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BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Short Cuts is so loving great and your post really nailed what I love about it. Good call on the PT Anderson comparison too.

Like you said, the cast is absolutely stellar across the board and the way the stories all intertwine is genius in a way that got me thinking about how often an individual person really does have that butterfly effect happen but will never ever learn about it. For the film's length, it really only drags in one or two spots that I can think of and those were musical numbers IIRC. Been a while since I've seen it.

loving Lily Tomlin, Lyle Lovette, Tom Waits, Jennifer Jason Leigh, Robert Downey Jr, Chris Penn, Andy McDowell...they're all just so well written and defined. And, for a film that deals a lot with death, they're funny also. I started to list standout names up there and then realized "all of them" is a better descriptor. There's not a weak link anywhere.

Seriously, look at this loving roster:

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0108122/fullcredits?ref_=tt_ov_st_sm

Interesting as well that I have a different Altman film on my To Watch List (Nashville) so now I kinda wanna go watch that now but I also maybe want to watch this again. One thing I like about Altman's films is how he uses overlap and cross talk a lot whenever groups of people are speaking (MASH, The Player) in ways that make the reality he's building feel more natural and organic. He's able to totally capture and translate on screen the way people really converse in groups

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BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
I saw Koyaanisqatsi on acid in a theater.

Would recommend

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
I still have Nashville on my list and it's probably been close to year now.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

Basebf555 posted:

You're only hurting yourself with that one. I put off Nashville for years too, was a big Altman fan but just didn't think the setting would be interesting to me. I was incredibly wrong.

I just keep waiting for it to show up on one of my streaming services. I'll chime in eventually. Just giving encouragement to the guy who was posting about slacking on the thread.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

Zogo posted:

Welcome to the Dollhouse - It's basically an edgier and darker, gender reversed Napoleon Dynamite (2004). It captures things from the time period really well. The antithesis of Hollywood in some respects. The punitive middle school teachers, the sibling rivalries, the unfiltered juvenile delinquents and the awkward sexuality. It's like opening a time capsule and going 25 or 30 years back. At times it's revelatory and at times it's an indictment of the era.

That's a really well thought out and accurate synopsis. Well put.

Usually, in movies like this, the trod upon nerd with the weird name always winds up being The Hero and the movie goes out of its way to cast them in a sympathetic light. But Dawn and Napoleon are both pretty off putting and difficult to root for a lot of the time.

Always nice to see this thread moving along. I need to get Nashville off my list so I can contribute a little but I can't find it for free anywhere.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
I love the Godfather 1 and 2 but my hot take is that Apocalypse Now is a little bit dull and pretty overrated. There's a lot to like about it but for long stretches I just find it really boring, especially the extended cut. Not an FFC film, but I feel the same way about Blade Runner.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
I love Being There and think it's probably Sellers' best performance. Gotta give that one a re-watch actually.

OP nailed the concept of projection and the idea of hopeful people ascribing tendencies to blank slates and quiet, seemingly thoughtful people, that they WANT to see. You can draw parallels there with Barrack Obama and even Donald Trump really, even though the latter is far from quiet or a blank slate. There's a real subdued, somewhat detached fellow I work with that everyone likes but no one really knows a god damned thing about because he's so quiet and so loving nice about it. Not standoffish or arrogant, just not chatty or as verbose as some others.

The ending is just a clever metaphor. At least that's how I saw it anyway.

Where they built this totally oblivious moron into something larger than life, to the point that it concludes as a Christ allegory. Or it can be read that Chauncey had actually unlocked the secret meaning of life and walked on water simply because he was too aloof to realize that he couldn't or was even doing it at all. In some ways, it's a precursor to Forrest Gump and the idea of failing upwards through life via avoiding the trappings, painted in corners, phoniness and pitfalls of the things that "smart" people have to do and the ways they compromise their integrity and their values or just outright lie to achieve "success" - and whatever that might mean. It's a better film than that one but they share a central meaning of simplicity and honesty I think.

