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Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Tab8715 posted:

I'm shocked it's taken so long for someone to market a commercial external GPU. Most gaming laptops are disgustingly gaudy and it'd be nice to be able have a Thinkpad or MacBook play real games.

msi demoed one years ago but until tb3 intel wouldnt certifify gpu over thunderbolt for some reason

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Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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BangersInMyKnickers posted:

This gives a pretty good rundown on how to connect a U.2 drive to current systems, if you were ignorant like me.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/sff-8639-u.2-pcie-ssd-nvme,29321.html

this article covers the pcie to m.2 adapters available, turn a 8x pcie port into 2 M.2!

http://www.servethehome.com/4-solutions-tested-add-2-5-sff-nvme-current-system/

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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thunderbolt 3 is only on few boards if that matters to you

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Boiled Water posted:

What possible scenario in a desktop environment could warrant Thunderbolt 3 when you're building the machine yourself or having it built?

if you have a thunderbolt 3 laptop it's the cheapest and easiest way to get 10Gb ethernet but yeah pretty niche

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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The best use of all that speed is backups, if people could backup and restore 100GB of data in under 2 minutes they would actually make backups.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Boiled Water posted:

This is correct. Turns out it's only Q-series (?) boards are affected, and those live in servers. It's still an issue, but slightly smaller than semi accurate wants to make out.

q series are generally not server but boring business workstations, at my work we have a bunch of Dell optiplex 7020 and hp elitedesk 800 's that are q chipsets

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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I'm probably going to get the 9900k but this does seem like a bad year for hardware, everything is slightly faster and 50% more expensive. I can get a 9900k for 620CAD through work so the intel tax for me is $240 compared to a 2700k with a taichi motherboard.


edit: I forgot the 2700x comes with a cooler and I was getting a d15 for the intel and forgot a rebate so the intel tax is more like $380 drat.

Perplx fucked around with this message at 18:29 on Oct 19, 2018

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Also tsmc is ahead because they get that apple money, which makes 75% of their business. If intel had taken apple's offer to make iphone chips they would probably be ahead now.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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I ordered a 9900k, hope I didn't make a huge mistake.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Siets posted:

I remember Postin’ Paul saying that the 9900K was to be the fastest gaming chip for the next 5 or so years. Something about having to switch to CCX architecture and latency getting worse over the next few node shrinks. If that’s still true given the benchmarks we now have, does that make the price tag a bit easier of a pill to swallow?

If you want to rationalize the price difference I’m currently using “it’s more hackintosh compatible” and “Ryzen needs more expensive ram”.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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My 9900k went from nov 5 to nov 12, now they say there is no fixed date. I work for a distributor so I'm paying $50 off retail but I can't wait much longer.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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I was able to buy a 9900k yesterday and just got the shipping notice now, I just refreshed canadacomputers.com periodically yesterday and 2 came into stock. I think they came from in store stock, I could only ship it to my billing address. I did it just in time, they raised the price by $20 today.

Perplx fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Nov 8, 2018

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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I finally built my 9900k system over the weekend and I lost the silicon lottery again, can't do 5GHz on all cores, 4.8 is stable and 4.9 probably is too once I do some more testing.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Yep tried all the llc settings and pushed the voltage all the way to 1.39v, silicon lottery reports only 46% of 9900k can hit 5GHz.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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That's cool but when can I buy an arm server for like $100 that can run unmodified centos?

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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wargames posted:

10nm intel is never coming out, we have to too toward 7nm intel for them to do a node jump.

Also 7nm won’t increase clock speed, just reduce power and increase density, IPC should improve but we might never see 6Ghz.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Cygni posted:

https://videocardz.com/82105/intel-10th-gen-core-x-series-cascade-lake-x-final-specs-and-pricing-leaked

Cascade Lake X prices essentially halved from last gen, more or less equal to 2nd gen Threadripper core for core. Launch is Monday, stock in November.

Very generous of intel to remove the firmware blacklist for 32GB ram sticks.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Intels capacity problems are probably all related to 10nm being behind schedule, 10nm has at least double the density of 14nm, which means double the chips per wafer. I'm assuming wafer throughput is relatively constant regardless of process node.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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I have 2x16GB LPX 3333C16 and its samsung b-die and does 3600c16 at stock volts, that should be cheaper.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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DrDork posted:

Again, don't get me wrong: I've got a 5600X sitting on my desk waiting to be installed later tonight.

But if Intel can actually hit the ~20% IPC gains that some have claimed for Rocket Lake, gaming preference will swing right back to the blue team again. Productivity and other wide-core loads will still probably be better off on AMD hardware unless Intel really goes to the mat with pricing (they won't), though.

They're not in a great spot right this moment, but thinking that Intel somehow can't maneuver themselves back into a good spot is, I think, a mistake.

Even if intel can take the lead in gaming, the performance per watt will be horrible by comparison.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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The battery life was for wireless web and video, they didn’t mention battery life running benchmarks. I don’t think any laptop run more than a few hours under full load.

