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Rusty Shackelford posted:That's the problem. Only one "insider" in the whole world has claimed that the 93,173 number isn't true while everyone else sticks with it. Even Silverdome.com (which is gone, like the stadium) said the number was 93,173. If the stadium held 80,000 for football and 90,000 for religious events (with a large stage area), why couldn't it hold 93,173 for wrestling? Fine, post a screen shot of the site. And he isn't the only insider who claims it, have you seriously not heard anyone else claim the figure is fudged? And do you find it that hard to believe it is fudged? In pro wrestling, a business this loving ridiculously sketchy? Even real sports teams fudge their attendence figures, for regular season games the Yankees would report the number of tickets sold if a bunch of people didn't show rather than the number of people in the building. PRIDE would fudge numbers for its events. It happens alot.
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Nov 5, 2009 03:45
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I should annoy Meltzer and get him to post a scan of the stuff Bresloff sent him because now I am really curious.
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Nov 5, 2009 04:07
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HHHH posted:Speaking of WM26, anyone ever see a wrestling event at a football stadium? I'm looking at the $150 range, which appears to be the cheapest floor tickets (i.e., back rows of the floor). Given the choice between back of the floor versus front of the lower level, which is better? Get the front of the lower level.
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Nov 5, 2009 06:45
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TL posted:I realize the NWA was in a bad way, but they couldn't possibly have done better than Dan Severn being their champion for four years? Who would have been better? Severn was the biggest name they could put the title on at the time who wasn't in WWF, WCW or ECW. Having the NWA title carried out on UFC PPVs like it was a legit championship was the highlight of the belt from the NWA/WCW split until... maybe now.
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Nov 5, 2009 22:57
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CubsWoo posted:Right, but the last match had the Puerto Rican Invaders go over in 4 minutes in a terrible match and based on the crowd reaction I don't think they were faces, or the crowd just didn't care. If I remember correctly, they didn't expect much from the Backlund/Sheik match, but it ended up getting over much better than they expected, to the point where they wanted to do a return match. But Hogan balked, since he was promised the belt in his first match in. So it may not have been the heel winning the belt so much as them having no faith in Backlund and Sheiky.
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Nov 13, 2009 09:07
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Raeg posted:If that is the case, won't the drop be lesser? If the had the same viewers as they had in 99/00, the rating would be smaller now due to more people being tracked as cable viewers, no? Yes, the drop is uch less than it appears. But overall there is still a drop with less kids, and less 18-35s watching now than then.
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Nov 16, 2009 05:32
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CombineThresher posted:JBL and Bob Holly probably don't like him, but they're both cunts so they might not count. Everything Lance has said about JBL makes it sound like they got along well in WWE.
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Nov 19, 2009 06:49
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Jerusalem posted:Didn't Flair like Mongo because he "lived the lifestyle"? Yeah, Flair thinks Mongo was an awesome Horseman because he acted, lived and partied like one. And considering he was in a stable with Benoit, Flair and Malenko, he could suck in the ring and who really cared? Some smarks.
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Nov 20, 2009 01:59
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The most recent Smackdown rating to come out was a 2.1 if anyone is wondering.
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Nov 20, 2009 09:16
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CombineThresher posted:Lance Storm is a pretty easy guy to book, provided you don't shoehorn every midcarder into a comedy gimmick the way WWE does. His UnAmericans phase got heat, as did the initial phase of his "Boring" gimmick, but then the writers had no idea what his strengths were and he floundered. The UnAmericans were going to be booked stronger, but two things derailed them. At MSG they were going to (not) burn the American flag and due to the parking situation they'd have to leave the arena surrounded by the public, so a guy backstage offered to pull their cars up to the building instead. They said sure as this would save them a lot of time as the garages were a pain, but when word got out, and the angle failed to get heat they got a reputation of being afraid to get heat. And around the same time Evolution started coming together and the heel stable of mostly mid carders lost the interest of the bookers.
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Nov 20, 2009 21:47
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sportsgenius86 posted:Lance Storm took wrestling too seriously. He was an amazing technician, but at some point, you've gotta have fun with it. He just seemed very business oriented 100000% of the time and you're never going to draw interest like that. His catch phrase was "If I can be serious for a moment." You don't think he was having fun with it? In the end, Lance was a family man who didn't drink or do drugs, so he wasn't a big time party animal. I've seen him be an energetic babyface, but he's much more interesting as a cold and calculating heel, since it plays more naturally. But in the end, he's a smaller guy who doesn't do drugs to make himself larger, and doesn't have a wacky personality to begin with. He knew he was never going to be a top guy, and was OK with it. And he still found time to goof off on spot shows or house shows. He just didn't do it on TV since that is unprofessional.
