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Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Ur Getting Fatter posted:

So once Win7 is released, is Ultimate going to have any deal-breaking features other than VHD booting and MUI, that will not be available in Professional?

I don't think anything has been announced at all, other than Bitlocker being a Ultimate exclusive. I vaguely remember hearing that language packs will be available for versions other than Ultimate, just at a additional charge but I can't find it. No idea on VHD booting.

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Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

queztal posted:

Has this just been the case since Microsoft got their hands on it? Worked fine for everything when it was owned by Connectix.

It still works just fine. The only thing that's changed is that Linux isn't fully supported. You'll have to make your own profile, which most people using it probably will do anyways, and if you call them they give very basic info on it, none really useful at all really.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

LoKout posted:

I'm not trying to argue or anything, but my source is directly from Microsoft's partner marketing website. I realize they're trying to push Home Premium as the primary version for home users, which makes sense, but they aren't going to be offering Pro for home users at all. They expect them to go with either Premium or Ultimate. I don't care what the "blogs" say. Pro will be the suggested and highly marketed version for the corporate user.

This marketing campaign will be much more like the XP days, when they tried to push Home for consumers and Pro for corporations. That ended up not going over very well because Home was crippled pretty bad in a few places and people became comfortable with Pro. In this case, they didn't remove that many features from Premium.

No, what happened was that people didn't like the fact that they had to buy a new OS just to get their home PC to connect to their corporate network. That's why Upgrade Anytime was created. The only problem with the Vista implementation was that if they were running Home Premium upgrading to Professional made them lose home features, so the only logical upgrade was Ultimate, which most people balked at, and as I mentioned in the previous thread most didn't' get the concept of just paying all that money for a new key.

Pro has always just been marketed for the corporate user. the only difference this time is that they figure enthusiasts will want Ultimate over Pro and those two are what their marketing campaign will promote. They can't completely eliminate Pro from the consumer marketplace as there will always be users who use their home PC to connect to their work's environment. It will be highly doubtful that you'll see all three SKUs sold everywhere, but I'm pretty sure Best Buy, Microcenter and so forth will have copies of Pro available for systems if people want it.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

DarthBlingBling posted:

I have the same drive I believe. I recently watched Terminator 2 on HD DVD on Windows 7 x64 using the Arcsoft player. However I am also using Slysoft's AnyDVD HD.

I also noted that I was able to watch the film on a cloned display (the film displayed on both displays), in the past this wasn't possible and only played on the monitor marked as the main display. Google led me to believe this was due to restrictions. Has this now changed or is it something Slysoft has recently got around?

This is actually an improvement that happened in Vista. The problem you likely were having before was due to Arcsoft player using overlay which is hardware limited to the primary monitor in XP. (there are cards can do it on secondary but they are rare) Secondary monitors either tried to display in software, or just refused to show it at all. however since the GUI is hardware accelerated in Vista/7 this largely eliminates the problem there as Overlay is depreciated unless something triggers aero and/or desktop composition to disable for compatibility or memory issues. This isn't to say that you won't have problems playing video on the secondary monitor ever, but it largely is a driver or hardware issue today than a windows limitation.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?
If I recall correctly, the 'next-generation' plugin, while it will work with Firefox 3, is actually optimized for 3.1 which was supposed to be done when the last version of Java was finished. We all know what happened there however. I do know another thing to look for is the quick starter, which isn't supposed to enable in Vista as it can conflict with windows prefetch.

Anyhow, if you don't mind betas you can try SE 6 update 14 here. Its slated for release some time in the 2nd quarter. https://jdk6.dev.java.net/6uNea.html#DOWNLOAD

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

hobb posted:

Does anyone have problems with the flat panel scaling options with a nvidia graphics card? When I try to tic any of the other radio buttons listed, after I hit apply it always reverts back to use my displays built-in scaling.

I'm using the 185.85 drivers and a 7950 GX2.

