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My Basenji Mix was a rescue, and despite being feral for the first year and half of her life has become the cutest, most stubborn thing imaginable. She loves people and will follow you everywhere (she had really bad separation anxiety when we got her), but fiercely protects the house from all manners of small furry creatures. She is mostly silent, but when she gets excited there is no way to shut her up with whining, yodeling, and other terrible sounds. It's not uncommon for her to wake us up with growls and other horrible Basenji sounds when there is a bunny in the front yard... This...used to be a toy just minutes before:    .JPG) She really looks like a tiny deer: .JPG)
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Sep 3, 2010 16:19
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YAY! Finally a good excuse to post my dog! Banzai is a 7 year old Schipperke/Shiba Inu. We got him from the Humane Society, according to his history his old family bought him from a breeder and gave him up when he didn't get along with their ~~new girl pug puppy~~  Why someone would PURPOSELY breed these two breeds together is beyond me but I'm happy with the result! I did my research on Shibas months before I adopted him, but had no clue about Schipperkes; I learned about them later. They are a spitz breed from Belgium, they hunted rats on barges, and they are just as douchey as any primitive type! Hooray! P.S. I never want to own any other type of dog now. Stockholm syndrome! "A cat? Where?!"  Lookin pretty (for a treat)  First day home (winning his heart with bully springs)  I have a feeling this thread is going to be nice and chill; I work with dogs and owners tend to be like their breed. Herding owners, for example, seem really high strung and expect their dog to obey no matter what. Retriever owners are pretty dumb and happy, and ignore any destruction caused by their dogs' happy dumb mayhem, as long as they're ~loyal~. Spitz and primitive breed owners generally accept their dog for who it is, and have infinite patience with their curly tailed monsters. I can appreciate that. GundanianBlitz fucked around with this message at 20:43 on Sep 3, 2010 |
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Sep 3, 2010 20:38
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GundanianBlitz posted:"A cat? Where?!" Except for the occasional geek out over each other's dogs.  Yours is GORGEOUS. I know that look and wag very well, though Koji's is a lot more swishy since he ended up with a sickle tail.Yeah, Koji is a rescue too, though they didn't get rid of him for another dog (at least, I don't THINK they did...) they just said didn't have enough time for him and their 7 year old. My dog, now. v  v But working in the rescue you'd be amazed at who gives up what and why. Still don't understand the 7 month old we just got...
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Sep 3, 2010 20:45
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Are spitz doggies generally good/bad with other dogs? I'm aware of Akita's gender aggression but not much beyond that.
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Sep 3, 2010 20:50
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Kerfuffle posted:Are spitz doggies generally good/bad with other dogs? I'm aware of Akita's gender aggression but not much beyond that. Sled dogs are generally pretty good with other dogs, actually, since they're bred to work in teams. The thing of it is, they're very pack oriented, so sometimes you can have clashes when two dogs who think they're hot poo poo get together. They tend to be pretty racist, too, in that they generally get along best with dogs who "speak" their language, so usually other pointy dogs who are really expressive. For example, Buddy has a hard time playing with my sister-in-law's dog because he's a Golden with VERY floppy ears, so I don't think Buddy can read his mannerisms well. So, really, as far as sled dogs are concerned, either you get an adult who's known to be good or bad with other dogs, or you raise a puppy on your own and socialize it so it's good with other dogs. But, yeah, they're not inherently dog aggressive (or people aggressive, for that matter).
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Sep 3, 2010 21:03
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pfox - thanks! I think he's adorable, he especially knows how to turn up the charm when there's something in it for him. I don't know about all spitzes (spitzen?), but my dog HATES dogs bigger than him. He tolerates small dogs and I've seen him get excited about pugs (ironically) but I've never seen him actually play with another dog. The few schipperkes I've seen at work CAN be playful, but when they decide they don't like someone that's IT, they have to be chased down and barked at incessantly.