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Nov 21, 2009 01:40
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Supreme Allah posted:Lance Storm was just another in a long line of bland but technically-proficient understized Canadians that have no charisma and can't cut a promo or sell an angle to save their mid card careers. Nothing against the guy but I don't even see anyone trying the 'HE WAS BURIED' defense, and that says something. Claiming Lance can't sell an angle is bullshit. The rest is pretty true.
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Nov 21, 2009 02:08
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Brickhouse Betty posted:A regular DDT, no. But here's a lovely 2 minute MSPaint of the single arm DDT, the red guy is Jarrett and the black guy is the victim. The faces indicate that the victim is facing us, and Jarrett facing away. Yeah, but the single arm DDT looks nothing like a Rock Bottom other than the set up, kind of.
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Nov 21, 2009 10:10
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Brickhouse Betty posted:I dunno, maybe my drawing is terrible, maybe I'm remembering it wrong, maybe you're talking about good people doing good single arm DDTs. But I swear Jarrett's version looked about 90% like him Rock Bottoming himself. Whoops, I understand what you mean now. I think the lovely moves of today like Matt Morgan's Hellavator (AKA "I am going to DDT myself") make a move where the deliverer ends up on his back and his opponent goes chest first seem really legit. I just couldn't see how you thought Jarrett was getting hurt since he was landing on his back. But yeah, I've also seen a lot of ROH guys do it, especially doing a tornado version where it looks way different from a Rock Bottom to yourself, and looks like your opponent takes the impact.
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Nov 21, 2009 10:22
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Certain football positions are harder on the body than wrestling. There are some players from the 70s and 80s who are worse off than wrestlers from that era, and had a much shorter career than guys like Hogan who wrestled a safe style but did it for 25 years.
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Nov 27, 2009 22:54
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oldpainless posted:But doesn't he have to pay royalty fees to anyone who ever commentated then? What makes Jesse such a special case? Did he want like ten times as much as anyone else? Jesse sued Vince for royalties and won, so Vince doesn't like Jesse.
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Nov 27, 2009 23:11
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Violator posted:Is there any word on what HBK, HHH, Vince, etc think of Flair wrestling again? Around the retirement festivities, I remember everything being so sentimental between them all what with the ceremonies, Rolex watches, "I'll never wrestle again out of respect for HBK" talk, etc. Now with Flair out there cutting heel promos about how they forced him to retire and whatnot, is it "oh that zany Flair needs the money to pay off his wives" or does everyone think he's making a fool of himself? Flair was only willing to wrestle again with HBK and Vince's blessing, so they don't really care too much. They probably understand better than anyone that no one retires from wrestling.
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Nov 28, 2009 21:38
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Scott Hall is a hero of the intifada.
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Nov 30, 2009 08:08
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Supreme Allah posted:See, do you see? Except Sting was put on top for extended amounts of time in the early 90s and bombed. The Undertaker was never expected to be a top draw, but when he had the title, he did really well in terms of house show gates, something Sting could never do. Sting's big return to win the title off Flair the first time did a loving awful gate (just over half full, about 8,000 paid) and not much of a buyrate. And from there WCW went to hell in a hand basket, and when Flair left the company just did worse and worse despite Sting on top. I was a big Sting fan. I still like the guy. But he was a draw for two big buyrates both against Hogan that capped off an 18 month program. Before that he was popular but not a big draw and after that the same applied. Angle, at his peak wasn't as big of a star. But his overall significance to the business may end up being bigger for one reason: He got guys over. He put over a ton of guys and made others look great beating them. Edge would not be what he is today without the Angle feud. Cena's STFU wouldn't have gotten as over if it wasn't established against Angle. And then there is the evil fact that TNA wouldn't have flirted with profitability if it wasn't for Angle's star power helping them get TV deals. When Sting was at his peak he wasn't putting younger guys over like Flair did to make him a star. This probably isn't his fault since the culture in WCW wouldn't allow these things to be booked. But, it does mean when it is all over, Angle may have more significance because of the fact like Flair he did lots of jobs and made guys look good.
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Dec 8, 2009 00:43
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The funny thing about Sting is he probably would have been a much bigger attraction in the WWF than he was in WCW just because he was such a kid friendly character and no matter how popular WCW got they never captured any kids.