Chauncey tells the truth the entire time and people project meaning into his inanity.

BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 01:03 on May 13, 2023

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
I'm a huge Prince fan with a special place in my heart for Purple Rain, but it's not a good movie.

The acting is laughable at times, there's a ton of misogony and I'm not convinced that the Kid's redemption is entirely earned. It's got a lot of problems but the musical numbers are electric and the star oozes the charisma on screen that he'll be known for forever. It's a bit of a time capsule, right place/right time thing.

The best only good Prince movie is Sign O the Times though.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Who the gently caress listed "Under the Cherry Moon" as a shameful omission? I'm the biggest Prince fan I know and I'd never tell someone to watch that poo poo.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

quote:

#154 Gummo - This one looks strange. 9/11/23

Holy poo poo. I can't wait to read this review.

This is the weirdest most hosed up movie I've ever seen

Still slacking on my Nashville assignment

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
I happened upon Gummo part way in the first time I saw it and it took me a good while to realize I wasn't watching a documentary.

EDIT

Ok, wait a minute.

I found a free place to watch my assignment, Nashville and...

So this is a Robert Altman film starring Ned Beatty, Karen Black, Shelly Duvall, Lily Tomlin and Jeff loving Goldblum? Where's this loving movie been all my life? Gonna settle in with some indica, get in the hot tub and finally watch this thing so thanks in advance to whoever gave it to me to watch.

I will report back with my findings.

BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Oct 7, 2023

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
One thing I've alway liked about Altman is how he films people the way most of us talk. Over each other, not waiting our "turn" and filmed in a way that feels natural, where people are often at cross purposes as they express themselves. This is evident right off the bat and throughout the film and it gives this film a fly on the wall documentary feel, similar to MASH. There's always ambient noise and things that distract us from what's going on. One can tell he allows his actors to work, but he never allows them to get sloppy; at least in the final edit.

*Smoking in the Hospital*

I watched this movie and I still can't figure out what it's really about though? Hopes and dreams I guess? It was entertaining enough and I'm glad I watched it but I wasn't blown away by it and it kind of left me wanting for a bit more...substance I guess.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Oh, I guess I'm supposed to assign a movie to the person who gave me NAshville but I don't remember who that was. Found it

Basebf555 posted:



6. The Fisher King: I enjoy Gilliam as much as the next guy(Brazil is one of my favorite movies), but never got around to this one for some reason.


If you like Gilliam you'll probably dig this. Jeff Bridges and Robin Williams are really good in it.

.....

Also need to update my list and add a few new ones

Casablanca - I've seen "The Maltese Falcon" and "The African Queen" but can take or leave Bogart. Plus I know the gist of the story and the ending, so just never felt the urgency.

On the Waterfront - I usually like Brando so not sure how I never got to his one

High Noon - Not a huge fans of westerns in general so never piqued my interest but I like GOOD westerns.

The Producers - I usually like Mel Brooks and somehow never got around to this one

Pan's Labyrinth - Sounds dumb but I need to be in the mood to deal with subtitles

The Bridge on the River Kwai - Need to be in the mood for a war movie too. Apparently I'm moody.

The Thin Red Line - Speaking of war movies, this one has been recommended to me and has drawn favorable comparisons to "Apocalypse Now", "Full Metal Jacket" and "Platoon" so I am very interested. Might watch it soon anyway if no one suggests it.

Patton - Another war movie. Was always worried this would be hokey and too "USA! USA!". The people I know who love it tend to be authoritarian types.

Nashville - I like Altman a lot but musicals are a hard sell for me if it's the main thrust like "Chicago", "Dreamgirls" or "Moulin Rouge"

Double Indemnity - I like caper films and double crosses and poo poo. The description sounds like the Coen' s "The Man Who Wasn't There" which I liked a lot.

