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So, first time Shadowrun player here, which means I've started out with 4th Ed (although I did read a couple of the old Shadowrun novels many years ago and loved them to death, especially Black Madonna). I have yet to play, but there's a chance I can participate in Grey Hunters game, so here's hoping  I'm loving all of 4th ed, although I have two gripes, and I hope some of you veterans can help me come to grips: 1) The versatility. Between bionano borg clades, full-body cyborgs, a zillion kinds of hacker/technomancer tricks, magical traditions and semisentient paranormal animals, how do you plan a scenario, let alone a campaign? It would seem that there are so many ways to solve one challenge (and as many ways to counteract the runners attempt), that I can't see players survive for long in a place like, say, Seattle with a competent game master focusing on reality. I know the answer is to wing it and apply the groups you want to with the relevant themes and technologies/traditions you want to play, but it still seems like a really hard setting to ever fully learn. 2) Matrix rules. I've rolled up a samurai/hacker for the aforementioned game, and then went to town with "the wireless world" chapter, and gently caress was I stumped. How does a normal hacking action play out, and is it possible to integrate a hacker in a game without going totally nuts or getting bogged down? (and yeah, I know some of this is already covered. Sorry for asking again, but you are discussing it in a bit of an in-crowd manner for a n00b like me) Thanks in advance Shadowgoons! Tias fucked around with this message at 10:41 on Jul 24, 2009 |
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Jul 24, 2009 10:31
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| # ¿ May 15, 2024 19:41 |
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Aw poo poo  Thanks, I guess it helps to keep things in perspective!
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Jul 24, 2009 10:50
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Seriously though (pardon the thread necromancy), but shouldn't we try to make a "4e Matrix use for dummies" of some kind? It's such an integral part of the game, there must be an easier way to process it - I bought Unwired, but I don't feel like I've become much wiser for it
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Jul 27, 2009 15:25
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The General posted:If I get a chance this week, I'll write one up. Condensed rules and important parts. Until then I offer the condensed tl;dr version. Yeah, that's my opinion as well, but I might be GM'ing a game, and I feel I owe it to players to let them deck, there's a lot of fun to miss out on. If it's really as hard as I think, perhaps we could work out some simplified house rules. Great man, please do it, it'd be a great help, and I'll assist as well as I can if Unwired mentions something we can use. Tias fucked around with this message at 13:40 on Jul 28, 2009 |
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Jul 28, 2009 12:25
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So, are there any good fan-made resources online for things like gear, programs and the like?
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Jul 28, 2009 14:08
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Hotdog In A Hallway posted:True. I like my games to be kind of like an action movie, whereas most Shadowrun GMs either choose Pink Mohawk or Ice Cold Pro. What do the terms Pink Mohawk and Ice Cold Pro mean? The General posted:We have different ideas on how to run a game Speaking of you, would you like to attempt writing that matrix rules for dummies? I'll help out as best I can!
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Jul 31, 2009 13:49
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The General posted:I didn't get a chance this week as I had to read Tribe 8 books for a game I'm starting up. This weekend is a long weekend and I plan on being drunk from the moment I get off work saturday morning until sometime monday morning. Check mang  I have the busiest vacation in the world (activist), but I'll do my best to be here.
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Aug 3, 2009 02:29
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This is all great stuff. I still am not sure how the Matrix works, though.
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Aug 3, 2009 17:15
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Well, specifically I'm having trouble understanding how Matrix combat works. Is it merely Attack program vs, er, Firewall(?), back and forth until one part is fried or dumps out? Then, whether one uses hot sim or specific black programs determines if it's real damage or integrity damage, yes? Also, I'm having trouble as a gamemaster knowing when to use specific programs. It would seem that most of the things one would like to do as a hacker (unlock a safe, crack a drone, pick some specific data out of a dbase etc.) is covered by the Exploit program, is this correctly guessed? Also, if anyone wants to do some PbP Shadowrun 4E here on SA, let me know. It'd be awesome as a learning experience.
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Aug 3, 2009 17:35
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Both playing or running the game is fine with me, but potential players must be understanding of the fact that I will make a gently caress-ton of errors if I run it. Also, thanks for the file Pierre, you're the man <3
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Aug 3, 2009 18:40
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I'm awed at the amount of interest, but it feels incredibly intimidating to GM with a system with so many rules - I've never been a rules-oriented person, preferring the storytelling system, but I do have a couple scenarios written up I would be willing to run if people can bear with a lot of fuckups. If people are not (and that is totally understandable), I should like PierretheMime to GM, as he really seems like he has his poo poo together. McGravin>> That was awesome, thanks!
