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rmdx
Sep 22, 2013

Slavvy posted:

Is it noticeable when you ride the bike? I'm having difficulty picturing which direction the play is in. Does the wheel just move back and forth along the axis of the 'axle'? By how much?

If I grab the top of the rear tire with one hand and the left passenger footpeg with the other, I can move the top of the tire by maybe 1-2mm. Less when it's been parked overnight.

I don't notice it when riding, but that doesn't mean much.

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Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

Stitecin posted:

Z3n didn't you say you were looking for a cbx at one point? I know you're a bit over projects at the moment but there's one on Craig's List in Walnut Creek at the moment. It's priced at $4,500 which seems laughably high.

Yeah that's pretty high - but I have a friend who might be interested. The carbs being clogged and poo poo is less than ideal for sure. The 79 is the most desireable year by collectors so it might fetch that. Or it might be possible to talk him down a ways...thanks for the heads up :)

Slavvy posted:

Is it noticeable when you ride the bike? I'm having difficulty picturing which direction the play is in. Does the wheel just move back and forth along the axis of the 'axle'? By how much?

What rmdx said - I would guess it's been there since new. I didn't notice any problems when riding it on track, probably because the wheel would move only when you were transferring load from one side of the wheel to the other. My concern is with something like that on every transition you're hammering the gently caress out of where ever that play is, which will trash races, bearings, etc.

rmdx - what color did you get? Done any mods yet?

rmdx
Sep 22, 2013

It's black, same as yours - no mods as such, but I've been working my way through the Powerparts and Racefoxx catalogs bit by bit. So far I've the seatcowl, sidebags, tail tidy, clutch cover, levers, new reservoir caps etc. Got today the newest addition, a set of white glossy plastics, waiting for the corresponding sticker set before fitting. No photos unfortunately right now.

About 6500km on the odo, including eight or so trackdays - I ride in the medium (middle) group so not really pushing the bike anywhere near its limits. Stupid fun nevertheless.

What I've been most surprised about is how drat versatile it is - sharp on the track, comfy on the road, commuting is painless too.

If anybody is on the fence, get down and buy one.

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!

I can't help but think "maybe there's a $17,000 bike I could buy that doesn't have wheel-fall-off syndrome".

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Safety Dance posted:

I can't help but think "maybe there's a $17,000 bike I could buy that doesn't have wheel-fall-off syndrome".

Or at the very least, improperly pre-loaded rear wheel bearings by the sounds. Is this the first SSA KTM?

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

rmdx posted:

It's black, same as yours - no mods as such, but I've been working my way through the Powerparts and Racefoxx catalogs bit by bit. So far I've the seatcowl, sidebags, tail tidy, clutch cover, levers, new reservoir caps etc. Got today the newest addition, a set of white glossy plastics, waiting for the corresponding sticker set before fitting. No photos unfortunately right now.

About 6500km on the odo, including eight or so trackdays - I ride in the medium (middle) group so not really pushing the bike anywhere near its limits. Stupid fun nevertheless.

What I've been most surprised about is how drat versatile it is - sharp on the track, comfy on the road, commuting is painless too.

If anybody is on the fence, get down and buy one.

I want to make a topcase setup for it, cause that would be really practical and nice. Gonna make some CF bullshit for it. Going to do the wheels soonish. But yeah, my favorite thing is the very same about it - totally versatile, can do anything well. Wheel control could use some sorting, wish I could change TC/ABS modes on the fly, but those are minor gripes.

Safety Dance posted:

I can't help but think "maybe there's a $17,000 bike I could buy that doesn't have wheel-fall-off syndrome".

You could buy like 16 KLRs, by the odds one of them might not shed an essential part within the first 3500 miles.

Slavvy posted:

Or at the very least, improperly pre-loaded rear wheel bearings by the sounds. Is this the first SSA KTM?

Yeah, their first SSA.

FlerpNerpin
Apr 17, 2006


Slavvy posted:

Or at the very least, improperly pre-loaded rear wheel bearings by the sounds. Is this the first SSA KTM?

Yeah, their first shot for a production bike.

One KTM dealer apparently got word it was an over tightening issue, that the factory set the specs too high but I'm not sure how long that'll fly.

Z3n posted:

Wheelie control could use some sorting

Wheelie control setup is flat out lovely, which is too bad, because its one of two problems with the bike. The other being another level of sensitivity or two is needed for the TC. A ECU flash that allows you to tune the TC & turn off the anti-wheelie separate from the other nannies turns this frown upside down.

FlerpNerpin fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Jul 29, 2014

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.
Ehh, I dunno, the spec is 160 foot pounds, yeah, it's high, but it's not crazy for SSAs - 1199 has the same spec.

FlerpNerpin
Apr 17, 2006


The other rumor floating out there is that Ducati's spec is 2mm, and Triumphs spec is 2mm of play, so there is no problem, but KTM is taking it seriously at anything over 1mm.

I guess it's still early days at the factory with this, probably don't have a lot of data to say 'what kind of issue is this over 30k miles?'

