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Welcome (or welcome back) to the world of menu/text-based baseball simulations! Depending on how you look at things, computer baseball sims are arguably the nerdiest thing on the planet. While they do not have the social stigma that comes with tabletop gaming or the antisocial, offputting worldview that comes with being a real life scientist or engineer, baseball simulations take an otherwise fun game of physical prowess and literally reduce it to a bunch of numbers and (figurative) dice rolls done by a computer. So yeah, it's pretty loving nerdy. Holy poo poo that's terrible why would I want to have anything to do with that? Because you're on the SA Forums and you're probably already past caring what people think about what you do on your computer. Also, you just watched your favorite team sign Jason Kendall to a multiyear deal and you keep thinking "I wish I could be a GM, I could do a much better job". Or maybe you want to imagine a world where Ron Santo is the career HR leader but your imagination needs numbers and spreadsheets to fully envision this fantasy.  Click here for the full 1024x768 image. Why this thread, why now? Recently, there was a resurgence of discussion of these games in the MLB News/Views thread and a suggestion that someone start a thread. Also, it is the dead of winter and those of us who live in places like St. Louis where there is no professional basketball and no professional football (at least nothing recognizable as professional football) need something to keep us occupied. What are these games? Well, there are two of them. The first is Baseball Mogul. The second is Out of the Park Baseball. They are both good games but they are very different. Okay, they're not very different. They both have the same basic concept. You are the owner/GM/manager of a baseball team and you draft, sign, trade, and (if you want to) coach your way to a championship. Or multiple championships. Or decades of domination, if you are playing on low difficulty levels or in historical leagues with no randomization. TWO games? But I can't make decisions! Honestly I buy both of them pretty much every year because I am horribly addicted to this genre. I even bought the terrible MLB Front Office Manager for the 360. It had no roster/player customization and didn't even attempt to fill out the minor leagues with appropriate mis-named players. In other words, playing as the Cardinals when it came out, there was absolutely no way to have Colby Rasmus in my minor league system. Do not by MLB Front Office Manager unless of course you are the one person in the world who enjoys text/menu based baseball sims but does not care for any level of accuracy or customization. Now that my tangent is out of the way, here are the two games you SHOULD consider if you enjoy replaying/revising/forging ahead into baseball history with a bunch of menus, spreadsheets, and text outputs. Out of the Park Baseball The current version is OOTP X and TODAY ONLY it is apparently 24.99. You can buy it at http://www.ootpdevelopments.com . There is also OOTP 8/2007 which is available FREE, which is always a bonus. OOTP is, of the two options, by far the most customizable. If you want, you can create an African baseball league. Or a high school baseball tournament. Or you can just sim from todays date. You can micromanage just about everything. Every minor league is fully simmed, fully supported, and you can even play as a GM/manager of one of the minor league teams. Honestly, I am too lazy to completely understand/enjoy the full spectrum of what OOTP can supply. But it does an amazing job of simulating baseball (though honestly the scouting is often loving ridiculous and should be ignored. Text Interface:  Click here for the full 1024x768 image. Play-by-play interface:  Click here for the full 1024x768 image. Baseball Mogul Baseball Mogul is the "arcade" baseball text simulator. It moves faster, does not require micromanaging the minor leagues, and is far more random (at default) than OOTP. It is, for those of you who also play military shooters, the Call of Duty to OOTP's ArmA 2. Probably more fun, but probaly less satisfying. It is currently 19.99 at http://www.sportsmogul.com . The minor leagues exist only for development in BBM. Everything is focused on the majors. I've found, for whatever reason, this ends up producing more realistic historical stats than OOTP. The AI absolutely does not give a gently caress about the minors, scouting is more even (so good players get promoted more quickly) and historical games tend to follow patterns closer to what really happened in baseball. Of course, going forward, OOTP is more realistic. Teams focus more on the minors, keep players down longer, etc... Text Interface:  Click here for the full 846x605 image. Play-by-play:  Click here for the full 846x605 image. Yeah but which one should I buy? Hopefully others will elaborate after me, but I see the difference as pretty simple. OOTP is an all-out, micromanaging, attention-grabbing game. You can't passively play it. If you want control over every aspect of your team (whether it is the New York Yankees, the Montgomery Biscuits, or the Capetown Flamethrowers) you want OOTP. Also, if you're more interested in an engaging, in-depth