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Aug 3, 2009 19:28
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Aye. And I am still up for gamemastering, if you are okay with it. I will warn all-comers that it will be a pretty strange scenario and setting, however.
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Aug 3, 2009 22:51
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Pierre>> I'm going low-drama/low-tech, so the group will mainly need "generic" street rogues who can handle guns, electronics, cars and facework. Riggers, technomancers, mages and the like are optional and definitely not necessary, but will provide an extra edge if you have them. McG>> Well, usually people drop off, so it's cool that you're up for it. The game will start in two weeks, and I have a mind to set it in either Germany or Denmark. It is definitely allowable to play a foreign 'Runner if you are all from the states or a far part of Europe or Asia.
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Aug 3, 2009 23:51
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The General posted:I know poo poo all about anywhere but Seattle. So I guess I'll be a foreigner. Bonus points because I can easily work it in to my idea. Cool that Just keep in mind that your character will either be a persecuted illegal (if SINless), or registered with either Mærsk Incorporated Assets or Saeder-Krupp (if a SINer, and this can both open some doors or close a lot of others).
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Aug 4, 2009 01:15
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Yeah, sure, we'll help you out. The 4th ed Anniversary edition has a nicely comprehensive character creation section if you have it or can borrow it. All character metatypes and 'classes' are in principle permitted, but I'd like it to be a n00bfest, and am thinking of capping you at 360 BP. Tias fucked around with this message at 10:01 on Aug 4, 2009 |
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Aug 4, 2009 09:58
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Game thread is up: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3181647 - Get your chromed-up asses in there and post some characters!
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Aug 4, 2009 11:57
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Would McGravin please pop by our 4E game thread? If you're still interested, that is. It's here: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3181647 Edit: In the interest of continuity I will let someone else have your spot if you don't sign in before next week. Tias fucked around with this message at 14:03 on Aug 5, 2009 |
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Aug 5, 2009 12:37
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The General>> Speaking as a punk rocker and cyberpunk fan of many years, I got to say it's not mutually exclusive. Science Fiction is full of psychopaths, skinheads, punks and other countercultural people who through sheer grit, creativity and lots of bloody-minded guts pull through and stick it to the enemy - and in the case of people with pink mohawks, the enemy is often people who work for multinational corporations.
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Aug 14, 2009 14:20
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Good thing you worked that out, then Why did you have to nuke stuff again?
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Aug 18, 2009 13:00
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Pierre>> Sounds epic. Where did the team procure the nuke?
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Aug 19, 2009 14:19
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So, running my first Shadowrun games, there is one thing I'm pondering how to handle: Paychecks. I have a model set up that looks functional, but I was wondering how other GMs handle it? What is a given job worth, and how does the reimbursement for a given level of challenge look, provided the team is not stiffed or overpaid by their employer?
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Aug 26, 2009 07:42
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Everyone with an AR-capable device turned on sees the matrix - as it is - in a given area. They see the same thing, unless we're talking something special like a complex AR-tag programmed only to respond to certain IDs or whatever. The most common setting is as a sort of HUD where you see nodes, tags, communications etc. as vibrant objects superimposed on your normal field of vision, although there's no reason you couldn't shut out your normal reason. Most people wanting to be that immersed, however, usually ditch AR and go for full virtual immersion by DNI or hitcher electrodes to the brain. You don't need 'bulky' equipment for AR, either. The most common way to access matrix with AR are AR-upgraded shades, goggles or cyber-eyes with an Image Link. If you don't have glasses/cybereyes/shade with AR capability, you can't see what's going on in the matrix. That's it, basically, ask if I was being unclear (also, check out "the wireless world" chapter in the rulebook for more comprehensive blurbs on the matrix, simsense and AR perception)
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Sep 10, 2009 19:58
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1) Well, a guy who can only shoot things well is not really at an advantage against anything but non-awakened/augmented characters. A security hacker could eject his clip from his rifle before he fires it, sabotage his scope or whatever. Mages or their spirit servants could detect him in the astral, alerting security drones or sensors to his location, and so on. I'm not saying you should do everything you can to make his life miserable, he's the hero after all, but he should have to put some effort into his ops if he doesn't want to be sniffed out. That's where working with his team becomes essential. 2) I'm assuming a high-rating bioware scanner could 'sniff' it out, but I don't see why you'd want to make him fall over that. Instead, try to make the people he outshines jealous or envious of him if you need to one up him. 3) If you don't want a character to have too high-level contacts, forbid them at character creation. That said, they are not all-powerful in any sense of the word. Even good friends will feel like they need something out of a relationship, so if his character mooches off the fixer he/she might resent the character. Also, even though the fixer would drat near give his/her life for the character at loyalty 6, it couldn't just keep giving him anything he needs, as the fixer's got to make a living as well. And, of course, the fixer could end up dead, although you'd have to compensate the character by giving him karma or other contacts amounting to the fixers rating in return. 4) I don't have the book here, but I believe the runner's companion has something about group lifestyles. Not sure though.
