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Hi thread! I'm an amateur shooting with an ancient Canon EOS Rebel T1i, looking to swap to mirrorless. I do mostly landscape stuff along with occasional travel shots (although not so much right now obviously) and usually wander around with the EF-S f15-85mm 3.5-5.6 lens on. A key thing to know is, for a number of reasons, having IBIS is an important factor in any upgrade. Insofar as I'd thought this through I was looking at a Sony A6600 or similar albeit with some misgivings, because the Sony lens lineup is a bit pricey and doesn't seem to have as good coverage of various ranges as on Canon, at least in a similar price bracket. I looked again recently and was surprised to see that Fuji have not only come out with the X-S10 but they also have the XF 16-80mm f4 (yay constant aperture) which seems to get pretty good reviews for a lens of its type. The X-S10 is also much more like a Canon DSLR in terms of physical ergonomics than any other Fuji camera and has a PASM dial rather than the more traditional Fuji controls, so again that's more marks for familiarity. Bearing in mind the IBIS thing, am I being a dumb dumb and overlooking any competition at a similar price point which I ought to at least consider? Looks like the X-S10 + XF 16-80 can be picked up for $1499 as a kit, and then I can ebay the Canon stuff for a couple hundred bucks.
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Mar 15, 2021 23:22
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harperdc posted:Just wanted to ask why, in particular, IBIS is a key. The usual approach I try to think about for gear updates is "I'm running into X problem, so I'm going to do Y to solve it," and just wanted to check the logic. Partially this is because if IBIS isn't as necessary, there are more Fuji bodies available used to help you budget-wise. The tl;dr is unsteady hands, so having something to assist with that on all lenses is a massive help. Lens stabilization is certainly one way to solve that (and the EF-S 15-85 is stabilized) but having IBIS just seems like the easiest way to solve the problem when I know I'll need it for all lenses. Plus IBIS can generally achieve better results than stabilization in the lens alone, and means you don't keep having to buy more expensive stabilized lenses. I'm aware the Fuji 16-80 is also stabilized but I'm looking at that for the focal length range more than anything, and it won't be my only lens in the longer term if I do go with the Fuji system. I also don't mind spending a relatively large amount (for an amateur anyway) since any modern camera is a massive resolution and dynamic range jump from the ancient Canon. Thanks for the advice from others above too. rolleyes fucked around with this message at 15:35 on Mar 16, 2021 |
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Mar 16, 2021 15:32
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Just picked up a Fuji X-S10, and I am not disappoint. It takes a bit of getting used to coming from a Canon 500D but the SLR-style grip and PASM dial are nice touches. Obviously the camera itself is light-years ahead in terms of the sensor and the IBIS is very impressive. I got it with the 16-80 f/4 which is a nice upgrade in terms of sharpness compared to the 15-85 f/3.5‑5.6 I was using before. The compromise is losing 5mm on the long end but I still think it's worth it. The only downside so far is trying to figure out the myriad settings and options, but having the custom slots on the PASM dial means I can quickly flick between setups once I know what I want. rolleyes fucked around with this message at 14:48 on Jul 25, 2021 |
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Jul 25, 2021 14:45
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8th-snype posted:The 18-55mm is the good inexpensive kit lens but the 16-80mm is a great lens and if you can swing that you probably should. I'm rocking the 16-80 and whilst it's not without its limitations (max aperture f/4, heavier than the 18-55) it's pretty drat good in all other respects and the f/4 is constant throughout the zoom range. The 16-80 aperture ring has marked values and a nice click at each step, which to me feels much nicer to use than the fly-by-wire ring on the 18-55 where you need to look at the camera display to know what your aperture is set to. This might sound like a small thing but the chances are if you're going for a Fuji camera then you like physical controls, so this means you'll have that for aperture to complement the shutter and iso controls on the camera body. e: Also worth noting that whilst the extra 2mm at the wide end might not sound like much, it's actually pretty significant in terms of the change in field of view. rolleyes fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Sep 26, 2021 |
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Sep 26, 2021 22:32
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Brrrmph posted:I have a Fuji X100F and I’m considering diving deeper into Fuji to compliment my Nikon habit. I've only recently gone to Fuji myself (X-S10) and the only lens I have right now is the 16-80 f4 so I've got nothing to compare it to. Whether you consider it to be an entry lens I'm not sure - it comes as a kit with the X-S10 but it costs $800 new. You might be able to find a used one though. That said, if you're looking for a general purpose walkabout lens it's hard to beat. It can be a little soft wide open at the 16mm end and it's pretty heavy, but you get a really nice range of focal lengths. Obviously being f4 the low light performance suffers a bit - the lens does have OIS to help compensate for static shots, and on the X-S10 this is boosted further by the really solid in-body stabilization. You also can't get the super shallow DoF you can get from an f2.8 or wider lens, although at the narrow end you can still get some nice separation at f4.
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Dec 3, 2021 10:13
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Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:Crossposting from the general gear thread: I’m interested in getting a fuji 23mm, probably want a 1.4, if I don’t especially care about weather resistance is the new one otherwise worth looking at? If you don't care for weather resistance why not get the old 1.4 now everyone's selling them off (relatively) cheap? There's plenty of good quality examples on eBay and used gear stores.
