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Alternative pants posted:About harmonies:
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May 15, 2010 05:56
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Hired Gun posted:The hardest part of harmony, to me, is when the harmony melody gets disjointed from the lead melody (for instance, when the harmony voice has to hold a note while the lead goes up or down). But that's the really exciting part!!!
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May 15, 2010 06:13
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Alternative pants posted:But that's the really exciting part!!! No doubt, it's just the hardest to come up with/sing.
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May 15, 2010 06:17
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Speaking of harmonies, I'm gonna re-ask a question I did in the General Question Thread as this is actually on topic. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpTesst2HN0#t=1m20s I can't figure what the harmony that comes in on this part of "The Real" by John Frusciante. I can sing the first few notes of it, but after that I just don't get it. Is it a typical harmony?
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May 15, 2010 06:26
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Awesome thread! I've been taking vocal lessons with a studio for nearly 8 years now. I've learned an awful lot, but I keep learning more every week. I adore singing and performing, but unfortunately, I'm not at the level where I've ever been paid to sing. I get all my venues through my studio, and lately it's been pretty sparse. It's usually a couple summer events, a trade show, and a few malls around Christmas time. I haven't sang anywhere since Chistmas.:/ My repertoire is also all over the place. 80's-90's pop, punk, rock, jazz, sock-hop and movie musical numbers. I haven't placed myself into a genre box yet. Anywho, a little over a year ago I had the opportunity to go into a real recording studio and do a one-off recording of a song I sing.  It's not perfect, but I was only able to sing it once. I've also improved a lot since then, but I can afford to go back to the recording studio on my own. Nessa fucked around with this message at 05:55 on May 17, 2010 |
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May 17, 2010 05:49
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Generally too much affectation and not enough foundation. There are multiple places where you aren't really owning the pitch and you're just sort of singing around a note. You should concentrate on singing everything as discrete tones and then later stylize them, but not at the sacrifice of the tone of the note. It sounds kinda breathy. And some of the phrasing/interpretation is kinda weird.
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May 17, 2010 06:04
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 I suppose I'd like more 'body' behind my voice? I know that a better mic would help, but especially live, my voice seems to get lost in the mix. Any tips?
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May 19, 2010 16:25
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Pedricko posted:I suppose I'd like more 'body' behind my voice? I know that a better mic would help, but especially live, my voice seems to get lost in the mix. Any tips? You're not a trained singer, right? It doesn't sound like it. You need to hold actual pitches and for longer. Right now it's very hokey dokey sing songy and you don't have a steady tonal center. You're mostly say-singing your way through the piece. Only on the longest most dramatic notes do we hear some actual singing. And you need to be doing that all the way through. If you ever see someone, particularly a thin/young female perform the National Anthem, notice how when they hit the lowest notes in the song, it sounds completely different. All the high notes sound beautiful and sustained while the low notes sound similar to their speaking voice. That's really bad. That's essentially what you're doing. You're not committing to the actual act of singing enough. You need to own and sing the song, instead of just singing along with it. Vocal lessons. Near the end, when you say "it's a small... crime" it's super, super obvious what's lacking. Triple Tech fucked around with this message at 04:54 on May 20, 2010 |
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May 20, 2010 04:49
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Triple Tech posted:You're not a trained singer, right? It doesn't sound like it. While I agree with what mostly you're saying, I think it comes off as a little overly harsh... I think Pedricko's got a really good start. Some improvements to make, for sure, but I would strongly disagree with the statement that there's no clear tonal center--he's pretty well on-pitch the whole time. His expressiveness and musicality are solid as well, especially for the style of music he's playing. Voice lessons are definitely the way to go--you'll learn to breathe from the diaphragm, and how to get that "body" that you're looking for.
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May 20, 2010 08:01
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My voice has been somewhat raspy for a little bit due to a cold so I thought it would be the perfect time to record this and add the grunge to it I thought it needed. Thoughts?
