorrow.

I'm trying to tell myself that the "normal" HCG charts maybe don't apply as much to her since her period cycle is so long/strange. I know that the actual "normal" range is huge for those things and that what really matters is that it doubles every 2 or 3 days, but hers is still well below the "normal."

Trying to get pregnant sucks. When you look around and see babies everywhere, especially people who have unwanted and unplanned children, it seems like it is so easy to get pregnant. It sucks for us though.

ScottK fucked around with this message at 19:11 on May 14, 2009

Lady googooGaGa
Nov 3, 2006

Are you freaking kidding me!?
Don't stress too much about low numbers yet. In the first few weeks the range can be kind of wide. Also, the month I got pregnant I even had marked the calendar on the dates we had sex, and I still was off by two weeks. I thought I was 8 at my appointment. I was 6.5. It drove me nuts too.

SKeefe posted:

Trying to get pregnant sucks. When you look around and see babies everywhere, especially people who have unwanted and unplanned children, it seems like it is so easy to get pregnant. It sucks for us though.

Also, trust me, I know this feeling. Right after I miscarried, my sister in law got pregnant, then a bunch of friends. I felt like such an outcast I spent like a month drunk on cheap wine just to try and numb it down. Then I just said that I was going to work with the doctors to get my PCOS in order, focus on my wedding and such, and boom, it happened. Stress doesn't help, and I know that sounds stupid, because of course its totally stressful, but you have to take the 'We can do it, we're just learning how we do it and when we do it as we go' approach.

ScottK
Jun 28, 2006

ElanoreMcMantis posted:

Also, trust me, I know this feeling. Right after I miscarried, my sister in law got pregnant, then a bunch of friends.
Yea, we are at the age where A HUGE NUMBER of our peers are getting pregnant, not to mention people younger than us getting pregnant accidentally. Every time someone announces they are pregnant, of course we are happy for them, but I can tell it is like torture for my wife.

Lady googooGaGa
Nov 3, 2006

Are you freaking kidding me!?

SKeefe posted:

Yea, we are at the age where A HUGE NUMBER of our peers are getting pregnant, not to mention people younger than us getting pregnant accidentally. Every time someone announces they are pregnant, of course we are happy for them, but I can tell it is like torture for my wife.

Yeah those feelings suck. It sounds cheesy, but just going on a few of the trying to conceive boards really helped me. I learned a ton about the process, and found people who felt the same poo poo I was feeling. I like SA infinitely better, but some of those places have enough traffic that when its quieter here I still had something to read/discuss. Once I got over a lot of the inadequate feelings I had it cleared my head up a good bit. I hope it works out for you guys!

Aardvarklet
Aug 12, 2008

SKeefe posted:


Anyway, on this past Sunday she took a pregnancy test and it came up positive! She went to the doctor on Monday, got another positive, and they took blood. Tuesday we got the results and her HCG levels were 249, which they said is more like what it should be if you are 3 weeks pregnant, as opposed to the 5 weeks that we think/know she is (ovulation was on April 19th or 20th, with her first day of her last period on April 4th).


First off, congrats, that is very exciting. Just to add another anecdote, my sister-in-law was doing IUI last fall. She finally got a positive in November, but then had very low HCG levels for several weeks. She went through all kinds of hell trying to figure out what it was--the doctors were fairly sure it was ectopic. Happily she wound up being fine and is due in August.

Something else I'm wondering--are you sure the doctors aren't saying "3 weeks" as in "3 weeks from conception exactly?" I know they normally figure from the date of last period, but maybe they mean exactly 3? Because if she ovulated around the 19th or 20th, and it didn't implant for another week...the numbers probably wouldn't be too far off. I'm sure you've already thought of that and I'm just misreading it but I thought I'd put it out there in case.

ScottK
Jun 28, 2006

Aardvarklet posted:

Something else I'm wondering--are you sure the doctors aren't saying "3 weeks" as in "3 weeks from conception exactly?" I know they normally figure from the date of last period, but maybe they mean exactly 3? Because if she ovulated around the 19th or 20th, and it didn't implant for another week...the numbers probably wouldn't be too far off. I'm sure you've already thought of that and I'm just misreading it but I thought I'd put it out there in case.
Yea, we thought of that, and that does make it more confusing. But according to the charts that we looked up online it appears that they are basically saying that the HCG levels are lower than they should be.

Anyway, while waiting on pins and needles to hear from my wife after she heard from the doctor's office, she just called and let me know that somehow her blood sample "didn't get dropped off" so we get to wait another loving day on the results.

Papaya
Apr 4, 2005

I'm a creepy furry who feels entitled to other people's babies, but only if they are white. Yiff!

SKeefe posted:

Trying to get pregnant sucks. When you look around and see babies everywhere, especially people who have unwanted and unplanned children, it seems like it is so easy to get pregnant. It sucks for us though.

