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Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
A reconstructive algorithm is practically impossible. It wouldn't be able to discern between lost information and intended waveform/frequency content. The SBR algorithm, which "restores" high frequency content in MP3 and AAC, relies on sideband data to function.

Any function in an amp or playback device/software is probably just a multiband compressor.

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Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
The AAC codec is pretty good at masking artifacts, because it injects noise in the appropriate areas, to prevent ringing a la MP3.

At 128kbit, you'll have to deal with examples that break the codec to notice them casually on normal systems. Or you need headphones to make the artifacts out. That said, with the prevalence of compressed audio everywhere, it also remains to be seen if the effect isn't just a placebo (by knowing you're listening to compressed audio). I've had plenty examples in the past, where I thought the MP3 codec hosed up the sound, just to find out the original CD sounded the same.

--very late edit: Masking, not making.

Combat Pretzel fucked around with this message at 15:39 on Aug 2, 2012

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Yeah, I'd figure something like this. Your ear is getting hammered with less varying frequencies, since the psycho-acoustic model drops about everything it deems your ear or brain would not pick up anyway.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Homeopathic levels of purity.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Yeah, right, try to have a technical discussion about digital data transmission over at Head-Fi. They'll try to convince you that their quantum-adamantium fiber optic cables brighten the stereo image and bring deeper basses.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
I have seen stray videophiles before, doing the same shtick as the audiophile cable fetishists. Yeah, that 1000€ HDMI cable sure results in better colors...

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Every material on earth has a certain degree of elasticity. Unless you're overdriving your speakers like hell, the vibrations aren't going to shake the suspension materials apart, unless they degrade chemically (rot or whatever).

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
It's like a mechanical comb filter.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

Khablam posted:

Found this when looking up that electrosomething creme mentioned a few posts up
An electrical engineer should know how digital encodings work and that any actual random modification of bits would result in clicks and distortion, not a wider stereo image or whatever. He should be able to answer his own question, but woe the power of delusional group pressure (or whatever the correct term is).

--edit:
As far as lossy versus non-lossy goes, at certain bitrates and codec efficiency, it's a moot argument. If you'd do a delta of a FLAC and a 320kbit AAC file, you'd end up mostly with low-level white noise. Any other results in the delta happen due to frame size selection and alignment in the encoding process.

The white noise would be masked away in the psychoacoustics, and the frame alignment issues are in the millisecond range the ear can't discern in, anyway. Unless you intend to re-encode ALL your music every time a portable playback device comes with a newer generation audio codec, there's zero use in lossless archiving.

Actually, if you're listening to the compressed versions all the time, it may just be the actual version to you, anyway, with no need to keep an archival version. And considering how hosed up the masters are when they hit the markets (loudness wars), I think bit-perfect archiving is silly to begin with.

Combat Pretzel fucked around with this message at 13:25 on Nov 29, 2012

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
I like how they call Polyethylene "Polyolefin", just so it doesn't sound like the insulation is some cheap poo poo.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

jonathan posted:

We had a discussion about lossless playback somewhere In this thread or another, and a couple of us theorised that a lossy format could strip away a lot of high frequency phsychoacoustics that would actually make a track sound cleaner and less fatiguing than a "full range" track with very high frequency info. Were talking inaudible but still subconsciously perceptible stuff such as cymbal crash. This stuff is scientifically proven to have an effect on people and its usually in a negative way. The same can be said for below 20hz content.
If that's true, it's a plus.

But anyway, if the encodings are transparent, there's economically nothing gained by keeping bit-perfect FLACs. Because it's sure as hell a pain in the rear end, whenever I have to do a full backup of my poo poo, and it's only around 35GB of compressed music. It'd be 3-4x that in FLAC.

Transcoding into every new codec of the month is also silly. If the current contemporary codec did well/transparent enough, you can keep the file in that format. Says already enough that MP3 is still prevalent, even after AAC been made mainstream years ago thanks to Apple. Don't even begin hoping that CELT goes anywhere, IETF RFC or not. Vorbis didn't manage, either.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

piratepilates posted:

What's wrong with playing vinyl records, don't knock it :mad:
The fact that enough audiophiles hail vinyls as the be-all end-all audio carrier is loving hilarious.