Also my 9900k only gets 1270/12622 in R23, that’s at 4.8Ghz avx.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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The m1 is still the fastest quad core processor period (I don't count the 4 power saving cores, because multithread performance is only ~4x single thread instead of ~8x like on other 8 core cpus). The m1x should be 8+4 core and murder every other 8 core cpu.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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My m1 at 3.2Ghz is faster than my 9900k at 5ghz, so I'm not worried about clock speed, plus apple will have first dibs on the latest tsmc node for the foreseeable future.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Intel showing some real innovation in sku creation, apple doesn't have the courage to ship 18 different mobile cpus in a year.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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I know not fair but the passive m1 handily beats the new intel space heater at JavaScript benchmarks, also you can’t seem to buy a 7nm anything right now but you can get 5nm iPhone and MacBooks easily.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Don't see what the bios could do, it's the basically the same chip they been selling for 5 years.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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From and older cpu review:

https://www.anandtech.com/show/15039/the-intel-core-i9-10980xe-review/5 posted:

3D Particle Movement v2.1: Brownian Motion
Our 3DPM test is a custom built benchmark designed to simulate six different particle movement algorithms of points in a 3D space. The algorithms were developed as part of my PhD., and while ultimately perform best on a GPU, provide a good idea on how instruction streams are interpreted by different microarchitectures.

A key part of the algorithms is the random number generation – we use relatively fast generation which ends up implementing dependency chains in the code. The upgrade over the naïve first version of this code solved for false sharing in the caches, a major bottleneck. We are also looking at AVX2 and AVX512 versions of this benchmark for future reviews.

For this test, we run a stock particle set over the six algorithms for 20 seconds apiece, with 10 second pauses, and report the total rate of particle movement, in millions of operations (movements) per second. We have a non-AVX version and an AVX version, with the latter implementing AVX512 and AVX2 where possible.

Intel makes the best processor for running custom 3d simulation code that you should have run on gpu to begin with, but didn't because you wanted to make the most edge case cpu synthetic benchmark possible.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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It's weird that it's easy to slap a desktop cpu in a laptop, but making a new high wattage power brick is a total non starter and you have to use 2 off the shelf bricks.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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They are doing this so next time they are stuck at a node size for 7 years they can just keep renaming it.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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We just label everything by Linux kernel compile time, single thread and multithread.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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I think its a great idea, the main reason I don't repurpose gaming rigs into servers is because the idle power is too much, it has to be <15W for me to run 24/7.

Perplx fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Aug 2, 2021

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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DrDork posted:

I mean, this makes a lot of sense for a lot of reasons, but you're still talking about a likely substantial portion of a die for a product already known to be aimed at "price insensitive customers" that's on a world-leading node that you had to out-bid literally the rest of the world to get. And you did so by enough that you got all the fab time.

Or yeah, this. Or for a slightly less pessimistic view, maybe 3nm doesn't provide a substantial enough bump over mature 5nm that Apple felt the need to bother and is instead happily iterating on their Mx line of chips.

An even more optimistic view, Apple has an architectural advantage over intel and is competitive while being behind a node.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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A high end xeon is almost the size of an iPhone, per sq/mm I wouldn’t be surprised if the iPhone had a bigger margin.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Isn’t the tpm on modern cpus now? So it would be the root of trust. Also it should be harder to extract keys from a 5nm cpu than a 28nm or whatever tpm chip.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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repiv posted:

I saw it pointed out that the M1 Pro is just the top half of an M1 Max (assuming the official die shots are accurate)



I wonder if there's some funky manufacturing optimization going on where they use the same masks for both chips

The M1 Pro definitely looks like the top half of the M1 Max. Also I'm sure the edges of the wafer are filled with smaller dies.

Perplx fucked around with this message at 16:23 on Oct 20, 2021

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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Those motherboards really show you need a full atx board to get 3 pcie slots because of 4 slot gpus,

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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BobHoward posted:

M1 integrates a TB controller into the SoC; no external PCIe lanes to an Intel "Ridge" chip are required. I doubt that's changed in the Pro and Max versions.

Plain PCIe isn't too useful for CPU interconnect due to poor latency, high power requirements, and no cache coherency.

Data point #1: Apple has some packaging technology patents showing multiple die with adjacent memory stacks side-by-side on some kind of interposer.

Data point #2: The leaks which accurately identified the new M1 Pro/Max machine specs (8+2 CPU cores, 16 or 32 GPU cores) mentioned two codenames for the chips: Jade C-Die and Jade C-Chop. It mentioned two further codenames, Jade 2C-Die and Jade 4C-Die. These are supposedly the desktop and Mac Pro versions. Specs are 20 CPU cores / 64 GPU cores for 2C-Die, and 40/128 cores for 4C-Die.

The following is just my attempt to make sense of it all. I could be very wrong!

I think all Jade chips are based on one physical design, Jade 4C-Die. Apple just put in cut lines to make smaller derivatives:

4C-Die: die-to-die interconnect on top and bottom edges. Supports 4 die in a ring topology.
2C-Die: die-to-die interconnect on one edge only. Supports 2 die.
C-Die: no interconnect
C-Chop: no interconnect, half the GPU chopped off

The following is also my speculation, but this time it's informed because this has been Apple's public messaging so far: They won't be supporting non-Apple GPUs. They're far too all-in on the benefits of unified memory. In the Mac Pro, they may provide some kind of proprietary expansion module to add more Apple GPU cores to the system, but AMD and Nvidia are out forever unless users and developers revolt.

I'm going to post here since this thread is more technical than the mac thread.

I did some simple chip math based of numbers from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor_count and the Jade 4C-Die is insane.
The Jade 4C-Die should be roughly 228 Billion transistors and ~1695 mm2 making it the biggest consumer chip ever, double the size of the GA100 Ampere. (M1 Max transistor count * 4)/ (M1 transistor count/M1 area)

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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I don't think so, when you are the one lagging you leak everything to get customers to delay upgrading.

Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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love to use my 2-in-1 laptop with the keyboard key-side on a table

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Perplx
Jun 26, 2004


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R23 has been out for like a year, but then you could directly compare it to an m1

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