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May 20, 2010 16:03
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Air Rock posted:My voice has been somewhat raspy for a little bit due to a cold so I thought it would be the perfect time to record this and add the grunge to it I thought it needed. You've got a cool punky sound I like it. I think for such a punky sound you've got a bit too much reverb, particularly as you have a really crisp backing track. I think your vocals would work a lot better dry and in-your-face. Also not a huge fan of the mad shouty bits at the end with the interspersed high notes. The high notes were actually pretty impressive though, but I thought it didn't fit in with the rest of the song.
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May 20, 2010 17:08
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Here's a better sounding version of StormChasing
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May 23, 2010 02:36
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Well I finally got around to recording some new, and hopefully improved, tracks. At first I had huge trouble wrapping my mind and voice around the whole "don't sing like you talk" thing, but I finally figured it out (I think?) somewhat randomly while listening to "Drops of Jupiter" by Train.  There are a lot of guitar errors, and I flubbed the lyrics a few times on the second track since I just learned it, but you get the idea. I still find myself over-pronouncing R's a bit, but I think I'm getting better. One question I have is: how is my vibrato? For instance, on "Turned araaaaaaaaaaaound" I feel like its pitchy and lovely. Should I try to tighten it up, or leave it relatively wide? As for the redo of Long Black Veil, I know Triple Tech will hate the slides, but it's country and I just can't help it. So what do you think? Obviously there's still work to do on eliding consonants, but what's the next step? When I'm concentrating on singing smoothly, I tend to lose focus on pitch, so I guess I should work on making both natural and reflexive.
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May 28, 2010 05:18
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Hmm hmm, mixed bag! The second Veil definitely sounds like you're "singing" more. The first one sounds so hokey dokey in comparison. But the bad news is the pitch problems are more apparent. You're doing a great job sustaining notes on better vowels, but you just have to make sure you're supported and in tune. She's Got a Way was better pitch wise, but you're dropping the ball on something. Imagine if you will firing a rocket across a football field. Or a parabola in math, same thing. See how it makes a beautiful, natural arc. It's smooth and gradual, and there are no interruptions. That's what you want the majority of your 8 measure phrases so sound like. Like an arc. Something with an apex and a destination. In She's Got a Way, you start each phrase sorta good, and by the end, you're dropping the ball. The rocket is smashing into a wall. And you're not letting the arc finish beautifully. Anything you start you have to finish equally well. You can't just "say sing" the end of phrases. You work hard throughout to make it sound beautiful, from beginning to end. I say whatever delta/change/work you put into making Veil sound different, do that even more. Keep that as the foundation of your technique/sound. And then deviate from it once you've got it down. And be mindful of staying on pitch for sustained notes (all notes, really). But you're doing great! Keep working at it!
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May 28, 2010 05:42
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Pedricko posted:
I like this and the way you sing it, (fits the style) but it sounds like you aren't really taking very deep breaths and you're usually inhaling slightly immediately before each phrase starts. What I think of when I hear people say "body" is breath support. Practice standing up and singing LOUDLY while pushing air out from your diaphragm. Scales or other classical style exercises are probably the best for this, although you could do it with pretty much anything.
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May 28, 2010 05:44
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Triple Tech posted:Sweet Advice Thanks for the tips and explanations; I'll keep working on it for a bit and post something in a week or two. By the end of the summer I'm going to kick rear end.
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May 28, 2010 06:00
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=obrFNxdZTAk&feature=channel Heres what I hope is a much better version than the tindeck I posted earlier. Its from a gig I played shortly after new years. Sound is direct from the desk. Apologise for neckbeard. Thanks for the advice guys, I'm taking it all onboard. I know that breathing is a big issue for me.
