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i cant speak to bmoq, but bmq is designed to introduce you to the military, learn its structure and ingrain some basic stress reponses, like operating a c7 in a stressful environment, or donning and doffing a gas mask in however many seconds
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Jul 13, 2023 14:17
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Basic training has has always been about indoctrinating you into the CAF, seeing how you react under stress, and making sure you can follow orders. You can also fail BMOQ if your leadership taskings are a mess, but I've seen total shitheels pass those. Sorry this experience hasn't been good. It's important to know that you have not failed. And I mean that. Do not become bitter from this experience, and make sure you keep working towards the career you want. It's pretty easy to get frustrated at the system, but doing so is totally unhelpful. Keep your sights on what you want, and don't stop working towards it. mom and dad fight a lot fucked around with this message at 15:42 on Jul 13, 2023 |
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Jul 13, 2023 15:40
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yea, i had to leave basic my first time due to family issues and it was rough, but ive joined the military 2 more times since!
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Jul 13, 2023 16:24
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SRQ posted:Outside of PT what's the point then? Why is basic structured in a way it teaches nothing. I certainly feel I improved as a person, but that always hit me as odd. The problem is that we no longer have "grunts", and most NCMs fill roles analogous to those of officers; you're expected to think for yourself, which is the opposite of what BMQ/BMOQ drills into you. Select quotes from Duty With Honour posted:"In the Canadian Forces, all non-commissioned members(NCMs) [...] share leadership responsibilities and are required to master complex skills and gain extensive knowledge of the theory of conflict."
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Jul 13, 2023 19:27
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mom and dad fight a lot posted:Basic training has has always been about indoctrinating you into the CAF, seeing how you react under stress, and making sure you can follow orders. You can also fail BMOQ if your leadership taskings are a mess, but I've seen total shitheels pass those. Thanks, it's nice to hear that. VR papers are going in tomorrow, and I'm gonna re-apply (after a running program at home) in 3-6 months. Hopefully my dumb canex plan laptop (a poor decision made assuming I was going to graduate lol) doesn't nuke all of my savings. I've only seen one actual failure- not a VR, not a med release. I've also seen a different person, a legendary shitpump I'll call the submarine (I'll share stories on request) get recycled a rumoured 5 times before he was released. Gainsboro posted:Basic training is all about breaking you down so you accept the word of command, which was important on the battlefield of yesteryear where Peasant Bloggings just had to point his spear in the right direction without making GBS threads his pants. We did get a lot of think for yourself stuff in BMOQ, but we also got an equal amount of "YOU ARE NOT AN INDIVIDUAL, SHUT UP." sorta stuff. I appreciate it all because it made me a stronger person, every beasting I took as a challenge- but some of the methodology does baffle me. It also baffled me we didn't do more actual leadership stuff. Kit day was a big one, and I imagine Farnham is full of it- but day to day there wasn't too much exercise there. The injury platoon having thrice weekly inspections failure of which can result in the whole platoon losing their leave passes is one such baffling idea. Why would they want to put that amount of stress and mental pressure on a bunch of people some of which have concussions? CFLRS stories on request with names withheld. SRQ fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Jul 13, 2023 |
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Jul 13, 2023 21:17
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I dunno what bmoq is like but outside of the occasional course senior role bmq was basically summer camp, we did most of our leadership development during SQ and battle school (and obviously even more in battalion). And things may have changed in the past decade or so but I still found a lot of transferrable skills from my indoctrination courses to my actual job. It wasn't the mediocre section attacks, shooting drills, or kit packing, but the grit and drive that you don't really get anywhere else in the workforce in Canada.
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Jul 13, 2023 21:36
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acumen posted:I dunno what bmoq is like but outside of the occasional course senior role bmq was basically summer camp, we did most of our leadership development during SQ and battle school (and obviously even more in battalion). Indoc cured my anxiety (which I realize isn't a fix for everyone, but it worked for me thanks to the kindness of my NCO and otherwise facing the worst of it and coming through) and taught me a very important lesson I will take to my grave. Always carry a notepad. My proudest moments are when I had covid (did not know until the next day lol) and on 3 hours of sleep for the last 5 days still went to morning PT with our Captain, and managed to keep pace while others fell off. The next day I went to iso because it turns out I had covid all along when I went to MIR to get some cold meds. Who knew that choking to death on your own fluids was covid*? *it seems obvious now but legit I thought covid cough was always dry and I had strong pressure to push through it. The banshee scream at the obstacle course which coming from lil ol introvert me was enough to impress our warrant. SRQ fucked around with this message at 22:48 on Jul 13, 2023 |
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Jul 13, 2023 22:46
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SRQ posted:The injury platoon having thrice weekly inspections failure of which can result in the whole platoon losing their leave passes is one such baffling idea. Why would they want to put that amount of stress and mental pressure on a bunch of people some of which have concussions? For the record I don't condone this approach, group punishments are bullshit. acumen posted:we did most of our leadership development during SQ The only thing I learned from that was that the CF is full of cunts who will abuse any position of power over others, and later I would learn that these rigid, hierarchical power dynamics were core to sexual abusers in the ranks getting away with their crimes. No, I haven't carried lingering resentment for over fifteen years, why do you ask?
