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WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

HalloKitty posted:

1U just isn't a particularly good format for power hungry devices, as you end up wasting a lot of power lost to nothing but turning tiny screamer fans, instead of doing something useful.


We have ~24 dual node 1U servers we used for testing some ssds (24 per box). Even long time, experienced data center people stop and say "what the hell is going on there" any time they walk by that aisle.

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WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

USB wouldn’t suck if you decided not to have a protocol that allows companies to sell the cheapest rear end garbage tier gizmos that can talk to a computer. But that kind of defeats the purpose of it

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 07:05 on Jul 19, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

USB2 being a broadcast bus has a lot to do with some of the protocol jank (periods of expected idle as example). It being a broadcast bus I think also stems from being designed for cheap rear end poo poo

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

https://tenstorrent.com/research/the-ojo-yoshi-report-jim-kellers-journey-from-cpus-to-ceo/

quote:

Keller’s next stop was Intel, where he had 10,000 underlings — another huge change.

Thus far, Keller has said little about why he left Intel in June, 2020. He told us last week that his experience there was “super fun.” Despite encountering many surprises along the way, Keller, looking back, is confident that he fixed a few things at the behemoth.

It’s more than likely that Keller faced resistance to the changes he introduced. Nonetheless, he stressed the positive connections he made at Intel while serving as senior vice president. “Believe me, I got hugged a lot at Intel.”

As Keller related, he came to Intel thinking he was going to “build these great supercomputers with all this great technology.” He quickly found out that “almost every methodology and process Intel had was broken.” He blamed this on the tendency to keep doing the same thing for too long, neglecting to change with the times.

Keller took this reporter’s notebook and drew a chart. “Here is a universal curve where people find problems and solve them. Then you ramp [your technology] and go into production. You reach a pinnacle. But then, you start failing.”

In his analysis, “once you get successful, you go into production for a while, and the world [around you] starts to change.” Meanwhile, the Intel veterans who worked hard to lead the company and develop products were gradually disappearing. “They all retired.”

At Intel, “we had to reinvent methodology, we also had to update it. They had computer design tools that were out of date 10 years.” Keller said, “We identified the problems and we solved some.”

For example, Intel’s Grand Rapids CPU got a tenfold bug reduction, said Keller. “Foundries need what’s called a physical design kit (PDK), but Intel when I joined didn’t have one. I’m not kidding.” Now Intel has a PDK.

Keller said, “I gave a talk to the Intel fellows … and I yelled at them: ‘How did you let this happen?’” Keller added, “Some people at Intel love me and others hate me.”

Keller said Intel’s culture enabled all its fellows to focus exclusively on their research, rather than peeling some away into more-diverse challenges.

“Intel went from the best-execution company on the planet to a company that took itself for granted,” he said. “Many people got promoted, more people did more research.”

Keller observed that Intel CEO “Pat Gelsinger is trying to fix that … but he also appears to believe the solution is to build more [fab] capacity which kind of makes things difficult.”

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Intel is restoring pay and benefits and apparently the junior level engineers are getting $250-$500 in RSUs. That’s a lol

Senior engineers are getting lost wages back in the form of RSUs too?

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Henrik Zetterberg posted:

Lol I’m on sabbatical right now and… what?!? That’s gotta be a fuckin joke. I really don’t want to open my laptop and read about a colossal shortcoming in restore & reward.

E: you made me look into this. The $250-500 is only for people who weren’t eligible for the pay cuts.

Yeah I meant the 6s and lower who didn’t get paycuts but also haven’t gotten a compensation bump. Can’t imagine a talented junior engineer sticking around if given $250-500 as yearly retention carrot

quote:

But they are dressing up a batch of RSUs as the “reward” portion even though it’s really just part of the “restore.” The cool part is they don’t even vest for another 15 months, so gently caress you if you leave Intel before then; you just gave the company money for nothing. lovely.

You can also look at it as an interest free loan to Intel from the employees in the best case

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 21:18 on Aug 2, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Intel used to not do it quarterly but corporate figured out that they can sell giving you your money quicker/more frequently vs. not making your bonus suck in the first place

BK pitched it as just giving you your money faster

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Twerk from Home posted:

It's not, which is why Intel's corporate strategy has always been to hire a thousand fresh college grads and lose most of them to Broadcom, Samsung, or other after a few years.

If you're looking for a chuckle or want to put a smile on the face of an ex-Intel engineer who moved elsewhere, ask them how hard was it to walk away from their unvested Intel RSUs. Or what their old group's counter offer to stay was (if offered).

Also I once had to explain the whole grade 3/5/6/7 progression thing to a boss who has been in the tech industry for over 20 years but never interacted with Intel and he thought it was a stupid treadmill to jerk around junior engineers.

priznat posted:

For the granite rapids cscripts the applications engineer swore to us that we should have access, and we kept saying no we don’t, and finally he came back and sheepishly said another internal group’s permissions were overriding his so yeah, that’s why we were locked out. Should be open now though!