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Sep 3, 2010 21:09
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Kerfuffle posted:Are spitz doggies generally good/bad with other dogs? I'm aware of Akita's gender aggression but not much beyond that. A lot of them do have gender aggression, though again, a lot of it has to do with the individual dog. Koji thinks he and everyone else in the world are BFFs. Jiro (my friend's Shiba) HATES with a PASSION any Boxer, Husky, or black person (he can't see very well, though all he does is bark up a storm. He does the same with a white person in a dark room.) One awesome breeder that's here locally received 2 imported Shiba pups for show. One went to a pet home while the other was kept to be shown. Both look very nice, fantastic markings (especially for B&Ts) and even won some puppy prelims. The pet home dog has issues with several dogs (save Koji, oddly enough), including Jiro and my friend's Kelpie, who he just bit on the ear out of the blue. The show pup was injured and isolated for a while while he recovered and turned out to be the biggest mess as far as temperament goes, he can't be around ANY dog without going completely nuts. I really do think tolerance has a lot to do with socializing and desensitizing, especially when they are still young. Koji used to flip out about little children, but shoving treats in his mouth and slow introductions has made him realize that they're not so bad (and they usually have something sticky and delicious on their hands.) A lot of these dogs were bred to work alone or with a small pack (save sled dogs), just because a huge group of them wasn't necessarily needed. They don't necessarily have the same attitudes now that many bullies do with their intolerance around other dogs, mostly because many of these breeders have been really looking at a family-friendly temperament and have been selectively breeding such things into these dogs. And what Wolf said is right, it's pretty funny to see the spitz automatically drift together at the park and hang out in their cool kids club.
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Sep 3, 2010 21:16
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Speaking of primitive dogs and cats, I forgot about this video until just now. It's the precursor to one of the pictures I posted: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdUmOd0KFeI&feature=related
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Sep 3, 2010 21:34
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WolfensteinBag posted:Speaking of primitive dogs and cats, I forgot about this video until just now. Buddy: It's okay, Kitty. I'll just wait here. 
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Sep 3, 2010 21:43
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Thanks for the responses guys. You DFW ladies need to let me meet your jerky dogs. 
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Sep 3, 2010 21:50
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If you go to our meetup group, you can see where we'll be with our Shiba jerkfaces!  Also, if you decide to get a job at Three Dog, you can see how neurotic Koji is indoors with TREATS EVERYWHERE OMG. Wow, I'm responding a hell of a lot. Can you tell work is dead today?
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Sep 3, 2010 22:03
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I finally got a good video of Kaidan's morning routine. This is pretty standard for him, usually around 8:30 AM sometimes a little later. Of course, now they are at boarding for the weekend and I miss them http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPtXQzIk_l4
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Sep 3, 2010 22:30
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hahaha Awww, it's awfully sad when he gives up. I don't know how you could stand boarding your dogs like that, I have a hard enough time leaving my pets with my brother who loves them and actually stays at the house. I know it's a normal thing to do, but I sooooooo miss Bud when I'm not here!
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Sep 3, 2010 22:40
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I know, I'm bummed right now. The place they are at is great though. Multiple large yards based on temperament, size, and age, 1-2 walks per day (with most of the day in the yards with the day care dogs), pools in the yards, indoor kennels, feeding our food at our normal times, etc. We take them there for day care on our really busy days and they have a great time. I'm really sad that we won't be home in time to get them on Monday, so I don't get to see them until Tuesday  Once we move and things are easier in general I don't think we'll be boarding them for weekends anymore, and this is the first time anyway. I just don't know anyone where I live who I would trust enough to do a better job with them than that place, and this is one trip we just couldn't bring them on. They said we can call to check on them whenever, I'm awfully tempted...
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Sep 3, 2010 22:46
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rivals posted:Of course, now they are at boarding for the weekend and I miss them Yeah, I JUST got home from taking Koji over. It wasn't as bad as I thought it'd be (my husband and myself swore I'd cry...).  I just hope I'll be able to enjoy this weekend, and they did invite me to call over the weekend if I wanted to, I just don't know if I want to be THAT guy... But the girl in charge of the kennels/boarding was very sweet and loved I brought his own treats that he can have (since I'm 99% sure all the vet has are things with chicken in it.)
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Sep 3, 2010 23:51
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GundanianBlitz posted:
All about that tail wagggg Constant, constant grumbling: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyPPMlAO960
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Sep 4, 2010 00:38
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paisleyfox posted:A lot of them do have gender aggression, though again, a lot of it has to do with the individual dog. Koji thinks he and everyone else in the world are BFFs. Jiro (my friend's Shiba) HATES with a PASSION any Boxer, Husky, or black person (he can't see very well, though all he does is bark up a storm. He does the same with a white person in a dark room.) Chiming in to say that Keeper's a racist little gently caress as well. He 'clans up' with dogs his size, like other Poms and Chihuahuas, but really only plays with them if they're female or subservient to his bossiness. Another male Pom he will likely just size up and then ignore, unless challenged. Larger dogs he has a tendency to be more nervous around, and will nip at their faces if they try to stand too close or sniff too long, which is fine. The only thing is he's now become emboldened from daycare and is now a little dragon on leash when he sees another dog of any size. He charges right up and nips away, instead of sniffing first, so we've been forced to re-school him in focus while on walks. The smaller Spitz style of play, from what I'm seeing in youtube videos and when Keeper gets together with other Poms, is all about chasing, nipping and bluff-charges, which I think often get misread as aggression. It's really just bravado. Still, even well-bred Poms can have a lot of dog aggression and stranger aggression issues, simply because breeders bred for full-coat aesthetics without regard for breeding down the primitive drive, resulting in a beautiful little lapdog that will happily gently caress up strangers and other dogs if you're not prepared to handle it. I personally love the drive and ferocity of the breed and don't want to see it bred out entirely, but I also think most people who buy Poms (just like most people who buy dogs) have no idea what kind of dog they're buying; they only see teddy bear cuteness.
