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thespaceinvader posted:Everyone appreciates high init. Except the DM when you declare that you're holding action because you need to go after your party member(s) and force him to remake his handwritten initiative order. 
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Feb 23, 2016 00:22
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thespaceinvader posted:Everyone appreciates high init. I love Blade Dancer too, but the GM likes deliberately avoiding the opportunity to let me use Cross-Body Parry very often, and the free feat slot, +1 to hit and net +1 damage from using Shock Trooper and two Short Swords over Two-Weapon Warrior and Rapiers seemed like the better deal.
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Feb 23, 2016 00:23
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isndl posted:Except the DM when you declare that you're holding action because you need to go after your party member(s) and force him to remake his handwritten initiative order. Get a big magnetic white board, laminate some cards for PC and monster names (and init and init mod, passive perception/insight), tape magnets onto the backs. Never worry again. Unknown Quantity posted:I love Blade Dancer too, but the GM likes deliberately avoiding the opportunity to let me use Cross-Body Parry very often, and the free feat slot, +1 to hit and net +1 damage from using Shock Trooper and two Short Swords over Two-Weapon Warrior and Rapiers seemed like the better deal. Fair enough; but I'd go as far as arguing that if CBP is causing the DM to mess up his tactics enough to avoid it, you should be able to capitalise on that - but Shock Trooper is also good and is much more proactive, so it's still a solid choice. Albeit the AP feature on Blade Dancer is noice.
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Feb 23, 2016 00:29
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MelvinTheJerk posted:I have a question I'm hoping someone can help me with. Generic Octopus posted:Rules Compendium has the updated rules. PHB errata is here. Errata Page 21 posted:Power Errata Page 23 posted:Magic Items
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Feb 23, 2016 00:30
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Unknown Quantity posted:I love Blade Dancer too, but the GM likes deliberately avoiding the opportunity to let me use Cross-Body Parry very often, and the free feat slot, +1 to hit and net +1 damage from using Shock Trooper and two Short Swords over Two-Weapon Warrior and Rapiers seemed like the better deal. Drow Long Knife (or thrown enchantment on offhand weapon), Cleave, and Deft Hurler. Drow Long Knife, Cleave, and Deft Hurler. Oh. And Heavy Blade Opportunity. Throw your swords, Mark at range.
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Feb 23, 2016 00:39
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Mecha Gojira posted:Drow Long Knife (or thrown enchantment on offhand weapon), Cleave, and Deft Hurler. Drow Long Knife, Cleave, and Deft Hurler. Oh. And Heavy Blade Opportunity. Throw your swords, Mark at range. I mean I'd lose 1 AC/Ref by swapping to heavy blades and no longer be able to hit Ref on Dual Strike/MBAs, but if I dual-wielded them the damage would more or less be the same and I'd have an actual use for my second at-will.