My sister can sneeze and get pregnant (she's got 4 kids and finally got her tubes tied) and my brother and his wife just had their first, and pretty much everyone that I went to school with (married or not) has a minimum of one child by now, ugh. And one of my exes just posted pics on his facebook of his son's 6th birthday party... I remember holding that kid when he was 9 months old (dating divorced men with kids can be both fun and drama, I don't recommend it) and I was there for his first steps and damnit he even called me mom once.

I feel so left out :( At my most angry and depressed moments I'm even mad at my husband but it's not his fault he got cancer and wound up infertile. That's just silly.

jennyinstereo
Jan 17, 2007

[rocking faces since the 80s]

Papaya posted:

My sister can sneeze and get pregnant

My sister didn't even think she could get pregnant and then she meets this guy... they've been dating 2 months and she's pregnant with his kid. They're happy, and want it but man... it's so interesting how I've been following the pregnancy thread for FOREVER and planning, researching, taking prenatals, etc. and she gets pregnant out of nowhere without even trying. I hope I'm that lucky when I start trying.

CrankyProf
Apr 22, 2008

by angerbotSD

qentiox posted:

I just wanted to say that we used Natural Family Planning for both contraception and conception, and it worked well in our case; we got pregnant twice in the span of 3 months. We didn't use the thermometer though, just the cervical mucus checks.

Good luck to everyone trying!

My husband and I had the same experience, though I charted my temp. I also found a computer program called OvuSoft that helped keep track of all the things you're supposed to chart.

pirate the dog
May 12, 2009
What great timing for this thread. I just came back to the forums after a long period of inactivity and registered a new account in order to post a thread about teaching in ask / tell. On Tuesday my wife and I decided that we're going to start trying to conceive in the very near future. I appreciate the links and advice that have been posted so far.

inaniloquent
Apr 7, 2007

Je suis génie.

Google Embryo posted:

There's pretty much no way to accidentally end up with 6 babies. Those women who end up with a ton of kids at once knew what they were doing and they had a choice, and I'm not even talking about "selective reduction" (aka abort a few).

If you're at the point where you need fertility drugs to get pregnant, you are monitored very closely via ultrasound. You go in for these ultrasounds every few days to check the status of your follicles and see if any are ready for ovulation. Some women even have to go so far as to take a shot that triggers ovulation because their body won't do it on its own. If you're going in for these ultrasounds, you know exactly how many follicles have the potential to ovulate, so if you see 6 mature follicles up on that screen, you can potentially get pregnant with 6 babies. Fertility doctors don't WANT you to get pregnant with 6 babies, it's a tremendous physical strain on the mother and children with high risks for premature birth, and even maternal or fetal death. Most responsible individuals will drop the cycle before they even have a chance to get impregnated. They'll ovulate, but abstain from sex and just end up with a regular period.

I've been in this position, it was horrible to throw away all that money we'd spent on a cycle, but it was the responsible thing to do. I'm not willing to risk my children's lives that way, if one of them was stillborn or born with horrible issues, I would never forgive myself because it would BE 100% MY FAULT. However, some women are so desperate, both financially and emotionally, they go through with it anyway. Hence, the Jon & Kate Plus Eight's etc etc...

Thank you so much for your answer. I'm not ready for kids myself yet, but I can't deny that the whole process is fascinating.

Crabsurd
Dec 19, 2006

SKeefe posted:

Trying to get pregnant sucks. When you look around and see babies everywhere, especially people who have unwanted and unplanned children, it seems like it is so easy to get pregnant. It sucks for us though.

This is the worst. I see those shows about fourteen year old mothers and they make me all :argh: :( :cry:

It's so bad, when characters in TV shows/movies find out they are pregnant, I get sniffly. I feel CRAZY. They're not even real people!

ScottK
Jun 28, 2006

SKeefe posted:

Tuesday we got the results and her HCG levels were 249,
Well we just found out that the levels have only gone up to 275 so it looks like it's just a loving matter of time.

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

I Wish I Was posted:

Posted in the pregnancy thread, but I thought I should keep an eye on this one as well since I'll be visiting it someday for realsies. I'll also likely learn some things that will come in handy when we do start trying.

I'm 36 and my boyfriend is 33, and we're probably going to try having kids at the beginning of next year. Right now I'm trying to do all the stuff you have to do before getting pregnant, like lose weight, quit smoking, get in better cardiovascular shape, and all that jazz.

Anyone else in here of "advanced maternal age" like me? I know it comes with its own set of challenges.

My mother had me at the age of 38, and I was the second try because the first baby didn't have a spine. And I still had spina bifida occulta. Apparently the risk of defects increases past some age. That being said, I think being a "later" mother is a great idea because of the extra stability and maturity it offers. So good luck!

Lady googooGaGa
Nov 3, 2006

Are you freaking kidding me!?

SKeefe posted:

Well we just found out that the levels have only gone up to 275 so it looks like it's just a loving matter of time.

I'm really, really sorry. I know that probably seems like nothing compared to what you guys are feeling, but I really am. You'll get there, don't give up.

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Aardvarklet
Aug 12, 2008

SKeefe posted:

Well we just found out that the levels have only gone up to 275 so it looks like it's just a loving matter of time.

Man, I'm really sorry. Don't know what else to say.

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