simulation of the future of baseball, OOTP is the way to go. However, if you'd rather play while doing something else--checking up on the team between e-mails or simming games during class--BBM is more suited to your needs. There is FAR less micromanaging, the interface is user-friendly, and years just fly by with the sims. Further, if you're interested in seeing an alternate-universe MLB play itself out, BBM is a better bet. I've never been able to set OOTP right for a 1900+ playthrough, while in BBM it's just a matter of going to league settings and pumping up "contract extensions" to +100% until free agency in 1976. Or you could just be like me and buy both  What's this thread for? Well, first raising awareness for these awesome games. Second, a lot of people were posting their Baseball Mogul/OOTP results in the News/Views thread. I'll probably start up a new BBM10 game soon, starting in 1901, with high randomization and post the strangest results. It's kind of fun when Mike Maddux is the Hall of Famer instead of Greg, after all. Finally this is recommended reading: http://www.amazon.com/Universal-Baseball-Association-Henry-Waugh/dp/0452260302/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262236358&sr=8-1 gyroball fucked around with this message at 06:17 on Dec 31, 2009 |
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Dec 31, 2009 05:12
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ManifunkDestiny posted:Does OOTP10 do expansion drafts? If so, can I run them whenever I want, or are they just hard-coded for historical expansions a la BBM? I really, really, really want to create my 32-team, 8-division MLB idea with an expansion draft in 2010 but BBM won't let me do that Unless I'm mistaken about what you're asking, it should be REALLY easy in OOTP. Game -> Game Setup -> League setup -> "Expand League & Expansion Draft" Save beforehand, this has crashed for me before ALSO, now edited into the OP, everyone should read this book: http://www.amazon.com/Universal-Baseball-Association-Henry-Waugh/dp/0452260302/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1262236358&sr=8-1 gyroball fucked around with this message at 06:16 on Dec 31, 2009 |
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Dec 31, 2009 06:11
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ManifunkDestiny posted:Can I change the league setup from 3 divisions to 4 and eliminate the WC? You'll have to do it after the expansion draft but, yeah, that should be no problem at all. edit: As in you set up the expansion with the new teams in whatever league/division, let everything run until expansion is over, then realign the league
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Dec 31, 2009 06:18
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whateverfor posted:It's just annoying how utterly stupid the trade AI is in Baseball Mogul. Every time I try to play OOTP, I get frustrated by the interface and how incredibly slow it is. Then I go to play BBM, and I get this: Lets be fair here, this is a fairly accurate simulation of Dayton Moore. But yeah you're right, the trade AI in BBM just can't evaluate the value of young players correctly and doesn't go into rebuilding cycles, etc.
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Dec 31, 2009 18:41
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Before starting a Baseball Mogul 1901-2009 game, I went through and filled out the portraits folder to get as many as I could. Most of these are from the baseball card packs on the BBM forum but I compressed them into a single "portraits" zip. This has a ton of historical players, but there are some hitches (for example Roberto Clemente and Roger Clemens have the same picture, almost all the pictures are scanned baseball cards) If you are like me and prefer pictures on your player profiles you can just download this and replace your Portraits folder with it: http://www.mediafire.com/?km4rw4qwzjm edit: apparently I fixed the clemens/clemente thing after all gyroball fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Dec 31, 2009 |
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Dec 31, 2009 23:02
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Male. Bi. Unix. posted:How can I stop the sim ai from running out 17 year old Sandy Koufax to go 1-31 with a 8.00 ERA, forever making his stats look super retarded? He stays in the majors but his ERA hovers around 6.50 until he turns 25 when he becomes league average. Is this Baseball Mogul? You can adjust how fast the AI promotes players to various levels under "league settings" in the "league" pull-down menu.
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Jan 2, 2010 01:42
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Sometimes I don't even know:
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Jan 2, 2010 18:33
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Politicalrancor posted:Gyroball how do I replace my portraits file? It's a folder. It should be in this directory: Sports Mogul/Baseball Mogul 2009/Skins/SportsMogul/Photos If you want to replace everything with what I uploaded, just unzip the portraits.zip and move the resulting "Portraits folder" into the "Photos" folder. Then say "yes to all" when it asks whether you want to replace stuff.