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Feb 23, 2016 00:48
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Unknown Quantity posted:I mean I'd lose 1 AC/Ref by swapping to heavy blades and no longer be able to hit Ref on Dual Strike/MBAs, but if I dual-wielded them the damage would more or less be the same and I'd have an actual use for my second at-will. Think of it this way: you lose the accuracy of Deft Blade, but make up for it with the ability to multi-attack on an OA. Here's a few thoughts: ====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ====== level 15 Thri-Kreen, Fighter, Shock Trooper Build: Tempest Fighter Fighter: Combat Superiority Fighter Talents: Tempest Technique Versatile Expertise: Versatile Expertise (Heavy Blade) Versatile Expertise: Versatile Expertise (Light Blade) Background: Brother in Battle (Brother in Battle Benefit) FINAL ABILITY SCORES Str 22, Con 15, Dex 18, Int 9, Wis 16, Cha 11. STARTING ABILITY SCORES Str 16, Con 14, Dex 13, Int 8, Wis 14, Cha 10. AC: 29 Fort: 30 Reflex: 27 Will: 26 HP: 114 Surges: 11 Surge Value: 28 TRAINED SKILLS Intimidate +12, Endurance +17, Athletics +20 UNTRAINED SKILLS Acrobatics +11, Arcana +6, Bluff +7, Diplomacy +7, Dungeoneering +10, Heal +10, History +6, Insight +12, Nature +12, Perception +12, Religion +6, Stealth +11, Streetwise +7, Thievery +11 FEATS Level 1: Weapon Proficiency (Drow Long Knife) Level 2: Deft Hurler Style Level 4: Two-Weapon Fighting Level 6: Mark of Warding Level 8: Superior Will Level 10: Improved Initiative Level 11: Two-Weapon Opening Level 12: Heavy Blade Opportunity Level 14: Armor Specialization (Hide) Feat User Choice: Improved Defenses Feat User Choice: Weapon Focus (Heavy Blade) Feat User Choice: Versatile Expertise POWERS Fighter at-will 1: Dual Strike Fighter at-will 1: Cleave Fighter encounter 1: Funneling Flurry Fighter daily 1: Villain's Menace Fighter utility 2: Glowering Threat Fighter encounter 3: Parry and Riposte Fighter daily 5: Dancing Defense Fighter utility 6: Kirre's Roar Fighter encounter 7: Come and Get It Fighter daily 9: Jackal Strike Fighter utility 10: Defensive Advance Fighter encounter 13: Storm of Blows (replaces Funneling Flurry) Fighter daily 15: Dust Storm Assault (replaces Villain's Menace) ITEMS Melegaunt's Darkblade Drow Long Knife +3, Drow Long Knife of Long Range +3, Lifeblood Hide Armor +3, Periapt of Cascading Health +3 ====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ====== Mark of Warding makes sure that even if you can't enforce your mark due to range, it'll at least help your allies out with another -5% to hit and give the monsters something to consider. Weapon of long-range off-hand is just for the fun of it. Melegaunt's Darkblade is the most important part, though, and note that it also comes in light blades! If you're stuck on light blades, though, Farbond Spellblade works pretty well as an off-hand, though it sounds like you really just want to use a Rhythm Blade. Mecha Gojira fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Feb 23, 2016 |
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Feb 23, 2016 00:51
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I can't get a printout, but I'll list off everything I have to give you an idea of what I would have if I swapped out light for heavy and did the stuff prior to your build. 22/12/22/11/14/9 Combat Challenge Combat Agility Background: Aglarond (fluff) Theme: Sohei PP: Shock Trooper Feats: TWD (Bonus), Improved Defenses (Bonus), TWF (Bonus), WF: Heavy Blade (Bonus), Heavy Blade Expertise (Bonus), WP: Drow Long Knife, Monastic Disciple, Mark of Warding, Deft Hurler, Improved Initiative, Iron Will (can't get superior, bonus dex gives way more benefits), Agile Tempest, Heavy Blade Opportunity, Two-Weapon Opening Powers: Dual Strike, Cleave, Rain of Blows, Come and Get It, Storm of Blows, Dancing Defense, Rain of Steel, Dust Storm Assault, Glowering Threat, Kirre's Roar, Fighter's Grit Items: Darkblade Drow Long Knife +3, Drow Long Knife of Distance +3, Battle Harness Earthide Armor +3, Iron Armbands of Power (heroic), Acrobat Boots (heroic), Elven Chain Shirt (heroic), Stone of Earth (paragon), Moradin's Blessing of Iron (L3), Melora's Storm Blessing (L3, amazing how this is fine), Iron Hand Unbreakable Form (I had an extra item slot and bonus THP seemed like a great idea. Could always swap this out with a L15 boon now that the weapons are weaker but eh.) I went full in on STR/DEX for maximum initiative, AC, Reflex, and tempest benefits. My will took a hit at a mere 25, but the DM doesn't like doing dominate and I can just ignore Daze for a turn anyway. I originally was considering keeping Spring Step instead of Monastic Disciple, but in retrospect it seems niche when I have so many movement abilities. Plus I still haven't found a multiclass or other fun feat besides maybe stealing quarry from Ranger to nab, so +9 damage 1/enc (+13 if it's a different dude) feels like a nice little bonus. And mildly flavorful.