I want to murder whoever wrote those cscripts

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 02:57 on Aug 3, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Permission control ran the gamut. In some cases I’ve seen sensitive documents and test plans shared on some random rear end windows share someone built from scraps and threw on the network and didn’t maintain

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

I’m still salty about some engineer chewing me out over email on my second day of work after I blasted a bunch of permission requests that were listed on a new hire wiki because saying “new hire on team X my responsibility is Y” isn’t sufficient with my manager CC’d even though that team literally existed only to build poo poo for us

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

JawnV6 posted:

They always insisted on the best of the best, top-shelf engineers that were heads above their peers... then paid in the absolute middle of the comp range. I left for a startup in SF.


I once went on a recruiting trip with my boss to a UC. The hiring guidelines were 3.0 or higher. My boss was livid that we were getting all these 3.2 and 3.3 people and complaining loudly to the advisor we were working with about why the A students weren't lining up. I didn't know how to tell him top tier candidates weren't going to line up to do post-silicon chipset validation in a not exciting city for not FAANG pay

That being said, if some borderline candidate managed to wrangle an interview, not have any major "absolutely do not hire" red flags, and the hiring manager starts hearing that the reqs are closing, you better believe they'll get hired

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Aug 4, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Rocko Bonaparte posted:

*Rocko's head popped out the trash can.*

They use it because nobody knows how to validate, they can't even get information on what to validate, but there is this thing from 2001 that the previous project used (and so forth) so that's what we'll use.

It's black box testing simply because nobody knows what is in the box. For all anybody knows, it's a filled with a condemned Roman prisoner, a snake, and a dog.

gently caress me, I did not realize this is the thread where Intel people get complain. Where have y'all been? I got sucked in during 2008 and have been unable to escape.

On the flip side, there was always some ahole popping up every 2-3 years bucking for a promotion who would try to kick start some initiative to remove "low value" tests defined as tests that haven’t found any bugs on the last project and I have to explain post-silicon chipset validators aren't mighty hunters scouring the jungle for some prized beast and bringing it down with well aimed spears but a bunch of lazy rear end fishermen who throw out some nets and hope something gets caught. Generally that didn't work but if I argue that it would impact the indicators, removing all the easy passing tests and having only the difficult stuff remaining then some manager would quickly shut that poo poo down

That's not to say you shouldn't ever remove stupid poo poo from your test plan, but if I can explain the technical reason for a test and that no other content provides the same coverage just leave it. It helps green line go up and green line is good!

And this ultimately is a test plan change and should be handled as part of the test plan review process. But some managers and technical leaders always tried to side step that process because some designer or architect would tell them to gently caress off. I think a lot of bad poo poo happened in my old group because technical decisions were mandated by managers outside the regular technical chain. I was once told by a manager to not try and run some tests until B-step because we can't expect it to work on A-step and I couldn't get him to see the problem with that logic

Sorry for the stream of nonsensical rants but I have strong feelings

tehinternet posted:

Just lmao at giving a poo poo that much about GPA when hiring, especially the difference between 3.3 and 4.0 — I bet hiring there was hosed

It was a really odd back and forth between "he didn't make the GPA cutoff I don't care how well his interviews went" and "ok your interview rating was don't hire but the req is closing so as long as you don't see any serious red flags we'll still take him"

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 07:08 on Aug 14, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

BobHoward posted:

No, it's entirely understandable why. JFC. You'd expect management at a semiconductor company to at least understand that finding bugs earlier in the process rather than later always saves money.

At some point people lose sight of the overall goal of the company (hey, ship this out on time and at a high quality) in favor of their direct measurables and indicators (hey I want our graph to be green not red to make us look better, I don't want to be the one holding up PRQ)

Same thing with temperature/voltage/process shmoo testing. "Hey why do you have so many tests targeted to run at cold temperature those lines never pass"

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 16:13 on Aug 14, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

one interface owner once set the dropped packet threshold to 100% to get his tests running. I forget when they finally changed it

when I started someone told me to remove the checker that reads back PCIe AERs because that always failed on him doing power management states

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

but wouldn't you want to know you flagged a bunch of uncorrectable errors when you come out of S3????

I'm pretty sure we had multiple times a customer came back and asked why they saw errors during their qual and we'd trace it back to someone shutting off some checker somewhere and not telling anyone

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Aug 14, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Beef posted:

I'm not anywhere near production, but on a prototype we tried to do extensive full-application testing on various simulators/emulation/FPGA before taping because we knew there was only budget for one stepping.

Touched on earlier but one of Intel's problems was that future steppings were just assumed. And that trickled down to bug finding and feature enablement.

I'm long gone from there but one of the issues my old co-workers would describe was people trying to beat it into the heads of worthless middle management and lazy engineers is that you can't assume whoever you are getting to fab your product will just let you crank out 6-8 steppings and try to ship something on C2. But I guess decades of habit and learnings are hard to break

quote:

Somehow, I still had to find out, running my software on silicon, that through all those layers of software no one had ever thought that someone would pass size=0 to a DMA instruction.

