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Finished Red Country today. Biggest area of improvement to his stuff is definitely his ability to make me tear up something vicious. Got through the whole of The First Law/Best Served Cold without a sniffle, heroes got me pretty good at the end but this one just loving ruined me. Some of the plotting was a bit too pat, and some of the dialogue was over-written but other than that it was an absolute blast. Really loved Lamb's slide back towards what he was, and the way it ended with him chasing after his bloody past.
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Nov 5, 2012 01:11
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Bedesh, I think?
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Dec 3, 2012 19:28
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Red country has a languorous first half. Most of his books are tight and pacey and focussed and come blasting out the starting blocks, this one really does just wallow in it for about half the book. Personally I thought it absolutely paid off, but as with all media, ymmv.
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Dec 4, 2012 21:49
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I hear a lot of people saying things like "the first book was a bit meh" and "whole lot of setup and not a lot of payoff" and I honestly just don't understand. I mean if you aren't On Board the by the time Glokta falls downstairs I can't imagine we're reading the same book.
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Dec 15, 2012 18:03
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Glokta is a torturer who works for an organisation that tortures people through official sanction. Logen is a lunatic murderer who comes from a land that venerates lunatic murderers. They are both likeable, and both sympathetic. Anyone who didn't love "Courage, Sand, courage" is Not Reading It Right.
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Dec 20, 2012 20:16
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The second book is the best one of the trilogy. It's between that, BSC and Heroes for which one of his I like best, you will love it.
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Jan 13, 2013 02:34
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The first one isn't going to come out until 2015 is it 
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Jan 27, 2013 11:31
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Neurosis posted:The world building is also generally a bit more interesting. The characters probably aren't on average quite as good, though.
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Feb 27, 2013 11:31
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I had no issues with Red Country on Kindle (UK). I think there was a typo, but that's all I remember.
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Mar 18, 2013 19:13
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Morveer was just the most compelling useless wanker. I mean, Abercrombie can usually seem get behind anybody but with Morveer you just felt the dislike seeping out of the ink. I hated him but he was really interesting to read about because he was totalling 'spergin ever so slightly and it was great. There was a lot of Cosca in Gorst.
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Mar 22, 2013 18:19
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Jeffrey posted:I propose hack and slash action game starring Logan. It doesn't have to be canon at all, have Logan fight the Feared and Shivers and Bayaz and the Maker's dragon. Also yeah, that's Not Logen at all. I would probably browse through a terrible comic adaptation if I got the feel that Joe got to make the calls on what stuff looked like. My problem with his books is that I never know know what some stuff looks like. I want to see The Divider and some Shanka and practical Frost concept art, much like that incredible Art of Discworld book (though interestingly even that got Vimes wrong by Pterry's own admission).
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Apr 7, 2013 17:57
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Most interesting Non-Joe fantasy I've read recently was the Prince/King of Thorns. Not sure what the status of the audio book is though. I finished a re-read just before Red Country and my love for each book increased apart from Last Argument of Kings, which at first read was epic and incredible but with a more detached eye is definitely his sloppiest writing. Best Served Cold is a hell of a thing though, I've got massive, massive hopes for his continued career as he's who I'm pinning my heart on to fill the void left by Pratchett. He'll need to get quite a bit more prolific.
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May 9, 2013 23:57
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syphon posted:Oh god, I started Prince of Thorns and gave it up after about 100-150 pages. To me, it epitomized the whole 'grimdark' phenomenon going on right now, and didn't appeal to me at all.
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May 11, 2013 11:31
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More than just that they don't exist, A thing being "Grimdark" has become this peculiar short-hand way of dismissing someone's work. And I've yet to see a Grimdarkian manifesto, or a definition of any kind.
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May 11, 2013 21:27
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Bakker remains the author who has made me feel the most legitimately uncomfortable when reading something (epilogue to book two). Not annoyed, not afraid, just plain old sick right down to the core. That said I've never read any of ASOIAF after how dull I found the first few chapters of GoT, but I did thoroughly enjoy Fevre Dream. 