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Feb 23, 2016 03:36
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Ehh, I'd still try to get a wisdom 15 by paragon. Iron Will can always be retrained. A 16 in paragon will make your combat superiority stronger too. And get combat superiority. Wis mod to OA attacks and stopping movement is too good to pass up. Ever.
Mecha Gojira fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Feb 23, 2016 |
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Feb 23, 2016 03:45
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Mecha Gojira posted:Ehh, I'd still try to get a wisdom 15 by paragon. Iron Will can always be retrained. A 16 will make your combat superiority stronger too. I'm not using Combat Superiority. I'm using Combat Agility. I already swing at a +22, and the campaign is using a math conversion to add Escalation die, so I'm already swinging at +25 just by having combat advantage by the second round. Unknown Quantity fucked around with this message at 03:52 on Feb 23, 2016 |
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Feb 23, 2016 03:47
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Unknown Quantity posted:I'm not using Combat Superiority. I'm using Combat Agility. Reread Combat Agility. It's kind of garbage. The enemy still needs to be adjacent to you to provoke that opportunity action either way, but said opportunity action takes place AFTER the enemy's action. Superiority is strictly better and Heavy Blade Opportunity makes it even sillier to have.
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Feb 23, 2016 03:55
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Since I know for sure the campaign is almost over, I'll meet it halfway: I'll grab Combat Superiority, and if the campaign reaches 16th level I'll put a +1 into Wis and retrain into Superior Will. If not, well, I still have Fighter's Grit and Sohei's boost to saving throws. Plus my GM was getting annoyed of my ranger having like 29-30 in all defenses (even more with AC/Ref) while simultaneously removing Elite Brutes in one turn 1/day, so this is cutting them some slack. Then again, I did go to the CharOP thread, so... EDIT: Wow I forgot the second stat boost is at 18th, whoops. Well, uh, thanks for the gear recommendations and stuff! Unknown Quantity fucked around with this message at 04:12 on Feb 23, 2016 |
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Feb 23, 2016 04:01
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senrath posted:Specifically the bits you want from the document are: Thanks man.
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Feb 23, 2016 05:35
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Mecha Gojira posted:Reread Combat Agility. It's kind of garbage. The enemy still needs to be adjacent to you to provoke that opportunity action either way, but said opportunity action takes place AFTER the enemy's action. Superiority is strictly better and Heavy Blade Opportunity makes it even sillier to have. Str/Wis fighters are secretly the best fighters in the game by a wide margin, even though you are supposedly looking at Con or Dex.
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Feb 23, 2016 05:39
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Unknown Quantity posted:Since I know for sure the campaign is almost over, I'll meet it halfway: I'll grab Combat Superiority, and if the campaign reaches 16th level I'll put a +1 into Wis and retrain into Superior Will. If not, well, I still have Fighter's Grit and Sohei's boost to saving throws. Plus my GM was getting annoyed of my ranger having like 29-30 in all defenses (even more with AC/Ref) while simultaneously removing Elite Brutes in one turn 1/day, so this is cutting them some slack. Then again, I did go to the CharOP thread, so... No problem. I think I've been thinking about that Tempest Fighter build for weeks. I know it's not the first time I've brought up Drow Long Knives or Deft Hurler before. Plus I applaud your choice of Thri-kreen. One of my favorites. OneThousandMonkeys posted:Str/Wis fighters are secretly the best fighters in the game by a wide margin, even though you are supposedly looking at Con or Dex. You can always swap out Wis for Dex with Agile Superiority, but that takes a feat. It could be worth it for certain builds like Dragonborn Fullblade carriers who want to play with their natural charisma score, though. Built one with the Yakuza theme, for example. He also had the feat that let you mark with Dragonfear, which I thought was super-tight.