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Jul 14, 2023 14:31
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SRQ posted:The injury platoon having thrice weekly inspections failure of which can result in the whole platoon losing their leave passes is one such baffling idea. Why would they want to put that amount of stress and mental pressure on a bunch of people some of which have concussions? Just to reiterate what some of the others have said, an injury or medical issue isn’t a failure on your part. As for the bullshit inspections, it’s a mix of several things: -First, while lots of people can be trusted to act like adults there are candidates who will happily wallow in filth. The whole platoon losing leave passes is a loving stupid idea, but the inspections serve a pupose. -Second, cultural change is slow. The “strategic corporal” exists in doctrine but there are lots of dinosaurs in the system who haven’t caught up and are proud of being out of touch. It’ll change in time but not all the turds have flushed yet. -Third, CFLRS and the training system in general have a lot of kayfabe. Most instructors I know (myself included) think the act is dumb as poo poo but the expectation is still there. Part of that is also to generate that stressful environment to test whether a candidate can actually function under stress.
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Jul 14, 2023 20:25
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There's definitely a fine line there. It's still important to galvanize the new guys but not to the point of abuse, and the instructors should absolutely be setting the example by doing every one of those push-ups with their recruits. I was pretty transparent as an instructor that it was a game, but it's still boot camp and we're gonna get beasted together and learn a thing or two about ourselves in the process.
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Jul 14, 2023 21:17
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Oh absolutely. Nobody should be handing out PT they don’t do at the same time.
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Jul 14, 2023 22:07
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acumen posted:There's definitely a fine line there. It's still important to galvanize the new guys but not to the point of abuse, and the instructors should absolutely be setting the example by doing every one of those push-ups with their recruits. I was pretty transparent as an instructor that it was a game, but it's still boot camp and we're gonna get beasted together and learn a thing or two about ourselves in the process. I have at least never seen any instructor not do anything to us they didn't do _with_ us. It was very important for morale, and myself seeing a Navy Lt beast us in freezing rain was like "well gently caress if he can." What gets me though is TRP is an injury platoon, and we're told constantly our first priority is to recover and get back on platoon. Then they do poo poo like pull weekends, give people write ups for frivolous or made up bullshit, and generally ensure stress is always extremely high. Morale is awful here, because you get all of the poo poo without that golden ticket of graduation waiting at the end, and because people come in and go out so often it's hard to have a cohesive platoon. The staff I talk to on a regular basis treat me very well, and I've always felt safe and respected- but at the same time I've felt there's a sort of toxic... something. Maybe it's just old culture that won't go away, I don't know. If the people are good, but the situation isn't, then I'm not sure what I can blame. I do have a question now. There's been what I think could be legitimate cruelty and things that I think go far beyond the norms of boot camp, and into targeted harassment. The people this is being done to are not going to speak up for themselves out of fear. Should I speak up, to who, and how? Consider also I'm already VRing so I have a unique opportunity (?) to speak up without fear of normal consequence. I can detail these things if it's appropriate in this space. SRQ fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Jul 14, 2023 |
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Jul 14, 2023 23:36
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SRQ posted:There's been what I think could be legitimate cruelty and things that I think go far beyond the norms of boot camp, and into targeted harassment. The people this is being done to are not going to speak up for themselves out of fear. You can submit a disclosure of wrongdoing, you can contact the ombudsman, you can call the MPs, e-mail the press, there are many avenues through which you can report these happenings, but that will never stop this behavior. It will be covered up at every level of the establishment. The instructors who went too far will never see negative consequences; if anything the most expeditious way to remove them from the school might be promotion. The system resists all attempts at change. Again, I wish there was another way, but it'll impact your mental health in the long run if you put a lot of energy into this only to see it come to naught. Save yourself the agony. I speak from experience.