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Dec 8, 2009 01:48
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Wazzu posted:Also not featuring him on PPVs much. He had his "match" against mr. T at WM2, but didn't have a PPV match again until Survivor Series 1989 (I think), where he brawled until it resulted in a double count-out. For some reason I feel like Starrcade 96 was the match that wasn't announced as non title before hand, so Piper won, but not the title even though it was played up as this huge thing that he'd won and beaten Hogan.
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Dec 9, 2009 21:31
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Zanael posted:Coffey's post in the TNA thread about TNA announcing the coming of Hogan too soon made me wonder : how much time before the Nitro where Shane showed in did they announce WCW was bought by WWF ? The sale was announced the previous week. It leaked on March 22nd 2001, and was officially announced on the 23rd. (The only reason I know this is I happened to listen to the WWF buys WCW episode of WOL that happened the day of the announcement. It's funny how accurate Dave and Bryan's predictions were, right down to Nash just sitting out his contract and becoming more valuable after things got stale.) MassRafTer fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Dec 9, 2009 |
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Dec 9, 2009 21:40
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FoodStampBrown posted:Pretty sure Don Leo Jonathan used to skin the cat on occasion. Also, didn't Jake invent the DDT? The DDT had been used a few years before Jake got started in the business.
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Dec 13, 2009 00:34
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It definitely happened. I rarely changed the channel on WCW until 99-2000, but I did during those shitfests. They were the kind of segments where you'd turn the channel and come back five minutes later and it would still be going. Then you'd come back in another five and it wasn't over!
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Dec 17, 2009 09:51
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It really is amazing how WCW completely went off the tracks in 1998 and how insane Eric Bischoff went. He was such a loving mark for himself and Hogan and it hurt the product so much. How much did it hurt Goldberg to be such an after thought on Road Wild? He was the champion and Bischoff is devoting 15 minutes of the show to cheap heat. The cruiserweight division started suffering as well as they lost any idea of how to not gently caress things up, and in the second half of 1998 you don't see any classic cruiser matches. Hell, there really weren't any for another two years on PPV. And at the same time the WWF is hyping up for a huge PPV in Summerslam which was sold on the premise: It is the Undertaker vs Steve Austin, YOU WANT THIS MATCH, we'll add storyline in later.
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Dec 18, 2009 00:09
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Meat Recital posted:Does CM Punk still own the rights to his name, or did he sign it away to the WWE when he signed? He has signed them away for merchandise while he is under contract, but he retains ownership of the name.
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Dec 19, 2009 22:41
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Nash may either have had a more lax contract on things like that.
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Dec 20, 2009 10:31
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FishBulb posted:He is now under WWE contract and will debut eventually. The only other thing known is he's still training at Xtreme Couture in Vegas while he waits.
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Dec 22, 2009 05:23
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Ric Flair can be a consortium by himself because all of his wives and ex wives are part of it.
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Dec 24, 2009 08:29
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battlemonk posted:So, we talk periodically about match styles, the one that comes to mind being "Face in Peril". There's also obviously the "Squash" match. There have to be other styles, and since there are, are any others named like that, grouped in any way, or are they just sort of a more generic group of "face wins clean", "heel wins clean", "heel wins dirty", etc.? Well, it sounds more like you are asking about match structure rather than style. Pretty much any match with a standard structure is going to have a "face in peril" since that will be the heat segment where the heel takes control of the match and works over the face. Realistically, every match outside a squash will use the same structure: Shine - Heat - Comeback - Finish. Longer matches will see a minor shine, minor heat, shine, heat etc. There are many styles, "King's Road" (The All Japan Style, pretty much dead today replaced by the NOAH Main Event Style of lots of head drops) "Strong Style" (Popularized by 1990s All Japan) "Main Event Style" (The WWE style of the Attitude era through today) "Memphis Style" (Used in Memphis in Lawler's hey day, lots of blood, brawling, heel antics and gently caress finishes to get the crowd back the next week.) and many others that you see like shoot style, lucha variants, European style etc. MassRafTer fucked around with this message at 07:55 on Dec 25, 2009 |
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Dec 25, 2009 07:51
