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Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Inner Light posted:

I know exactly what you mean. Male senior leaders at every place I've been at have been consistently tall as gently caress. The football team captain in their high school days type guys. I don't know exactly what it means but it is very obviously a thing.

It means humans are dumb and their perceptions are untrustworthy

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Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
A former boss "gifted" me a copy of "Getting Things Done" and thus unlocked in my mind the virtue of weaponized office book-giving.


I think I'm going to give my new manager a printed copy of The Gervais Principle

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Salami Surgeon posted:

A coworker is someone I don't like who I have to work with
A buddy at work is someone I like and avoid working with

The true goal of becoming ungovernable is to turn all coworkers into buddies

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Shhhhhh don't use the C word, the C-Suite will hear you

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
I've been loudly quitting all year and it's not made much difference other than making my manager twitchy

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

remigious posted:

I am low key crushed that she said that because she’s always been a great person to work for and I looked up to her. There are many reasons I should update my resume, but I have to think pretty hard and weigh if more money is worth losing my fully remote, largely unsupervised job that I enjoy.

Similar has happened in my experience and I have thus come to pity management. Getting too close to the rules that business logic runs on destroys your humanity and critical thinking skills.

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Insufficiently deferent to authority - blacklisted

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Remembering the time the head of HR was so condescending it made me go home for the day afterwards and lolling at my then-boss's reaction:

"Would you like me to file a complaint with HR?"

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Tnuctip posted:

So does upper management really act they way they do because they’re that dumb, or do they not give a poo poo about what the people below them actually do?

I’m pretty sure that the answer is whatever will piss me off the most.

It helps to have a good understanding of nuclear physics, but the core of a corporation emits a high-energy decay particle that detaches the things and people exposed to it from reality, the closer you get, the higher your dose

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
I've got a sort of similar issue to Qubee in that I know the answer is "Just leave" but I got shoved under a brand-new-to-managing manager (who I didn't like before this) during a re-org this year, and have been trying to escape them without success ever since. Telling them how I work best and how they can get me to be productive again has been futile - I will perform as they desire when they desire or else. I snapped off and ordered them to follow through with the 'or else' and have since been put on paid leave for my mental health in hopes I return to pre-new-boss effectiveness.



Been using the time to job-hunt.



IF IT SUCKS, HIT DA BRICKS

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
The manager maybe, the prez flipped out; "what can we do to keep you here and make you happy?"


I didn't throw my manager under the bus though so nothing changed :shrug:

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Inner Light posted:

Did you….. did you not say money?

Alas, like an idiot I asked for autonomy instead. Manager had been using money as a carrot/stick to no success anyway, wouldn't have been on-theme.

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Something Awful: Corporations Make You Stupid

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

pmchem posted:

he's either terribly bad or management material

"They're the same picture."

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
The intense desire to tell one's manager "I'm not surprised you're having trouble hiring anyone", quenched by the knowledge that they would self reflect and come to the conclusion that they have no control over it

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
From experience, dogs poo poo on the floor and get their own office privileges revoked

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Demanding competency from management is a great way to set yourself apart as a go-getter

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

teen witch posted:

Like they can sell, that’s clear, but it’s almost like they don’t understand what they’re selling, and what they can and cannot promise. And it’s not everyone, but there are some trends we’ve noticed.

This is an intentional feature.

E; beaten like an engineer trying to explain that the sales team has promised the customer something physically impossible

Car Hater fucked around with this message at 17:15 on Mar 2, 2023

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

bee posted:

I got voluntold today to talk for a couple of minutes in my org's ~200 person all-department weekly zoom about the importance of employee voice. Guess who balled up their courage, smiled with faux confidence and introduced themselves and their talking piece on mute?

:ughh:

Probably the best possible way to underscore the importance of employee voice. Have a pizza party, you earned it! - mgmt

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Trabant posted:

Serious question re: Mentoring

Every gigacorp I've worked for has made a big deal of their formal career mentoring programs. It's great! It helps you develop and grow! It can boost your career in new and exciting ways!

Except... I can never get anyone to tell me what exactly is discussed and what kind of guidance is offered in these conversations. Is it "consider learning about topic ______ because it's the way of the future in our industry" or is it "take classes in field ______ because there's a need for people who know it" or is it "think about moving into an org like _____ because your resume could use it" or... What exactly?

I know that each person who goes through this has different mentoring needs but surely someone can give me examples, things they could take action about. No, instead all of it is described in the abstract. As if it's the freaking Matrix.

So, if you've done something similar: could you please describe how/what you got out of it? Am I missing out on something, or is it old farts talking about how when they were coming up in the industry things were different!


It's an opportunity for your manager to look good by improving you. Actual initiative will be punished.

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Chainclaw posted:

I don't agree with that, but I've heard enough people claim that if somehow you stop coding or whatever for some time to manage people you can't code anymore, which is insane to me.

Having observed several IC's jump up and over me as I stubbornly cling to the right to do actual productive work, it's because management makes you stupid. Critical thinking skills atrophy when you're forced to internalize the logic of the company and reduce your worldview to whether or not the box is green for the objectives handed to you by someone who knows even less about the work than you do.