It's something about that driver. I have similar with my TV. It can do 24hz and no matter what the driver wants to put it in 24hz. It doesn't matter how I set it, if I reboot or turn off the monitor the next time its up it detects it as a new set and thinks 24hz is optimal. It also used to change the resolution to a weird resolution (1777x860 or something like that) but at least I was able to stop that.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?
Its minor, but since I rarely use it I just now ran into it. What is everyone using to capture images from a webcam? In Vista and XP it showed up in my computer but I can't find it anywhere in 7. Yes I did verify that it is installed.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

The Wonder Weapon posted:

I don't suppose w7 has a built in virtual drive manager like daemon tools, does it?

Virtual Clone Drive works as well. I started using it instead of daemon tools months ago and haven't regretted it yet

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?
Wall Street Journal is reporting that 7 will be released October 22nd.

http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20090602-711873.html

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

jeeves posted:

RTM comes out monday.


So I am curious, with the Release To Manufacturers version being released-- how will the betas and such work? Do they expire once the full Win7 public release occurs, or such? Also, folks that download the RTM-- will they work until the release as well, using the beta keys?

the RTM will not be released. it will be available for manufactures, and will be made into retail copies, but that's it. RTM is just the same as saying "gold", the final copy. Beta 1 is already rebooting every two hours, and RC1 will be fine until March 1, 2010 when it will start rebooting every two hours as well.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?
Remember with OEM versions, it really is supposed to follow the hardware it's installed on. No major upgrades and keeping the same install, even if the upgrade is replacing damaged hardware. It also does not have phone support if that's important to you.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Unexpected EOF posted:

Really? I've called MS after major system upgrades for OEM versions plenty of times.

Yep. They are not supposed to, but that is how the license reads and is probably the reason why a call is triggered. But those are the two main reasons why they say that they can offer the OEM software for cheaper than retail.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Parachute Underwear posted:

What exactly does this mean for pre-built computers? My rig came with the same revert-to-factory-settings drive most pre-builts have. I used the software that came with it to burn a DVD version of the image. What'll happen if I end up wanting to reformat after having upgraded to 7? Will I need to stick use my DVDs to revert back to Vista and then be able to re-upgrade without issue?

The main things I'm worried is what happens to your key/activation when you revert back to factory settings, how that's affected by upgrading the OS, if it'll be activated upon reverting as well as if I'll need to call up Microsoft every time I re-upgrade to 7 after going back to Vista for a "format".

Gah, this is turning out into more of a hassle than I figured, I should've just built my own and went with an OEM copy like I always do. :(

You could A) install your image, and then reinstall 7. or B) find a OEM copy of Vista suitable for your system and install with your systems existing key, and install 7. If you do A then you shouldn't have to ever worry about activation since it usually uses bios information to verify itself. With 7 installed it will revert to the standard way that normal systems uses, checking the existence of various parts of the machine.

Something tells me that the old trick that worked in Vista will work in 7 as well. That was install the OS once without entering the key and then reinstall entering your key and choosing custom install.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Xachariah posted:

Since when did being annoyed become being mad? But yeah, I guess I am a lil' annoyed that their regular release schedule is so short.

Sorry for having a differing opinion? :ohdear:

It's not that its just its been said before. "See! Vista sucks because they are rushing to get 7 out!" Microsoft has been trying to go to a three year schedule for years and SP2 for XP severely threw them off track. They aren't expecting people to upgrade to every single one. One would be the major OS and the other is a minor incremental release. About the only thing people can really argue is that in Vista/7's case the Major/Minor instance may have been reversed.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

keratas posted:

Does anyone know Microsoft's stance on purchasing full retail (non-OEM) copies of Vista on places like ebay and then applying for the upgrade? They state you need to buy it at retail but how do they work out if it's an ebay store or a private small-scale local seller?

They will tell you to take it up with the seller as the copies of 7 do not come directly from them. Every company is different. Most are doing it for free, but some want money for shipping and handling, and others will say let you upgrade from Vista Home Premium to 7 Professional for an additional charge. Don't count on a private seller to have the agreement in place to give you the upgrade unless you get it in writing.

edit: The only thing that MS does is give the company credit for new licenses in exchange for doing the program. In general these rebates are treated like mail in rebates, less than 10% are completed.

