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Hogge Wild posted:I've heard lots of praise for Renault, I'll try her books next. Does she write anything about triremes? It's been a while but there may be some mention of them in Last of the Wine. It's the story of two young men who fall in love (with each other, natch) during the Peloponnesian War. Her other really excellent books are Fire From Heaven (about Alexander the Great's youth and love affair with Hephaistion), The Persian Boy (written from the viewpoint of Alexander the Great's Persian love-boy), and The King Must Die (Theseus as historical fiction; surprisingly, contains almost no manlove at all).
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Apr 13, 2014 21:45
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coyo7e posted:bromance-on-a-boat For a couple thousand pages, actually! There are a few books that take place on shore and there are female characters mostly starting with (I think?) the third novel. The third one is kindof O'Brian's take on Austen and it rolls from there. They're still in the background for huge swathes of the series though.
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Jun 14, 2014 17:28
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Just think of the whole series as one very long book.
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Jul 13, 2014 18:00
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Bubbacub posted:I've read the series through several times and I never caught this. I always want to slap Maturin at that point. In todays' terms a copy of Birds of North America would probably be more valuable than the Blue Peter.
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Aug 8, 2014 19:58
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I imagine most readers of this thread have seen the Book of the Month thread for this month, but in case you missed it, we're doing Pride and Prejudice; same time setting as Aubrey/Maturin so there's a lot of overlap.
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Sep 9, 2014 17:44
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Hogge Wild posted:What kind of ship does she command? A readership, naturalment.
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Sep 9, 2014 19:33
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quote:
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Sep 17, 2014 05:05
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I finally got around to reading the whole Sharpe series by Bernard Cornwell. They're pretty drat good. They aren't written on the same level as Aubrey/Maturin, but they also don't have the morass of nautical language, but they also don't make any obvious historical mistakes and are better-written overall than most things I've read set in that era -- significantly better-written than the Hornblower books for example. Probably my third favorite overall regency series, just below Johnathan Strange and Mr. Norell and the Aubrey/Maturin books. I think they'd be a really good stepping stone into Aubrey/Maturin for most people. More accessible and more pulpy but they don't cut any corners in the process. Most amusing thing about the series is that while Cornwell clearly can write nuanced and shaded characters, and most of his villains have redeeming features and so forth, every once and a while he'll just throw in an unabashed, mustache-twirling, puppy-kicking cartoon villain just so you can really enjoy hating him. Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 13:48 on Oct 20, 2014 |
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Oct 20, 2014 13:46
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Hogge Wild posted:That series is something I've planned to read for some time. In which order did you read them? I read them in chronological order. Normally I read in author's written order but Cornwell had very clearly plotted out Sharpe's entire career start to finish from the time he wrote the first book, so there are very very few inconsistencies, plus a lot of the characters in the Peninsular War books also show up in the India books. Basically, if you read the Peninsular War books first, you'll get a lot of spoilers for the India books, both because you'll know certain characters stay alive till the Peninsular War and because the Peninsular War books talk a lot about Sharpe's career in India. So read in chronological order and avoid spoilers. I also watched one of the Sharpe TV series episodes just to get a feel for the setting etc. Highlight: All the french infantrymen attacking while wearing what looked like pouffy chef's hats (apparently they would wear white cloth bags over their fancy hats to keep them looking nice). Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 14:11 on Oct 20, 2014 |
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Oct 20, 2014 14:04
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I have a pet theory that we actually see Stephen's dad at one point, which I posted in this thread roughly a year or two ago:Hieronymous Alloy posted:Holy poo poo, did I just read a passage with Stephen's Dad?!? Hieronymous Alloy posted:1) We know Stephen's father was older than he is, a Fitzgerald, in the Spanish military service. "Cousin Fitzgerald" is all three of those things. How many such people were there likely to be? My guess would be not many, and those few details are all we have of Stephen's father, and this guy only shows up for a paragraph and all three are mentioned.