The Last Picture Show - In honor of the late and recently deceased director, Peter Bogdanovich, I'll add this

The Conversation - I like Gene Hackman and capers and have seen snippets of this. It looks interesting and up my alley

Duck Soup - Seen a couple of Marx Brothers movies but not this one

Ronin - I enjoy Deniro and this film has flown under my radar

Wait Until Dark - Heard a lot about this one but never watched it.

Body Heat - This looks like something I might enjoy
[/quote]

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

Zogo posted:

You pick a movie from the list of the last person posted a list rather than the person who last recommended one to you.

So you can pick one of these for me to watch:

-Silkwood

If you haven't seen any of them or don't have an opinion on them then you can just choose at random.

Oh. Well, poo poo. I haven't seen most of these movies and was looking forward to The Fisher King but OK.

Let's see.

I gotta go with Silkwood then because it's a great cast, Meryl Streep was approaching the height of her powers here and even though it's been a long time since I've seen it, I recall enjoying it a lot.

So go watch Silkwood, Zogo. Thanks!

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

quote:

Dmitri Russkie, watch Wild at Heart. I'm not the biggest David Lynch Fan but I remember liking this one when I watched it a long time ago.

___

I watched High Noon and liked it a lot.

I thought the acting was kind of hit or miss. It was a kick seeing a young Lloyd Bridges and Harry Morgan but some of the performances came off a little stiff, especially Cooper. The two female leads really shine though. One minor nitpick I have with older films is the consistent 90 degree camera angles where most scenes are framed like a play and don't do much to set themselves apart but this one breaks that mold a bit with some bird's eye view shots and some nice framing here and there. I particularly liked the continued callbacks to the train tracks/station where the posse was waiting and also the ticking clock, which seems to be unfolding in real time.

The storytelling here and the script are quite good. We're given several well sketched out characters, all with conflicting motives but with enough in common to make you root for the good guy, while still being able to find sympathy with the ones who just want the whole situation to pass and go away. It's kind of a lesson on bullying and the idea of having the courage to stand up to it; because of or in spite of one's moral compass. Or lack thereof. The film does a great job of building suspense while simultaneously informing and giving equal time to several very well fleshed out characters, which is shown more than told.

I read some political overtones into the film as well, some of which resonate today. Kane felt a bit like a mayor who's respected but who has fallen out of favor for numerous reasons and who is reduced to going around town to drum up votes (support), even interrupting a church service to solicit help. Is he brave, altruistic and purposeful or just stubborn? Is he selfish for putting his new bride in harm's way when he has the option to just gently caress off and retire? Most of the town folk, are similarly conflicted and motivated by their own self interests, levels of courage and peer pressure, to varying degrees.

Oddly, the titular hour climax was, to me, the film's weakest point and mostly degenerates into a standard shootout. The only real moment of triumph and decisiveness was Amy Kane's (Grace Kelly) ultimate redemption, which I felt was telegraphed a mile away and the movie's last 10 minutes are pretty much your basic Red Dead Redemption/Western cinema gun fight that rather abruptly ends the film.

Very good overall though. 9/10

quote:


Casablanca - I've seen "The Maltese Falcon" and "The African Queen" but can take or leave Bogart. Plus I know the gist of the story and the ending, so just never felt the urgency.

On the Waterfront - I usually like Brando so not sure how I never got to his one

High Noon - Not a huge fans of westerns in general so never piqued my interest but I like GOOD westerns.

The Producers - I usually like Mel Brooks and somehow never got around to this one

Pan's Labyrinth - Sounds dumb but I need to be in the mood to deal with subtitles

The Bridge on the River Kwai - Need to be in the mood for a war movie too. Apparently I'm moody.

The Thin Red Line - Speaking of war movies, this one has been recommended to me and has drawn favorable comparisons to "Apocalypse Now", "Full Metal Jacket" and "Platoon" so I am very interested. Might watch it soon anyway if no one suggests it.

Patton - Another war movie. Was always worried this would be hokey and too "USA! USA!". The people I know who love it tend to be authoritarian types.