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May 12, 2013 14:54
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Ornamented Death posted literally all of the sexual violence to date in the series on the last page. It's not a bright and happy read but it's not Bakker.
Evfedu fucked around with this message at 23:29 on May 13, 2013 |
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May 12, 2013 17:53
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Yup. Even the Shanka are symmetrical and cartoony, TFL Needs someone like Lewis Larosa.
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May 15, 2013 22:31
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I did not feel enthused at any of the action in Red Country. At all. And I'm not going to get into what a person should or is supposed to feel while reading but I really suspect that you weren't meant to enjoy any of the violence. Logen vs Glama felt like a really unpleasant mirror held up to Logen vs Fenris, the assault by the mercenaries on the Dragon Enclave was literally heart-breaking, and even Savian's last stand was nothing noble or heroic, he literally dies thinking "man I hope that girl doesn't do this poo poo like me-" and is then blown ingloriously to pieces from afar. The euphoric bits of the book were when Temple finds Pitt, or when Logen stops Ro running off. In terms of Cosca becoming cartoonish, the guy has been larger than life ever since Dagoska was besieged. Obvs if it didn't work for you, it didn't work, but it was a very different book to his others.
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May 22, 2013 12:41
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Requires Only That You Hate is probably the only place I've ever been online that actually justifies a tone argument.
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May 23, 2013 19:26
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Zeitgueist posted:I think that Abercrombie's response is about as good as you're going to see from the author of a book, though it shouldn't excused. Realizing that you made a huge mistake and wrote an entire gender poorly in your 3 book series doesn't make it less bad that you made the mistake. However, I'm glad he has stated he made a conscious effort to be better in later books, and I think he has a bit.
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May 24, 2013 21:04
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Zeitgueist posted:I think it should be recognized that he made mistakes, rather than saying "well he got better in later books so that's OK". Not that anyone here is saying that, I'm just saying it's something I've seen done and shouldn't happen. I commend that Joe recognized the problem and took steps, that's far beyond most fantasy authors. But there's a reason why he made that mistake in the first place.
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May 25, 2013 10:48
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Lemon Curdistan posted:I'm not Zeitguesit but I am fairly sure he's talking about rape culture (which, yeah, is doubtless why anyone would have considered that an acceptable plot device at all - I mean, the failure here is systemic since neither the author, the proofreaders or the editors stopped long enough to go "this is lovely, we should probably not do this"). I'm not arguing that Terez was well-handled but we never got the Gurkish dentist/Salem Rews/Anyone else under the knife as a POV and no-one cried foul there.
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May 26, 2013 11:30
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They're books that excuse evil in that the perpetrator's never really have a choice but to do evil. Even Bethod at the end of the third one was basically getting pushed one way by Logen then another by Caurib. It's a pretty accurate portrayal of a medieval world in that you either join the inquisition or get treated to a spiky seat. I guess Bayaz/Khalul/Caurib could be said to be evil, but we never really get a look into their heads so who knows.
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May 29, 2013 19:52
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I think there was a whole monologue in the first book where he basically laid out "it's torture people or go home and lie around in my own poo poo" (paraphrased). I may be repeating myself at this point but applying 2013 conventional SJW morality to a cripple tortured beyond his breaking point in search of whether he is a Good or Bad Person is... not a good way to approach the character. Bayaz/Khalul do seem like total dicks, though.
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May 31, 2013 10:03
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@Affi: I Think It's a Bit More Complicated Than That.
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May 31, 2013 10:55
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Red Country spoiler That's what Logen looks like in my brain. Dumb sexed up version of Shy though.
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Jun 17, 2013 21:26
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He's been a little Space Marine'd there, but I though Shy was meant to be five foot nothing, while Logen is an easy 6'6".