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May 28, 2010 14:15
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99% of everything that's wrong can be solved with proper breath support, as AriTheDog pointed out. Your sustained notes are mad pitchy/flat. And as I was mentioning to before, it doesn't sound very musical. It sounds so breathy. Like your singing is done from the neck up with weakness and tension. Which is the complete opposite of what should be happening. Singing should come from deep within, from your diaphragm. You're trying to produce the "loudest", maximum amount of sound with the least amount of air. Right now you have very poor efficiency. You're expending a lot of air for very little sound, and that's where that breathy quality comes from. I don't know how to communicate this over text... Maybe try this, imitate an opera singer, like for comedy option. You have this big, rounded tone and you fill your stomach with air. Consequently, that's how real singing is done, but just not as comically. It needs to be as supported as that big opera singer dude. You don't hear air coming out of singers mouths (minus when the special effect calls for it). Your musicality will grow leaps and bounds once you find out how to support your sound. Edit: Things that help enable a clear sound. Stand up straight, one foot in front of the other, knees slightly bent. Pretend there's a pole through your entire body, keeping everything straight like you're a stick of meat on a BBQ. Raise your hands and arms above your head and that will elevate the rib cage. Lower your arms but don't lower your chest. Keep it up and open. Release any tension in your shoulders/mouth/face/etc. Keep water near by. I prefer to sing on an empty stomach. None of these things are directly related to your problem but they help reduce variation and afford consistency in your production. Triple Tech fucked around with this message at 20:02 on May 28, 2010 |
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May 28, 2010 19:57
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Make a hissing sound where you expel air from your teeth and try to hold it for a solid 30 seconds.
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May 28, 2010 20:03
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Well, I've been lurking in the musician's lounge for a while now - mostly due to spending more and more time playing music/singing. I'd like some feedback on my singing (bla bla I'm insecure etc).  This is probably a fairly good representation of my normal, relaxed singing voice. Edit: I guess I want to know how my pitch is. I'm aware that my voice is somewhat high-pitched, but I like having my guitar tuned down one semi-tone. Would it sound better if I brought it back up to standard tuning? Also, does the example sound like a fitting song for my voice? I can't record much more at the moment, but usually I like to sing John Frusciante songs. Screaming and all. Also, thank you. I'll think about that. Porcupine Hunted fucked around with this message at 10:43 on May 29, 2010 |
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May 28, 2010 22:16
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Porcupine Hunted posted:Well, I've been lurking in the musician's lounge for a while now - mostly due to spending more and more time playing music/singing. Try lengthening your vowels and shortening your consonants, if that makes sense. You have really long s, m, r, and other consonant sounds. Not bad at all though - if you're more specific on what you'd like to improve, or what you'd like feedback on, well, it'll be easier to give more feedback.
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May 29, 2010 06:11
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Preface: So I'm a nineteen year old male from a working-class English city and thus have been somewhat preconditioned to think that singing lessons are 'a bit gay'. In fact, I asked somebody about singing lessons once at the tender age of thirteen but was met with "What are you, a ponce?". It still hurts me a little inside. I'm also insecure on levels that would emotionally cripple most people. As far as style goes, I don't really want to be strutting around crooning out Volare, I don't want to be jiving around a stage singing hits from the shows and I certainly won't be starring in La Triviata any time soon. I don't want to take any grade certificates either, I just want to be taught how to be a stronger singer so I can write my own music and go and perform it around the world safe in the confidence that I don't suck absolutely horribly. I also have a naturally deep voice. I have a theory that listening to Leonard Cohen during my formative years made my voice creep downwards. If I'm not 'serious' about singing but I'd still like to sing, are lessons still a good idea? Is there any other way to get the confidence boost?
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May 29, 2010 20:08
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ascheapaschewinggum posted:Preface: So I'm a nineteen year old male from a working-class English city and thus have been somewhat preconditioned to think that singing lessons are 'a bit gay'. In fact, I asked somebody about singing lessons once at the tender age of thirteen but was met with "What are you, a ponce?". It still hurts me a little inside. I'm also insecure on levels that would emotionally cripple most people. If such a thing exists where you are, community college music classes are almost certainly the way to go. See if you can find an introduction to singing class. I wouldn't really recommend private singing lessons, unless you're planning to perform opera (or can't find any group lessons) it won't be worth the money. If you can read music (or have a piano that you can plunk stuff out on), I would actually recommend Vaccai, a book of singing exercises. I have a copy that came with a CD, but I could find one like that online - I'm sure it's out there though. It sounds ridiculous, and you will sound ridiculous, but attempting to imitate the singers on the CD will almost certainly improve the strength of your voice and your technique.