Nashville - I like Altman a lot but musicals are a hard sell for me if it's the main thrust like "Chicago", "Dreamgirls" or "Moulin Rouge"

Double Indemnity - I like caper films and double crosses and poo poo. The description sounds like the Coen' s "The Man Who Wasn't There" which I liked a lot.

The Last Picture Show - In honor of the late and recently deceased director, Peter Bogdanovich, I'll add this

The Conversation - I like Gene Hackman and capers and have seen snippets of this. It looks interesting and up my alley

Duck Soup - Seen a couple of Marx Brothers movies but not this one

Ronin - I enjoy Deniro and this film has flown under my radar

Wait Until Dark - Heard a lot about this one but never watched it.

Body Heat - This looks like something I might enjoy

BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 23:25 on Nov 11, 2023

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Looking forward to Wait Until Dark so thanks, TrixRabbi. I needed a break from all the war and western movies on my list.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
EDIT: UPDATED UPDATED LIST


On the Waterfront - I usually like Brando so not sure how I never got to his one

The Producers - I usually like Mel Brooks and somehow never got around to this one

Pan's Labyrinth - Sounds dumb but I need to be in the mood to deal with subtitles

The Great Escape - I tend to dig prison movies and already loved McQueen doing a similar thing in Papillion

Double Indemnity - I like caper films and double crosses and poo poo. The description sounds like the Coen' s "The Man Who Wasn't There" which I liked a lot.

The Last Picture Show - In honor of the late and recently deceased director, Peter Bogdanovich, I'll add this

The Conversation - I like Gene Hackman and capers and have seen snippets of this. It looks interesting and up my alley. FFC directed so that's a plus.

Duck Soup - Seen a couple of Marx Brothers movies but not this one

Ronin - I enjoy Deniro and this film has flown under my radar

Paris, Texas - I know jack poo poo about this movie but it's @ 94% on RT and Harry Dean Stanton is a treat

Wait Until Dark - WATCHED




BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 17:47 on Dec 24, 2023

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

Crescent Wrench posted:

You get to pick for me then!

You sure?

I was given Wait Until Dark and haven't written a review yet. I thought I had to post that first and then assign a movie?

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

Crescent Wrench posted:

Ohh, I thought you were just posting a new list, I didn't know you had an outstanding assignment with a pending review. Carry on. (I watched Wait Until Dark a couple of years ago for one of the horror movie challenges, curious to read a fresh review.)

I had a review for it ready to go for the most part but the trouble was, if I posted it then, I'd need to pick a movie from HeavyMetal's list and I haven't actually seen a single one of them. So I guess now that you posted, watch:


Crescent Wrench posted:


32. The Iron Giant (1999) (added 12-21-23): Came out at an awkward time when I was "too old for cartoons" and I never caught up on it.


Wait Until Dark

This was a very good film but is dragged down for me by some plot holes, contrivances and some questionable acting.

The movie's origination as a play is very obvious throughout but the director does a very good job establishing the layout of the apartment and makes it work; evoking Hitchcock films like Rope, Rear WIndow and Dial M for Murder. A blind lady and her husband come into possession of a mcguffin doll that they do not realize happens to be stuffed with a large stash of heroin (I thought it was a clever touch that we have Heroin/Heroine with a female lead, even if wasn't intentional). A few con men run an elaborate scheme to retrieve it but Suzie and her husband have misplaced it. When she's alone, they take turns running lies, subterfuge and wild stories on her in an attempt to gain her trust and convince her to hand the doll over but, despite being blind, she proves to be more perceptive than they expected and she gradually becomes more and more suspicious, chips away at their bullshit and ultimately unravels their plan. Tensions escalate as the three crooks struggle to keep their act together, playing cat and mouse with a blind woman that culminates in a genuinely tense finale with a classic jump scare. Makes me want to see the play.