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Jun 17, 2013 21:52
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Not My Goodies posted:Logen looks like Mickey Rourke in The Wrestler, except bigger and uglier. Morgan's fantasy is really interesting, but aggressively confrontational about you trying to get into it. Like, the tone and speech is all wrong (deliberately) and if you think Prince of Thorns is unpleasant then you ain't seen nothing.
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Jun 18, 2013 15:51
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There was an enormous change in his demeanour in the second book and the scene around the campfire, and the bit where he literally fantasised about killing the unconscious Bayaz, and the bit where he broke the pot over a bandits skull and crushed it into jelly and and and and. It's only a twist because it turns out to not be an Eater.
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Aug 5, 2013 23:28
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Yep, from the first time in the first book he always brings up the cold of the other side, which is where the magic comes from. The bloody nine is absolutely a distinct magical entity, but Logen can choose to block him out of his life and doesn't do so. So again, complicated dude morally speaking.
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Aug 10, 2013 13:25
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Mr.48 posted:Not really, we see the Bloody-Nine seizing control regardless of Logen's wishes whenever Logen is badly injured and doesnt have the mental energy to stop it. In Red Country it's been over a decade since a B9 sighting and he wades back into violence with a great big smile.
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Aug 11, 2013 16:03
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I honestly thought the whole trilogy owned bones from the second Glotka fell down the stairs. So, uh, keep reading at your own risk.
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Oct 11, 2014 00:25
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Fucken double posting from my phone.
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Oct 11, 2014 00:25
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Yeah just pop something in the op about spoilers maybe not being strictly adhered to in the thread so probably don't read an 88 page conversation about Joe's books until you've actually read all the books just in case. Still, I think I do prefer spoiler tags personally because I know I hate being spoiled and after reading one book in a series I'll go to a thread and go "hey dudes I just finished this cool book by the author this thread's about! I'd like to talk about it!". But I'm a horrible neeerd.
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Oct 19, 2014 00:00
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Khizan posted:The biggest problem with the last book of Land Fit for Heroes is more that it doesn't actually wrap anything up; it ends like it's book 3 of 4 instead of 3 of 3.
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Dec 18, 2014 00:24
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Chamberk posted:drat, you guys are getting me psyched up. I'm planning a reread of the First Law sometime later this year, and I'll probably reread all of the standalones as well. Abercrombie is drat good. Also BSC is so much better second time around.
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Feb 23, 2015 17:30
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Glokta is Abercrombie's best character. I know he's just tall, crippled Tyrion but gently caress me he's just the perfect mixture of horrifying honesty and black humour. God I love The First Law. I did feel somewhat unsatisfied on my first read through, but I think it's just how things are. I mean, we aren't exactly overthrowing evil irl so why should he write the kind of nostalgic comforting fantasy that portrays this? Bad vs Worse, not Good vs Bad; and all that. The second time round I far better grasped his objective and themes, so I enjoyed the ending much more. E: Also I just finished Richard Morgan's "Land Fit For Heroes" trilogy and would recommend it without reservation. The first book is a little generic but it really, really improves as it goes along and The Dark Defiles is absolutely superb.
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Apr 17, 2015 10:35
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It was the stair and porridge monologues. There's a part of a Doctor House in him as well and there's something magnetic about that kind of brutal, destructive honesty.
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Apr 17, 2015 10:40
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No, you should give up because he uses adjectives and you have isolated sentence fragments that seem awkward when marooned without context. I dunno, man, his writing improves with time but he isn't and doesn't aspire to be McCarthy. Read the books, make up your own mind.
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Jun 29, 2015 14:42
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For real the shattered sea trilogy owns. Owns hard. Finished Half a War in, like, 48 hours and loving loved it. Gotta be honest, though, you'd have to be a loving idiot to call Half the World and Half a War "Young Adult". Yeah great the men who choke to death on their own blood don't swear while they're doing it. Safe For Kids! I guess Post-Apoc-Fantasy is kinda the In Thing right now, huh
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Jul 22, 2015 10:44
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