Ryokurin fucked around with this message at 13:40 on Jul 14, 2009

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Death of Rats posted:

Does anyone know if Windows 7 will be region locked? I may end up importing it from somewhere, 'cause the EU prices are prohibitive.

Unlikely, but you may have a problem with localization in some areas. Support for different regions and languages is Ultimate only, so you may get it and then figure out you can't say change the way the OS handles time and dates to the European standard.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?
The deal is now available in the UK. http://www.microsoft.com/uk/windows/buy/offers/pre-order.aspx July 15th to 9th August 2009

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

ilkhan posted:

I run 3 comps (albeit ones a laptop which will have 7 natively) as well.

Depending on pricing, technet could be a better option.

I wish they offered it for Pro, but then again I understand why they wouldn't (it would prompt small business to buy that instead of proper licenses) My main PC and my laptop require it as I use them to VPN into work. what I'll probably end up doing is having 7 on my main PC, keeping the RC on my laptop for a while and upgrading my HTPC to home whenever there's a good enough reason to. I probably would have upgraded them all in one shot if it wasn't for the fact that I need to fund a 7 upgrade and a new PC for my sis, as well as myself.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Vulcan posted:

Whats with Windows 7 jacking a 100MB partition without my consent!? How dare it ruin my perfect partition configuration >.<

The space is reserved to allow you to convert the drive for bitlocker later on and for the windows recovery environment. There were similar reasons why XP always liked leaving 8mb free on the drive as well.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?
multiple disc drives? try the other drive if so. I've had systems that only tried one, or systems that tried all the optical drives on the system before moving on. You can also put it on a thumb drive and try that way as well, after setting it as a bootable device in the bios

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Rev. Bleech_ posted:

So is there any reason not to just grab Windows 7 via a TechNet subscription, other than Microsoft's "please stop using this when your membership expires" thing? Me and a friend both have multiple machines we'd like to upgrade, and splitting a TechNet membership with him is a hell of a lot cheaper than buying four or five seperate full copies.

only 10 activations.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

wang souffle posted:

Does anyone know if the AMD Dual Core Optimizer is still recommended? I thought it was only needed in XP, but now I'm reading random things that recommend it for Vista & 7.

Not needed. it just specifically fixed a timing issue in XP that could slow some programs down. I believe in Vista and 7 the only thing is really does is make sure the processor drivers are up to date which Microsoft periodically send updates for in windows update anyways.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Mogomra posted:

I've actually been using a version from before they started charging for it, but I'll gladly lay down the money if it definitely plays nice with Windows 7. Thanks!

Since you didn't say you were using it, I'm just going to throw it out there. don't use windows media player to play the files if you are, because it will try to use the built in mediafoundation codecs over what you have installed. Other players will use directshow instead. You still should go ahead and buy the newer codecs however. That old one has graphical glitches and other problems, and as long as you have a recent Nvidia card you have CUDA acceleration.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

scarymonkey posted:

He'll also need to take ownership of the msmpeg2vdec.dll file and rename it so the Microsoft codecs don't take precedence over CoreAVC, more info here:
http://forum.corecodec.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1917

That works, but you may end up breaking acceleration of those formats over remote desktop and a few other programs. There is a utility that works and shouldn't throw off any other programs that require mediafoundation in the process. http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=146910&highlight=windows+7

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Shmoogy posted:

I tried running this earlier and it said my system didn't have hardware virtualization enabled while it (should) have it. I just ended up running Sun VirtualBox and it's working well enough.


http://www.grc.com/securable.htm run that and it will tell you for sure.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Factor Mystic posted:

Home Basic/Premium can't do an in place upgrade to Pro? Really? Both can upgrade to Ultimate. I wonder why that is.

It can. It's just that the matrix Microsoft made really is confusing. Ed Bott made one that you can read in 10 seconds and don't even have to scroll the page to read.

http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=1246

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

PirateBob posted:

I think LCD monitors run at 59.94 hz anyway...
so whether it says 59 or 60 hz is irrelevant. Forget about it.