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May 29, 2010 21:07
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I've been in and out of bands over the last few years - last year saw me getting kicked out of my creation for (probably) lack of ability and it really hurts. Finding a new guitarist to work with is proving fruitless and I don't see the point wasting £50 or so a week on a tutor again when there's no guarantees I'll get at least SOME use out of it. Sigh. I really enjoyed singing but a huge lack of self confidence probably took over - which is a shame because when my band was on stage I felt on top of the world and in total control. It's just the rehearsal aspect that was the problem! Anyway, there's been some great critique in this thread and my thin confidence will probably take a battering because of this but my old Myspace could do with a bit of a battering to get me in the mood to better myself. Thanks for reading. https://www.myspace.com/foreignfields
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May 31, 2010 14:59
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Rankine Over Gash posted:I've been in and out of bands over the last few years - last year saw me getting kicked out of my creation for (probably) lack of ability and it really hurts. Finding a new guitarist to work with is proving fruitless and I don't see the point wasting £50 or so a week on a tutor again when there's no guarantees I'll get at least SOME use out of it. Sigh. (Amateur opinion) First impression: You're beating your voice into submission. It's as if you aren't quite warmed up, not relaxed enough - but screw it: You want to reach those notes, and you're going to! Thinking back, did it seem like you had to push yourself to sing those songs? Did it feel physically uncomfortable? I don't think you should give up on your singing. However, some of the more knowledgeable goons might be able to give you some pointers that could save you the cost of tutoring.
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May 31, 2010 21:43
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One thing that I've noticed in like the last decade or so (may be longer, but that's when I started to really notice it) is that male singers tend to try for a goofy way of singing that is not at all natural, but something that someone else doesn't do. For instance, Robert Plant; to hear him talk is pretty rough. His accent is ridiculously awesome. However, when he sang you could understand each word (for the most part) perfectly. On the flip side, there are folks these days that have what sounds like a forced accent. Example; that douche from Oasis. Yes, we get it, you are british. Don't even get me started on over-annunciation. Aspiring male singers: for the love of all that is holy, stop being pretentious shmucks. SIng with passion, sing with natural feeling. If you feel you need to process your vocals electronically; don't be a singer please. More Joe Cocker and less Justin Bieber. Signed, Someone who misses the days prior to Creed, Nickelback, Oasis, John Mayer, and Autotune.
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Jun 1, 2010 03:24
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Rankine Over Gash posted:I've been in and out of bands over the last few years - last year saw me getting kicked out of my creation for (probably) lack of ability and it really hurts. Finding a new guitarist to work with is proving fruitless and I don't see the point wasting £50 or so a week on a tutor again when there's no guarantees I'll get at least SOME use out of it. Sigh. It sounds like you have barely any control over your voice in terms of breath support and pitch. You're speaking most of the lyrics on these songs. It sounds very post-punk, so if that's what you're going for, great, but if you want to improve, you'd probably be best taking a general singing class and learning some technique.
