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I've heard talk in a couple threads about wanting a thread for this, and I've been itching to make it for a while so here it is. Math Rock  What is Math Rock? (Shamelessly stolen from Wikipedia): "Math rock is a rhythmically complex, guitar-based style of experimental rock music that emerged in the late 1980s. It is characterized by complex, atypical rhythmic structures (including irregular stopping and starting), angular melodies, and dissonant chords." Simply put, it's an obscure form of rock that uses abnormal time signatures and rhythms and in most cases some dissonance in the song writing. It is similar to Noise Rock in this way (dissonance), and in fact many early Noise Rock bands like Shellac are said to have influenced the genre. Among the first bands to be called "Math Rock" are Don Caballero and Slint, despite not agreeing with the label. But d0grent, is Math Rock even a real genre? Sure many people recognize that it's silly to label a band specifically as Math Rock and leave it at that, but genres are really just a way to group similar sounding bands together, and it has become commonplace to call bands with these characteristics "Math Rock", so I don't personally have a problem with this label. However, when talking about these bands it is more appropriate to describe them by other means than to simply call them "Math Rock". What do some bands in the 'genre' sound like? Some Math Rock is loving crazy: Hella https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7S-RhlG1bk Tera Melos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amodU65_Qt4 Some Math Rock is a little more chill: Don Cabellero: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TGgWKngEJg Giraffes? Giraffes!: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZqZCS0rCmE Mathcore What is Mathcore? I like to think of Mathcore as Metal's parallel to Math Rock. Easy enough? I guess it's similar to Metalcore but in my opinion Metalcore can be pretty boring. Dillinger Escape Plan are pretty much the originators of this genre, though like all genres it's debatable. Other bands that were there for the beginning are Converge and Botch. Here are some bands and stuff: Dillinger Escape Plan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q5qvft2i-s Botch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSSx2N2dtYM Edit: Made OP more relevant/accurate Edit2: Fixed broken links d0grent fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Feb 24, 2015 |
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Jan 7, 2010 11:40
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Well this thread like all threads was made for discussion so why don't you discuss whatever questions you think have been "raised".
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Jan 7, 2010 23:37
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Okposolypse posted:Thanks OP, I'm a huge DEP fan, didn't know that there was a more rock oriented parallel going onto the math genre. Faraquet's "The View From This Tower" is a favorite of mine, maybe you should start there. If you want something a little heavier you should try Keelhaul's new album as I mentioned above.
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Jan 8, 2010 02:04
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Decades posted:Hail Dillinger Yes my friend. So Many Dynamos is what you are looking for. You'll find anything that has a poppy sound also has more stable/safe rhythms, but I digress: http://www.myspace.com/somanydynamos - Listen to pretty much every song. You might also like Minus the Bear as mentioned above - http://www.myspace.com/minusthebear maxnmona posted:I'm neither a music theory expert nor have I listened to more than a few math rock songs, but how many fans of the genre really know what a time signature is? Like how many just hear a lot of starting and stopping in the guitars of what is basically a 4/4 song and assume that something really complicated is going on time signature wise? A song can be in 4/4 and still have obscure rhythm. I included Don Caballero because they are thought of by many to be one of the originators of math rock, even though the band members have expressed their distaste in being called such. Anyway, they have other songs that do deviate more often into other time signatures. Edit: I want to clarify that using atypical time signatures is not the only defining characteristic of the genre and most bands use 4/4 in their songs along side other signatures, most often 3/4 and 7/8 d0grent fucked around with this message at 04:49 on Jan 8, 2010 |
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Jan 8, 2010 04:37
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maxnmona posted:I have no real idea what math rock is other than that every time I read about it, including in this thread, unusual and multiple time signatures are brought up a lot. So I thought it was weird that the first example in this thread, and a lot of the other examples I've been linked to, don't really do much with time signatures at all. I just double checked to make sure I wasn't retarded, and the first song definitely uses 4/4, 5/4, and 3/4 so maybe you didn't even listen halfway through the song? Stink Dinner posted:The OP does not do a very good job at introducing people to the genre! Yeah I suppose my song choices weren't the best, but to be honest the ensuing discussion is more valuable than the introduction in most threads in NMD. I'm not gonna pretend like I know more about the genre than a lot of the people that will be attracted to this thread, but it didn't seem like anyone else was willing to make the OP. Edit: in short I think I went with accesibility over accuracy :\ the great deceiver posted:(the phrase mathrock is so horrible). Yeah I had to cringe just a bit every time I typed it out in the op and capitalized it, but there's no other way 
d0grent fucked around with this message at 09:50 on Jan 8, 2010 |
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Jan 8, 2010 09:34