It's for color NTSC compatibility, and as you said, essentially the same thing. If windows is forcing 59hz, its probably is because it believes the monitor is a TV set.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Rev. Bleech_ posted:

Half the reason most people who hated Vista and DID try it was because anything new or different in the computing world, in Windows especially, is greeted with hatred and scorn. See also the complete and utter shitfits everyone I know had over the Ribbon interface in Office 2007.

:confused: What's the problem? The organization makes a lot more sense than a bunch of random dinky unintuitive buttons
:cry: BAWWWW I KNEW WHERE EVERYTHING WAS IN 2003, THIS loving SUCKS
:confused: But...it makes sense. It's like a drawer full of neatly labelled files to 97-03's shoebox full of junk
:cry: I FEAR CHANGE, AND I SHALL KEEP MY SHOEBOX

I liked Vista alot, to the point where I didn't even complain about buying it for a ridiculous sum, but Win7 really does slap the poo poo out of it for me.

Pretty much. I just came from a IT professional group and one guy had to make the comment during one of the sessions on how it the ribbon takes up a lot of space, and the speaker brought up how you can hide pretty much all of it by doing Ctrl-F1 and the guy still tried to play it off as "well, it still is irritating" The instructor just dropped it by saying "if you still have a problem, you probably want to contact the office team before 2010 is finished." but the guy still had that :downswords: look like he just embarrassed the instructor into saying the ribbon actually sucks.

BTW, if any of you guys are signed up for "the New efficiency" meetings, they are giving you 7 Ultimate, not Pro, which is a nice surprise.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

deviant. posted:

I haven't been following the thread, so my apologies if this has been covered already :v:

I've been running Build 7100 on an Asus M2NPV-VM motherboard which has an NForce 430 chipset. Win7 works fine except for hinky sleep behavior (doesn't always sleep the first time, have to unplug and replug USB devices sometimes on wake). It also seems to "forget" certain settings such as mouse speed when restarted. Neither of these behaviors are present in XP SP3.

Has anyone else figured this out or do we just wait for retail?

There were reports that a lot of sleep issues in the RC was fixed in the final but it's impossible to say for sure if it will fix it. What you can do for right now is go to a elevated command prompt and type in "powercfg –energy" to see if sees any problems. This is a good document on what powercfg can do. Warning Word document link. http://download.microsoft.com/download/7/E/7/7E7662CF-CBEA-470B-A97E-CE7CE0D98DC2/PowerCfg.docx

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Morphal posted:

Oh cool, that's good news for me because I might actually use one of the Ultimate-only features. I've been learning a little Brazilian Portuguese and I thought it might be fun to be able to switch my interface language back and forth. :)

Also, I'm going to the event in Kansas City, MO on November 4th. Out of curiosity, did you guys get the retail-type box and stuff, or just a disc in a sleeve or something? And if you've installed it already, did you install the 32-bit version from the disc, or did you get 64-bit media from elsewhere to install the 64-bit version? I'll probably just install my copy on my laptop (which only has a 32-bit CPU anyway), but I'm just wondering if I'll have the option to install the 64-bit OS instead on a different computer if I change my mind about that.


They give OEM copies at shows like these, and it's listed on the back of the sleeve, "Contains 32 and/or 64-bit software" the one I received was 32-bit only, but if its like Vista the key should be interchangeable so I'm just going to use a 64-bit CD from my purchased copies when I'm ready to build.

I was planning on installing it on a HTPC yesterday, but I'm just going to hold off and keep this for a PC I plan on building next month and install the retail version of professional on the HTPC later, if not just keep Vista on it as I don't use MCE.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

krushgroove posted:

just wondering if anyone knows:

tl;dr
1) does the price for new MS OS's (full version) historically rise from the intro price, or do folks think the price will stay the same?
2) does anyone know if the price to upgrade from RC1 will be cheaper than buying the full version, come June 2010?

Price stays the same throughout life.