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Sep 4, 2010 16:42
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So Kodi arrived today! Anxiety level was pretty high, but at least not spiking -- just general alertness and stress (which was to be expected). What I wasn't expecting was how easily he seems to be transitioning into the new place. Of course, fingers crossed - the real trouble is going to start when he thinks he owns the place. But for now, I'm content to have a little shedding furball follow me around while I do chores Have a picture 
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Sep 4, 2010 19:57
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Just happened to be reading local news online, and saw that the humane society is having a "half off" sale this weekend, because they're so packed with animals. I caught a glimpse of this guy:  He looks sad.
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Sep 4, 2010 21:31
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I've got an Akita mixed with ~ something ~ and he is literally the best dog I've ever had. So loving chill, so loving sweet. Never has been aggressive or anything - most aggressive he gets is him butting in the way of any dogs fighting and just standing there in the way like HEY Dog totally listens and is social as heck. Him being a mixed breed has probably something to do with that, though we're fairly certain the other breed is some Shepherd type so I don't think that would add much to that! He's huge as hell too. His old owners got him as a puppy, but then put him in a shelter when he was like 1 or 2 since he was so big, and he was in there for nearly a year  He came out okay personality and behavior wise, beyond a bit of bathroom troubles for awhile.He's going on 13 which makes him pretty old. He's slowing down a lot, and he's got a big old lump of a tumor-boobie going on, and we don't want to risk him not waking up from the anesthesia. He gets around ok for now and he's a happy dog so that's ok! 
Zorak fucked around with this message at 01:13 on Sep 6, 2010 |
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Sep 6, 2010 01:09
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paisleyfox posted:COWER AT THE MIGHT OF THE JAPANESE! The poor Akita always falling through the stairs makes me laugh every single goddamn time. And AWWW I WANT A KISHU NOW. SO BAD. Why do I have to be a student!
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Sep 6, 2010 02:49
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Zorak posted:I've got an Akita mixed with ~ something ~ and he is literally the best dog I've ever had. So loving chill, so loving sweet. Never has been aggressive or anything - most aggressive he gets is him butting in the way of any dogs fighting and just standing there in the way like HEY If nothing else, shepherds are bred with insane biddabilty, so they're much more likely to listen, and you (in theory) would have a much easier time with training and the dog actually listening to commands. It's a good reason people should consider adopting mutts if they're interested in primitive dogs but are intimidated by their temperament.
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Sep 6, 2010 14:48
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My dog passed away in the summer but I never realized that she was a mixed breed that included one of these. I guess in retrospect, she did have a curled tail and never stopped shedding. But she wasn't as aloof as any of the primitive breeds so I guess her other genes included Retriever and Beagle. She was still a stubborn ox, though.
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Sep 6, 2010 17:17
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CarnivorousThing posted:But she wasn't as aloof as any of the primitive breeds so I guess her other genes included Retriever and Beagle. To be fair, there are a lot of primitive/spitz dogs that are super friendly. Huskies in particular are super social, but most sledding breeds are the same way. They're bred so much to work with people and work in a group that they're generally excited to see anyone, contrary to their Asian/pariah brethren. Do you have any pictures of your dog??
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Sep 6, 2010 17:21
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WolfensteinBag posted:To be fair, there are a lot of primitive/spitz dogs that are super friendly. Huskies in particular are super social, but most sledding breeds are the same way. They're bred so much to work with people and work in a group that they're generally excited to see anyone, contrary to their Asian/pariah brethren.   The vet said she was either part husky or part GSD or maybe both. She passed away in late July. Holy god could she shed.
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Sep 6, 2010 17:47
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Yeah, I could definitely see her as a husky/retriever/godknowswhatelse mix. No wonder she was so friendly! Some of my favorite dogs I've met have been similar mixes, something about them really seems to work out in an adorable manner. I bet she was the best dog.
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Sep 6, 2010 17:53
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She totally was the best dog.
