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Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


LooseChanj posted:

The only times I've ever bought a console were to play Dragon Warrior/Quest. An NES for 1 & 2, and a PS2 for 8. I bought DW2 when it was released, and I have no loving clue how I finished it without the internet. Hints simply were not an option, I think I actually took notes. You drat kids today have no idea. :bahgawd:
Dragon Warrior 2 did come with a fairly comprehensive map and some spoiler-esque information on the trickier puzzle stuff, although I forget if that was on the map or in the guide. Nintendo Power went over a few of the other hidden things too, if I remember. Sure it's not gamefaqs or something, but that was enough to get through it.

And man, why don't games have maps and stuff packed in anymore? :smith:

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Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


DQV really benefited the most from the DS remake, really. The original version was amazing but it looks something like "upgraded NES game". The DS re-release gave it some modern polish, letting the good game behind it shine through.

And yeah, it's depressing that Dragon Quest never picked up here. I wonder how much NOA lost practically giving the thing away trying to recapture the Japanese success. :smith:

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Yeah, I'm not sure the fact that PC RPGs were more advanced at the time was really a factor, considering PCs were far far less common at the time than they are today especially in lower-income households, and the target market for Dragon Warrior was the 8-14 set. The real reason it probably didn't do well is because the Toriyama art and such were simply not the huge selling points here (at the time anyway) that they were in japan, and that RPGs have never really been a big genre here. You can even see some of this in the modern era where jRPGs are basically a dying genre, and even computer RPGs like Fallout and Dragon Age have been slowly moving towards interactive combat.

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


SpaceDrake posted:

Also JEEEEEESUUUUUUUUUUS, what the gently caress happened to the price of DQV?
Small-scale release after DQIV DS did poorly? V:shobon:V

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Nah, not really. There's some homages to prior games, but the Zenithian triology has less obvious connections between the games than the Loto trilogy did.

You should still play 4 and 5 anyway though. Because they're fun.

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Nah, DQ1 is really pretty fair, as long as you keep in mind it's designed with old sensibilities. Don't go exploring over bridges until you're comfortable with the local enemies, and be sure to carry more torches/herbs than you think you need. The only real problem with it is it requires a good amount of grinding that seems very tedious by modern standards, but if you know what you're doing you can blow through the game in a few hours even despite this.

DQ2 can gently caress right off though. :v: It's just as grindy if not more so, a lot more freeform with even less direction once you reach the midgame, and by the end of it you're running into instant-death spamming enemies, pitfall traps, and other such hilarity. The remakes improved on it some, but it really took until DQ3 for them to get the final formula down.

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Really, there's two important things to remember about the NES-era Dragon Quests over the more modern Final Fantasy-style jRPGs.

The first: it's more about the journey than the destination. Which sounds like some silly philosophy, but I mean more, the games are balanced such that it's an endurance push rather than focused on difficult boss encounters. You need to manage your items and MP to get through and out of dungeons intact, as individual fights generally aren't a big risk but you'll be slowly worn down, and it's difficult to recover from a party member death. The endbosses are still difficult fights mind you, and 4 has several tough boss fights scattered throughout, but they aren't really the main challenge.

The second: it doesn't really matter if you die. There's no game over. You lose half your gold, but keep all the items and experience you got in the meanwhile. The gold thing's a bit painful, but there's ways to mitigate it (the bank, simply spending it on new stuff, etc.) and it's generally a minor problem. Don't be afraid to venture out into unfamiliar places, or push the limits of what you think the party can do.

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Terpfen posted:

If you have a better idea of how job progression should occur, please share.
You could use the exact same mechanic, but cut the number of required battles by like half? :geno:

I still like DQ6, and for the time it was an absolutely amazing RPG, but there's basically no justification for the tedium of the job system these days.

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Himuro posted:

It's not that characters take a backseat in DQ. It's that YOUR characters always take a backseat. Your characters are caught up in the events, but it's never -- EVER, except in the case of DQ5 -- about you. It's about the towns people and people you come across.

As much as I didn't like DQ9 not having DQ8-like characters, as soon as I remembered this fact, I didn't really care.
Yeah. This is the major difference between Dragon Quest and something like Final Fantasy, even if the latter's had more of an influence on modern jRPGs. DQ's always been more about world building and adventuring and such, along with a heavier focus on exploration and dungeon than boss-fighting (not that Dragon Quest is short on those, but). It's why many of the games have a "create a party" mechanic (such as the tavern in 3, or the monster-recruiting of 5) and why the game only punishes you with death by taking half your gold rather than a game over (so that you don't lose everything but exploring and getting in over your head.) It's a fine difference, but it's always been an important one.

Also, even in Dragon Quest V the events of world don't revolve around the main character even if the viewpoint of the story does, since it's his kid that's the legendary hero, not him. :v:

That said, DQX really needs to be "Dragon Quest Online" or something instead, and I can't fathom this Japanese idea of throwing MMOs into the main title release path. But Japanese-made MMOs are basically never good to western eyes, so it's probably safe to just ignore it, for better or worse.

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


LordAndrew posted:

I don't get why Square-Enix thinks they need to make one of the main games in the series an MMO.
"We are failing rapidly and need lots of reliable money very quickly."

Hell, this is why they did FF14, and we saw how well that turned out for them. It will likely be a disaster.

Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Hakkesshu posted:

Does Toriyama actually do all the art himself or does his assistants do parts of it, as I understand is common for many older Japanese artists.
Toriyama has an entire studio to do the art for games and such these days. He used to do it himself way back in the day (like... DQ1-3? Maybe a few later ones), but that hasn't been the case for... what, twenty years or more now? In the best cases he does the rough designs then the assorted assistants finish the rest, but even that tends to be pretty obvious due to his particular style of coloring and shading that Bird Studio usually doesn't quite get right.

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Asimo
Sep 23, 2007


Honestly 7 is probably the worst dragon quest. I mean okay the first is shallow and 2 is janky and punishing, but both at least have the excuse of being old as gently caress. 7 should have known better. :colbert:

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