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May 11, 2022 21:40
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I own the 16-80mm and it's really nice for what it does - it's still my default walkabout lens. Depending on what you like to shoot then sooner or later you'll likely find f/4 is limiting, but it's nice that it's constant through the zoom range and the much improved Fuji ISO performance over your current Canon will compensate to a degree. With you planning to primarily rely on in-camera JPEGs you might be reassured to know that Fuji's in-camera noise reduction and lens distortion correction is basically witchcraft. I've yet to find a raw processor (lightroom/capture one/iridient) that can match it, particularly the distortion correction. It's also worth you knowing that you can do basic raw edits in-camera including applying different film sims to save out as JPEG copies, so that's another reason to shoot both JPEG and raw.
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May 19, 2022 11:22
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Blamestorm posted:That’s great. I was kind of surprised people online were making such a big deal about WR as it’s not something I used to think about with cameras, so I was wondering if the modern stuff is just way more delicate. I've used an X-S10 at 20 degrees, 3,000ft above sea level, on a ridge, in a blizzard and it was fine. Obviously snow is a bit different to rain and I was careful to wipe it down before putting it back in my backpack but they can stand up to more than you think. Just don't let it get totally wet basically. Taking it out of the bag in mild rain and getting a few drops on it won't kill it, particularly if you have a cloth with you to dry it.
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Jul 2, 2022 13:31
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As you'll have seen from the site linked above, the f/2 primes are waaaay smaller than the f/1.4 versions. That said, Fuji just released a new version of the 23mm f/1.4 so you can get the older version for a good price on eBay or whatever. The main difference between the two versions apart from optics is... you guessed it... weather sealing. On the point about sand, weather sealing won't do poo poo to prevent damage from that - on lenses weather sealing is more about preventing dust getting in (and water of course). Sand and high grade optics is just a terrible combination but, again, just take care and if you do get any on the front of the lens DO NOT try to brush it off. Blow it off with something like this: https://www.amazon.com/Giottos-AA1910-Medium-Rocket-Blaster/dp/B000L9OIQC/ Edit: again, I've used the X-S10 on beaches in windy conditions, including getting a bit of salt spray on it. That's obviously not ideal and I took care when cleaning that off but can confirm it did not explode 
rolleyes fucked around with this message at 21:27 on Jul 2, 2022 |
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Jul 2, 2022 21:25
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pumped up for school posted:For a bit more reach I'm using the 16-80. I've been pretty happy with it. Same. Only caveat is max aperture of f/4.
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Aug 9, 2022 20:38
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aricoarena posted:I'm mostly curious about this since I have not paid attention to cameras in the last 9 years. If anyone was doing that level of processing in camera? They're two different markets I think. If you're buying a smartphone for its photography abilities, there's an assumption you want to point, shoot and have something ready to chuck up on Insta even if it looks a bit artificial. If you're buying a dedicated camera, especially one with interchangeable lenses, there's an assumption you're probably going to edit the RAWs later. The likes of Apple, Google and Samsung can afford to invest in their AI-powered magic and a lot of that runs remotely on the cloud, meaning it requires a permanent data connection - something cameras don't tend to have. Sure you could tether a camera to your phone's connection, but if you're trying to market a stand-alone camera and you have to put a giant asterisk next to key features that says "only works with your phone, soz" then it's not really standalone, and consumers will rightly wonder why they should buy this over a better phone. This is also why the middle-ground of compact cameras with fixed lenses is mostly in decline. Mostly. As others have mentioned, Fuji has built themselves a unique ecosystem around their APS-C format X-Trans sensor where they have both mirrorless CSCs like the X-T series, but also fixed-lens cameras using the same sensor like the X100V. As part of this, they've long provided film sims/digital filters in-camera, and have a reputation for very good out-of-camera JPEGs. They also have basic RAW editing functionality built into the camera, e.g. you can shoot in RAW, use the in-camera tools to raise shadows, warm the image up, apply a film sim etc, all without making destructive changes to the original image, then upload to Insta (via companion app on your phone). Basically Fuji have decided to walk a slightly strange path where their fixed lens cameras have capabilities more usually associated with CSCs, and vice versa. Seems to be working for them, and it's the closest you'll get to iPhone-style low light images in a standalone camera. You'll still have to push a few menu buttons, but you won't need to fire up lightroom on a laptop unless you want to do more advanced stuff.
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Jan 2, 2023 23:24
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That's also a fair point. Most modern phones can shoot raw, and there are plenty of apps (even free ones like Snapseed) that can edit them on the device.