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

Spiffness posted:

The other rumor floating out there is that Ducati's spec is 2mm, and Triumphs spec is 2mm of play, so there is no problem, but KTM is taking it seriously at anything over 1mm.

I guess it's still early days at the factory with this, probably don't have a lot of data to say 'what kind of issue is this over 30k miles?'

I'd like to get a dial gauge on mine and see what the actual travel is on it. I'd estimate it's about 1mm right now when hot.

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!

Z3n posted:


You could buy like 16 KLRs, by the odds one of them might not shed an essential part within the first 3500 miles.


:wink:

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

Realpostin' - a buddy of mine snapped 2 of the rear bolts off of his KLR hub due to some previous damage, no problems for another 10k miles until he finally pulled a rusted up replacement off of an abandoned burning man KLR that was under a pile of garbage in oakland.

Real KLRs of the Bay Area.

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.
Update on the KTM rear wheel:

quote:

Just got off the phone with the dealership - (very pleased that they returned my call as promised, despite it being quite a bit after close...)

So, here's the deal:
Some amount of play is expected by design.
Their engineers are reviewing the technical specs to determine a boundary of appropriate vs. inappropriate play - that is in process, and will be communicated once agreed on by KTM.
They are going to disassemble/reassemble my rear wheel assembly and verify that everything was assembled appropriately, as well as inspect for damage and record current play -- charged to KTM, of course.
KTM stands behind their bikes and will replace any parts if they are out of spec.
There is no safety or liability issue with rear wheel lock up, rear bearing damage, etc, to ride the bike with the play that is currently present.

I'll pick up my bike tomorrow or maybe the day after.

I'll keep folks posted on the spec for play as I discover it.

rmdx
Sep 22, 2013

That's good news I guess, and pretty much in line with what I was told. Now you just need to go ride the pants off it!

Beve Stuscemi
Jun 6, 2001




I dont get why single sided swingarms are even a thing. There are always so many more problems over a normal swingarm its not worth it. Between these weird play issues, bearing issues, etc, its not even worth it.

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

Jim Silly-Balls posted:

I dont get why single sided swingarms are even a thing. There are always so many more problems over a normal swingarm its not worth it. Between these weird play issues, bearing issues, etc, its not even worth it.

Beve Stuscemi
Jun 6, 2001




I get that they're cool looking, but does it add anything that a regular swingarm doesnt? Aside from problems?

Maybe this is a :myducati: thing that I fundamentally dont understand

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!

Racing bikes need single sided swingarms for quick rear tire changes, so the answer is "because racecar".

Ola
Jul 19, 2004

Without single sided swingarms it's impossible to duct tape a GoPro on the wheel hub and go for a ride.

https://vimeo.com/101358524

rmdx
Sep 22, 2013

It makes the rear wheel easier to clean. It could also offset the weight of the exhaust on the other side, allowing for a lower total weight.

Many bikes forfeit that aspect and route the pipes under the seat to properly show off the SSA though.

Even so it's mostly about the coolness factor.

FlerpNerpin
Apr 17, 2006


rmdx posted:

It could also offset the weight of the exhaust on the other side, allowing for a lower total weight.

This isn't true, as a SSA requires extra stiffening materials so it ends up heavier. This is why moto-GP bikes all have normal style swingarms. Ducati sacrifices the extra weight for looks in the factory WSBK bikes (well, and the homologation rules).

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

Jim Silly-Balls posted:

I get that they're cool looking, but does it add anything that a regular swingarm doesnt? Aside from problems?

Maybe this is a :myducati: thing that I fundamentally dont understand

If the design is good (KTMs is), it makes chain adjustments super easy.

Powdercoating wheels is easier cause you don't have to pull rotors.

That's, uh, about it.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Jim Silly-Balls posted:

I get that they're cool looking, but does it add anything that a regular swingarm doesnt? Aside from problems?

Maybe this is a :myducati: thing that I fundamentally dont understand

Despite the various justifications provided, it is 100% because it looks loving awesome.

infraboy
Aug 15, 2002

Phungshwei!!!!!!1123
They shouldn't be any less reliable than normal swingarms, Honda has been using them on VFRs for a couple decades now with no major issues.

Shimrod
Apr 15, 2007

race tires on road are a great idea, ask me!

Hey Z3n, quick question - you have a rear brake master cyclinder laying around for a ZX6e? They want $550 retail for a new one over here in Aus land so I figured I'd check if you had a spare and throw you a not loving ridiculous amount of money if it's working before ebaying one and just hoping it works.

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

Shimrod posted:

Hey Z3n, quick question - you have a rear brake master cyclinder laying around for a ZX6e? They want $550 retail for a new one over here in Aus land so I figured I'd check if you had a spare and throw you a not loving ridiculous amount of money if it's working before ebaying one and just hoping it works.

No, sorry. I can reship one from here if availability is crap there.

Shimrod
Apr 15, 2007

race tires on road are a great idea, ask me!

All good, thanks anyway, just got off the phone to a wrecker in Brisbane and he can get me a working one for $85. Fkn $550, what a joke. I can do a full brembo swap from a 'blade for that.