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Feb 23, 2016 05:52
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Mecha Gojira posted:No problem. I think I've been thinking about that Tempest Fighter build for weeks. I know it's not the first time I've brought up Drow Long Knives or Deft Hurler before. Plus I applaud your choice of Thri-kreen. One of my favorites. Well, there's the bonus to hit on mark punishment from Wisdom, but there's also: -Superior WIll and a really good Will defense -Polearms and stuff -Most of the best skills in the game I kinda want to do a thri-kreen self-prone-shift build for maximum hilarious combat style.
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Feb 23, 2016 11:38
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:Well, there's the bonus to hit on mark punishment from Wisdom, but there's also: I forgot there's also a bunch of paragon paths and powers that key off Wisdom, too. Essentially, Wisdom should light up as a build choice when you make a fighter on the builder, but other classes have this problem too.
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Feb 25, 2016 01:06
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:I forgot there's also a bunch of paragon paths and powers that key off Wisdom, too. Essentially, Wisdom should light up as a build choice when you make a fighter on the builder, but other classes have this problem too. To be fair, focus on wisdom is almost completely weapon specific. Hammer and Ax feats and powers generally key off of Constitution while Light Blades, Heavy Blades, and Flails key off Dex. Polearm fighters are stuck in the middle requiring both decent dexterity AND wisdom. Fortunately, Fighters are the best class to take advantage of the good old classic 16/14/14/13/10/8 pre-racial stat array since accuracy and damage are not issues for them. As long as you're running a Str-primary race, you're pretty much golden whichever path you choose. And like I said, with Agile Superiority, you're only giving up a feat to basically make your class feature key off Dex, allowing you to go for a more charismatic fighter build if you so choose, and you'll still qualify for Superior Will!
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Feb 25, 2016 01:59
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Can you drag enemies up walls with you? Because if so I have a stupid idea for a Ranger/Fighter who grabs a thing then rides their spider up a wall to drop them for 20 squares of fall damage or whatever.
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Mar 5, 2016 05:42
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NORTH-HALL posted:Can you drag enemies up walls with you? Vertical forced movement is generally a no-no in 4e for exactly this reason. Try to build around something else unless your DM is okay.
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Mar 5, 2016 06:49
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If memory serves, you can. It's just that the target gets a saving thrown if they are unwilling to move. But yeah, what Mecha Gojira said.
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Mar 5, 2016 16:39
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No, you cannot force them to move somewhere they ordinarily couldn't move without a check with the exception of forcing them off the edge of something. If you do that, or force them into any hazardous terrain (note, most zone powers and auras don't count) they get a save and fall prone in the square prior if they succeed.
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Mar 5, 2016 23:03
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thespaceinvader posted:No, you cannot force them to move somewhere they ordinarily couldn't move without a check with the exception of forcing them off the edge of something. If you do that, or force them into any hazardous terrain (note, most zone powers and auras don't count) they get a save and fall prone in the square prior if they succeed. This doesn't stop you from finding some means to apply a save penalty and then making said person roll a far more difficult save vs falling off a cliff, but I'm pretty sure out of some wizard shenanigans there's not much in the way of stacking save penalties.
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Mar 5, 2016 23:23
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It does stop you dragging them up a wall and dropping them, though.
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Mar 5, 2016 23:24
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I have a player that really, really hates missing playing a dragon sorcerer playing the zeitgeist adventure path. They are happy to tip everything into optimising too hit chances. They are currently level 5. Stuff that immediately occurs to me: * They already have a free expertise feat and inherent bonuses * Accurate Staff Feat * Switch from 18/18 stat array to 16/20 * Grab oncoming thunder and change up power mix to include a ton of lightning + thunder spells. * Grab coordinated explosion, potentially switching out to war wizard's expertise and getting war wizardry to ensure you don't frag team mates. * Grab a lucky charm (Which they have and forget to use) and possibly the couters that allow a re-roll. Also 'use more big AoE attacks' to allow multiple chances to hit. Anything I've forgotten?