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Nov 12, 2014 21:52
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Arglebargle III posted:
Oh, if you don't get bleary-eyed there you've a cold-stone heart. To your question When Stephen catches the spy in Blaine's house, the spy is a Spanish royal (or something like that, working from memory) dilettanting as a spy. The Spaniards essentially pay the money back in ransom to keep the guy un-hung and get him back safely. .)
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Nov 20, 2014 06:40
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Murgos posted:Is it pathetically spergy that what I really want is more of a quarterdeck simulator than an age of sail fighting game? I don't even think I would want ship-to-ship combat to be the focus, rather just sailing to different ports and such. For that kind of thing you could try Sunless Sea by Failbetter Games.
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Nov 24, 2014 21:57
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khamul posted:Right then, I'll start with the first book. Does the series ever get into the larger fleet actions of the period or does O'brian mostly stick with the cruisers? Mostly sticks to the cruisers; they miss Trafalgar, oddly enough. There are a few points where they watch fleet actions with telescopes, but I think the two largest actions they find themselves directly involved in are based on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Pulo_Aura and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_of_5_October_1804. One whole book is based on the Mauritius campaign so there are multi-ship actions in that one as well.
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Dec 11, 2014 06:40
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ItalicSquirrels posted:The general assumption seems to be that Jack apologizes while Stephen's patching him up. Or at least shortly thereafter. I think O'Brian does it purposefully since shortly into the chapter Stephen mentions "a little spot, convenient in every way" before it's fully realized that everything's fine again. There is an on screen apology but it's way way later, like maybe not even in the same book? Basically once Jack's wounded it wouldn't be sporting to ask him to duel and they're both over it anyway, it all gets basically resolved, but the officiall apology isn't till much later.
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Dec 21, 2014 21:28
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ItalicSquirrels posted:I think it's later on aboard the Lively when Jack says he'd never accuse Stephen of lying, "Not when I'm in my right mind at least" or something to that effect, but that's the only one that springs to mind. Am I forgetting an actual apology? Yeah, that's what I'm referring to. And Stephen says that sometimes he has to lie but doesn't like to be reminded of it.
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Dec 21, 2014 23:37
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Colonial Air Force posted:Maybe, but I found reading Sharpe actually was better in chronological, even if there were some oddities in the short stories. Yeah, Sharpe is fairly unusual in that Cornwell seems to have plotted Sharpe's career out in fairly granular detail out before writing the first book -- it seems to have been plotted from the start as a 20 book or so series, he just jumped around a bit to write the most sellable books first.
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Jan 7, 2015 18:11
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Colonial Air Force posted:I've been pondering trying some Austen. I'm worried it's just 29th century romance novels though. Are they about things other than "a woman needs a husband" or "a man needs a wife"? http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3662001
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Jan 16, 2015 02:58
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builds character posted:Do you think you'll finish that read through? I enjoyed what you'd written. It's on my to-do list. Unfortunately it's a *lot* of work to do each chapter. I really do want to finish it up at some point though. Still, even as it is, it gives people enough background to get their teeth into the book as a whole.
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Jan 16, 2015 06:38
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Raskolnikov2089 posted:Read Emma. It's one of my faves. Rich sheltered women being passive aggressive to each other and freaking out about gypsies. My favorite Austen is actually Northanger Abbey, just because it's so hilarious if you've read a lot of other gothic fiction. I think the two biggest barriers to reading Austen are 1) people need a lot of exposure to the setting and time period to understand the context of everything, and 2) you have to be a sharp reader with a really good eye for multiple layers of meaning to fully appreciate her prose; her jokes are incredibly dry and you'll miss two-thirds of it if you aren't looking carefully. But any reader of Patrick O'Brian has both those things.