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Jan 4, 2010 17:29
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OOTP 11 comes out in a week and you can still preorder it for $10 off. Also it will now have custom batter walk-up music 
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Apr 8, 2010 20:30
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For the first time in years I didn't buy Baseball Mogul on release--just didn't see enough that warranted a (more expensive than ever) upgrade. OOTP on the other hand has two-way players this year. That alone got me to buy it. Fake baseball cards, OPS+/ERA+, and dynamic leagues (with nickname changes for players!) is also kind of awesome in a dorky, wouldn't-admit-it-anywhere-else kind of way.
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Apr 12, 2010 02:21
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In class all day, OOTP does not run well on netbooks (BBM does by the way) but will post trip review later tonight
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Apr 13, 2010 00:22
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Quick first impression: Yes it takes time but everyone should download the 2010 add on if only for ACCURATE FACEGEN 
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Apr 13, 2010 03:58
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Okay, after a few hours last night I'm pretty impressed. First off, the interface is slick. I'm not sure if it's better than last year yet, mostly because I'm re-adjusting and figuring out where everything still is. The menus have been somewhat re-organized under snazzy buttons and I think they're better organized this time around, but I won't be sure until I get used to them. What's improved? I haven't had much of a chance to test out two-way players, though I plan on drafting guys with those skillset (probably to the detriment of the team) to check out how it works. They re-did the fielding engine and I think you can tell fairly quickly, especially if you're playing inning-by-inning. Health/injuries are now denoted by a "status". Players who don't get injured a lot are "normal". Chris Carpenter is "fragile" and he was injured in his first start of the season  Speaking of injuries, they are still brutal. This is something that started last season and I think its intended to be realistic. If its too much, you can always just change the setting to "low" and deal with fewer injuries. On the "realistic" setting I swear every team you control becomes the Mets. But thats not something thats changed (except for how you "scout" health ratings) and its easy to fix if you don't like it. The most noticeable and important change is that the trade logic is tougher. In OOTPX you could often move a player just by shopping him around, even if no one would want him in real life. Someone would offer something, and often someone would offer a decent prospect. Not any more. Also, it seems to me that the AI GMs won't make "meaningless" trades for them. In a really brief time with a historical sim (I just quickly simmed a few years), I feel like OOTP has finally caught up to one of the things BBM did better: alternate histories. Historical stats seem more in line with the baseball of the era. Further, you can quickly compare performance in your game with actual historical performance. Its a small touch, but its really nice. Finally, fictional leagues are amazing. The best changes have been made here. The "dynamic league" option may have me playing fictional leagues more than historical leagues for once. Rule changes, team owner deaths, team sales, expansion, etc. will all happen dynamically. According to the developer, this feature will also be patched into MLB 2010 leagues, which will also be awesome.
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Apr 13, 2010 16:22
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Double post but I felt like this should be highlighted. I haven't seen this show up yet (have played only a couple weeks in my MLB 2010 game) but this is pretty  and is moddable so some amazing poo poo is gonna come out of this:From a dev on the forum quote:* The game contains a database of 'storylines'. These might be simple one-offs (player shows up late for practice and is benched for the day, or player organizes charity event in the community) or can be running narratives (player involved in altercation at local bar, player misses court date, player sentenced to three days in jail, or whatever). The running narratives can have a tree structure, so what kq76 suggests above should be possible: when a story is triggered, there could be different ways for that story to continue. Interactive Lets Play OOTP?