As mentioned before, you're dragging a needle made of one of the hardest materials over plastic, degenerating and as such changing the record every play. And then, the way the groove is read varies with the flex of the cantilever and the amount of counterbalance. And lets not even go into preamps and the different ways the RIAA equalization curve is implemented. Or rather approximated, since different electrical implementations of an equalizer behave differently.

In short, it's a loving awful lovely medium.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

Detroit Q. Spider posted:

I've always said that if you want to argue for the superiority of analog you need to talk about 30 IPS tape. Most audiophiles would probably find it too sterile and clinical though.
That's what I don't get. If you're all about accurate reproduction, you'd want a linear response in every step from the recording session to the playback. Why else would they want to buy all this oxygen-free hyperpure bullshit, if they're actively loving with the source medium at various stages of the playback, anyway? Audiophiles are backwards retarded.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Warm is a silly term, it means poo poo all in in audio. For me it means richer in basses. It's a worthless term.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Moronic logic. If you know they sound extremely different, you know in which ways they sound different. As such, you should be able to discern between the two with, wait for it, just your ears!

But hey, one's got to justify silly buying decisions to himself.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Why the gently caress does it need four Westmere Xeon CPUs (makes most sense, 4x12MB L3 = ~50MB) and two high-end GPUs to serve apparently only music over a loving network or its audio output? Also, the CPUs are overclocked, I'm sure that generates RF noise as gently caress all over the place.

...actually, why am I even asking...

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Picture quality, too, eh? I'd really like to know how a completely digital chain (both software, i.e. decoding, and hardware, i.e. HDMI) towards your digital TV and panel is in any way influenced by that PSU. I am aware I won't get a proper answer, but some voodoo magic to laugh at would be nice.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Q-tips with gold fibers in the cotton.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

quote:

Formula: Highly purified (99,999%) non specified substance.
Distilled water! :v:

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Ask them to do... wait for it... a double blind test.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Learning that radio stations gently caress with the audio before it goes on air explains why most radio stations drive me up the wall with their sound quality.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Headphones are broken in in mere seconds. The components don't move enough to venture outside of the flex in the materials used. That said, beats headphones are targeted at the sort of kids that stuff a huge bass box into the boot of their first car. Sound quality isn't a priority here.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
With Monster's involvement, it should be clear that there's a huge gap between claim and fact. But the purpose of marketing in general is to sell apples as bananas. You'd think any halfwit would know this by now. But seeing the demography involved...

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
I love how the framerate in the video jitters like gently caress. As if his camcorder was like "FUUUUUUUUUUCK YOUUUUUUUUUUUU!"

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
The vinyl rotates at a specific constant speed. The vibrations picked up by the needle, which is in the cartridge at the top of the arm, going through the groove, make up the sound. The whole arm is just articulated to follow any warps in the vinyl.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

RoadCrewWorker posted:

Right, that's my point - the vinyl presumably has the recording on it in a constant angular velocity, and if it rotates at a constant speed the vertical deviations will change the speed of the needle on top of the material as the relative surface normal changes, resulting in a non-constant playback speed.
Must be an unusually warped record for it to be noticeable. An audiophile would be morally required to shred a record, if it ain't 110% level.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Which led me to this device. A "power conditioner"!

http://www.lessloss.com/firewall-p-196.html

Quoting the page itself:

quote:

No capacitors, no inductors, no resistors, no fuses, no diodes.
Which pretty much implied that a male and female power plug are connected by a simple wire.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
What's the irony with the turntable is that it has an Ortofon cartridge. That's a lowly common people brand, so what the gently caress!

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

jonathan posted:

Why do these insanely expensive listening room and million dollar home theater owners never post measurements?
Why are these idiots afraid of ABX tests? Same reason.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

Wasabi the J posted:

I'm thinking now I need to make a smear campaign on this guy, and start reselling copper audiophile tubing as wiring. Gon' be rich.
We tried extruding insulation on copper tubes for a customer. Unless your extrusion line is completely geometrically serial* for whatever impractical reason, have fun with that. Because it ended up in a comically bad catastrophe over here. Also, audiophiles dig our power cords for whatever reason. Knowing and actually seeing with what little care they're manufactured, I'm rather bewildered about that.