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Jun 1, 2010 04:11
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The feedback in this thread is pretty interesting and helpful. I'd like to learn to sing better, so it would be awesome if you could apply your ears to this singing sample of mine and tell me how I can improve.  All You Do Is Talk (by BRMC)
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Jun 1, 2010 14:43
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Hi all, I've been really encouraged by a lot of the feedback people are getting - seems like some of you folks know your stuff. I was wondering if anyone had anything to say about how to record singing? I know 'holding a microphone up to your mouth' isn't the best way, but does anyone have any advice on cheap, effective methods? As for a contribution, I'd like to offer up a song I wrote last year. I know there's problems with it (the line 'past the city...' is particularly embarrassing), but I think there's plenty about it that works well. Trouble is, I'm not sure how to go about improving it, and I'm currently very strapped for cash so a teacher isn't much of an option. http://tindeck.com/listen/wjqk
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Jun 1, 2010 16:02
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quote:Hi all, Really all you need is a microphone, a pop filter and a room thats fairly acousticly dead, solutions for the latter I've seen involve putting up a matress against the wall, using a cupboard, the singer singing with a blanket over his head ect. Remember any wall behind the singer is going to be sending reverberations back into the mic. Also dont put it up to your mouth, but like 3 inches away is fine. massive spider fucked around with this message at 16:17 on Jun 1, 2010 |
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Jun 1, 2010 16:13
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Fog Tripper posted:Aspiring male singers: for the love of all that is holy, stop being pretentious shmucks. SIng with passion, sing with natural feeling. If you feel you need to process your vocals electronically; don't be a singer please. By "process your vocals electronically," do you also mean artists like T-Pain who use a lot of autotune, or just pitch correction? Because the truth is that almost everybody in the music industry these days uses some form of pitch correction to make their vocals sound perfect. Robert Plant? Probably had some work done on his last album. Now of course Plant has a great voice, certainly a better one than that guy from Nickelback, but in the same way that movie scenes can take many tries to get right, a vocal take can have all the emotion and power the artist wants with a couple intonation slips, and vice versa. In those instances, it's a lot easier to just fudge the pitch a little than to do it all over. The technology is there, and most people demand their records to be spotless, so why not take advantage of it? I think what you're really getting at is sincerity. People are more willing to forgive an imperfect voice that has power and conviction. In this thread, I've heard some aspiring singers who express their love for singing, but when I listen to their tracks, it sounds like they don't even want to be there. Timidity is really what kills vocals - even Miley Cyrus isn't afraid to go in front of a crowd and sing. You can also go too far in the other direction and come off as really overwrought, but sincerity is what makes your vocals interesting, regardless of what kind of music you're doing.
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Jun 2, 2010 11:24
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Three Red Lights posted:Really all you need is a microphone, a pop filter and a room thats fairly acousticly dead, solutions for the latter I've seen involve putting up a matress against the wall, using a cupboard. This is the solution I've found works best, ideally a wardrobe rather than a cupboard. Fill the wardrobe with clothes as you would do anyway, then lay a towel across the top of the wardrobe and down round behind the hanging clothes. Wedge your mic stand inbetween the clothes as far back as you can with the mic and pop guard attached. Hang another towel on each open door and lay a duvet from the top of the wardrobe across the open doors and hanging down to around your waist at the back. It usually helps to have something heavy on top keeping the towel/duvet in place.
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Jun 2, 2010 11:26
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Porcupine Hunted posted:Well, I've been lurking in the musician's lounge for a while now - mostly due to spending more and more time playing music/singing. AriTheDog already touched on this. You need to sing your vowels longer and your consonants shorter. And elide (detailed elsewhere in this thread). Regarding your pitch, you sound fine. I'd actually tune you back up since the lower ranges sound kind of homogenous and boring (happens to many people, myself included). By the way, the word "father" is never sung "fah THURRRRRRRRR". It's "fah thuh".
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Jun 6, 2010 22:55
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Veggie Patties posted:The feedback in this thread is pretty interesting and helpful. I'd like to learn to sing better, so it would be awesome if you could apply your ears to this singing sample of mine and tell me how I can improve. It just needs to be more classical. Taller, clearer. More vowels, more consonants. Like the word "thing" is more "thih" and less "INNNNGGG". The NG doesn't come until the very very end of the note. Some of your pickups into phrases are not as strong as the middle of the phrase. The phrase should have a good attack, all the way through to the end. And I think I heard some awkward breathes. Don't breathe in the middle of a musical phrase.