I literally hit a bug on something because of something like. The person writing the actual industry spec said he never explicitly forbid that scenario because he if had to write everything you couldn't do then the spec would be too long (:wtf:). No one else down the chain, from the technical leads to the domain owners thought to question the guy writing the spec. Thinking it was bullshit I then got a customer to weigh in on it and they went ape poo poo and the same people that told me it isn't allowed then acted like they were paleontologists who just discovered a dinosaur egg themselves.

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 23:18 on Aug 14, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

JawnV6 posted:

? it's right there in the post you quoted, "try to ship on C2." No consumers are getting B0's, you're tilting at an imaginary windmill. It's only a pain for the post-si folks who have to do big feature validation in a compressed time frame.

that said, steppings got weird before I left. I sorta understood "X0," less so the '/prime ones that seemed more about rear end-covering than technical descriptions.

On one project the actual steppings were getting dangerously close to the sku designations and I was wondering what happens if the streams cross

Prime was an asscovering on the project I was on but that kind of got blown out the water because they immediately had to do a real stepping right after it. I might be misremembering but I swear they even made the stepping ID the same and you had to look elsewhere to get the prime designation so it was a pain in the rear end for some of our test scripts

X0 was an rear end covering too right? As in, "hey we can't get this important thing ready in time for tape-in and then we end up blocking a whole bunch of people so let's make up a new stepping designation to redefine what A0 is so that we can say we were actually ready on the new A0"

priznat posted:

In my experience at datacom parts if it went to C0 it was a huge fuckup, B0 should be the production parts. Nowhere near the complexity of a server class CPU though.

At a previous company one part before my time went to F and it was spoken of in hushed tones as people tried to forget the shame

I was once on a project were we found a bug but because it didn't fail all the time on all the parts so the designer was convinced they could just implement a screen. There was another stepping already planned too and he could have easily gotten it in time but "had timing implications". We later had to do another stepping literally just for that issue and only that issue

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 19:12 on Aug 15, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Hats off to a big waste of time for everyone?

https://twitter.com/ServeTheHome/status/1709309292942426124

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

priznat posted:

That's just bizarre. What a massive waste of time!


That describes most of Intels efforts expanding outside of making x86 CPUs

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Someone pour one out for WiMAX

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

BobHoward posted:

When Intel acquired Altera, someone whose opinion I respect told me they thought Intel would mismanage Altera to death in only a few years.

Obviously that prediction didn't quite pan out. However, if being part of Intel didn't improve Altera's competitive position against Xilinx, then what was the point of the acquisition? Yes, Intel made lots of noise about Xeons-with-FPGAs, but that's a niche product. Lucrative, but niche. And it was never clear why it needed to be under one roof, especially with all of Intel's packaging technology.

(Same issue applies to AMD+Xilinx, TBH. What's better about each company's products that wasn't possible without an acquisition/merger?)

Intel bought Altera because Altera was their biggest foundry customer (might still be true). But 10nm was…well you know, and the worry was that Altera would look elsewhere because they literally weren’t able to launch their next product and they’d have a really embarrassing situation to deal with. So dump some money to keep that from happening and draw up some theoretical block diagrams to make people think you have a plan

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

BobHoward posted:

Which is insane, because sure, they could stop Altera from looking elsewhere, but that just hurts Altera's business, reducing the value of the acquired company

Let me introduce you to a CEO named Brian Krzanich

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

how can anyone forget DRONES! and Intel Sports???

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Intel bought Basis for wearables and made very little effort to actual promote them or do anything with them other than burn people’s skin

Someone asked BK in a company meeting if they thought of giving one to everyone in the company so employees could talk them up to their family and friends because otherwise at the time why would anyone buy a wearable other than Fitbit. BK just said if you want one buy it yourself (with a 15% discount off retail at the employee page)

Which reminds me, BK/Intel did some “we need all employees to really shill how great our products and company is to friends and family” campaign but didn’t give out any extra special discounts or swag to make that happen. Like, they just wanted employees to bring it up organically when talking at dinner or whatever

Oh and they also worked with 50 cent on some smart headphones that no one bought

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 19:55 on Oct 4, 2023

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

hobbesmaster posted:

I would’ve thought that Intel of all companies would love dogfooding.

The disconnect between the poo poo they crammed into AMT and advertised vs. what their poo poo tier IT actually used was stark. Same with the “hey companies refresh your fleet look how productive your employees will be…no please don’t ask why our employees are on 4+ year refresh cycles”

The core product was CPUs and they used to be really good at that with discounts and free samples (until SKL at least where PMs all of a sudden got lazy or scared to ask for any for the team).

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

My PC is both a space heater and my fruit dehydrator

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Those who know nothing about USB or PCIe don’t think it can be used anywhere
Those who know a little bit about USB or PCIe think it can be used anywhere
Those who know a lot about USB or PCIe are surprised any of this poo poo actually works

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

Someone have an ampere server they can use for an experiment??

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

My beige inwin full tower will be with me until the day I die and if something manages to kill it before then I have an identical spare

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

goons that have an external port 80 card sitting in a drawer somewhere say what’s up

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WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001

For fun try writing 6 to port cf9

or probably better you don’t

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