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the great deceiver posted:No I totally understand you kinda have to use it out of necessity. I'm not sure why I dislike the label so much; probably because "mathrock" sounds so dry and formulaic when a lot of these bands are actually extremely creative and innovative artists. I generally label them as prog when I have to label them but that doesn't really do the style of music justice either. I can't think of anything better to use than mathrock although I did hear one person try to get the name "wizardcore" to stick. Still pretty retarded but I like it better than mathrock. I think the first time I heard of "mathcore" I imagined 4 nerds sitting at desks literally calculating out the placement of notes for their songs on a calculator. Maybe that's why it's annoying to use.
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Jan 8, 2010 10:12
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Rujo King posted:Math rock exists solely to give hipsters like myself a reason to say "One two three, One two three four, One two three four five six, One two three four five," while artfully stabbing the air in front of us and possibly clapping out the beat on our thighs. I do unironically do this while listening to music sometimes, but to be fair I'm a drummer.
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Jan 8, 2010 10:17
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maxnmona posted:Where? They switch into 5/4 at 2:03, and into 3/4 at 2:43. When they switch into 3/4 they are even alternating between parts at 4/4 every 4 measures or so. Duckman2008 posted:Also, my opinion, but Math Rock = Prog Rock. Just mincing words. They're definitely very closely related, but I think prog rock tends to have mostly really long drawn out songs and "math rock" tends to be more energetic. Prog Rock is an actual genre of rock though so you have a point. d0grent fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Jan 8, 2010 |
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Jan 8, 2010 20:32
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hey I changed the op a bit are people happy now?
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Jan 8, 2010 21:07
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Business Raptor posted:That being said, here is chon. I gotta second this band because they are all utterly phenomenal at their instruments, including the drummer who is 13 and still puts a lot of older drummers to shame (although he recently quit the band to be a kid). The guitarists can sweep pick like no ones fuckin' business. Seriously check these guys out. d0grent fucked around with this message at 09:36 on Jan 9, 2010 |
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Jan 9, 2010 09:29
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Decades posted:Heard Minus the Bear before, yeah. Both them and dynamos sound not bad at all but seem lighter on the "math" than what I had in mind. You're right about safe/stable rhythms. Minus the Bear switches time signatures and uses stuff besides 4/4, and that's all well and good, but really I just consider that a basic part of being in a good band almost regardless of genre. Basically what I have in mind is a band with the rhythmic complexity of Dillinger Escape Plan and the melody of, say, Grizzly Bear that embraces both extremes simultaneously without moderating either. It's kind of a ridiculous idea. May attempt to make it happen on my own some day though. Hmm, the closest thing I can think of to what you are describing is Protest The Hero. Have you heard of them? Their latest album has a lot of technical metal influence but their first album leans closer to the punk side of things and definitely more poppy. Try this song (their sense of rhythm is great) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4Ct9rbxxbQ&feature=related Decades posted:Regarding the talk of time signatures, it's a bit of an oversimplification to equate odd signatures and time signature changes with math rock - as bands can use some of those tools without really qualifying as math rock while math rock bands can play in 4/4 just fine. I can't really explain why that is and what it means though. Kind of like how I know prog and math rock when I see them but couldn't actually describe the difference. Part of the problem certainly is that all of these terms are vague. I guess it's also a matter of what a given band does best and what techniques they emphasize. The term "math x" should be used lightly regardless especially considering the way things started off in this thread. There's a certain sound that bands have that makes people jump to using the term but I think it's a good basis to use for people to find new music. d0grent fucked around with this message at 07:38 on Jan 10, 2010 |
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Jan 10, 2010 07:31
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Ignitus posted:It's in the OP dude. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhMfz4HrcEA I'm not going to stop recommending this band until everyone in the thread listens to them. NarkyBark posted:I used to be in a math band called Ouch, it really is strange playing structured yet really random sortof stuff... https://www.myspace.com/ouchmetal I only listened to the first song on that myspace but it kicked rear end, and you guys are in Boston? I'm gonna have to come to a show of yours I'm just outside of Worcester quote:While I'm on the subject, speaking of polyrhythms, how can Meshuggah have not been mentioned? Pretty much everything they do consists of polyrhythms. Yeah Meshuggah are definitely a huge influence on the Mathcore scene
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Jan 12, 2010 10:05
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NarkyBark posted:We're playing in Worcester on Thurs the 21st at Ralphs, come by! Aw poo poo I'm seeing my cousins band on that friday and I can't take two days off work. I'm sure you'll be around again soon though right?