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battlemonk posted:That's exactly what I mean. I'm trying to build a sense, in my head, of how these various segments are put together, because as a stage combat director, that sort of thing is what I need to be able to put together more; as much as it is intuitive to an extent, wanting to draw the crowd in and show the struggle of two equal/unequal combatants, I guess what I'm looking for is a little more of a breakdown of exactly how the pros tend to put it together. One of the most better later examples of Kings Road: Misawa vs Kobashi from January of 1997: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=9FNCKVD6 This isn't the best example of Memphis, but it is from my favorite feud in Memphis history: Lawler vs Bockwinkel http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu0k-4HOgfA from the legendary $500 Dollars a Punch Feud. Feud History: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL3LJMQmKpA Bockwinkel worked mainly for the AWA and would come into Memphis often to defend the AWA title, but you get an idea of the face/heel structure of Memphis. There's probably a better example out there, probably in Austin Idol vs Savage or something like that but I can't think of the right match off the top of my head. Shoot Style: Sano vs Suzuki http://www.megaupload.com/?d=X81JN5UT from July of 91. Probably not the best example of strong style, but Hashimoto vs Regal for the IWGP title should be more accessible http://www.megaupload.com/?d=ZLWWY8DN Lucharesu a fusion of lucha and Puro found mainly in Dragon Gate today: Magnum Tokyo, Dragon Kid & Ryo Saito vs CIMA, SUWA and Fuji vs Mochizuki, Kanda and Darkness Dragon http://www.megaupload.com/?d=BPK6YDMU from August of 2001. MassRafTer fucked around with this message at 09:49 on Dec 25, 2009 |
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Dec 25, 2009 09:46
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DannoMack posted:When the WWE plays or releases footage of the Bret Hart hall of fame induction, how do they pretend that Chris Benoit wasn't sitting behind the podium the whole time? He was really short so you can't see him.
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Dec 30, 2009 06:09
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DannoMack posted:Did Mick Foley leave WWE on good terms? Foley's contract ran out. Vince was pretty mad at Foley when he wanted to go to TNA in 2005 and doubled the offer to prevent that. I'm guessing he isn't their favorite person but they'd work with him again after TNA.
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Jan 3, 2010 00:07
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Umbra Dubium posted:Also Candice Michelle has been replaced by Kelly Kelly. Karl Stern discussed this a few months ago. I think the footage is from 1907 but I don't remember the names.
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Jan 3, 2010 01:25
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Carlton Banks posted:I finally got with the times and signed up for the WO/F4W website and listened to the Dec 31 show with Lance Storm which makes me want to listen to more interviews, so what are some shows in the archives that are "must listens"? Any of the Konnan interviews are awesome. Most are Figure 4 Dailies but I think one is a Wrestling Observer Radio. The Bruno Sammartino interviews are great, both are Wrestling Observer Radios. The Paul Heyman interview about Captain Lou's death is great. The Don Frye interview from this summer is loving hilarious too.
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Jan 3, 2010 21:55
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Pneub posted:Speaking of Chyna, was she ever any good at actually wrestling? All I can remember is her acting as the (180 lb) "muscle" of DX, and I was WCW back then so I don't recall any woman's matches. No, she was a really poor worker who looked ridiculous in there even against light heavyweight sized guys.
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Jan 4, 2010 03:58
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Paul Revere 3000 posted:That storyline really went nowhere, didn't it? Dolph Ziggler is just a go-nowhere kind of guy.
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Jan 9, 2010 05:20
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projecthalaxy posted:If they ran brawl 4 all today, who would win? Taker? Punk? Hornswoggle? Kozlov or maybe Regal depending on the rules. Regal was trained in the Blackpool area which tended to train wrestlers in real catch wrestling as well as professional wrestling. I assume Finlay has some of that training along with just being a tough guy. Kozlov has legitimate sambo and kickboxing experience, so I'd put him as a big favorite to win it. Billy Robinson is convinced that DH Smith could be a UFC Champion if he could train him, so maybe he'd have a chance as well. Taker is too old, not properly trained and not very mobile. (Mobility would probably hinder Finlay as well.) CM Punk has no training and isn't the most athletic or coordinated guy out there so I don't see him even entering. I guess if you throw Big Show in there he'd be a favorite, but I imagine Kozlov would be able to neutralize his size. As for Meng, he was a tough guy, but stories of him being this amazing shoot fighter are overblown. Bischoff tried to get him to enter an early UFC (at a time when there weren't any all around fighters) and he told him no, he'd have no chance.
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Jan 16, 2010 02:20
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oldpainless posted:What about the Iron Sheik? He was in the gimmick battle royal at WM 17 and I think his last match before that was WM 3. So he had a gap of 14 years. He wrestled a few times during the Slaughter Iraqi heel run didn't he?
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Jan 16, 2010 02:21
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dusty udder smoker posted:not at mania i dont think. Bah, I misunderstood what he was talking about in terms of a gap.
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Jan 16, 2010 03:32
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