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Apr 13, 2010 17:44
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AlleyViper posted:What's player progression like in OOTP? If a guy is a big time prospect is he going to pan out every time or are there a decent number of flops? Will a player's performance actually impact whether or not he'll improve? Can I take a guy as a project and make him into something better than he otherwise would have become? It's random as all hell, and I mean that in the best possible way. If you're using scouts and especially if your scout isn't fantastic, you'll see plenty of first round busts. You'll also see some surprises from later rounds, guys who looked like they never had any potential becoming major leaguers. I'm not sure exactly how much you can affect this. I tend to let the AI manage my minors so I can keep things moving quickly. It's possible by giving a lot of playing time to a marginal player you can make him better. At the very least, I drafted the following guy as a closer out of college, saw he had three good pitches and decent stamina (as well as a kickass name), and proceeded to make him a starter. Two seasons in the minors destroying A and AA, plus a rash of injuries to my pitching staff and suddenly he's my ace and hasn't given up the spot: 
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Apr 24, 2010 02:04
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AlleyViper posted:Okay, based on that here are my two main questions: I can't say for sure, but I'd think well lower than 50% if we're talking "the next Maddux". If this is a prospect who is starting from low ratings and you're using the default injury setting, I might even put the chances of "the next Maddux" ever being even a MLB pitcher at ~ 50%. If its a college guy like Prignano above, and he's already developed but needs polish you can probably at least plan to slot him into the rotation. But greatness is very rare and if you expect it from your draftees you will always be frustrated. Keep in mind that this is all on the default settings. You can easily tweak development and injuries and scouting accuracy (even the best scout in the entire world will gently caress up occassionaly on the default settings) to make players more predictable. quote:b.) My most recent BBM season I did an expansion draft Rockies game. Leo Gomez became my starter at third base in my second year and, as a guy who was mid-70s overall, went for 30+ bombs and a ~.900 OPS. Since he's loving Leo Gomez, though, he regressed following the year. Other than putting the game in commissioner mode to edit his ratings or tweaking progression models, no way that I know of. I will say, though, that breakout seasons are usually a little less fluky in OOTP. If a guy breaks out, he usually doesn't immediately sink back down to terrible right away. gyroball fucked around with this message at 02:34 on Apr 24, 2010 |
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Apr 24, 2010 02:32
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AlleyViper posted:Well obviously my example is the most extreme of extremes, but I guess what I'm asking is that if you have undoubtedly the best scout in the game how often will he lead you astray? That's just a really tough question, because I'm not sure I've ever had the best scout in the game. I can't give you an exact percentage, or even close to one, but I've had very good scouts and they've definitely led me completely astray. By that, I mean that they tell me a guy will be a superstar then that guy stays healthy and doesn't even become a bench player. Not often, but it happens. And those very good scouts would still often miss how good a player will be. Like, they're reliable enough that if they say someone is awesome they'll probably be a major leaguer. But beyond that? Even with a really good scout, that's not that reliable. That slugging 1b might not ever reach the awesome power/gap ratings the scout projects and suddenly he's Ryan Garko. And again, with the realistic frequency of injuries, that's another minefield that can lead to a scout being completely off. Elbow injury? Goodbye future Maddux hello future Silva.
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Apr 24, 2010 04:07
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Cold Sprunk posted:Have yall used any free website based sims that I can use to get my feet wet before I drop some cash on these things? I'd like to have some idea of what I'm doing before i jump in. Pennantchase.com is free wondering how that is... OOTP 8 is free and will give you a better idea of what you'll be getting into than any website game. I'm not sure there's anything web-based that comes close to the complexity of these games. WiS stuff has a similar feel, but that costs money too and is entirely multiplayer focused http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/ootp8/
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Oct 28, 2010 23:22
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Mighty Mumbler posted:So I picked up OOTP11 with the halfprice special deal. Started a Major League game, and I think someone broke the players union 3 years in: Right now, I've got a game in the 2030s that features 38 man rosters instead of 40 man rosters, a 13 day DL, and options have been abolished (players can freely be recalled and demoted to the minors). Also there are a ridiculous number of teams and a guy on the Cardinals who came within 2 walks of Bonds's single-season record (and he's only 26).
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Nov 2, 2010 19:20
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Captain Kickass posted:I've never played OOTP, but I've played BM for years. My major complaint isn't the financials or player progressions, but rather the total lack of expansion options if you want to totally customize a league. If you want that buy OOTP. Seriously, it's league customization options are amazing. On that note, today (1/31) is supposedly the last day to pre-order OOTP 12 for $10 off! If you're like me and know you're going to buy it anyway, now's the time.
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Jan 31, 2011 05:29
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Looking at the features, I'm not sure if Mogul has added anything significant for two years. And they're charging more. It's really a shame, I used to like it better than OOTP because it ran faster/was easier to get into.
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Mar 22, 2011 02:15
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Apparently I did buy OOTP 12! E-mails have been sent out, for anyone else who did.
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Jun 20, 2011 20:54
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Colby Rasmus just retired in 2012 at age 26 He was unhurt He was OPSing .867 It was the middle of the NLDS The Cards were up 2-0 in the series 
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Jul 9, 2011 00:43
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You think that's bad, I forgot to order until this morning and have to wait until Monday.
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Apr 18, 2014 16:54
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