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Jul 15, 2023 02:32
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Gainsboro posted:I wish there was something you could productively do, but targeted harassment is the norm of boot camp. Abuse is the norm of boot camp. This is the way of things. Very fair. I plan to do some low-level things that will keep my name directly out of it, but at least give me some sense I did something. To be clear, none of it I think was criminal or directly harmful in such a way that anyone was at any immediate risk. It was just all extremely unethical and equally extremely counter-productive. The like, you know, challenge and stress I get. It's lies and gaslighting that goes too far. Watching this place ruin a few of the best people I've ever seen and convince them they can't make it sucks. Meanwhile I've seen a few awful shitpumps get through. I've seen incredibly selfish and vain officers slide through, equal to shitpump ones, while good ones get smashed by a wave of inexplicable trash. SRQ fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Jul 15, 2023 |
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Jul 15, 2023 03:29
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I have a friend that retired with 43 years of service. This is what the issued running shoes looked like in 1987.
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Jul 15, 2023 20:14
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Mantle posted:I have a friend that retired with 43 years of service. This is what the issued running shoes looked like in 1987. Those were still issued to cadets in the mid-late 90s for summer training (I got some when I was a kid). They weren't exactly stylish, but they were durable and not overly heavy though insoles made them far more comfortable. The athletic shorts though... those were barely longer than briefs.
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Jul 16, 2023 01:14
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I didn't get issued anything I brought my own. Lucked out with boots though. For whatever hosed up my feet, wasn't the boots. I love these. SRQ fucked around with this message at 02:19 on Jul 16, 2023 |
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Jul 16, 2023 02:08
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Fearless posted:Those were still issued to cadets in the mid-late 90s for summer training (I got some when I was a kid). They weren't exactly stylish, but they were durable and not overly heavy though insoles made them far more comfortable. The athletic shorts though... those were barely longer than briefs. We had those too in the late 90s, called them Air Bordens.
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Jul 16, 2023 04:01
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MA-Horus posted:We had those too in the late 90s, called them Air Bordens. We called em gumby runners out west. And yeah, those shorts were not a great idea for teenagers.
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Jul 16, 2023 04:17
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B33rChiller posted:We called em gumby runners out west. And yeah, those shorts were not a great idea for teenagers. God those shorts were terrible. So were the woolen socks. Scratchiest things I've ever had the misfortune to wear
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Jul 16, 2023 05:34
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I don't think they even issue the shorts anymore. Last I saw, kids had to bring their own PT shorts. I liked the wool socks, though. And the fire blankets. But I know both weren't popular!
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Jul 16, 2023 13:45
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mom and dad fight a lot posted:I don't think they even issue the shorts anymore. Last I saw, kids had to bring their own PT shorts. We got our grey PT gear issued at CFLRS.
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Jul 16, 2023 14:44
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Yeah, sorry, I thought we were still talking about cadets.
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Jul 16, 2023 15:39
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I was probably confused myself as 'cadet' means officer cadet to me at the moment. I also want to ask, during my 3 month "get better and maybe come back". CSIS? Anyone with experience there? I have my Secret already so I figure that'd get me a foot in the door. If I can get work there I'd certainly take it. I want to help support the defense apparatus, where specifically is a matter of finding a place.
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Jul 16, 2023 21:07
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I threw a resume at a csis surveillant job when I got out, figured with a history of infantry reconnaissance I'd have a decent shot but didn't hear anything back. I'd assume bilingual+ is a big asset, which I'm not. Instead, wound up doing 911 dispatch and starting pay is about the same as a warrant officer with only high school. If you really want to stay as part of that "public service" kind of thing I'd recommend it if you can stomach working with/for cops. I'm not entirely sure csis actually contributes a lot to our "defense" anyway
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Jul 16, 2023 21:22
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My time in the CF made me a far better social worker, and I have worked in that capacity with a couple of police departments as well. There are a lot of ways to serve society, depending on what your inclinations are. E: I personally know nothing about CSIS or its selection process but the folks I am aware of who were involved with it are all at least bilingual, and we're not talking English/French here. mom and dad fight a lot posted:I don't think they even issue the shorts anymore. Last I saw, kids had to bring their own PT shorts. I came to appreciate the fire blankets as a kid. I could never get behind the wool socks though... it took a long time to learn that not all wool socks are like those. Fearless fucked around with this message at 21:29 on Jul 16, 2023 |
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Jul 16, 2023 21:26
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Fearless posted:My time in the CF made me a far better social worker, and I have worked in that capacity with a couple of police departments as well. There are a lot of ways to serve society, depending on what your inclinations are. How did you get that job? I feel that could be an option, but I'm not sure how.