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Jan 15, 2010 10:05
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Primetime posted:As mentioned before, one of the biggest problems with the 'math' label is it encompasses way too many bands, so you can rarely find what you want. I personally love 65daysofstatic, Minus the Bear, Maps and Atlases, and now thanks to this thread, This Town Needs Guns. As I mentioned before, So Many Dynamos fit this bill pretty nicely. https://www.myspace.com/somanydynamos Listen to Progress and Artifacts of Sound
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Jan 18, 2010 21:02
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Sophian posted:There's a lot more of these bands than I thought. Maybe we need separate Math Rock and Mathcore/Math metal threads? More people would post if the topic was refined a bit maybe... If I had to guess I'd say that 1 out of every 4 bands recommended in this thread aren't "actually" math-whatever. That being said, I don't think there is enough interest to really merit two separate threads on this, especially if a separate Mathcore thread served only to suck posts away from the Metalcore thread. One reason I think they should stay combined in the topic is that many people that listen to one of the genres find it easier to get into the other.
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Jan 21, 2010 11:06
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the Bunt posted:So many dynamos is at least cool because it's a palindrome Prog Doctor posted:Also, no one's mentioned Don Ellis yet. His bands have put out some crazy tunes. For instance, on the album "Tears of Joy" there's a song called "Bulgarian Bulge". It's in 33/16. Basically anything you pick up from Don Ellis will be mathematically challenging and fun to listen to.  Anyone listen to that collaboration between Mars Volta and Hella? I have mixed feelings about it. I mean... it sure does sound like Omar and Zach Hill in a studio together.
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Mar 22, 2010 06:25
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Unfortunate posted:-Lite Gotta mirror the love for this band. Bassist is especially fun to listen to but this is great instrumental work all around. the Bunt posted:I'm not sure if this sorta secret "supergroup" ORBS(members from Between the Buried and Me, Fear Before, Abigail Williams, Nightbear) would fall under this but they have a really spacey yet complex abstract psychedelic pop sound going on. This is loving great thanks.
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Mar 27, 2010 09:17
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Ambuletz posted:i've seen some great bands posted, I have lots but let's see some international math rock: Lobster rules, LITE rules, gonna check out the rest of these guys later MoaM posted:Might as well plug something a bit out of the way: U.S. Maple. Not exactly cookie-cutter time-signature, experimenting pioneers or anything (wouldn't label them solely as a Math Rock band either); certainly do fiddle with typical four-to-the-floor though and have got a place in your heart if your taste floats to the Don Cab section of "Math Rock". You shouldn't label any band solely as a math rock band.