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Sep 6, 2010 17:56
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The love of my life is Charlie, who I rescued when I was living in Japan. The vet and I thought he was part Shiba Inu, part some other random thing. Now that he has grown up, I think the other half was a bear. Here he is as a lil babby   Those are from right when he was found. He had to be maybe a month old at the most.   Those are from the day I brought him home. When he was a puppy he was such. a. pain. The shedding, the attitude, the intelligence were pretty much spot on with a primitive dog's temperament. Then, in the last 6 months or so, he has calmed down to the point where everyone calls him "chill", especially compared to my roommate's dog, who is also probably a primitive mix and is INSANE. It's such a 180 I can't believe it. It's like all the crazy grew out into hair. He turns 2 this month, and this is what we do now:  That is all I can access from work but I might have a picture of his lovely fluffy tail explosion at home :3 PS: the SHEDDING OH GOD THE SHEDDING.
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Sep 7, 2010 21:24
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That dog is so awesome!  It's like some crazy shiba terrier. Similarly, here's a couple of husky terriers that are at Buddy's rescue place. They were actually both born AT the rescue (returned for one reason or another, I think) and their mom was a pure husky.  
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Sep 7, 2010 23:26
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Oh man that first one is so pretty, but they're both kinda goofy lookin' I love them.
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Sep 7, 2010 23:54
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That first one has been there a lot longer, I think she never got adopted out in the first place. But since she's been at the shelter so long, she's been groomed regularly since the head of the rescue is a groomer. Looks like the other boy's coat's been neglected, I'm guessing the people didn't know what they were getting in to since I'm sure they signed up for a HUSKY coat, not a terrier one!
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Sep 8, 2010 00:14
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Went to my friends house, she had two of these! Little boy and girl, Niko and Kita. :p
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Sep 8, 2010 15:03
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Wolves: Close Cousins to Primitive Breeds As we’ve already mentioned, Primitive Breed dogs are scientifically shown to be, out of all purebred dogs, those closest genetically to wolves. Because of this, when considering any sort of Primitive Breed (whether you already own one or are considering one) it’s important to look at wolves, their behavior, and how it both differs from and influences dogs. Last year my husband and I went to a seminar on wolf and dog behavior at Wolf Park in Indiana. After taking a crapload of notes, I wrote up a whole post that a few good samaritans were nice enough to pull up from the archives for me.  Since I REALLY don’t feel like typing out all this info again, here are some of the more important parts about wolf behavior. I know it might seem odd to have such a large section on just wolves, not dogs, but not only is this a great way to look at raising Primitive Breed dogs, it’s also a lead in to some other fun discussion later on.  WolfensteinBag posted:The first lecture of the day was about the domestication of the dog, and how they came about. It covered wolf and dog genetics, mentioning how aside from slight variations, they are genetically identical. Up until they started doing the research that they use now to differentiate different breeds of dog, you could send a sample of any dog's blood along with a sample of a wolf's blood to a lab, and they wouldn't be able to tell you the difference. Where wolves and coyotes, for example, are genetically and specifically different species, wolves and dogs are not, which is very interesting. WolfensteinBag posted:As the pups get older and start moving towards adolescence, they start pushing their boundaries and seeing where they might fit in the pack. If it's a small litter, you can see very early on which pups are likely to be dominant, and which ones are submissive, but with larger litters, it can be hard to tell until they're older. Once the pups start getting older, their play fighting also starts to have a purpose, and before long the adults are no longer "tolerating" their BS anymore, and actual pack structure starts to develop. I’ll leave this for now, but it’s an important lead in for things to come! Wolf Hybrids and New, Wolf-like Dog Breeds! WolfensteinBag fucked around with this message at 15:20 on Sep 8, 2010 |
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Sep 8, 2010 15:16
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Added to the main post, Wolf! Also, I love everyone's dogs. This thread seriously fills my heart with joy.
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Sep 8, 2010 15:29
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paisleyfox posted:Also, I love everyone's dogs. haha I know!! I love that all these awesome dogs are coming out of the woodwork now.