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Jan 16, 2015 17:29
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Hogge Wild posted:I don't think that it was cheating, he just had learned to read people from the card player he met in prison. Yeah, Stephen doesn't need to cheat to win, he's just an expert on probability and can read pupils. He doesn't always bother to exert his full powers though. He's also somewhat lucky at cards, within the special meaning that "luck" has in this series. Probably because of the common superstition that those unlucky in love are lucky at cards and vice versa. You could write a whole thing about superstition in these books. There are a few points where they almost become fantasy novels.
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May 12, 2015 15:23
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Nektu posted:Such as? I would have to write it all out and I'm on my phone, but basically there's no point in the series where superstition doesn't act in a manner indistinguishable from a law of nature. You can always read it two ways but I can't think or a point where the superstitions prove wrong.
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May 12, 2015 17:41
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Murgos posted:In The Surgeons Mate there is a section where Stephen is going to negotiate with some Catalan soldiers on a fortified island and in the lead up to it many bad omens happen. Stephens patient dies, he accidentally drops a glass of wine that Jack is handing to him, they sail on Friday and it's the 13th day of the month, etc... But nothing bad happens. Jack specifically calls out that he is going to ignore omens from now on. While touching wood of course, because that's not superstition that's just good common sense. And even then don't they crash into the French coast on the return leg?
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May 12, 2015 18:06
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Arglebargle III posted:It's confirmation bias. You're just doing the same thing as the sailors. It's a work of fiction, though! So yes, that's one reading -- but on the other hand, every time there's an omen that's fulfilled (which is almost every time there's an omen), that's a conscious narrative choice on the part of the author, so . . . Reading it all as confirmation bias and the sailors are just viewing everything through the lens of superstition is definitely a valid reading (and also the reading most consistent with the historical fiction genre). I think my point is just that an alternate reading of things, where "luck" and superstition are a lot more "real," is also possible, and very little within the narrative universe of the books conflicts with such a reading. Omens are almost always fulfilled, Jack's "Luck" does seem to be a physical quality that he has or hasn't got at different times, Stephen is lucky at cards and unlucky at love, etc. Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 11:02 on May 13, 2015 |
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May 13, 2015 10:55
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builds character posted:Jane Austen is good because she is 100% making fun of the vast majority of the people in her books. Yeah, Austen wrote her characters with multiple levels of irony. It isn't unusual for the character speaking, the one hearing, the narrator's voice, and the author's voice to each be working on a separate level of irony. That said there usually is at least one character in her novels who is relatively sympathetic. Look for the young, unmarried, intelligent female.
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Sep 24, 2015 17:51
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Hogge Wild posted:In what order? Read Sharpe in internal chronological order, not publication order, IMHO. The author planned the series out first then wrote them out of sequence based on what he thought would sell. I don't think it's quite as good as Aubrey/Maturin but its on the same level at least.
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Feb 9, 2016 22:10
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Raskolnikov2089 posted:If it helps, you'll find new things every time you re-read the series. I'm on my fifth re-read and find new layers to my favorite characters in every book. I re-read them about every other year. I'm still learning from them. Each re-read teaches you how to read it the next time. This is always a good read when you close the covers, though: http://www.tor.com/2011/02/28/forever-bailing-patrick-obrians-last-unfinished-novel-and-the-end-of-the-aubrey-matrurin-series/ quote:We don’t need a conclusion or a culmination or any of the things we’d like in an ordinary series, it is enough that they are forever bailing. There will always be oceans. Stephen will always be causing Jack to almost miss his tide, and Jack will always be saying hurtful things about the Pope, and there will be nondescript birds and strange sails on the horizon, and gun practice, and music on calm evenings, and Killick muttering over the toasted cheese, until they all come to Avalon, by way of Valparaiso Bay. Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 05:37 on Feb 10, 2016 |
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Feb 10, 2016 05:34
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bondetamp posted:A rather deaf man named Watt. Oh niiiiice
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Mar 14, 2016 23:05
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PerilPastry posted:His autobiography is poo poo though. Basically, one giant political apologia after he got mixed up in the Great Stock Exchange Fraud. His account of the Battle of the Basque Roads is fun though and does a great job of conveying his frustration at being saddled with an admiral hopelessly reluctant to engage the French. Oh good lord, now my head canon is that in 21 Stephen gets a parrot and this happens to his new flame whats her name
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Nov 24, 2016 16:27
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bondetamp posted:No, it must have happened to the admiral wife Jack called a poxed son of a whore or something in book one. No, see, she gets all upset but then realizes OMG ITS A PARROT later in the book the parrot is killed in action and they dissect it together
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Nov 25, 2016 00:13
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ItalicSquirrels posted:Actually, that's an interesting point. Is it time to start the thread over? It's almost six years old and the OP's been marked with an R since about a month after it started (and only halfway through book 2!). Should we begin from the beginning or should we press on, crack on regardless? I kinda like seeing this thread eternally recur, but that may just be me.