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Sundae posted:

Sundae: *observes grammatical and typographical errors in a document he's reviewing. Corrects them with Track Changes on*
Author: *rejects all grammatical and typographical suggestions, puts all that poo poo back into the document*

Oh well. I tried. :shrug:

Devil on Sundae's shoulder: "Threaten to destroy them and their heirs unto the last generation"

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Showbag Limo that breaks down regularly

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Vasudus posted:

There needs to be some kind of man on the mountain one. I'm here for the hard stuff and if you ask me to do some mundane tasks I'm going to take the absolute longest amount of time possible.

quote from a prior manager: "Thanks for pulling off that Minor Miracle, I could never have figured that stuff out. The PM said you were difficult though so I'm going to stick you on Remedial Task X and let them carry your work on Miracle forward"

Three months later after I've bailed: "PM here, Miracle doesn't work anymore and new guy can't figure it out, how did you make it happen? I'll buy you lunch."

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Sure they can, they just have to forsake all hope of long term survival

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Am I a bad person for pretty much exclusively asking when someone has time for an actual chat so that I can ask my question without posting a whole page of :words:?

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Lol yeah only people I'm tight with get any sort of inquiry about how they're doing - If I don't know you well, why would I give a poo poo? I've gotten pushback about not including details about what I want to talk about but once I start writing out the problem I start info-dumping and it's a waste of my time to write all that sooo

"Hey. Are you at your desk/free for a call? I need X minutes. lmk when works if not."

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Creating and running meetings is management's job, if they wanted me to do that they'd compensate me accordingly

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

~Coxy posted:


Perfectly acceptable, just state it in the form of "Hi X, I wanted to pick your brain about Y and show you this document/problem that I'm working on, can you let me know when you're free for a call and a screen share, or would you rather I book something in your calendar? Thanks!"

Nah I mean no Y. Never Y. If I say why I might as well ask Google

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Jenkl posted:

Ok and this is something you're unashamed to admit semi-publicly?

Management material.

I like actually accomplishing things, so no thanks






Do not, my friends become addicted to titles! They will take hold of you and you will resent your meetings!

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Zarin posted:

Personally, I like getting paid; as far as I can tell, when walking THAT path all roads lead to management.

I mean, I'm still an IC (hoping to fix that with whatever move I make next, even though people keep trying to bend my ear about how great laterals are) so maybe I'll change my tune when I finally get what (I think) I want :v:

Nah I'm way too spectrumy to live with the double-speak and myopic obsession with quarterly KPIs. Entering management actively erodes your brain, it's like a diet of pure sugar for your teeth. Not worth the extra money when I already have the power to say whether and when I'll do OT.

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
*flashing back to Head of HR lady telling me that my saying "I couldn't put down a problem I knew something was wrong with until it was fixed" meant I'd be laid off in the next recession, then immediately getting thanked for saving yet another senior manager's rear end because of that same obsessive trait*





It's pretty depressing that I learned all that stuff about camaraderie and leadership on college teams and in my fraternity and then it turns out to be a detriment to success in business

Car Hater fucked around with this message at 15:01 on Jul 21, 2023

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
How did you not burst out laughing

I'd have gotten myself canned

"eyo the boss is jerkin it! Clearly this meeting is worthwhile and important!"

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Sing it to the VP



Director makes a dollar

I make a dime

That's why he wanks on company time

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Atopian posted:

Speaking as someone who has usually been an IC, if they've been fine without management for that long, don't mess things up by overmanaging now.
Go in, fix problems that need to be fixed - even if that includes people and how they do things - but leave the other stuff alone, at least for a while.
I've had two good teams broken up by people coming in and feeling that they needed to make changes in order to be seen to be doing something.

With that in mind, how do you successfully tell a new manager that their relentless drive to put their mark on a hitherto functional situation is the thing killing productivity? Or does it just have to blow up in their face a few times so that they learn?

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Eric the Mauve posted:

Learn what? When it blows up it's your fault.

:sigh:

I just wanted to do interesting work and make enough to be comfortable without stressing about social stuff all the time. If I had known that was too much to ask I'd have gone into carpentry instead of engineering.

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Midjack posted:

Is the problem your manager, or do you manage the problem manager?

The former, but obviously the problem is me

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Theory: It's not about pulling one over on the peons, preserving company morale, or lying to keep financial gain coming at all. It's what the executive brain believes about itself and the world that they filter through rose-colored glasses. Their reality is so buttoned up in neoliberalism that they literally cannot handle negative thoughts about themselves, their decisions, the state of the company or the economy etc.

I once had an exec pat himself on the back at a company event for getting through a tough year but not having to cut any salaries when I and 3 other people had been laid off 6 months prior, I just happened to be the one who came back. Everyone started looking at me and then back to him and having a sort of "uhhhh" moment before he corrected and went "oh right except for Car Hater, glad to have you back" but still didn't mention the other 3.

Brainworms. Intensely powerful brainworms.

Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
I see some of myself in Employee A. Buy them a forums account.

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Car Hater
May 7, 2007

wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!
Just be condescending to them about their needing to straighten up or get fired and wait for them to quit/melt down


E; Employee A comes across as Autistic from your description so trick them into believing they can be an independent contractor and then just give them no work. Saves the company money and risk.


P.S. it's me, the employee that avoids 1:1's and doesn't want to be involved in any sort of politics or making my line manager look good to upper management. Just let me do some technical work and leave me alooooooneeeee

Car Hater fucked around with this message at 02:36 on Aug 22, 2023

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