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Sep 28, 2009 19:12
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My tabletop players don't appreciate why they need runner aliases. While I brought up the obvious (notoriety), they don't dig it. What arguments could exist for using them?
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Oct 7, 2009 19:01
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I'll update it soon enough, just got life hitting me - GM'ing tabletop SR now, have another game and a CYOA, as well as getting a shitload of volunteer work. I promise I'll prioritize the game so I get back to the two weekly updates I said I'd make. And thanks, please keep them coming. They all agreed to get a nick, but it's good to have some ideas for when they slip.
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Oct 7, 2009 21:15
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GM'ing for my tabletop group today. Bloody hell is this game hard to run, rules-wise.
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Oct 14, 2009 18:44
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The Sekah posted:Good luck. I'd like to hear how it goes. Let us know. Not really a success IMHO. Three of the players (one was absent) either had played 3rd a loong time ago or had no experience with Shadowrun whatsoever. This didn't pose any problems as they were good players and avid readers, but jesus christ did the game get bogged down with looking up rules and rolling dice - my players are the type that will like to use all optional rules and learn them by heart, it's part of the fun for them, so I've decided to get a lot better acquainted with the rules so I can just tell them what to roll and get on with them. My own (lack of) experience meant that the antagonist on this run got served by the troll bounty hunter with burst-firing shotguns, when he was supposed to get away - Not too bad a loss, considering they want to hand him over to police, so I guess he can always be sprung and return a cybernetic monstrosity some other day. I'm beginning to get them somewhat turned on to the atmosphere, even though some of my players sort of are manchildren that will sometimes zero on something idiotic and inconsequential for fun - for instance, the social adept is also a collector of 20th century card games with a penchant for pokemon, but he plays it well and entertaining so no problem there, only one of the other players have taken it to mean everything in SR4 is campy anime poo poo and will rant on about how we should have a campaign in Japan, argh  Needed to vent, there. The enormity of the rules are basically what made parts of the game really boring, particularly when the drone rigger had to look up his rules or the hacker had to do something. I think it will get a lot better if I get a better handle on the rules till next time.
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Oct 15, 2009 13:23
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So it's tabletop day again, and my player pointed out something pretty interesting to me: How can a smartgun link (listed as an image modification) be used with a smartgun system "eject a clip by mental command"!? My common sense tells me this is done by comm-link, and both the artwork and descriptions of commlink use tells me that people use it without working it with their hands. So: Are commlinks wired directly to the brain with electrodes somehow?
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Oct 21, 2009 18:23
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Hey, I AM the GM here, and I don't want to make a players life hard - just trying to make sure I conform to general "hard" SR tech, as I like that sort of thing So the general consensus is that you CAN use a smartlink without getting a DNI or implanted commlink, for example by connecting your commlink to your head by trodes and going wireless, or jury-rigging your image link to accept eye gestures for the smartlink?
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Oct 22, 2009 15:29
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Young Freud posted:To add something to this discussion, I pretty sure, if not in Augmentation, then in previous books like Man & Machine and Cybertechnology, that Smartlinks are a spin-off technology from Simsense. I know that M&M has even a breakdown on how the Smartlink cyberware package works, including using a limited Simsense rig. So, if you can use a Simsense rig (or can't, because you bought that Simsense Sensitivity or Euphoria or whatever disadvantage), then you could use a smartgun link. So if you have a simsense rig you can smart-link? That makes sense. But having a "smartgun-only" image link brings up the whole dilemma again: How can you issue a "mental command" to eject a clip if the only connection to your gun is a pair of eye glasses with an image-link? It makes no sense, unless you let the glasses register som sort of eye gesture as a valid command.