(*: As in no significant diversion-wheels. Just as an example, the extrusion line I work on has around 600 meters of copper in-flight at any given moment.)

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

BANME.sh posted:

There's an exploitation here that goes beyond regular audiophile bullshit.
Do us a favor and try to explain to them how digital transports function. Then tell us whether it's exploitation or just a continuation of their bullshitting.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
But it's high purity!

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

jonathan posted:

Actual measurably bad things.
You and your science!

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Accurately reproduced flaws are considered worse than flaws that get hosed up even more?

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

Iamthegibbons posted:

Is this as much bullshit as I suspect?
The lowest interface is Kernel Streaming, where you set the soundcard to a specific format (sampling rate, channels, bitdepth) and play your poo poo. That's bit-perfect.

On top of that you have WASAPI (WinMM in old rear end versions of Windows), which is a mixer through which all applications channel their audio via the different interfaces like DirectSound, WinMM, XAudio1/2, and so on, which sit on top of it. The WASAPI mixer operates at a set format (default is 44Khz, stereo, 16bit, but the user can change it). Anything being played in an application that doesn't match its sampling rate is going to be resampled, number of channels is going to be up-/downmixed. Application specific volume levels are applied, tho. WASAPI uses 32bit IEEE floats internally, which are then going to be dithered and converted to whatever bitdepth your output format is set to.

WASAPI has an exclusive mode, which is essentially a pass-through mode to KS, which lets you select a format and play your music bit-perfect. It doesn't do any resampling or channel mixing, nor apply volume changes to the data. It blocks any other audio.

If you're playing audio in the same format WASAPI is set to, the volume slider for your application is maxed and nothing else is playing, the audio should be bit-perfect, too, since WASAPI doesn't need to resample or mix channels. I doubt that going to IEEE floats and back to integers will involve any rounding errors.

--edit:
That said, I'm not sure about the resampling. I know for sure that it doesn't do that when recording audio. Playback, I don't know. Heard yes, back when WASAPI was introduced. Internet however says no.

Combat Pretzel fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Aug 26, 2013

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Digital streams are either fine, or broken (blocking, wrong vectors warping the image, etc.). There's nothing in-between.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
I count bit errors as broken, because it doesn't let the data decompress into what it is supposed to be. lovely SNR on analog means noise. lovely bits means corrupted macroblocks, wrong motion vectors, both creating broken frames. Which is an issue, considering that several successive frames will be reconstructed from motion vectors, smearing the broken image sections all over the place.

So technically, either a stream is correct or not. I guess the main point is however that a higher SNR, beyond a sufficient one to read a reliable stream, doesn't make more vivid, crisp or contrasty video. Signal fuckery may achieve that effect on an analog TV signal, but your digital decoder would just go ape poo poo and show a blank image.

That said digital TV, at least in Europe, is overcompressed to boot. Ringing everywhere.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

Khablam posted:

The connection was bit-perfect nearly all the time. I know this, because wary of the issues I ran MD5 checks on any large download.
Anything that runs on top of TCP, like HTTP, FTP and whatever else is usually used for downloads, is supposed to be bit-perfect, because it does checksums and requests retransmits if they fail. Bittorrent runs on UDP these days, which isn't checksummed in itself, but the Bittorrent protocol is based on chunks each with their own checksum. If a chunk fails to verify, it'll be rerequested, too.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!
Any effect, that employs any sort of feedback, changes its characteristics depending on sample rate (that goddamned unit delay). If you're running a single lowpass filter on a sound, you probably can do fine with oversampling, but if you have a whole filter chain, things may look different.

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Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

longview posted:

I used to get minor headaches from listening to music for too long without a crossfeed filter activated, it's not so much improving the soundstage so much as it's emulating a stereo speaker set in your headphones. IMO it should be implemented in hardware in a "proper" headphone amplifier, it's much more useful than the 6 dB bass boost that most amplifiers come with.
A lot of smartphones do that when they detect a headphone plugged in (apparently they can discern between headphones and aux), and audio gets crappy sideswipes on reviews because of that. Usually the stereo crosstalk goes from -90dB to -60dB when using headphones.

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