You should format and install the final fresh, although there is a way to force a upgrade (sorry you'll have to read the thread to find it) upgrades are cheaper than full, but upgrades require you have previous software installed and authenticated first.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Lenins Potato posted:

This even has the same engine as Forefront, which has been recommended in the past.

I find it funny how Symantec and McAfee immediately started making GBS threads on it saying "you get what you pay for" and such. That may be true, but they definitely aren't the ones who have the right to say it. If their programs doesn't miss a threat, then it slows the system down. If it doesn't slow down, then it breaks compatibility. If it doesn't do that then it nags or locks down systems without warning. Almost everyone has forgotten how to be minimalistic and only get in the way when there really is something going on.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Cojawfee posted:

I meant you need a license for whatever OS you are running. So if you are wanting to run any Windows versions, you need a license for it.

Yep. A lot of people don't realize that VLK key's are NOT site licenses. They are meant as upgrades for existing licenses. They threw a bone by including a XP license for Professional users, but on other systems it's going to make a already tedious license compliance procedure even more complicated.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

brc64 posted:

Also, I was under the vague impression that the only reason they even charged for antivirus in the past was because all of the other AV manufacturer would cry antitrust. Why isn't that happening now? (Not that I mind.. I'll always take free over not free when it's a viable option)

Not included with windows, and others provide it for free. And since everyone has crowed about what extra they offer, MS could use that against them, and they have stated they are targeting the people who won't pay for or does not have antivirus so unlike the Dos 6 MSAV day's I don't think anyone has a good leg to stand on.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Josh Lyman posted:

Is there any reason to use AnyConnect over the built in 7x64 VPN tool? Cost is a non-issue.

If the built in client works for you, then go ahead and use it. However there are some benefits of going to a SSL VPN such as allowing limited access to resources via any modern browser, and it basically eliminates IP management issues that can happen over IPSEC.

Where I work we ran into a similar issue, so we are just converting over to Juniper equipment instead. I don't know the hardware, but its kind of set up as a SSL/IPSEC hybrid. Much better than Cisco IMHO.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Yaos posted:

For the OEM version you can buy yourself will they be using Activation to see if you've installed it on a different computer, or will just not care and ask nicely not to do it?

all versions have product activation. And OEM software is not transferable, even if the old machine is destroyed.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Swilo posted:

IE does it just fine, unless you meant strictly third party products. I'd expect Firefox to get it before the official launch date, maybe a little after, but you know it has to be coming.

I don't believe it will be out until 3.7 along with the other 7 UI changes and that won't be out until the spring. Jumplists are available now in a mindfield build just released. http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/10/05/firefox-3-7-now-with-windows-7-jumplist-support/

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?
If you are having trouble just getting the client installed in 7 32-bit due to bluescreens this is what I did in the RCs and it should work in the final.

1. Install Citrix DNEupdate. http://www.citrix.com/lang/English/lp/lp_1680845.asp
2. Reboot
3. Take ownership and delete ndis.sys (in c:\windows\system32\drivers).
4. Take ownership and delete ndis.sys.mui (in c:\windows\system32\drivers\en-us).
5. Install Cisco VPN Client 5.0.04.0300 or better
6. Reboot
7. Windows 7 will repair itself (should take a few seconds) and automatically reboot. after that it should work.

That's my problem with the Cisco client. it seems to replace system files that it has no business changing, if you mess with your network settings you'll likely need to reinstall the client again and on and on. I'm glad we are finally getting rid of it.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?
granted the laptop will never be a server, but with terminal server 2003 using the 32 bit version in a 64 bit OS increased the amount of users you could have on the machine due to the benefits you got in memory usage. I'm just bringing this up to show how a 64-bit OS can help 32-bit program performance sometimes.

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Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

Sad Panda posted:

Is there an equivalent to Bootvis that works on Windows 7? I tried running Bootvis and it won't work as it's made for XP.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/performance/default.aspx

It provides some of the same graphical logs of boot but the majority of optimizations are built into vista/7 and it adjusts on the fly. Just use it to see if a driver is causing a delay so you can update it to see if it fixes it.

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