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Oct 22, 2009 17:55
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Well, as long as it can be done with 'trodes I'm satisfied. It seems like needlessly invasive to NEED a DNI or implanted comm-link to control smartgun mechanisms.
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Oct 22, 2009 22:11
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MohawkSatan posted:This is true. Plus the bundles are great things. Save a bit of essence and money getting your basic cyber-gear in! I sort of hope my players will start posting, otherwise, I'm up for restarting!
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Oct 24, 2009 11:56
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The General posted:I'm being a bad player and was waiting for someone else to reply first :/ I'd encourage you to do so now, but I can't really run with one player. If you see Lighttigersoul online, try to ask if he's still in, then I'll email IP in the meantime.
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Oct 24, 2009 13:30
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Cool. Post away when you get around to it, then I'll update.
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Oct 25, 2009 19:44
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So, new game: What are good plots or game events you have experienced (or as GMs, written) when playing Shadowrun? I'm GM'ing a tabletop game set in Hamburg, and have some trouble fleshing out what I want to do. There is the city council, the shadow government, and a host of rad-groups and syndicates working with either the corps or the shadow govt. for control of the city. My current plot revolves around stealing the senate presidential chain, thus postponing the opening of the senate and letting corporate troops break up a series of government-supported strikes on their facilities. But I want to bring in even more mayhem, this whole pawn-in-corp/government war isn't, how do I put it, spicy enough. Any ideas are welcome!
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Oct 28, 2009 13:14
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I'm thinking that, seeing as the CYOA format works so well here on the forums, perhaps a Shadowrun CYOA featuring just one ice pro Shadowrunner against a runner city like Hong Kong or Seattle could be pretty interesting. Just let the players create whatever they want to, and then go from there with a covert ops, eco-shaman, drone rigger, mage or whatever - Shadowrun certainly has it's share of solo operatives, and perhaps that would make for a neater phase. I certainly love Ice Phisherman's Shadowrun CYOA, and was thinking in the same vein, just a bit more "hardcore" mission-solving inside the urban jungle. Also I've switched to playing rather than GM'ing in my tabletop game. I found the rules too hard to manage while keeping my players entertained, and I got to say that playing the game is fun as hell! Got to distract a horde of SWAT, blow a sewer to bits, shoot someone in the head and almost complete a run on top of it!
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Oct 29, 2009 18:55
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I'd like you to offer some advice for my weekly TT 4th ed. game: So for the tabletop game we're running I want to create a chronicle focusing on the power struggle in the city, between corps and government. What could be good runs, and how do I get the players entangled with a faction? Currently we have them stealing the senate's presidential chain for Saeder-Krupp, in order to postpone the opening ceremony and give the corp time to beat down a series of teamster strikes that the senate and connected rad-groups would support. How can I let the players know they work for Saeder-krupp, and what are good ways to get them to feel involved in the conflict? (only two PCs are native to the city it happens in).
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Oct 30, 2009 20:01
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They know their fixer is affiliated with S-K, but for some reason haven't made the intuitive leap and at least guessed at the corp being the employer. Crude intervention works I guess, but I was trying for subtler hints. The game is set in Hamburg, Germany. It's a corp-sceptic free city rulled by a senate, but in reality controlled by an "old men's council" of powerful movers and shakers. The senate is afilliated with rad-groups of all sorts (mainly extremist left wing and a few racist ones too), and the council is afiliated with shadowrunners. I'm trying to get the players to eventually decide if they are pro-govt or pro-corp, but am stumped for good ideas as to how to do it.
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Oct 30, 2009 20:52
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So on the subject of contacts: My co-GM killed off the team fixer, and now I have to create one or several new ones for the team. Thing is, how does this work with karma and build points? They have spent about 5 BP each on the now deceased dude after all, so I've decided to give them a new one for free. But if I want them to have several fixers, or obtain new contacts in general, how is that handled? I'm thinking they just "get lucky" and I give them contacts free of charge. After all, if I charged them karma for it, it would be a bit too harsh, don't you think?
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Nov 5, 2009 21:23
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| # ¿ May 15, 2024 19:41 |
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All good stuff, thanks. The next run is going to be keeping up with a bunch of fixers and choosing one to go with, I think. Also it's going to feature gangs a lot. Any of you know of good fiction or resources for cyberpunk gangs or gangs in general?
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Nov 9, 2009 23:26
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