Alan Arkin is a revelation here. I saw his name in the opening credits but didn't recognize him on sight and, by the end, I'd forgotten he was in the movie. He's the true standout, steals every scene he's in and is kind of...ahead of his time I guess I'd say. His performance feels like it comes from a 70's film like Taxi Driver, Marathon Man or even something like Reservoir Dogs. He's loving fantastic in this.



The cast mostly delivers dialogue in that late 50's kind of "over expression" and heavily articulated loud speech; a holdover from stage acting. Audrey Hepburn is over acting here for me. RIchard Crenna is just like he is in every other movie I've seen him in (wooden) and the remainder of the cast ranges from decent (the husband), serviceable (the young girl) to bad (the 3rd goon). The story adds a lot of stuff that often seems unneeded and appears to only be there in order to confuse the viewer, but a few plot points DO have fairly clever "wtf?" set ups that actually do pay off.

It's rare for me to enjoy a movie with as many problems as this one but I did like it. Complaints (spoilered)


- The big one is that it's never made entirely clear WHY Suzie just won't give them back the loving doll once she finds it. Unless I missed something
- The elaborate hoax/con that the crooks run is needlessly complicated. Even though they need Suzie to tell them where the doll is, there are far easier ways to get that information and the gang is shown to not be above straight up murder from the outset; at least not the mastermind anyway. They could kill the husband at his studio and then ransack the house at their leisure if they wanted to, with arguably far less risk. They'd somehow need to subdue the young girl character is all.
- Suzie's "powers" of perception are all over the place. One minute she's Daredevil/Matt Murdock (knowing that one goon is wiping down fingerprints or others opening the blinds even though they're silent) and the next she's oblivious (failing to notice the rigged/unlocked door and being unable to locate smoke coming from a nearby ashtray).
- Why doesn't Suzie flee to the young girl's apartment upstairs when her phone line is cut and use their phone to call police or her husband?
- In one scene, the goons are pretending to be other characters but one guy goes to the trouble of using a disguise and prosthetics. Suzie is BLIND.
- The little girl character is just..weird. Throwing a random tantrum, coming and going at will and seemingly has no parents at home; or none that we're shown

- The photographer character husband character has a dark room in the apartment but is shown developing photos with a regular light, which not only wouldn't work but a RED light would have been easy and added far more atmosphere to later scenes.


There are more but those were the big ones I remember. Other set ups and reveals are more clever. A refrigerator, a rotary phone, a safe introduced early on and a pay phone all play roles that work well. Good movie overall and worth a watch but could stand for a remake I think. The movie Hush borrows heavily from this film's concept.

Weird fact: The play was remade with Quentin Tarantino playing Arkin's character, "Rote"


Whoa. Sorry that was so long

BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 18:08 on Dec 24, 2023

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Thanks for the Ronin assignment. Looking forward to it.

Twister is not a good film and I remember seeing it in the theater. I laughed at it more than anything because it's so god damned goofy )especially the finale), relying on effects and set pieces over any real plot. Kind of like Independence Day for me in that way, which I think came out around the same time. They're both so over the top and struck me more as "look at these special effects!" over anything that I could really sink my teeth into. Both had their moments but are ultimately just cheesy popcorn films that both made a fortune IIRC.

We Hate Movies podcast did a good episode on it recently.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

TrixRabbi posted:


The Conformist blew me away,

I'm intrigued now and found this on Daily Motion if anyone's interested

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7p08lb

never heard of it

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Not gonna add it to my watch list but will check it out in my spare time. Yeah, the clips and the synopsis along with yours and TrixRabbi's glowing endorsement got me sold. Anyone posting in this thread knows what's up so I trust the recommendation.

Never even heard of this movie so thanks. I love great camera work as much as good acting so looking forward to it.

I assume it's cool to post random reviews here, right? Even if they're not assigned to me?