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May 5, 2010 09:44
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I actually think the new Tera Melos is sounding great, feels like a little bit more structure was a good thing. Anyway, if you haven't heard of Mutiny On the Bounty, you made a mistake. Check this song out, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MYePPdHpuk&feature=related
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Aug 26, 2010 20:29
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Protest The Hero have new videos on their myspace page about the upcoming album. Here's the first one: https://vimeo.com/12473761 Also someone mentioned Cinemechanica a couple pages back and they need to be brought up again because their drummer kicks more rear end than two donkeys in an MMA cage match and they rule: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmV1RGhO_JA
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Oct 11, 2010 06:09
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Eight Is Legend posted:Has rooftops been mentioned yet? Because they rock: http://www.myspace.com/rftps Thanks for this, you were right. Pyroxene Stigma posted:So what the hell happened to Minus the Bear between their last album and Omni? I forgot this came out, haven't even listened to it yet. Is it watered down?
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Oct 29, 2010 05:42
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Pogobubba posted:I listened to this album a lot in the week after it came out to prepare for a concert I went to. It started out disappointing and did not improve at all. I was hugely disappointed because up until then they were the only one of my favorite few bands who were still releasing good music. Wow, didn't know that. But on the other hand Botch's bassist Brian Cook is in These Arms Are Snakes and Russian Circles and they both kick rear end: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOQmc9A4kcA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rm5AzUXCFfo
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Oct 31, 2010 22:50
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apophenium posted:Lots of good recommendations in this thread. Have to add my own. This needs love. Both of these bands are total keepers. And So I Watch You From Afar is pretty post rocky, but they absolutely KILL it in the rhythm section. Ambuletz posted:Saw that this thread had been bumped since my last post, here ya guys go: Echoing the love for Giraffes? Giraffes! and Antarctic. Gonna check out the rest of these bands cause I'm sure I'll enjoy most of them
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Dec 11, 2010 22:08
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Protest The Hero have another update on their page, this time for vocals. Looks like they're bringing back the chick from Kezia! Check it out: https://vimeo.com/17820844
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Dec 30, 2010 23:35
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I know I've been doing nothing but pimping this band recently, but Protest The Hero just officially announced their new album:quote:Toronto, Ontario – (18 January, 2011) - Protest the Hero will release their 3rd studio album, Scurrilous, on March 22 on Universal Music Canada. Scurrilous is the follow up to the 5 piece band’s Number 1 debuting 2008 sophomore release, Fortress, and reunites the band with producer Julius “Juice” Butty. I've heard that band Tessaract before and I remember them kicking rear end. I'll definitely be picking up tickets when they come around to New England.
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Jan 18, 2011 20:23
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I just stumbled on some new songs from Cinemechanica and now I'm really psyched for their upcoming album. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkp1QtxGCHg What do you guys think?
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Feb 15, 2011 10:43
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Exactly. Calling something math rock is akin to calling something "experimental". It attributes a general idea of style but doesn't necessarily categorize any band specifically. To lump a blanket term like that across such a wide array of bands is ridiculous. I do agree that there are some bands that use technical wankery as a crutch but that's not limited to "math rock" and it's the bane of many more varieties of complicated music.
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Mar 14, 2011 02:23
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Yo, dropping in to say what's up cause I found a loving AWESOME band called Proceed. Check out this song: http://soundcloud.com/proceedband/04-strange-meeting
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Mar 24, 2011 23:23
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Speaking of lyricless math rock, I just checked out the debut S/T from Antarctic. They're signed to Hello Sir Records, the same label as Maserati, So Many Dynamos, and Cinemechanica. Anyone who's a fan of those bands or Rooftops should definitely give them a listen.
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Jun 2, 2011 23:32
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^^^ I'm loving this-Atom- posted:Tera Melos is coming out with a tour documentary I love when that drunk chick calls them "generic" in an attempt to be pretentious  . Definitely gonna pick this up, thanks.smell the witch posted:I really don't see much of a point in worrying too much about labeling the bands to a 'math' genre, considering that Protest The Hero, Don Caballero, ATDI and Meshuggah all count as 'math' bands but they all come from different genres. The "math x" (math rock, mathcore) label I just find useful in telling me these bands all share characteristics that I love (odd time signatures, elements of experimentation, noise), not that they all sound the same. Any band with odd-time signatures and complex structures can be labeled as math, doesn't make them a 'math' band, and saying so denotes they're not interested in anything but technicality. I mean, one of the reasons I like these bands so much is because they're usually so restrained from genres and do their own thing. True, the term math rock was originally intended to be insulting.