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Sep 8, 2010 15:38
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Hey, I don't know if I should muck up this thread with 'what is my dog' talk, but Supposedly, according to the foster parents/rescue Cosmo is Border Collie/Chow Chow. But I'm not seeing much chow, I feel like he definitely has husky in him, just due to the markings. So in the weeks before getting him I was reading more/preparing more for a Chow tempered dog, and learning about how to handle them the best, then it turns out he's the sweetest nicest loving dog in the world, who loves everyone and everything, unless you cross him, he holds grudges if you hurt/piss him off. At the campground this weekend some kid loving hit him with his bike, and after yelling at the kid and his hambeast family everything settled down, until the kid came out of his camper and Cosmo just stared him down growling/barking. Anyway, Here's his picture. Scared/Sick at 8 weeks  Click here for the full 800x600 image. about 6 months  Also, about the wolf thing and dog evolution, what were dogs like Jack Russel terriers and Beagles doing before domestication, are they a product of domestication? Did they evolve into their current breeds from the wolf and/or human's cross breeding them? Are all dogs descendants of wolves if you trace it back far enough? I've always had a hilarious mental image of a pack of Jack Russels all small chasing a deer, nipping at its hooves. Or like a pack of any dog really, in the wild, makes me giggle.
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Sep 8, 2010 16:12
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I wonder if Lapponian Herders qualify as a primitive breed? They've been shown to carry a mitochondrial marker suggesting a recent hybridization with wolves, they are classified as spitzes as far as I know and the tails of some individuals are definitely curly enough. A sample tail: Edit: RizieN, I think the current consensus based on DNA evidence is that all dogs originate from a population of wolves domesticated tens of thousands of years ago somewhere in what is now China, if I recall the location correctly. The variable phenotypes of dog breeds as we know them now are a product of centuries of selective breeding. Neoteny is linked to why we've ended up with dogs that don't look like wolves at all. Rixatrix fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Sep 8, 2010 |
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Sep 8, 2010 16:13
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That dog is SUPER awesome. How old is he now, and how large? He looks like he could have husky or malamute in him, depending on his size. I'm curious, too, to see what his adult coat looks like.RizieN posted:Also, about the wolf thing and dog evolution, what were dogs like Jack Russel terriers and Beagles doing before domestication, are they a product of domestication? Did they evolve into their current breeds from the wolf and/or human's cross breeding them? Are all dogs descendants of wolves if you trace it back far enough? Yeah, those types of dogs didn't exist before human intervention. All dogs are decedent from, and related to, wolves, however. I actually just posted a bit on this, the wolves that weren't afraid of human camp sites realized they could score easy meals if they stuck around. So their flight response lessened while the traits they needed for hunting also lessened. After a bit, people realized dogs could be useful and started actually breeding them for a purpose. Dogs that are far removed from wolves (like the jack russels and beagles you used as an example) are the products of years and years of artificial selection to breed for useful traits. So, yeah, any wild dogs are/were more likely scavengers than dogs that would actually hunt in packs. Small game like rodents or rabbits, if anything.Fake Edit: Yeah, Rixatrix, regardless of function or breed classification, Lapponian Herders would be a primitive breed. Like it was mentioned in the main post, it's more to do with how closely related the dogs are to wolves, as opposed to when or where they were bred and for what purpose. Anything spitz-like is going to fall in that category. Also, tail curling *technically* has nothing to do with whether or not a dog is primitive! Wolves themselves don't even have any curl to their tail, it's definitely a dog trait as opposed to a wolfy one.
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Sep 8, 2010 16:23
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WolfensteinBag posted:I’ll leave this for now, but it’s an important lead in for things to come! Wolf Hybrids and New, Wolf-like Dog Breeds! I'm so excited for this. I'm going to do a photo dump of Kaidan tonight I think because he's so pretty He's getting groomed today or tomorrow too. I'm just so glad he is back from boarding too.Edit: This might be a decent place to ask. Is it worthwhile to get a cheaper force dryer to use at home? I'm not a big fan of drying Kaidan after baths and that might make my life significantly easier. When I did some quick searching a while back they seemed to be around 125-175 but I didn't look at quality at all and I'm not sure if it's worth it. rivals fucked around with this message at 16:54 on Sep 8, 2010 |
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Sep 8, 2010 16:33
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WolfensteinBag posted:That dog is SUPER awesome. He's going on 6 months now, 30 pounds give or take a few. He had a growth spurt where he stretched out and got all dorky looking, probably at around 4ish months, but I suppose we'll have to wait it out for another 6-8 months to get an idea of where he'll end up. Our vet said he'll probably end up around 50-60 pounds, the rescue said 60-80, but I trust my vet more than them (they were not a great experience for us). Here he is sleeping on my chest, I'm about 6'2" so this might be able to provide a little more perspective on his body  Click here for the full 643x480 image. And here you can kind of see his coat.  Click here for the full 640x478 image. when he was a little baby his fur was real fluffy, a lot like a husky/malamute, but now its more wavy, kind of like my mom's lab/terrier mix. He also has 'crimped' fur on his ears, which looks ridiculous(ly cute). Also eagerly anticipating the wolf-like/hybrid post.
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Sep 8, 2010 17:00
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