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Pretty sure that To Die For was based in a true story

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
I really tried with John Wick and maybe it's just me but just watching a guy shoot motherfuckers for 2 hours got old quick.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
drat. Saving my review of Ronin until one of you guys posts a movie I've actually loving seen so I can recommend something.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Cross posting from the IIMM thread because it was on somebody's list

I watched Platoon yesterday for the first time in a long while and it wasn't nearly as good as I remember.

There's a lot to like about it but maybe it's me getting old, having seen better war films (FMJ, Dunkirk, The Thin Red Line, Apocalypse Now) or the satiric influence of Tropic Thunder but, I dunno, a lot of it came off as hamfisted and forced. Like movie stars playing war and an actor's idea of what being in a war is like. A large chunk of it (Charlie Sheen's narrative letters, a lot of the dialogue, the brief examinations of race and class) were just too on the nose for me and it's almost made worse by the fact that there are some really good scenes by Berenger, Dafoe and a few others, so the parts I didn't like stood out in comparison.

Maybe I'm just cynical and jaded or was in a cranky mood.

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Finally got around to Ronin and weird that I slept on it since I like DeNiro a lot and also enjoy heist/caper poo poo.

It was quite good and kind of gave me some Tarantino vibes in the vein of Reservoir Dogs and Jackie Brown. I mean, in as much as it's a bunch of cool characters saying and doing cool poo poo and then being even more cool when the poo poo hits the fan. It doesn't offer the kind of snappy dialogue that we expect from Quentin but it has that ensemble "who can we trust?" poo poo going on. Everyone's a total badass that totally has their poo poo together who are all wrapped up in conflicting motives. It's got a little bit of a Usual Suspects, Heat, Mission Impossible, The Departed and maybe even a hint of Oceans Eleven thing going on.

In lesser hands and with shittier actors, it could be real shlock but it's super smooth from the outset and never overplays itself.

Natascha McElhone is really good here as well as Deniro. One gets the sense early on that someone in the main cast is gonna double cross everyone and the film does a pretty good job of not making it obvious, even though it does suffer occasionally from some ply contrivances - people happening to be in the right place, etc. It never loses the thread and keeps throwing twists and turns at you, usually in a good way.

Good movie.

Zogo posted:


new #170 Trees Lounge - Something about a bar. 4/14/24


Zogo, you get this. One of my favorite Buscemi performances.

UPDATED LIST

On the Waterfront - I usually like Brando so not sure how I never got to his one

The Producers - I usually like Mel Brooks and somehow never got around to this one

Pan's Labyrinth - Sounds dumb but I need to be in the mood to deal with subtitles

The Great Escape - I tend to dig prison movies and already loved McQueen doing a similar thing in Papillion

Double Indemnity - I like caper films and double crosses and poo poo. The description sounds like the Coen' s "The Man Who Wasn't There" which I liked a lot.

The Last Picture Show - In honor of the late and recently deceased director, Peter Bogdanovich, I'll add this

The Conversation - I like Gene Hackman and capers and have seen snippets of this. It looks interesting and up my alley. FFC directed so that's a plus.

Duck Soup - Seen a couple of Marx Brothers movies but not this one

Paris, Texas - I know jack poo poo about this movie but it's @ 94% on RT and Harry Dean Stanton is a treat

Wait Until Dark

Ronin - I enjoy Deniro and this film has flown under my radar


I'll add a 10th one when I can think of one.

BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 23:19 on Apr 15, 2024

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.
Looking forward to On the Waterfront so thanks!

BTW, for anyone looking for a free way to watch a lot of the films that come up in this thread, a LOT of them are on Tubi.

If you have an ad blocker, you're golden

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BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

Dmitri Russkie posted:

Zogo, Haven't seen any on your list, but Nighthawks sound the most interesting to me.

Been gone a while, I was tasked with Wild at Heart, but, unfortunately, I can't seem to find it to watch. Instead, I watched Monkey Business.

Here you go.

https://tubitv.com/movies/405455/wild-at-heart

Also, I remember Nighthawks being good

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