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Jan 2, 2023 23:39
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I mean the default camera app on my Samsung S10e (hardly the latest and greatest phone) provides manual control over ISO, shutter speed, focus and white balance (color temp + g/p tint) as well as tailoring the contrast, saturation and highlight & shadow recovery. The only reason it doesn't do manual aperture is both lenses are fixed aperture. As mentioned above, the interface for it is terrible though. What you'll definitely never get on a phone in the foreseeable future is the image fidelity you get from a standalone camera, in multiple ways. Sensor size determines how much light can be gathered - the larger the sensor the more light you get so the lower the amplification/gain (ISO) needs to be so the cleaner (less noisy) the image is. A cleaner image also means more information captured, so more detail can be recovered from highlights and shadows when processing the raw data. Sensor size (along with aperture) also determines depth-of-field range. The larger the sensor the shallower the DOF so the more you can blur things in front or behind what you've focused on. Phones have small sensors, which is why they have to fake this effect - see "portrait mode". It's passable and good enough for what most people want, but also obviously fake to anyone who knows what it really should look like. So... why not just slap an APS-C or even full frame sensor in a phone? Well apart from the cost, sensor size is also a key factor in the equation that determines minimum distance between the sensor and the back of the lens. The larger the sensor, the larger the distance and even for APS-C it's typically around 18mm which is twice the thickness of many phones - and that's before you consider the size of the lens itself. Even the simplest, flattest lenses for APS-C format cameras protrude another 20-30mm from the camera body at least, so... yeah. Everything is a compromise between size & image quality (and price), it all comes down to what you want to achieve and what's important to you.
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Jan 3, 2023 00:21
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frytechnician posted:I think Ken, the Angry Photographer guy was convinced they were gonna do one but judging by a lot of his other content pretty much since COVID hit, he's gone full-on into bonkers territory so I'd take what he has to say with a pinch of salt and then some... One more reason to continue to ignore Ken Rockwell sounds good to me. Re. the Q2, goddamn that's both a nice looking camera and hilariously out of reach for most people (myself included). On Fuji usability, yeah I kinda agree. I used to shoot Canon, now I shoot Fuji. The gap between Canon's intuitive menus and Fuji's "put everything in a massive list" approach is about the same as the gap from Fuji to Canon sensors, just in the opposite direction. Yes they give you a myriad of ways to customize it but that's part of the problem; there's at least 3 different ways to customize the drat things (presets, Q-menu (which itself can be customized) and My Menu). Don't get me wrong I enjoy using it and have no regrets about selling the Canon, but I'm strictly doing this as a hobby and mostly do landscapes so I'm rarely in a hurry.
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Feb 3, 2023 20:08
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In my experience the Fuji app works fairly reliably most of the time, but then abjectly refuses to acknowledge the camera exists 1 time in 20.
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Feb 22, 2023 21:25
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As someone who moved from APS-C Canon to Fuji X-S10 a couple of years ago, the physical ergonomics are pretty nice, but dear god, the menus. Partly it's just that it's a much more complex system than my previous camera, but even accounting for that Fuji just don't seem to know how to make an intuitive menu system. There are about a billion settings, usually multiple ways you can change at least half of them, and some of them move to entirely different places when the camera gets a firmware update. Basically be prepared to spend a lot of time searching the PDF manual to find where the setting you want is. I sometimes still have to do that 2 years later, although I've put the things I use most into "my menu" (basically a favourites page for settings). Although even then, not all settings can be added to that  Don't get me wrong I love the camera, but the experience of setting it up could be vastly improved. TLDR: hardware good, software bad.
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Jun 7, 2023 23:28
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Late to the pod/clip party, but I've used the peak design one with the XF 16-80 attached and carried it up mountain hikes with no issues. It's pretty comfortable too.
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Aug 25, 2023 19:29
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tuna posted:What oddball poo poo will Fuji do with the screen on the latest xPro this time, I wonder. Motorized and AI tries to predict what orientation you want.
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Feb 7, 2024 08:54
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wolfs posted:ok so Fuji is putting out a 40 mp “compact” In one way this is surprising, but in another kinda not. I'm sure everyone in this thread is well aware that smartphone sensors are not comparable to dedicated camera sensors, but when 3 year old smartphones have 50mp main sensors there is a "gotta keep up with the big numbers" marketing element to this. If Fuji and others are hoping to hook (wealthy!) casual users into their compact product lines, then they've either got to educate those people about why 24mp is perfectly fine or suck it up and pander to the "bigger number better" crowd.
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Feb 20, 2024 17:54
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Splinter posted:OTOH, when are we going to get some of the computational stuff smartphone cameras can do baked into a camera with a real sensor. The extra MP can be helpful for some of that. Let me hand hold a burst long exposure with a real camera and have the it align the shots and do the LE summing for me in camera plz. Yeah this would be pretty sweet but at this point it pretty much requires a camera manufacturer to team up with Apple/Google/Samsung (or to be bought by one of them). They're so far ahead with realtime and near-real-time AI/image synthesis (both hardware and software) that simply getting on parity with today's smartphone capabilities would be a huge R&D investment, and camera makers don't have an Apple/Google-size budget. Or their software engineering capabilities (I'm looking at you Fuji and your terrible menus). Maybe the future is cameras with "Powered by Google Photos" on the back.
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Feb 21, 2024 01:24
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The 16-80 is a great general purpose travel lens imo. Yes it's quite bulky but it's often the only one I take. As with all zooms there are compromises, the main one being the f/4 max aperture. It's a very capable lens though.
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Mar 10, 2024 16:07
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