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Apr 11, 2016 04:03
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Gambler's Eight and Shape of the Multiverse. Stone of $Relevant element Or just play and Elementalist. It's trivial to get elementalists to hit on a 2.
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Apr 11, 2016 08:33
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What are good ways for Elementalists to ignore a potential monster's elemental resistance or immunity? I haven't read the description in a long time, so excuse me if it's an upper-tier class feature or feat.
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Apr 12, 2016 11:39
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BetterWeirdthanDead posted:What are good ways for Elementalists to ignore a potential monster's elemental resistance or immunity? Arcane Admixture in paragon. Those Gifts of the Queen items - one of them lets you count lightning as radiant. For the most part though you don't worry about it too much; the best way to bypass resistance is to just blast right the gently caress through it.
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Apr 12, 2016 12:12
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It also seems like a very reasonable house rule that elemantalists should get the same piercing resistance feature as sorcerers
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Apr 12, 2016 14:35
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Coming into Paragon with the Brawler I asked about earlier. My DM likes to field grudge monsters that break my grabs either through teleporting or forced movement. For the porters I'm eyeing a feyslaughter weapon, but is there a feat or item or something that's good for countering forced movement? I went Shock Trooper for the Paragon Path. Any particular feats a Brawler should be eyeing at Paragon?
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Apr 13, 2016 06:13
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Lemniscate Blue posted:Coming into Paragon with the Brawler I asked about earlier. My DM likes to field grudge monsters that break my grabs either through teleporting or forced movement. For the porters I'm eyeing a feyslaughter weapon, but is there a feat or item or something that's good for countering forced movement? Feyslaughter is a good start, as are things that blind (can't usually teleport whilst blinded). Forced movement resistance, look for items with 'Dwarven' in the name, I think there's a feet slot? There are also a couple of 'IR bounce back up and get back in the fight' type powers, but forced movement really screws with Brawlers  I assume you're doing Master of the Fist.
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Apr 13, 2016 11:41
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Feyslaughter is very good, as every loving monster starts teleporting around paragon. But if your DM is wasting actions breaking your grabs, you're doing your job.
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Apr 13, 2016 12:40
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thespaceinvader posted:Feyslaughter is a good start, as are things that blind (can't usually teleport whilst blinded). Thanks, I'll keep an eye out in the builder. Yeah, MotF. I've actually been annoyed that I have to start relying on weapon. I've had a lot of fun being a fistfighter. Improved Monk Unarmed Strike is pretty high on my list of desired feats, because it and Shock Trooper combined for an effective +2 damage on average, and the group doesn't really have a dedicated striker so everybody has to pull their weight in damage.
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Apr 13, 2016 13:32
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Feyslaughter spiked gauntlets  I.e. not actually weapons, magical knuckle tattoos.
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Apr 13, 2016 15:04
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thespaceinvader posted:Feyslaughter spiked gauntlets I went with a talid so I can still grab stuff. But I'm only going to break it out when we're up against bamfers, otherwise I'll just punch stuff as usual. EDIT: plus I kinda like the visual of an offhand claw weapon, grab-and-stab.
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Apr 13, 2016 16:17
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Spiked Gauntlets don't stop you grabbing stuff though?
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Apr 13, 2016 16:35
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thespaceinvader posted:Spiked Gauntlets don't stop you grabbing stuff though? Don't they interfere with hand slot magic items in a way that a talid doesn't?
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Apr 13, 2016 16:42
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They're a weapon, they go in the weapon slot, they don't interfere with any other type.
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Apr 13, 2016 16:45
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From the Compendiumquote:These gauntlets are specially fitted with metal spikes. Unlike other weapons, the spiked gauntlet occupies your magic item hands slot while enchanted.
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Apr 13, 2016 16:50
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Huh. I was wrong. But there still isn't much that is good that goes in the hands slot that's better than faeslaughter gauntlets. Short of doing claw gauntlets/weretheme bullshit.
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Apr 13, 2016 17:06
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