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Jul 16, 2023 21:47
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SRQ posted:How did you get that job? I feel that could be an option, but I'm not sure how. Social worker? Or social work in a police department?
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Jul 16, 2023 22:12
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Fearless posted:Social worker? Or social work in a police department? Either I guess, I'm looking at other options to serve the state/community and my mind is pretty open. CSIS intel op/officer looks like a good fit but isn't a promise, so I'm looking around.
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Jul 16, 2023 22:35
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Social work requires a degree in that field from an accredited university-- generally a BSW or an MSW. The tendency these days is to require an MSW and it's certainly easier to pursue a clinical certification with an MSW. Either degree will require a couple of field placements and these are where the real learning takes place so it pays to put some effort into getting a good one. With a prior 4 year degree, a BSW is two years. With a BSW complete, an MSW is one year or two without it. After you've graduated you've then got to get registered with your provincial college or association. This can take several weeks to three or more months depending on how involved the provincial standard is... in BC we have to sit an exam as a part of the process. Generally, nobody will look at you without a complete and active registration. You'll find social workers in provincial child protection units, family service units, providing case management for the elderly or for persons with disabilities. We're also the primary providers of therapy and counselling in the US and Canada and you'll find us in victims service units in a lot of police departments... though the nature of those units depends a lot on the parent department. When I worked in Fredericton, it was a volunteer thing but in Vancouver it is far more organized, paid and unionized too (did you know the Teamsters also represent the Helping professions like social workers? Next time some anthropologist tries to help you, ask to see his registration and tell him "No scabs!"). Applying for job with a PD is much like any other, except you can expect a very, very in depth security check with a larger department. All kidding about anthropology scabs aside, social work is kinda like nursing in that there are a LOT of different things you can do in that field. I've delivered addictions treatment in a frontier setting in Alaska, in person crisis support in Vancouver during a pandemic and toxic drug crisis, worked with at risk kids in a residential setting, done conflict resolution facilitation and now I lead a team of mental health care professionals in a clinical setting. I joke a bit about being the person you never want to see, but if you need me you'll be glad I'm there but it's not really that much of a joke come to think of it. It's also like nursing in that the people that do it are crucial but rarely treated accordingly and the work can be tremendously challenging. But with that said I also suspect that last bit has more than a few people in this thread nodding along even though they put up a more cavalier front. Fearless fucked around with this message at 01:12 on Jul 17, 2023 |
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Jul 17, 2023 01:03
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My condolences on the new Minister.
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Jul 26, 2023 18:40
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Never thought I'd be working for the dude who ousted the crack smoking mayor of Toronto.Shumagorath posted:Blair sucks but calling him a pleomorphic liposarcoma is a bit much. 
mom and dad fight a lot fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Jul 26, 2023 |
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Jul 26, 2023 19:06
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mom and dad fight a lot posted:Never thought I'd be working for the dude who ousted the crack smoking mayor of Toronto.
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Jul 26, 2023 19:17
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Well gently caress. Anand was doing some great low-key stuff that can't be talked about. I guess the glass half full interpretation is that moving to TB will enable some more things that can't be talked about.
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Jul 26, 2023 21:50
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Who in the actual gently caress thinks Blair is any any way whatsoever qualified for this job.
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Jul 27, 2023 04:19
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Lol Mona Fortier got quietly shitcanned.
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Jul 27, 2023 05:58
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I'm promoted to civilian in 48 hours. I can't believe I tolerated 3 months of 7-10km a day walking with planter fascitis, good lord. Ironically now that I'm in release section it is, finally, starting to heal. Of course it'll still take a few months and that is time the forces was not willing to give me. Kinda sucks that I didn't complete CFLRS but I have long since gotten past that and now I'm just emotionally dead inside from the last month of this wild ride. SRQ fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Jul 30, 2023 |
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Jul 30, 2023 22:02
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Go find another job. The CAF is not for you.
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Jul 30, 2023 23:46
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mdivi posted:Go find another job. The CAF is not for you.
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Jul 31, 2023 00:54
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Apparently there was a local vendor in Halifax making Centennial RCAF ballcaps, and people we're using those instead of the Canex issued ones for their dress of the day. Kinda wish I'd thought of that first.
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Aug 23, 2023 19:53
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