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Nov 30, 2016 15:04
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Professor Shark posted:I just finished the first chapter of Fortune and I don't know anything about Cricket... did Maturin play the game right and astound everyone? Yes to the second part
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Jan 19, 2017 00:57
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Xander77 posted:Really not sure that he did. Among (many) other things, he really has to play the proper gentleman to the jealous local crowd, what with being Jewish and all. There's a strong argument that both Stephen and Canning deserved better than Diana. Not because she was a "fallen woman" but because she treated them all horribly.
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Feb 16, 2017 21:03
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The Jew and the bastard papist were both absurdly rich, though, and the bastard was bastard (Irish) nobility.
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Feb 17, 2017 02:13
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The real issue with Mauritius is that, from what I remember, the historical model for Jack in that campaign basically got All The Awards and retired for life right afterwards, so if O'Brian gave him realistic rewards, so would Jack.
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Jun 22, 2017 17:00
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Arglebargle III posted:Master and Commander isn't really an action movie, it's more of an adventure movie. There's two actions in the film and the rest is everyday life, heavy weather around the horn, the doldrums & Hollum's story, landfall at the Galapagos, Stephen getting shot, trepanning Plaice, officers chatting about the design and force of the Acheron and Blakeney having people try to cheer him up. So what I'm hearing is it has everything I saw it when it came.out but it's been years
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Jul 22, 2017 04:41
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Arglebargle III posted:M&C is a perfect subject for a prestige miniseries with a big CG budget. I think the prohibitive factor has been all the water. Filming boat stuff is ludicrously xpensive, as is filming period, so together it's just prohibitive for a TV budget. Maybe CGI will change that with time. They did do Sharpe, but Sharpe didn't have water. Honestly I expect Temeraire on the TV before Aubrey, which is just sad.
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Jul 24, 2017 14:41
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Professor Shark posted:Why dors Jack paint his little cannons brown instead of leaving them raw brass like the crew wants (with them scrapping the paint little by little)? Keeping them shiny is an immense amount of work in terms of polishing and does nothing to keep the ship battle ready, it's purely aesthetic.
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Aug 24, 2017 20:37
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jerman999 posted:I always thought that Maturin absent-mindedly walked away without getting his change, and when the silversmith came and gave it to him in front of Martin, now Martin would know how much it cost. Which is deeply embarrassing, of course. It also demonstrates how stinking rich Maturin is at that point, to the point that he can just forget that much money, which inevitably creates a wall It's always a little rude to be rich
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Sep 16, 2017 00:30
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Fire Safety Doug posted:Ok, apologies for the middling quality but I only thought of snapping some quick shots right before we had to head off. Oh yeah that's the good poo poo right there
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Oct 3, 2017 04:10
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"Formulaic" implies that the *only* things that happen are according to a formula, I think. There's a basic plot engine that drives the series, sure -- [everyone's broke and lonely -> go to sea -> get rich -> come home -> gently caress up -> goto start] but what makes the series compelling is how O'Brian rings the changes on that theme.
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Oct 30, 2017 13:25
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