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

quote:

SuperDuke Rear Shock
58mm stroke
383mm length
325mm full compression
156mm stock rear wheel travel
1mm shock travel -> 2.7mm rear wheel travel

ADV R Rear Shock
70mm stroke
406mm overall length
220mm travel
336mm full compression
220mm stock rear wheel travel
1mm shock travel -> 3.15mm rear wheel travel

ADV shock -> Superduke
+62.1mm ride height
+32.4mm travel
+30mm/1.1 inches of clearance at full bottom
188mm/7.4 inches of total travel

Front forks
Superduke 125mm travel
SMR 160mm (+35mm) travel
ADV Forks 190mm (+65mm) travel
ADV R 220mm (+95mm) travel
Longer travel ride height adjustment range ~50mm

Don't mind me, just guaranteeing KTM comes out with a 1290 SM.

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.
KTM poo poo doesn't work cause of exhaust clearance.

RS125/450 still rotting, waiting for motivation.

999 back in the garage. Nemesis TCS unit purchased for no skill riding.

BlackMK4
Aug 23, 2006

wat.
Megamarm

Z3n posted:

Nemesis TCS unit purchased for no skill riding.

Played cat and mouse with a S1000R at a trackday today... thing laid down darkies leaving every corner. Pretty loving cool to watch. TC for cool poo poo.

BlackMK4 fucked around with this message at 23:53 on Oct 18, 2014

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

BlackMK4 posted:

Played cat and mouse with a S1000R at a trackday today... thing laid down darkies leaving every corner. Pretty loving cool to watch. TC for cool poo poo.

Yeah just need to get the wiring harness adapters, it seems like they're stupid expensive, but I've got some tricks up my sleeve still...

And on to the carbon stuff - first project was a carbon fiber heat shield, but that hasn't gone well yet and we'll just leave it be.

Second project was just a silly wet layup carbon fiber fender eliminator, like so:


I'm not 100% pleased with it, but it's not bad for a first pass. I'll probably sand things smooth and fill some of the other areas where I didn't cut it cleanly and the wrap it in a final layer of carbon to cover up all my mistakes.

Only carbon bits visible with the plate mounted:


Shout out to Jay-Z, telling it how it should be: All carbon everything.

BlackMK4
Aug 23, 2006

wat.
Megamarm
How expensive is it to get into trying wet layup cf?

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.
Not super expensive - maybe 200 bucks for all the supplies. I used this store, and spent about 600 bucks so I wouldn't have to worry about running out of supplies and stuff. I've got piles of fiberglass, kevlar, and CF.

http://www.cstsales.com/

They also have some pretty decent tutorials, which is why I bought from them.

Raven457
Aug 7, 2002
I bought Torquemada's torture equipment on e-bay!
plate holder looks really nice, man. good work

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

Raven457 posted:

plate holder looks really nice, man. good work

Thanks! I'm gonna clean it up a bit, might even try and sell them in the future :)

Frozen Pizza Party
Dec 13, 2005

Z3n posted:

Thanks! I'm gonna clean it up a bit, might even try and sell them in the future :)

You should make one for the 690 too... I'll gladly test it out for you :)

Aargh
Sep 8, 2004

Compared to a minimal fender eliminator style plate holder, how much weight are you saving going CF?

Z3n
Jul 21, 2007

I think the point is Z3n is a space cowboy on the edge of a frontier unknown to man, he's out there pushing the limits, trail braking into the abyss. Finding out where the edge of the razor is, turning to face the darkness and revving his 690 into it's vast gaze. You gotta live this to learn it bro.

Aargh posted:

Compared to a minimal fender eliminator style plate holder, how much weight are you saving going CF?

Oh god, nothing. Maybe a 1/10th of a pound? I mean, I own a Ducati these days but I haven't reached the point of obsessively weighing everything. My last holder was 2 bits of metal so this is lighter but it's all just insignificant dickwaving, honestly.

Aargh
Sep 8, 2004

Z3n posted:

Oh god, nothing. Maybe a 1/10th of a pound? I mean, I own a Ducati these days but I haven't reached the point of obsessively weighing everything. My last holder was 2 bits of metal so this is lighter but it's all just insignificant dickwaving, honestly.

Oh good, I thought I was missing something. Don't get me wrong I love CF and learning a new process for making something is always fun but it seems a lot of people obsess about CF parts these days when steel is probably more suited. Sure it might weigh a little more but it costs a shitload less when you buy it and if /when it breaks.

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Barnsy
Jul 22, 2013

Aargh posted:

Oh good, I thought I was missing something. Don't get me wrong I love CF and learning a new process for making something is always fun but it seems a lot of people obsess about CF parts these days when steel is probably more suited. Sure it might weigh a little more but it costs a shitload less when you buy it and if /when it breaks.

Making things out of CF is actually easier than out of steel (in my opinion), especially if you want to work with rounded shapes. Not necessarily lighter because you generally use a fair bit of epoxy/thick carbon weave.

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