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Jul 12, 2011 20:24
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That new Hella is sounding really loving good, and I'm super excited for the new Giraffes? Giraffes! This video is a year old but I assume this song is gonna be on their new album http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Asb3FRvq38I&feature=player_embedded
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Aug 18, 2011 20:09
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I haven't even heard the whole album yet and it's killer. Between this and Tera Melos' "Patagonian Rats" it has been a good year for math rock already. Still no release date for Giraffes? Giraffes! :[ Oh and btw, Mutiny on the Bounty are just about done with their new album. From their Facebook: "We're officialy done with the recording, tomorrow we keep going with the mix for a whole week. It sounds already killer like that, add a couple of good reverbs, compressor, tons of work and magic tricks from mister Bayles and it will sound magic  "They're recording with Matt Bayles who has produced records from the bands Botch, Minus the Bear, The Fall Of Troy, Mastodon, Russian Circles etc... So it's looking like this record will have a seriously good sound to it.\ For those unfamiliar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMQ2pSBHjWE
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Aug 25, 2011 20:11
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redz posted:September 30th! They are playing a show with Thee Silver Mt. Zion Memorial Orchestra on the same date in Boston. I am really considering driving a pretty good distance to see that show. Oh snap, I'm an hour away from Boston so I think I'm gonna go to this.
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Aug 31, 2011 07:47
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gently caress yes, after being disappointed by Opeth and Mastodon in the same week, this album is making me feel so much better. I think this'll be my favorite G?G! album.
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Sep 22, 2011 02:07
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Rolo Tomassi kinda sounds like iwrestledabearonce tried to be Converge. Can't really get behind the vocalist. Their bassist has a great heavy sound though.
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Aug 22, 2012 07:51
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the Bunt posted:FERO LUX are my heroes. I'm proud of them, they opened for Circa Survive in Orlando the other day! They put on some of the best performances I've seen and the music is very "smart" but most importantly its super loving passionate. I hope they get a lot bigger. This was giving me some serious Botch vibes and that is a very good thing.
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Dec 11, 2012 03:44
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-Atom- posted:Tera Melos is turning into a band that isn't quite like Tera Melos, but I still find myself interested in this direction they have taken. Did you.. did you just link me to a Dinosaur Jr. track? Seriously though, I was a big fan of Patagonian Rats and a lot of that had to do with how their guitar tone has evolved. The vocals sound nice and dreamy too, but the actual song writing of that new track leaves a little much to be desired. Air Julio posted:Anyone listen to Rooftops? A buddy has played a few tracks for me and they seem like they would fit in here. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mp60LTGerNQ I love rooftops because they manage to blend complexity with soft calming riffs so well. They also somehow manage to have that cliche "math rock" guitar tone while still sounding unique in a way. Here's my favorite song off the album: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlnOSKmjyV4 Fun Fact - All the song names on that album are anagrams of each other. d0grent fucked around with this message at 01:45 on Jan 18, 2013 |
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Jan 18, 2013 01:39
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I loving love These Arms Are Snakes! I can definitely tell there's a member of botch in there, I think it's the bassist. Here's one of my favorites: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOQmc9A4kcA If you like that then you should definitely pick up their first album "Oxeneers or the Lion Sleeps When Its Antelope Go Home" Oh and I'm digging that other Tera Melos track, can't wait to hear the full album!
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Feb 26, 2013 09:04
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The Fall of Troy's album "Manipulator" was pretty jazzy in some songs, though some people find it hard to get into the vocalist. I still think this song kicks all kinds of rear end: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBfnjcRLBQE
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Mar 1, 2013 01:56
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And here's a couple tracks by "The Cancer Conspiracy" that fit your description better and you're far more likely to enjoy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dbqoqJsDYI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePL47v5tbmo d0grent fucked around with this message at 02:08 on Mar 1, 2013 |
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Mar 1, 2013 02:05
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