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Jun 6, 2010 23:00
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Mitthrawnuruodo posted:As for a contribution, I'd like to offer up a song I wrote last year. I know there's problems with it (the line 'past the city...' is particularly embarrassing), but I think there's plenty about it that works well. Trouble is, I'm not sure how to go about improving it, and I'm currently very strapped for cash so a teacher isn't much of an option. Hmm, touch and go. I like it a lot. But you're not really owning all of the key changes and accidentals. Musically, they're great. But sometimes it takes you too long to tune. Or the vocal phrase leads into the key change earlier than the arpeggios, so it sounds wrong. Also in general, some of the sustained notes just sound pitchy. Know the upcoming key and own it! Also, on your crescendos on "we stay", it sounds like you're muscling your way through the dynamic. I'd rather have a more beautiful growth than you being like OH poo poo FORTE TIME. Same advice as nearly everyone in this thread, it wouldn't hurt to be more tall, more clear, more classical.
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Jun 6, 2010 23:06
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Triple Tech posted:Also, on your crescendos on "we stay", it sounds like you're muscling your way through the dynamic. I'd rather have a more beautiful growth than you being like OH poo poo FORTE TIME. Do you mean towards the end? In that case, I know what you mean. When I play this live with my friend, it has piano and the dynamics are much more layered, and the loud part has build-up. Thanks a lot for the tips - this was recorded a year ago now, and I'm better these days, but everything helps. Edit: And how does one make things less pitchy, because I know that's a pretty big problem of mine. Is it all to do with more support, better breathing/standing and a more rounded mouth? Mitthrawnuruodo fucked around with this message at 10:59 on Jun 7, 2010 |
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Jun 7, 2010 10:56
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This song was a challenge, since it's more or less at the limits of my range right now. But it's also one of my favorite melodies, so I wanted to try it. Despite the mistakes (including some embarrassing guitar flubs), I'm pretty happy with it. But I'm sure there are lots of things that can be improved that I'm not hearing, and I'd love to know what those are. (I'd also love to take lessons, but I don't have the time right now. Maybe once I'm not a grad student. Or once I have tenure. Or...) In the Days of Our Love (instrumentally known as Afterglow), Marian McPartland (music) and Peggy Lee (lyrics) 
Pyrthas fucked around with this message at 22:31 on Jun 7, 2010 |
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Jun 7, 2010 22:27
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I like the recording. It's so clear! But I feel bad.  You get the same advice as everyone else. Because I think it goes so far! More classical. Taller vowels. The right vowels. You do so many things right. And nothing really sticks out as horribly wrong. Except for the few times you hold the wrong vowel or make an R stick out. Classical vowels sound way more beautiful and are less prone to "say singing", which sounds hokey, as I've mentioned many times before.I feel like I need to give a seminar or something on how to sing classically... But you did good! I liked it. PS - I love your range, it sounds so nice. But the beginning sounds a bit schmaltzy at times... But still good overall!
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Jun 7, 2010 22:58
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I'm looking for suggestions for a singer looking into getting into screaming - I have a decent voice but want to branch out my abilities as my tastes in music have been shifting towards metal/hardcore etc. I looked into Zen of Screaming but it seems to be tailored towards those who have already figured out how to do it and want to develop techniques to make sure they don't damage their voice.
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Jun 7, 2010 23:08
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Triple Tech posted:I feel like I need to give a seminar or something on how to sing classically... Anyway, thanks! Partly I wanted to see if there were any big things I was just missing, and I figured this song would be good for bringing them to the fore if they were there. You shouldn't feel bad; if anything, I feel bad 'cause I made you repeat the advice I've been reading in the rest of the thread, but still, it's well-taken. I'd noticed a couple vowels, but more carefully going through word by word and figuring out what the vowels could be instead, I can see what you mean. (Rs, too. I'm usually better about them! Good to have them called out; I'll definitely be more careful in the future. I know I was a little too preoccupied with hitting the notes and having enough breath this time through.) And schmaltzy, yeah, I've struggled with that with this song. The lyrics are really sentimental, and I'm still not quite sure what to do with them in places, but I love the melody, so when I realized I could actually hit all the notes (I couldn't a couple years ago), I had to try it. Thanks again! Pyrthas fucked around with this message at 23:52 on Jun 7, 2010 |
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Jun 7, 2010 23:37
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